Bundesliga, DFB Cup, and other Bundesliga business 2014/2015

Signing Mikhitaryan instead of Eriksen looks like a worse decision by every week that goes by. I feel sorry for Dortmund and Klopp. They are falling as quickly as they became a powerhouse.

If the team goes down, who do you think will stay ? I can see Hummels, Reus, Kampl, Ramos, Kagawa, Aubameyang all leaving..
 
Why, out of interest?

I don't really know. I watched them in group stage when they got to the final, and I loved watching them play, Klopp too. I think it would be fascinating to see who leaves and who stays and how they cope in the next 5 or so years if they were relegated

The madness of it all too I've found exciting.
 
I'm still sure they'll stay up. Still plenty of points to play for. The exodus in inevitable though and it's a damn shame but it's gone stale at their club. Perhaps they are guilty of falling into their own trap of making themselves this footballing utopia club in a world of mercenaries and sugar daddies. It's always sweet when you're at the top but they also had quality players then. Now they've lost those players and have failed to sufficiently replace them.
 
Signing Mikhitaryan instead of Eriksen looks like a worse decision by every week that goes by. I feel sorry for Dortmund and Klopp. They are falling as quickly as they became a powerhouse.

If the team goes down, who do you think will stay ? I can see Hummels, Reus, Kampl, Ramos, Kagawa, Aubameyang all leaving..
His agent Raiola said yesterday that he wants to leave Dortmund at the end of the season. It's out of order for Raiola to go public with that right now but not surprising, I'm glad he has no influence at United.
 
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Such mess. So much space. So lazy defence. Such pass. Wow.
 
Slim? More like nonexistent.

Unless you're talking about Augsburg.
I'm slightly serious here :D

They are 17 points adrift from Augsburg, who are sitting forth, with a half a season to spare. If they go on a 5-6 games winning streak they will be in the reach. That is if the reason they are bottom was because they were missing key players bad form, off pitch issues, etc.

However there is a reason to be seating dead last - they have been terrible in most of those 19 games.

They won't be relegated, Padernborn are really shit, same can be said about Hertha and Stuttgart, while Hamburger have been even more impotent than them.

I think a change in personnel can do them good and maybe regain some form.
 
I'm slightly serious here :D

They are 17 points adrift from Augsburg, who are sitting forth, with a half a season to spare. If they go on a 5-6 games winning streak they will be in the reach. That is if the reason they are bottom was because they were missing key players bad form, off pitch issues, etc.

However there is a reason to be seating dead last - they have been terrible in most of those 19 games.

They won't be relegated, Padernborn are really shit, same can be said about Hertha and Stuttgart, while Hamburger have been even more impotent than them.

I think a change in personnel can do them good and maybe regain some form.

:lol:

No. It doesn't work like that. You're then assuming that Leverkusen/Hoffenheim/Schalke have exactly the same issue in form. They're out and they'll be fortunate to avoid relegation based on how the last 10 games have gone. They have only won 4 games out of 19 and there leading goalscorer is on 5 goals.
 
I've only seen them play against Anderlecht this season but they were pretty good back then, it'll be interesting to see how far they get in the Champions League.
 
:lol:

No. It doesn't work like that. You're then assuming that Leverkusen/Hoffenheim/Schalke have exactly the same issue in form. They're out and they'll be fortunate to avoid relegation based on how the last 10 games have gone. They have only won 4 games out of 19 and there leading goalscorer is on 5 goals.
Leverkusen have won 2 of the last 6 matches, Hoffenheim as well 2 out of 6 with 4 losses, Schalke 3 out of 6, but with a really good result yesterday, yet they lost to Cologne and drew with Hamburg at home. They look the most in form team for that last 4th spot.

The sides that hover around the CL places have been very inconsistent this whole season, apart from Wolfsburg, especially Leverkusen who haven't been able to string more than 2 wins together the whole season.

However the demise in Dortmunds game this season is clearly visible, they are really shit. It won't work like that because at the moment they are incapable of winning 5-6 matches in a row.
 
Leverkusen have won 2 of the last 6 matches, Hoffenheim as well 2 out of 6 with 4 losses, Schalke 3 out of 6, but with a really good result yesterday, yet they lost to Cologne and drew with Hamburg at home. They look the most in form team for that last 4th spot.

The sides that hover around the CL places have been very inconsistent this whole season, apart from Wolfsburg, especially Leverkusen who haven't been able to string more than 2 wins together the whole season.

However the demise in Dortmunds game this season is clearly visible, they are really shit. It won't work like that because at the moment they are incapable of winning 5-6 matches in a row.

That's the whole point i'm making though. There is no chance that they can instantly fix their problems and go on title winning form (which is what would be required to finish in the CL positions). Football simply doesn't work like that. There's far more chance that their terrible run of form will continue and they'll be in for a very tense relegation scrap.
 
Leverkusen have won 2 of the last 6 matches, Hoffenheim as well 2 out of 6 with 4 losses, Schalke 3 out of 6, but with a really good result yesterday, yet they lost to Cologne and drew with Hamburg at home. They look the most in form team for that last 4th spot.

The sides that hover around the CL places have been very inconsistent this whole season, apart from Wolfsburg, especially Leverkusen who haven't been able to string more than 2 wins together the whole season.

However the demise in Dortmunds game this season is clearly visible, they are really shit. It won't work like that because at the moment they are incapable of winning 5-6 matches in a row.

Chasing one team is a whole different kettle of fish to chasing the whole rest of the league to the spots. The chances get smaller and smaller the more teams there are between you and the CL positions, because it is extremely likely that out of all the teams ahead of you there will be a couple with good enough form to hold you off even if results drastically improve. Dortmund shouldn't be thinking about anything other than surviving the drop at the moment.
 
Chasing one team is a whole different kettle of fish to chasing the whole rest of the league to the spots. The chances get smaller and smaller the more teams there are between you and the CL positions, because it is extremely likely that out of all the teams ahead of you there will be a couple with good enough form to hold you off even if results drastically improve. Dortmund shouldn't be thinking about anything other than surviving the drop at the moment.
On the top of my head Villa in 98. They were terrible and 15th in February winning 2 out of the last 8 and then when Gregory took them they won 9 out of the last 11 games and finished in UEFA cup spot at 7th place.
 
Leverkusen have won 2 of the last 6 matches, Hoffenheim as well 2 out of 6 with 4 losses, Schalke 3 out of 6, but with a really good result yesterday, yet they lost to Cologne and drew with Hamburg at home. They look the most in form team for that last 4th spot.

The sides that hover around the CL places have been very inconsistent this whole season, apart from Wolfsburg, especially Leverkusen who haven't been able to string more than 2 wins together the whole season.

However the demise in Dortmunds game this season is clearly visible, they are really shit. It won't work like that because at the moment they are incapable of winning 5-6 matches in a row.

Leverkusen are on the same tactics Dortmund are on. Counterpressing as the main playmaker... And they even have the better technical players to play ball possession.

A lot of the smaller teams are, too - but it somehow looks like underdog tactics work better with the underdogs than with the big guys...

Matchday 19 - 16 points
Another 15 matches... - or 45 points to get
The last seasons you needed about 55 for the Europa League and 60 for the CL. But even if 50 would be enough - they would need 34 points from 45 or winning atleast 11 matches from the last 15. They won 4 matches this season - since mid of September two from which one was won by an own goal out of 30 m distance...

They have 10 points from the last 15 matches - 2 out of the last 5.
 
Leverkusen are on the same tactics Dortmund are on. Counterpressing as the main playmaker... And they even have the better technical players to play ball possession.

A lot of the smaller teams are, too - but it somehow looks like underdog tactics work better with the underdogs than with the big guys...

Matchday 19 - 16 points
Another 15 matches... - or 45 points to get
The last seasons you needed about 55 for the Europa League and 60 for the CL. But even if 50 would be enough - they would need 34 points from 45 or winning atleast 11 matches from the last 15. They won 4 matches this season - since mid of September two from which one was won by an own goal out of 30 m distance...

They have 10 points from the last 15 matches - 2 out of the last 5.
Not saying they will, on the contrary, at the moment they look like most likely they will lose 11 out of those 15 games, rather than win it. However crazier things have happened, like that VIlla example - they beat Chelsea, Pool and Arsenal during that run, and IMO even though they have some really poor signings in their rank, Dortmunt are by no means a team that should be sitting last or playing that shite for the whole season.

I expect Leverkusen and Schalke to get the top 3 as Gladbach and Augsburg should fade away.

As for Dortmund - they'll finish probably somewhere around 12-13.
 
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Dortmund's forwards are very poor, Immobile, Mkitarayan and Abamayang just aren't getting it done, and Reus looks like his head is already in Madrid. I thought Gundogan played pretty well, looking mobile and passing it well, but the movement in front of him left a lot to be desired. I think they'll stay up but it's getting harder and harder for them to reverse the momentum and now the home crowd has turned.
 
:nono: Augsburg deserve to be 4th. They've been playing very good football this Season. They're ahead of the likes of Leverkusen, Schalke and Hoffenheim in the table and rightfully so. Joint 2nd highest win rate in the Bundesliga (11 games).
Harsh on a team which sits 4th on UCL place.
Yea yea, I was just exaggerating for maximum troll, you killjoys. To be fair, I only knew they were at the top because google now showed me Bundesliga table before the match.
 
Augsburg's goal pretty much sums up Dortmund's season: an absolute mess. Grosskreutz with a poor touch and then being caught high up the field, Gündogan doing his best Anderson impression and not being able to run, and then a series of crap and non-existent challenges leading to the goal. Very poor all around.
 
pretty shocking stuff this. I just can't understand why or how the dortmund players forgot how to put the ball in the back of the net.
 
pretty shocking stuff this. I just can't understand why or how the dortmund players forgot how to put the ball in the back of the net.

Actually they forgot how to pass, too...

I expect Leverkusen and Schalke to get the top 3 as Gladbach and Augsburg should fade away.

As for Dortmund - they'll finish probably somewhere around 12-13.

Why should Augsburg and Gladbach fade away? I just think they are better equipped against the most of the Bundesliga teams...

Augsburg had 24 points in the first half of 13/14, 28 points in the second half and now 27 points in the first half of 14/15 - they are just no one-hit-wonder anymore. Augsburg has a very experienced squad and a great coach. That is why I liked the loan of Höjbjerg to them - he might not learn the technical knows of Bayern there but I think that he can learn from the Augsburg players a lot how to fight battles... Gladbach was not as consistent but had 33, 22 and now 27. It is Schalke and Leverkusen who need to perform as if they do not there is others that take the spots.
 
I'm very generous if i say "If Dortmund don't win any of their next 3 matches (Freiburg, Mainz & Stuttgart) then they must sack Klopp or he must go".
They (Board, coach and players) have said before the winter break that something will change in the 2nd half of the season........they were right.....they are now even worse!!!!

I've already said around Matchday 12 that Dortmund will have a relegation battle this year and others still have said "They'll go on run of wins now or then after the winter break".
We Manchester United fans have said and thought the same last season but it hasn't come and i see no sign that Dortmund can do that since months.

Dortmund are so lucky that there are still 4-5 other poor clubs around them.
Dortmund!? They'd be doing incredibly well to make the Europa League.
They wouldn't make the Europa League over the league.
Their only chance is that they win their next three DFB-Pokal matches (3rd tier Dresden is the opponent in the Last 16 round) and a top 4 are is the other club in the final.

It sounds harsh but they shouldn't play their best team in the CL against Juventus if they're still winless on the next three matchdays.

We score 3 goals in one game. I tought I'd never see it again in my life...
and Olic hasn't even scored :) As i saw Hamburg have scored 3 goals today....i thought "The goals are coming with Olic".

Very important 3 points for Hamburg.
But now they must win against Hannover on the weekend too to come away a bit of the relegation places (because they'll get probably 0 points from the two matches after the Hannover match).
 
Apparently Boateng will get a 3 match ban and it seems he'll get a 3 match ban instead of a 2 match ban because Neuer has saved the penalty

A ban of one match is enough......anything more is too stupid

Btw Huntelaar has now a ban of 4 matches + 2 matches on probation (In case of a red card in the 12 months)
 
Am I the only one that thinks their only chance of survival is for Ramos to get healthy and be the focal point of their attack? The only time I've seen Immobile look ok is when counterattacking and Aubameyang is another counterattacker who looks lost when he doesn't have space to run into. They look utterly clueless when the opposition plays a deep, disciplined defensive line.
 
There's some serious motivational issues going on in that BVB team. Klopp seems like he's out of ideas as well. It's been said for a while now that they need to wake up, but it could be too late before they do. (they've already pretty much lost the European spots)
 
I'm slightly serious here :D

They are 17 points adrift from Augsburg, who are sitting forth, with a half a season to spare. If they go on a 5-6 games winning streak they will be in the reach. That is if the reason they are bottom was because they were missing key players bad form, off pitch issues, etc.

However there is a reason to be seating dead last - they have been terrible in most of those 19 games.

They won't be relegated, Padernborn are really shit, same can be said about Hertha and Stuttgart, while Hamburger have been even more impotent than them.

I think a change in personnel can do them good and maybe regain some form.
They don't look like they can win one game at the moment, nevermind 5 or 6.
 
watched the game last night and whilst they looked reasonably dangerous coming forward they were an absolute shambles at the back. there were huge spaces everywhere and you just knew augsberg would score at some point, they seemed to know it too and never looked worried i think dortmund have been sussed out big time.

i'm tempted to say a good striker would do them the world of good as they do still come forward well but aboomerang and immobile are average at best. However they simply have to tighten up first. i wonder if their (klopps?) ego is pushing them forward trying to shoot their way out of trouble when really they'd benefit from just shutting up shop for a couple of games and grinding out some clean sheets.

it's still hard to fathom but you have to say they are in serious trouble now of relegation. this was one of the best sides in the world not so long ago
 
Sligtly off the current topic but still relevant in the thread. A great analysis of Bayern/Bundesliga finances:

http://swissramble.blogspot.co.uk/2015/02/bayern-munich-model.html

A few highlights:

Since 2009, Bayern’s revenue has grown €198 million (68%) from €290 million to €488 million with all three revenue streams showing good growth: commercial up €133 million (83%), broadcasting up €38 million (55%) and match day up €27 million (45%). Most notably, merchandising revenue has almost tripled in that period, rising from €37 million to €105 million.

Since 2007, Bayern has grown its revenue by €265 million, while Dortmund’s growth was €172 million and Schalke €100 million. Bayern’s revenue superiority over the second highest club was €103 million in 2007, but has climbed to €226 million in 2014. Even worse, revenue at clubs like Hamburg, Werder Bremen and Stuttgart has essentially been flat over this period, leading to concern that Bayern’s financial dominance will be bad for competition in Germany.

Perhaps the most staggering figure is from merchandising sales, which rose €22 million (28%) in the last season alone to €105 million. This means that over a fifth of Bayern’s revenue is generated by shirt sales and the like. In fact, Bayern sold 1.3 million replica shirts in 2013/14, which was more than the total sales of all other Bundesliga clubs combined.

Bayern’s wage bill rose 6% (€12 million) from €203 million to €215 million in 2013/14, but the wages to turnover ratio fell to a very impressive 44%, the lowest for many years, following the significant revenue growth. Again, it is interesting to contrast the wages growth with Dortmund. Over the last seven years, the gap has averaged almost exactly €100 million, with Bayern’s €215 million wage bill being twice as much as Dortmund’s €108 million last season.

Despite this flat 2014/15 expenditure, Bayern’s net spend of €135 million over the last four years is still miles higher than other German teams. In the same period, all other Bundesliga clubs only spent a net €172 million. Basically, Bayern’s motto has been, “If you’ve got it, flaunt it.”

Although the football club has had no debt for a while, the group did have debt from the Allianz Arena company, which was used to finance the €346 million needed to build the stadium. This loan was taken out in 2005 with the original intention to pay it off over 25 years, i.e. by 2030, but the club have announced that they have actually already paid it off, more than 15 years ahead of schedule.
 
Up until 12-13 games into the season I also thought Dortmund could go on a run and still win a CL place, not anymore though. The talk about them possibly being 4th reminds me of when QPR were basically all but relegated a couple seasons ago and people on here would say 'they could easily stay up' repeatedly.
 
Signing Mikhitaryan instead of Eriksen looks like a worse decision by every week that goes by. I feel sorry for Dortmund and Klopp. They are falling as quickly as they became a powerhouse.

If the team goes down, who do you think will stay ? I can see Hummels, Reus, Kampl, Ramos, Kagawa, Aubameyang all leaving..

Let's not forget De Bruyne, they were after him aswell and he ended up in Wolfsburg after They singed Mkhitaryan. But that's football you're transfers don't always work out perfectly but to say it's only the transfers not being good enough wouldn't really be enough to explain their immense downfall. The team should easily still be playing for the EL or even CL places even in a bad season. I bet this case is really interesting to sports psychologist, how a team can slip into such a scared mental state that they turn from vice champions into relegation candidates.
 
Despite this flat 2014/15 expenditure, Bayern’s net spend of €135 million over the last four years is still miles higher than other German teams. In the same period, all other Bundesliga clubs only spent a net €172 million. Basically, Bayern’s motto has been, “If you’ve got it, flaunt it.”
That part is a bit weird. Did they add the positive and negative netspends together? Which would mean, they cancel each other out. Wolfsburg's netspend in the past 4 years is 112.78m for example. If you compare that with Bayern's 135m all of a sudden the gap doesn't sound impressive anymore.
 
Hertha fired Luhukay. There are rumours that Slomka was seen at the club and might be his replacement, what a stupid idea that would be.