Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

Do you think there will be a Deal or No Deal?

  • Total voters
    194
  • Poll closed .
Dave89 said:
No you were right, it was close. If the DUP, who have no confidence in her or her deal but like her money, had voted the other way, she would have lost by 1.

Bribery in a public office?
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There are one billion reasons why the DUP continue to back her.
 
Sassy Colin said:
So it doesn't bother you that the case for Leave was built on lies? That our whole country has been plunged into chaos due to the slenderest of margins?

Tell you what mate, I'm fecking angry.
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And you are quite right to be so.
I am as well but please don't be angry with me. I am a very proud English man and I detest what is happening which makes our country look rather stupid.

You must know that we were lied to by both sides.
Yes it was a relatively slender margin but it was a margin nonetheless.

Tell you why I am not in favour of a second referendum.
If the result is the same as I suspect then what was the point.
If it is to remain but by a tiny margin, this country would be even more divided.

The pressure is on our leaders to come up with a solution to this mess. A second referendum would allow them to abdicate their responsibilities.
 
Hammerfell said:
Corbyn should resign.
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He lost the vote because the unholy alliance of the Tories and DUP fear him and are trying to deny the people a vote. That's more than enough reason to say.

The Prime Minister who can't lead and has to buy a confidence vote is the one who should go. If Corbyn was as unelectable as Murdoch tells you, we'd have been going to general election at 8 last night.
 
Smores said:
Yeah disgraceful how he couldn't get Tories to vote against their own leader. I mean anyone could achieve that
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Would you agree then that the "we want a general election" line now has to go?
 
With 100 dossiers, and 1000 powerpoints, Marcelo Bielsa would have solved Brexit all by himself.......in a week
 
Just wait. Corbyn can call another no confidence vote. Was always losing this one.

If May goes full Brino, and tries to add permanent single market, customs union and 4 freedoms to her deal she'll lose support of ERG.

Probably quite a few ways she can lose Tory MPs support. Just wait to see plan B.

Then she's toast.
 
Hammerfell said:
Corbyn should resign.
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So. Corbyn should resign eh.
But it is perfectly acceptable for all those Conservative MPs who only a few weeks ago signed a letter of no confidence in Mrs May, were voting to support Mrs May in the no confidence vote.
 
Buster15 said:
The Withdrawal Bill that was thrown out last night.
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This makes no sense, you said that they are making it difficult for May to get an improved withdrawal deal and now are pointing to the deal that has been offered from the beginning.
 
She’s won the vote, so back to business.

Hopefully now Mrs May can now reach out to the non-partisan types across the Commons benches and find a sensible solution to all this nonsense from the centre ground among the moderates.

Cross party solutions are eminently possible. Heck we even used to govern that way for a few years when a war was on.

Enough of the Yah-boo bollocks & get the feck on with it.
 
JPRouve said:
This makes no sense, you said that they are making it difficult for May to get an improved withdrawal deal and now are pointing to the deal that has been offered from the beginning.
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Goodness me...
The Withdrawal Bill was soundly rejected despite Mrs May having gone to the EU to try and get an improvement to it which would have made it more acceptable to Parliament.

Again today they reiterated that there can be no improvement.
There is no incentive for them to concede any ground while there is a chance of a second referendum which could potentially reverse the leave vote.
 
Strachans Cigar said:
She’s won the vote, so back to business.

Hopefully now Mrs May can now reach out to the non-partisan types across the Commons benches and find a sensible solution to all this nonsense from the centre ground among the moderates.

Cross party solutions are eminently possible. Heck we even used to govern that way for a few years when a war was on.

Enough of the Yah-boo bollocks & get the feck on with it.
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Bribe worked, move along, nothing to see here.
 
Anybody think she'll consider staying in the customs union now? I think it's the main way she gets enough cross party support.
 
10 MPs holding the whole of the European Union hostage.

Bearing in mind NI votes remain
 
Buster15 said:
Goodness me...
The Withdrawal Bill was soundly rejected despite Mrs May having gone to the EU to try and get an improvement to it which would have made it more acceptable to Parliament.

Again today they reiterated that there can be no improvement.
There is no incentive for them to concede any ground while there is a chance of a second referendum which could potentially reverse the leave vote.
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Maybe I didn't express myself properly but I simply asked you what would be that improved agreement. You seem to think that it's just a matter of making it difficult which insinuate that there is an obvious way to improve that agreement. What would be acceptable for the parliament and is it in line with the interest of the other 27 countries?
 
Ubik said:
Would you agree then that the "we want a general election" line now has to go?
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I said earlier that my thinking is not just yet but that's going to depend on what happens in the next couple of days.
It has to be dropped soon, in line with conference but i wouldn't want them to empower May before her next vote. The threat of a referendum going into the next vote may be the thing that gets Mays deal through then we'll be cursing.

Let Mays deal fail, put down another VONC and then go all out referendum, which i still don't think will pass the house unfortunately
 
JPRouve said:
Maybe I didn't express myself properly but I simply asked you what would be that improved agreement. You seem to think that it's just a matter of making it difficult which insinuate that there is an obvious way to improve that agreement. What would be acceptable for the parliament and is it in line with the interest of the other 27 countries?
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Listening to the various debates I would say that the Backstop is a very big sticking point but what do I know. I voted to remain.
 
Dave89 said:
Bribe worked, move along, nothing to see here.
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So, she’s got the DUP onboard is that what you are saying?

Jesus, what was the alternative?

A ragbag collection of parts on the left forming an alternative coolly monikered by the media as a “Rainbow Coalition” ?

I’m sure that would have worked out just grand. And non of the minor parties would have demanded anything. Oh no siree.
 
Buster15 said:
And you are quite right to be so.
I am as well but please don't be angry with me. I am a very proud English man and I detest what is happening which makes our country look rather stupid.

You must know that we were lied to by both sides.
Yes it was a relatively slender margin but it was a margin nonetheless.

Tell you why I am not in favour of a second referendum.
If the result is the same as I suspect then what was the point.
If it is to remain but by a tiny margin, this country would be even more divided.

The pressure is on our leaders to come up with a solution to this mess. A second referendum would allow them to abdicate their responsibilities.
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That makes no sense. There is no better deal available, lurching out with no deal would be an utter disaster and not what most leave voters thought they voted for and even in the unlikely event we get the same result it would be a vote for a specific exit - we would know the exact consequences of each option.

Sound very democratic to me.
 
Buster15 said:
Listening to the various debates I would say that the Backstop is a very big sticking point but what do I know. I voted to remain.
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The backstop comes from UK's red lines about NI and the rest of the UK staying in the same custom area while the island of Ireland stays borderless and the UK leaves the EUCU, so it doesn't really fit with your claim that the EU purposely made it difficult for May, she made it difficult for herself.
But let's pretend that it wasn't the case, how do you improve it? How do you make sure that even without a trade deal within two years, the island of Ireland doesn't see any borders?
 
Strachans Cigar said:
So, she’s got the DUP onboard is that what you are saying?

Jesus, what was the alternative?

A ragbag collection of parts on the left forming an alternative coolly monikered by the media as a “Rainbow Coalition” ?

I’m sure that would have worked out just grand. And non of the minor parties would have demanded anything. Oh no siree.
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117 Tory MPs expressed no confidence in May last month. The 10 DUP MPs consistently oppose her approach to Brexit. Today's vote is a sham. I believe in democracy, unlike the 127 aforementioned MPs, so if they won't vote on their principles, the alternative is a vote for the people. General election or referendum, whatever.
 
All a bit absurd, isn't it? Half her own party voting against her Brexit proposals, showing they quite clearly don't trust her to implement Brexit...but also somehow cool for her to continue on as leader. Pretty much in deadlock.

To piss the hardcore Brexiteers off she should just go full-on soft Brexit, stay in the single market and customs union. Wind em up if nothing else.
 
With all this talk about delaying march 29th... What's in it for the EU?


Cheesy said:
All a bit absurd, isn't it? Half her own party voting against her Brexit proposals, showing they quite clearly don't trust her to implement Brexit...but also somehow cool for her to continue on as leader. Pretty much in deadlock.

To piss the hardcore Brexiteers off she should just go full-on soft Brexit, stay in the single market and customs union. Wind em up if nothing else.
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Not only that, a third of them also voted against her in the leadership challenge. It is completely dishonest and illustrates the tories mp's loss of reality. They don't support her leadership, they don't support her policy, but they have confidence in her government. They should be ashamed of themselves and I really hope their children are/ will be.
 
Abizzz said:
Not only that, a third of them also voted against her in the leadership challenge. It is completely dishonest and illustrates the tories mp's loss of reality. They don't support her leadership, they don't support her policy, but they have confidence in her government. They should be ashamed of themselves and I really hope their children are/ will be.
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Yeah, quite literally at a point where you've got people who refuse to support the government on a central issue but who also refuse to bring the government down. Meaning we're just left in a bizarre stalemate.
 
Hammerfell said:
Corbyn should resign.
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If only

Labour will never get into power with him leading .

I don't think I've ever seen an easier opportunity for an opposition party to grab power in my life but Corbyn consistently pulls out defeat from the jaws of victory
 
Dave89 said:
117 Tory MPs expressed no confidence in May last month. The 10 DUP MPs consistently oppose her approach to Brexit. Today's vote is a sham. I believe in democracy, unlike the 127 aforementioned MPs, so if they won't vote on their principles, the alternative is a vote for the people. General election or referendum, whatever.
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Why is it a sham? 117 Tories was almost exclusively a Brexit protest and nothing more.

This is ONE issue, albeit an important one. Far from the only issue a government deals with though on a day to day basis right? (Although it doesn’t seem like it sometimes)

Plenty of Old Labour MPs in New Labour didn’t like Tony Blair and some of his policies but held rank along party lines generally because they liked having a centre left/Social Democratic government rather than a Tory one.

So why wouldn’t the Tories vote along party lines if their position in power is threatened?

What you are proposing, like Corbyn, is even more chaos at a time when the country does not need it.

May needs to head across the floor and deal with the right wing of the Labour Party and like minded moderates to come up with a solution that will win a majority in Parliament. That’s the way out of it. Time is not on her side though.
 
Abizzz said:
With all this talk about delaying march 29th... What's in it for the EU?
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With the shambles of politicking, EU perhaps think if they give them more time to exhaust their idea of making a deal, then they'll eventually come to recognize that staying in is the only option left.

Abizzz said:
Not only that, a third of them also voted against her in the leadership challenge. It is completely dishonest and illustrates the tories mp's loss of reality. They don't support her leadership, they don't support her policy, but they have confidence in her government. They should be ashamed of themselves and I really hope their children are/ will be.
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I see this as MPs don't support current deal, but still have confidence in May to work out a better deal. So no to the deal and yes to the government.
 
lsd said:
If only

Labour will never get into power with him leading .

I don't think I've ever seen an easier opportunity for an opposition party to grab power in my life but Corbyn consistently pulls out defeat from the jaws of victory
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How would you have played it?
 
Strachans Cigar said:
Why is it a sham? 117 Tories was almost exclusively a Brexit protest and nothing more.

This is ONE issue, albeit an important one. Far from the only issue a government deals with though on a day to day basis right? (Although it doesn’t seem like it sometimes)

Plenty of Old Labour MPs in New Labour didn’t like Tony Blair and some of his policies but held rank along party lines generally because they liked having a centre left/Social Democratic government rather than a Tory one.

So why wouldn’t the Tories vote along party lines if their position in power is threatened?

What you are proposing, like Corbyn, is even more chaos at a time when the country does not need it.

May needs to head across the floor and deal with the right wing of the Labour Party and like minded moderates to come up with a solution that will win a majority in Parliament. That’s the way out of it. Time is not on her side though.
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Okay, you've explained desperate Tories voting against principles to cling to power. I understand that.

What about the 10 votes she paid £1bn for?
 
Reiver said:
Anybody think she'll consider staying in the customs union now? I think it's the main way she gets enough cross party support.
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EU will probably demand that and single market plus 4 freedoms to remove backstop and extend A50.
 
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