The Okey Cokey with emphasis on In-out in-out
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
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Corbyn is relishing a debate with May. Bet she backs out.
Those are some proper Tory names aren’t they
She might not if there's a guarantee of keeping it on Brexit. She is well briefed and clearly has a position on that whereas Corbyn isn't and doesn't.
in fairness this will be comedy gold if this debate goes ahead, will also be extremely embarrassing for the UK.
Just been reading the comments against todays BBC Brexit article and its depressing how many think we can just leave with no deal and they'll be no major impact.
Wouldn't be shocked to learn that some of them are paid contributors.
Wouldn't be shocked to learn that some of them are paid contributors.
Yes its setting the stage to either force labour into a free vote on the deal or make them look to be putting party politics above the countrys needs
To be fair it would be piss poor telly but a fairly logical trap to set from the conservatives
the consistent line of attack would be - we are prepared to let each MP take the opinions of their constituents and vote in the interst of the country and the pople they represent - you are threatening MP's with deselection if they dont play party politics
to be hoest although its at best a half truth it would work well as a framing device... that said i cant see any debate without somebody wanting to represent leaving with a hard brexit view (mogg, borris, farrage etc) and somebody wanting to aggue the peoples vote (blair?) - and I cant see May or Corbyn being prepared to go into a 4 way debate
Corbyn could at last set out his master plan for a withdrawal that passes his six tests. Then we could just run it by Barnier, re-open negotiations and job done. What could possibly go wrong?
I saw that article before and it's absolutely idiotic.
he says "We’re heading for a second referendum – and maybe a third" and then makes no mention of it other than to say that a no deal brexit might not be a disaster. Whut?
She didn't want a debate for the GE but wants for brexit.
Hope Corbyn tells her to feck off.
Hope Corbyn tells her to feck off.
Do you mean the third ref? I think that's the second of the two-part referendum he says could happen, i.e. no deal or deal if leave won the first round.
The only way I see this getting through parliament, outside a second ref, is May going "feck it, we'll stay in the EEA".
She needs to debate it with her own party first. What a clown.
Why would he? As soon as he gets her off her pre-scripted answers, she’s fecked.
How many traitors will go?
You aren't really a traitor if you go to a briefing on a bill that'll be up for a vote in a couple of weeks.
That's exactly the sort of thing she'll be hoping to hear. Tories, putting country above party politics; Labour, self-interest first. You're walking straight into the trap.
I think they’ll go then walk out and say it was a waste of time because it won’t get through parliament or that it’s a Turkey Trap.
She's playing a blinder. She'll give the Tories a free vote on it next. Labour will be under pressure to reciprocate. If they stick a three line whip in they'll look as if they are acting out of self interest.
She has a tangible deal to argue for whereas Corbyn only has a fantasy position to promote/defend. Corbyn's plan if he ends up holding the Brexit baby is too '11th hour' the EU into capitulating to his demands.
I don't think Labour has much to lose by allowing a free vote, most MPs seem to hate the deal.
They thought that in 71. Heath forced a free vote and won by a 112 majority. This isn't the same I know. But is is kitchen sink stuff from May which tells me that if she doesn't get it through she'll resign.
There's been something about the last day or two that's been a bit sea-changeish for May. The 'man on the street' has started to back her. A John Major on his soapbox type thing. Events are so volatile it could change again at any moment of course, but right now I think she's picking up support strongly. I'm sure the party zealots on here will disagree, but I'm no Tory, I'm just saying what I see.
But she's REALLY bad in that kind of situation. She gets flustered and uncomfortable extremely easily, and can only hold up a coherent sales pitch if she's giving a speech or answering questions in a very controlled environment where she can hedge and fall back on soundbites that aren't necessarily relevant to the question being answered. Put her in a head to head debate with an experienced debater like Corbyn and its not going to matter whether she has the stronger case, he's just going to put her on her heels and watch her come unglued.
For a TV debate it doesn't really matter who makes the better arguments, what matters is the manner they come across to the viewers. It's the reason why in the JFK-Nixon debate, radio listeners thought Nixon had won easily while TV viewers overwhelmingly thought JFK had won. With May however she couldn't even win over the radio crowd, she just can't handle this kind of arena.
I think it's just because the initial uproar has gone and she's had a few perceived victories in surviving the leadership challenge and getting the agreements passed by the EU.
They've had the benefit of planning their media campaign for a while now where as everyone else is just responding to events.
Corbyn's great at doing that, when he believes in something. Less sure he could muster it up for the current triangulated brexit approach they have.
The UK won't separate NI from the rest of the UK. But really there is no solution. Well there is, the UK stays in the EU.
As May heads to the Houses of Parliament, if she is true to form ,after having visited Brussels she will completely deny that she has agreed anything with the EU.
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...taking-part-in-brexit-tv-debate-jeremy-corbyn
I'm so sick of this stupid cnut. Yeah Jeremy, lets have a televised debate about Brexit, not talk about one of the main options 70+% of your own party want, and talk about lots of non-Brexit related issues instead. You fecking moron.
Brexit should be the topic, first and last. There'll be plenty of time for other matters. The country is in a crisis. Blathering on about wage growth will not get anything resolved.
Yes, could be, it's about how she moves forward I suppose. Not sure perceived is the right word though, temporary is arguable, but they're still real enough in themselves.
fecking Corbyn wanting to talk about people's actual lives, that were shit before Brexit came along and will be shit regardless of how Brexit plays out, as if they're actual human beings who are equal to the cnuts whose interest in politics began in June 2016 and will almost certainly end whenever this distraction goes away. Boo that man. Boo.
Just talk about Brexit and then we can all go back to those halcyon days of May 2016, when the only threat to vulnerable people were the same Tories now warmly welcomed at People's Vote events, 3 days after they vote to hide the Universal Credit rollout risk assessment.
Time and place. Corbyn gets to raise those issues every week at PMQ's. Right now the country faces a crisis and if it is not resolved then the lot of the people you talk about could get a whole lot worse.
He's not just walking into May's trap, he's running into it. Labour need a cleverer leader.
Yeah, the time and place to talk about actual people's lives is definitely not whilst trying to get them to vote your way - whether it's a GE or a People's Vote. How stupid of me.
Let's pretend their lives are of little consequence and that ending Brexit is far more important. I seem to remember that tactic going down extremely well at the last referendum.
I’ve been following politics closely for over 30 years and it’s funny how many of those people whose lives were shit before never gave a single feck about politics, thought it had no impact on their lives, but then suddenly decided in July 2016 that they were the experts and that leaving the EU would change everything for the better.
Of course the fact that leaving the EU is going to hand the Torres a blank cheque to feck the poor (which is why it’s predominantly hard right Tory cnuts who have fought so hard for it) is just by the by. Or maybe you think the likes of Jacob Rees-Mogg and John Redwood are deeply passionate about the troubles of sandwich factory workers in my home town?
Thank goodness they've been so restricted, in their ability to do that, by the EU for the last decade.
The 'So you agree with JRM, eh?' tactic would probably be a decent one, had People's Vote not warmly welcomed Jo Johnson to an event recently, despite him voting 13 times against EU nationals' right to remain in the UK (to 0 times for it) and 15 times against the UK's membership of the EU (again, to 0 times for it). But no, suddenly he's definitely the EU's number one fan because he's had a little moan in the Commons.