Bundesliga, DFB Cup, and other Bundesliga business 2014/2015

strongwalker said:
Apparently, HSV are willing to throw a total of 38 mio € (25mio € for new transfers) at Tuchel for his signature. (Source: focus et al)

Tension is building up slowly for the BVB - FCB clash Saturday night 6:30 Gündogan is highly doubtful, Ribery is 50/50.
Click to expand...

It is a pretty meaningless match even if the media already seems to make more out of it. Next week in Leverkusen and the Porto match are a lot more important.

The Bayern players did not travel back with the other German players from Georgia Monday morning - Bayern fetched them with a Learjet already Sunday night after the match. But surprisingly they still had off today.
 
JoaquinJoaquin said:
Especially since they have Van Der Vaart still collecting 100k a week, which is huge for a club like HSV.
Click to expand...

Van der Vaart's contract is running out end of the season and HSV already announced that there will be no extension. Same with some others.
 
Where do HSV get their money from?

I understand they're a historically big club but they've been utterly shite for a long, long time.
 
matherto said:
Ah cheers.

He's 78, what happens when he passes on? Has he got family who are also HSV fans or will they pull funding?
Click to expand...
No idea about that. He bailed them out quite a few times but it's a rather difficult relationship between him and the club, because he doesn't have as much control as he'd like to have.
 
Blackwidow said:
It is a pretty meaningless match even if the media already seems to make more out of it. Next week in Leverkusen and the Porto match are a lot more important.
Click to expand...
Oh, I do think it's a biggie - for both clubs. Prestige at stake, Bayern in danger of losing two games in a row, Dortmund having an awful season and in need of points if they want European football next season & it's the "Klassiker" after all.
 
I for one start getting nervous, if Wolfsburg beat Stuttgart and we lose :nervous:. For various reasons. I doubt we can feck up the league title, but it's not over yet. And we certainly have something to prove against one of the better teams. A loss would be a very bad sign for the away game in Leverkusen in the cup quarterfinal next week and make me worry about the CL. We really, really need a convincing game against a good team.
 
Balu said:
I for one start getting nervous, if Wolfsburg beat Stuttgart and we lose :nervous:. For various reasons. I doubt we can feck up the league title, but it's not over yet. And we certainly have something to prove against one of the better teams. A loss would be a very bad sign for the away game in Leverkusen in the cup quarterfinal next week and make me worry about the CL. We really, really need a convincing game against a good team.
Click to expand...

No. It is 10 points ahead and there is more important matches than the ones against Dortmund.
It will be a match without Robben and Ribery, with a Lahm that comes from an injury and for sure needs some matches to be fully fit, with a central pairing with Alonso and Schweinsteiger who have not found each other yet...

The two matches against Leverkusen and in Porto are important in the next two weeks - the match against Dortmund is not. If we win it with all the extras it is good - if not it is nothing bad even if the media will paint it like that. And hopefully everything looks different in two or three weeks when Lahm is getting into shape, Ribery is back and Thiago can have an impact.
 
Blackwidow said:
No. It is 10 points ahead and there is more important matches than the ones against Dortmund.
Click to expand...

The perceived importance doesn't matter, but we really need to finally show a good performance against a strong team again. We looked awful against both Wolfsburg and Gladbach and I shudder to think what would happen if we put in a performance like that again...

Guardiola needs to get his act together for these last few months and I feel like the game on saturday will be a good reality check.
 
Piratesoup said:
The perceived importance doesn't matter, but we really need to finally show a good performance against a strong team again. We looked awful against both Wolfsburg and Gladbach and I shudder to think what would happen if we put in a performance like that again...

Guardiola needs to get his act together for these last few months and I feel like the game on saturday will be a good reality check.
Click to expand...

But not with the injuries we got right now. And after the latest information Alaba will be out for the rest of the season, too. The first information from Austria that it just was precaution - now it is probably an Innenbandeinriss - partial rupture of the inner ligament?

No wingers. No Alaba. An unfit Lahm. No subs for the offensives. An Alonso and Schweinsteiger who haven't found the right balance with each other. Benatia who has been more off the pitch than on the pitch. Badstuber who went from the field against Australia out of precaution because of problems (he still needs some time to be fully back)...

I do not hope on a good match. I hope on staying clean defensively and making a lucky punch on the other side as Dortmund is always good for an error. The problem is - if we make an error it will be very hard to make a comeback.
 
Our injury crisis won't stop :(. If Alaba really is out for the season, we're fecked again. Whenever one midfielder returns from injury another one goes straight to the hospital. Lahm in, Alaba out. I wouldn't be surprised if one of Schweinsteiger/Alonso is next, now that Thiago could play again and Martinez might return in a few weeks. Ever since the treble we've been truely fecked.

Most likely, we play without Ribery, Robben, Alaba, Martinez against Dortmund. Lahm and Thiago haven't started a game in ages, no idea if they're fit enough to start, let alone play 90 minutes. Add to it that Alonso and Schweinsteiger don't work well together at all and the next 7 days with the league game in Dortmund and the cup quarterfinal in Leverkusen look increasingly terrifying.
 
Sean_RedDevil said:
The Bremen fans will now jump on the "I hate RB Leipzig" bandwagon
Click to expand...

That has to be a April 1st joke, although both Kicker/Bild report the Selke transfer. Given the pure striker drought post Miroslav Klose, he could have jumped on the Euro 2016 train, if he build on his strong debut season. A drop back down to the 2nd division just for the money seems a very short-sighted move. Incredible, if not a joke.
 
Alaba confirmed to be out for the rest of the season. God bless friendlies against Bosnia...
feck this shit, every single time someone comes back from long term injury...

At least we have Bernat. Still can't see us win much in the CL now. It's piling up too much now.
 
JustFootballFan said:
That has to be a April 1st joke, although both Kicker/Bild report the Selke transfer. Given the pure striker drought post Miroslav Klose, he could have jumped on the Euro 2016 train, if he build on his strong debut season. A drop back down to the 2nd division just for the money seems a very short-sighted move. Incredible, if not a joke.
Click to expand...
That's no joke. There were rumours about it for a long time and both clubs confirmed it on their websites. I doubt he could have made the Euro 2016 squad though. Let's not get carried away here, he has 7 goals in 26 games this season (league and cup). He won't even play in the u21 Euro this summer.
 
Piratesoup said:
Alaba confirmed to be out for the rest of the season. God bless friendlies against Bosnia...

feck this shit, every single time someone comes back from long term injury...
Click to expand...
At least no ACL. Still incredibly annoying :mad:.
 
Balu said:
At least no ACL. Still incredibly annoying :mad:.
Click to expand...

Same injury he suffered against Roma (MCL). These MCL tears are really a plague.

When was the last time none of our potential starters were injured? I honestly can't remember.
 
Piratesoup said:
Same injury he suffered against Roma (MCL). These MCL tears are really a plague.

When was the last time none of our potential starters were injured? I honestly can't remember.
Click to expand...
If you count Badstuber as a potential starter, then probably not in a very long time. Our squad is big enough to make up for 2 or 3 potential starters missing without it being a problem, as long as they're from different parts of the team. But Ribery and Robben at the same time, 3 or 4 midfielders at the same time and then irreplacable key players for Pep's system gone as well? It sucks, a lot.

Sahin is still injured for Dortmund though, which sucks for them as well. He was easily their best and most important player since the winterbreak. Doubt we'll see a great game, both teams have too many problems at the moment.
 
Balu said:
That's no joke. There were rumours about it for a long time and both clubs confirmed it on their websites. I doubt he could have made the Euro 2016 squad though. Let's not get carried away here, he has 7 goals in 26 games this season (league and cup). He won't even play in the u21 Euro this summer.
Click to expand...

Which pure German striker has more? Alex Meier has 19 goals, but we all know he´s too old for Loew. Then it´s Kruse and Schieber at 7, Selke at 6. All the others are attacking midfielder like Mueller, Reus, Goetze, Bellarabi, Herrmann, Volland. Germany always played their best with Klose as an outright striker. They´ll need to replace him and the options are limited. If Selke had a 10-12 goal season next year with Bremen he´s very warm for the 2016 squad, even if it´s only to learn the ropes. Now he´s dropping in class and not even guaranteed to be promoted next year, no matter how much money RedBull throw around. They didn´t make it this season with Darmstadt on probably 10-20% of their budget hanging around the top 3.
 
Piratesoup said:
Alaba confirmed to be out for the rest of the season. God bless friendlies against Bosnia...
feck this shit, every single time someone comes back from long term injury...

At least we have Bernat. Still can't see us win much in the CL now. It's piling up too much now.
Click to expand...

That´s unlucky mate. Specially when it happens in pointless friendlies. Hope he recovers well, big fan of his.
 
JustFootballFan said:
Which pure German striker has more? Alex Meier has 19 goals, but we all know he´s too old for Loew. Then it´s Kruse and Schieber at 7, Selke at 6. All the others are attacking midfielder like Mueller, Reus, Goetze, Bellarabi, Herrmann, Volland. Germany always played their best with Klose as an outright striker. They´ll need to replace him and the options are limited. If Selke had a 10-12 goal season next year with Bremen he´s very warm for the 2016 squad, even if it´s only to learn the ropes. Now he´s dropping in class and not even guaranteed to be promoted next year, no matter how much money RedBull throw around. They didn´t make it this season with Darmstadt on probably 10-20% of their budget hanging around the top 3.
Click to expand...
Klose was a fantastic player for Germany though, Selke isn't and won't be next season either, no matter at what club he plays. He's worse than Lasogga was last season for example, and I would have been furious if Lasogga played any minutes for Germany in Brazil. Kruse, Müller and Götze all are still much better strikers than Selke, even if it isn't their best position.

There's a good chance that we play with 3 midfielders again next year, something like Kroos, Schweinsteiger, Gündogan and then only 3 attackers upfront. Reus, Müller and one of Götze or Özil will take those spots. Gomez might find some form and provide a different option, then we have Volland, Kruse.

And let's not forget that we did very well at the World Cup before Klose was fit enough to start again. I'd actually say that Müller played better in the first four games as a striker than he did in the last 3 games as a winger.
 
Balu said:
Klose was a fantastic player for Germany though, Selke isn't and won't be next season either, no matter at what club he plays. He's worse than Lasogga was last season for example, and I would have been furious if Lasogga played any minutes for Germany in Brazil.
Click to expand...

How do you know all that? You must have a magic ball. He was the leading scorer and virtual MVP of the Under 19 European Championship. He broke Morata´s tournament record and I heard he´s turned out pretty good. At age 19 his game has seemingly and seamlessly translated into the Bundesliga. He is fast. He has finishing ability and a nose for goal. He is also a very good and willing passer. Not only six goals, but also four assists so far. In many ways he´s similar to Klose. Maybe he would have had a sophomore slump at Bremen, maybe not. Nils Petersen is a good example of a young player wasting a few years of his career with a poor career choice. Bayern was just too much too soon. Then his confidence had deteriorated so much that despite putting himself in great scoring positions over and over, he just couldn´t finish at Bremen. Now he´s gone to an even smaller club again in Freiburg and has finally re-discovered his scoring touch from the Cottbus days.
 
JustFootballFan said:
How do you know all that?
Click to expand...
Obviously he could surprise everyone and make a huge step next season, but it doesn't seem very likely and I actually like Selke and hope he develops into a top player over the next few seasons. The likelihood of it happening and his step forward being big enough that he becomes an option for the nationalteam for a major tournament that starts in 16 months is very small though, really tiny. It won't hurt him at all, if he plays a massive role for RB Leipzig in the next few years. No need to rush him into the senior nationalteam and if he's as good as you think he is, he'll destroy the 2. Bundesliga and help Leipzig finally go up into the Bundesliga. Let him find his way, let him play well for the u20 and u21 nationalteams. I don't think anyone of the u19 Euro winning team last year will be part of the nationalteam next summer (unless one of them quickly becomes a good fullback).

Nils Petersen is a very good example for a player who simply wasn't good enough for the top level by the way. He didn't waste a few years, he gave it a shot for one year at Bayern in 11/12 and that was it. His first season at Bremen was actually decent and they happily bought him and hoped he would improve further. The confidence theory seems a bit strange, because he failed to push on and establish himself as a good player in his 2nd and 3rd season at Bremen. And it's a bit too soon to judge him on his performances for Freiburg. He played 4 or 5 games for them so far, I wouldn't call it a turnaround just yet despite the hattrick in his first game there.
 
Balu said:
Obviously he could surprise everyone and make a huge step next season, but it doesn't seem very likely and I actually like Selke and hope he develops into a top player over the next few seasons. The likelihood of it happening and his step forward being big enough that he becomes an option for the nationalteam for a major tournament that starts in 16 months is very small though, really tiny. It won't hurt him at all, if he plays a massive role for RB Leipzig in the next few years. No need to rush him into the senior nationalteam and if he's as good as you think he is, he'll destroy the 2. Bundesliga and help Leipzig finally go up into the Bundesliga. Let him find his way, let him play well for the u20 and u21 nationalteams. I don't think anyone of the u19 Euro winning team last year will be part of the nationalteam next summer (unless one of them quickly becomes a good fullback).
Click to expand...

You know how it works under Loew. A few good games by a promising young player, especially in a position of need, and they are invited as squad players to learn at the big tournaments over older players. We have seen it over and over again. Jonas Hector has as many BL games as Selke. There will be somebody like that next summer, probably Geis or Can, maybe even somebody like Kimmcih as a RB option.

Balu said:
Nils Petersen is a very good example for a player who simply wasn't good enough for the top level by the way. He didn't waste a few years, he gave it a shot for one year at Bayern in 11/12 and that was it. His first season at Bremen was actually decent and they happily bought him and hoped he would improve further. The confidence theory seems a bit strange, because he failed to push on and establish himself as a good player in his 2nd and 3rd season at Bremen. And it's a bit too soon to judge him on his performances for Freiburg. He played 4 or 5 games for them so far, I wouldn't call it a turnaround just yet despite the hattrick in his first game there.
Click to expand...

He barely played at Bayern. When he did, he actually scored his goals. He played only 200 total minutes for Bayern. Scored two goals. His problem was that Mario Gomez hammered in goals for fun that year: 26 in 33 BL games. For Freiburg it´s now 200 minutes and four goals.
 
JustFootballFan said:
You know how it works under Loew. A few good games by a promising young player, especially in a position of need, and they are invited as squad players to learn at the big tournaments over older players. We have seen it over and over again. Jonas Hector has as many BL games as Selke. There will be somebody like that next summer, probably Geis or Can, maybe even somebody like Kimmcih as a RB option.
Click to expand...
But Hector, Can and Kimmich really are possible options for a position of need. We're truely fecked when it comes to fullbacks. Strikers on the other hand is a different story, Löw has his preferences there and doesn't add anyone easily. E.g. Mustafi replacing Reus instead of Volland last summer, even though Klose wasn't even fit enough to start at the beginning of the tournament.

JustFootballFan said:
He barely played at Bayern. When he did, he actually scored his goals. He played only 200 total minutes for Bayern. Scored two goals. His problem was that Mario Gomez hammered in goals for fun that year: 26 in 33 BL games. For Freiburg it´s now 200 minutes and four goals.
Click to expand...
Yeah, 200 minutes is nothing. Which is why I judge him on the 4800 minutes played for Bremen.
 
Balu said:
But Hector, Can and Kimmich really are possible options for a position of need. We're truely fecked when it comes to fullbacks. Strikers on the other hand is a different story, Löw has his preferences there and doesn't add anyone easily. E.g. Mustafi replacing Reus instead of Volland last summer, even though Klose wasn't even fit enough to start at the beginning of the tournament.
Click to expand...

We´ll see. A shame that Timo Werner will likely go down to the 2nd division as well. Maybe it opens the door for Nils Petersen. :D

Balu said:
Yeah, 200 minutes is nothing. Which is why I judge him on the 4800 minutes played for Bremen.
Click to expand...

He wasn´t bad there either, but he was a better finisher at Cottbus, Bayern and Freiburg. Didn´t need a lot of minutes and chances. In Bremen he just missed so many easy scoring chances. If you have the instincts to move into the right spots regularly as a striker, you have already done the hard work. You need to give yourself the scoring chances. The rest is just a matter of confidence.
 
Petersen is just a mediocre player, even if his finishing is decent at time everything else still screams midtable at best. Germany's offense is so stacked that I very much doubt that someone like Selke with zero international experience would've made the squad. Yes, Löw experiments with FBs, but that's because we don't have fully convincing players (or even talents) for that position yet. It's completely different on the striker position, just look at Kießling for example who had a couple of decent or even good Bundesliga seasons and EL/CL games to his names but didn't even get invited once (not that I think it was a mistake), Löw seems to be satisfied with one of the AMs in that role.



It appears that Bremen had to sell him for financial reasons so you have to ask yourself which other club would've been willing to pay €8-10m for someone like him. I think out of those clubs RB is a decent choice, at least if they keep investing.


Also I don't get the laughter at Hamburg for their attempt to sign Tuchel. They would be incredibly fortunate so sign someone like him. Imo he really belongs to a top 3-5 team in Germany, so I don't see any fault in offering him a salary that matches his reputation and a big transfer budget, even if it means involving Kühne.
 
Last edited:
do.ob said:
Also I don't get the laughter at Hamburg for their attempt to sign Tuchel.
Click to expand...
might be because...
do.ob said:
[...]he really belongs to a top 3-5 team in Germany
Click to expand...
?! :wenger:

Face it, HSV joined the ranks of the Unmanageable Ones, where VfB and Hertha linger.

oh, and Alaba came back damaged goods from Austrias friendly against BZH. 7 weeks out. Great.
 
It is precisely because of that reputation that Tuchel is so valuable to them. He's one or two tiers above the coaches they could hire instead. And tbh there have always been a couple of "unmanagable" teams that suddenly came back to life with the right coach.
 
do.ob said:
PIt's completely different on the striker position, just look at Kießling for example who had a couple of decent or even good Bundesliga seasons and EL/CL games to his names but didn't even get invited once (not that I think it was a mistake), Löw seems to be satisfied with one of the AMs in that role.
Click to expand...

Kießling has a good Bundesliga record (apart from recently) - but even if you take per minute goal ratios of the last five years, since Müller and Reus entered the stage, they are winning it. When it means international goals - or goals in knock-out-competitions - the ratio Müller has with goals (somehow it is 50-50 assist/goals in the Bundesliga, but whenever we talk about knock-out-matches he is the best goalgetter) on this stages atleast equals a lot of the German strikers of the past even if they are far away from Gerd - but he is not the benchmark. As long as nobody else of the real strikers shows that he is capable to be as successful as goalscorers for their clubs as our offensive midfielders are it does not make any sense to press them into the formation.

Kießling's CL goal tally is 4 goals in 1645 minutes (against not the most difficult opponents) - in the Europa League it is one in 596 minutes. He has 7 goals in 1400 minutes in the old UEFA-Cup - but that is 7 or 8 years ago... - but the real reason for him not being invited was the World Cup 2010 and his behaviour there, in which he was no help on the bench. He is one that has to be the first striker and being pampered and he cannot live with being just a bench player or second option.

Another problem is that none of this young strikers is working in a bigger or more dominant team - all of them are counter attacking strikers. The German team is favourites most of the time and the most opponents just sit back deep and park the bus.
 
do.ob said:
It is precisely because of that reputation that Tuchel is so valuable to them. He's one or two tiers above the coaches they could hire instead. And tbh there have always been a couple of "unmanagable" teams that suddenly came back to life with the right coach.
Click to expand...
True.

But there also are clubs where not even sir Alec Rinus Mourinhola could do any good, especially on a short term timeline. VfB Stuttgart is one of those clubs for me. HSV is dangerously close to becoming one of those as well. I do think that both Vogel and Zinnbauer could have developed into quite decent buli coaches under different circumstances.

Although they started to do a few things right recently, axing van der Vaarts is definitely a step in the right direction.
 
Everything is going for Dortmund so far. If they win today, they're only 1 point behind an Europa League spot. And we're in shit form, have half the starting line-up out injured or coming back from longterm injuries and not fit enough for 90 minutes :nervous:. I'm really worried that we'll see an awful game later.
 
Gonna be a fun League next year with the likes of Ingolstadt and Darmstadt getting promoted as well. Lot of interesting match ups like Darmstadt-Hoffenheim, can't wait :drool:
 
gofelx said:
Gonna be a fun League next year with the likes of Ingolstadt and Darmstadt getting promoted as well. Lot of interesting match ups like Darmstadt-Hoffenheim, can't wait :drool:
Click to expand...
They might not look as interesting on paper, but they sure as hell won't play any worse than you guys. I doubt Darmstadt will get promoted anyway, even if they finish 3rd. They won't finish above Kaiserslautern and won't win the relegation/promotion playoffs. And while Ingolstadt played well in recent weeks, they stopped getting good results. Karlsruhe could still surpass them, in my opinion.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.