Frank was a little overweight, mind.
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
- Thread starter Silva
- Start date
May is deeply unpopular with hard-Brexiteers over the Chequers deal which will be rejected on Tuesday night.
...but the Tories would be hugely naive to think that Johnson or Rees-Mogg would have enough public support to secure a majority. I'm a Lib Dem/Conservative swing voter and I even I wouldn't want Boris or JRM anywhere near power. The latter is especially out of touch with reality, he's like a politician from the 1930s unfrozen from a time capsule.
I stated quite clearly that I thought Labour's six tests policy was bollocks and invited anyone who thinks otherwise to put me right, so feel free, go right ahead.
No. Tell me the bet
Sorry, I didn't realise you were that dim, in the event of an early election I would bet on the Tories because Labour's Brexit six tests policy is so patently unachieveable that the electorate would see through it and vote against them. I also invited anyone to put me right on that view as I'm always willing to learn, but I'm still waiting for that, for some reason.
It's always best to counter with this premonition about Little Englanders:
The unnatural and increasingly rapid growth of the feeble-minded and insane classes, coupled as it is with a steady restriction among all the thrifty, energetic and superior stocks, constitutes a national and race danger which it is impossible to exaggerate... I feel that the source from which the stream of madness is fed should be cut off and sealed up before another year has passed.
Churchill to Asquith, 1910
If you are 30 or under, check thw working holiday visa too. They just opened the pools. Is how i entered canada and eventually got the residency
Here we go...
Anyone else feel like this is the start of the purge? 
May pondering a second referendum with no remain option.
I doubt she will be the one calling another ref.
I wasn't expecting this, and it totally alters my point of view, I'm now right behind a second referendum with Remain as an option. Previously I thought Remain with unknown conditions couldn't have won anyway, but if it's possible to stay as we are then there's a strong chance. Furthermore, if May's deal is voted down in parliament tomorrow then that shouldn't even be on the referendum, it should be a straight choice between Remain and Hard Brexit.
Feckin hell though, imagine the scenes if after all of this time, it goes back to status quo? Apart from the monumental waste of time, the losses to the economy, the companies who've already moved, there'll be uproar from the leavers. It's lose-lose for everyone. David Cameron should go down as one of the worst PMs in history.
Yeah, hugely embarrassing but seems the best option to me.
They don't have to worry about that though until 5 May 2022. Not if they can hold onto that DUP support anyway.
There'll be uproar regardless. It would be better to have uproar and a stable economy rather than uproar and an unstable economy.
I don't think many Corbynites disagree with you. They were always bollocks but there's just some disagreement on whether they were used to keep the Tories to their promises and set them up for failure or if they're actually deluded. I think the former as that seems to be what all the conversations via any front bench other than Corbyn indicate. Labours activity and those six rules don't match up but we'll see which it is this week.
An important note missed out on the above, they've confirmed A50 could still be unilaterally revoked within extension. Although extension needs EU approval.
Think the outcome if we end up staying in the EU is exaggerated . This is the UK 2018 ,don't see any mass riots from the leavers.
Think you'd see some unrest but not as bad as the 2011 riots, for example. It will happen and be forgotten about within a year.
There'll be something and there will be people fanning the flames, all the usual suspects will be doing it.
I'm probably not thinking major riots, but definitely major moaning and a bit of schism in UK society. Scottish Independence definitely back on the cards over this.
Didn't the majority of Scots vote to stay in the EU though? Remaining would make Scottish independence less likely, I'd have thought.
If the "Brexit Betrayal" march over the weekend is anything to go by, the threats of mass unrest is definitely being over exaggerated by the Leavers
She has spent 18 months negatiations a deal she cannot bring to her parliament.
Surely there's no embarrassment in accepting we made a mistake, voted wrongly and want to change our minds. This is why we have elections every 5 years to give us a chance if we want to change our minds. I've not yet heard anyone argue the case in this manner against those arguing we cannot go against the will of the people. Our politicians have lost all perspective and common sense.
I'm not so sure.
If there was an actual failure to leave, I think you would have plenty genuinely feeling that they were oppressed and up against a tyrannical government, you'd even get some on the extreme fringes feeling like it was a conspiracy and honestly I could see it getting very violent. Look at what happened with Jo Cox, you have some very dangerous people out there who have been fed a certain type of rhetoric for years now 'the betrayers, traitors' etc and would feel fully justified to react in reacting like horrible thugs.
It's a great rallying cry on paper .. 'betrayed by the government, will of the people rejected'. It's one that worked well with Hitler and his 'stab in the back' nonsense, and you would have plenty of people in the media given a platform to spout those views. I hope people are right with the 'it's the UK in 2018' attitude, but looking at Paris recently and the London riots not so long back, I think that's a very dangerous and casual way to look at the situation. The potential for violence and unrest is definitely there and should be taken very seriously if we are to end up remaining, because you have a large amount of people who would feel very strongly that they have been betrayed by their own government.
It would be pretty embarrassing to have gone through all this and then go 'hey actually we want to stay after all!' but certainly way less embarrassing than continuing this farce, and far less damaging than going through with a no deal brexit or anything similar to that.
Embarrassments will soon be forgotten. Taking the country down the unknown and playing with people's lives is unforgivable.
Absolutely. But that isn't the only factor in play, not leaving would be pretty damaging for the Conservatives. A large part of their voter base would feel betrayed by them and they know that, nobody wants to take the hit with brexit voters. It's party over country, basically because both labour & conservative know that deciding to go against the referendum would be political suicide for a decent period of time. Especially since it's not like the conservatives would gain loads of voters from the remain side, because a lot of those are from young people/people more liberal minded in general, who wouldn't vote conservative regardless.
We have already made fools of ourselves over Brexit. Better to start repairing our reputation by acknowledging the mistake rather than stubbornly persisting in a course of a action that damages the country further.
As for a leaver backlash, the nationalist genie is already out of the bottle. We should not be influenced by what they may or may not do as trying to appease extremists got us into this mess in the first place.
As for a leaver backlash, the nationalist genie is already out of the bottle. We should not be influenced by what they may or may not do as trying to appease extremists got us into this mess in the first place.
Pretty clear May's only goal is to survive as PM.
Exactly.
If we were living in an alternate universe where the only aim of the government/leaders was to work for the good of the country, then yeah we would remain.
The reality is though, May & the Conservatives know that any move to stop Brexit entirely would have a huge impact on their voting base, they just won't do it, ever. Have a look at the Conservative facebook page, they've been spamming out videos with titles like 'Another referendum? 'A BETRAYAL'. They've picked their side and to change it now would be politically disastrous for them.
Basically, we're utterly fecked.
It would be a disgrace to pull the vote but I'd do it if i was her. The best opportunity she has to pass it would be to convince more MPs that it is the final deal and this way she can maybe demonstrate the EU won't budge.
To me it would be circumventing democracy somewhat as it would delay motions for a people's vote for instance until it may seem too late. It would add further chaos and uncertainty so she would be at fault for that when she's spent weeks accusing others.
It's against the will of the people to ask what thier will is more than once apparently.
Yesterday's 'people' have more rights than todays people
If she pulls he vote then clealry yes. Trying to delay the inevitable.