Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

[Nogbadthebad]

Difficult one for them. Corbyn undermines his "honest politics" mantra by not taking a stance, but at the same time taking a firmly pro-customs union stance will alienate a considerable portion of the party's voters who want an end to freedom of movement.

Not only that.

It would allow the media to go full on offensive about traitors to democracy and let them ignore whatever feck up the tories are doing.

I think in the end, he will be able to stand up in front of the country and say if we leave the single market we lose Nissan, Toyota, Honda, BMW and a long list of other jobs, and that he can't agree a deal that destroys people's livelihoods in that way.

But I don't think we as a country are ready to hear it yet. It will only work when the lies are exposed for what they are.

 

[MoskvaRed]

I don't think it's that difficult, quite honestly. Labour voters overwhelmingly are anti-hardline Brexit, Labour's youth are positively Europhillic and under any other leader of the last 30 years they would have had this stance from the outset and not let May et al off the hook for so long as they have. It's because Corbyn and McDonnell are still pretending not to be against something they've been against their entire political lives save for a few weeks of unconvincing campaigning in the summer of 2016. Still, better late than never so can't grumble.

I definitely agree with the last part of your post. The question I have is whether Labour’s traditional voters who voted leave (places like the NW, NE, S Wales) have been persuaded to change their mind on Brexit. While there has been some small movement in polling, I don’t think most who voted leave have yet been convinced - the sky has not fallen in economically and there doesn’t seem to be enough effort made by Labour to outline what the Rees-Mogg/Fox type bonfire of regulations would actually mean - not so much a return to bendy bananas but rather to the 21st century version of children working up chimneys.

 

[Cheesy]

I don't think it's that difficult, quite honestly. Labour voters overwhelmingly are anti-hardline Brexit, Labour's youth are positively Europhillic and under any other leader of the last 30 years they would have had this stance from the outset and not let May et al off the hook for so long as they have. It's because Corbyn and McDonnell are still pretending not to be against something they've been against their entire political lives save for a few weeks of unconvincing campaigning in the summer of 2016. Still, better late than never so can't grumble.

Labour voters aren't overwhelmingly anti-hardline Brexit, over 30% of them voted for it in 2016 and of that number a significant amount will desire a hard Brexit which entails ending freedom of movement. Corbyn taking this approach will inherently advantage the Tories and drive voters towards them.

 

[Nuts]

Why does that cnut Blair keep saying ‘bregsit’??

 

[Jippy]

I don't think it's that difficult, quite honestly. Labour voters overwhelmingly are anti-hardline Brexit, Labour's youth are positively Europhillic and under any other leader of the last 30 years they would have had this stance from the outset and not let May et al off the hook for so long as they have. It's because Corbyn and McDonnell are still pretending not to be against something they've been against their entire political lives save for a few weeks of unconvincing campaigning in the summer of 2016. Still, better late than never so can't grumble.

That's bollox. You're telling me the likes of Sunderland, which was 70%+ Brexit, are anti-hard?
Both parties' supporters are massively divided, which is one, of many, reasons it's such a mess.

 

[Ultimate Grib]

 

[Paul the Wolf]

"I know" says May, "as it's 20 months since the referendum, it's about time we decided what we want, remember it has to be realistic according to the EU".
After eight hours of discussion May announces "Right we've tried cherry-picking, we've tried cake and eat it but neither worked, let's try the basket case strategy".
Well that went well.

 

[rcoobc]

Difficult one for them. Corbyn undermines his "honest politics" mantra by not taking a stance, but at the same time taking a firmly pro-customs union stance will alienate a considerable portion of the party's voters who want an end to freedom of movement.

customs union and freedom of movement.. eh?

 

[Valar Morghulis]

We just need to do the Brexit, the EU globalists are not taking us down with the rest of them.

 

[Oscie]

"We'll have £350m a week for the NHS!"

Lies. We'll have less money for the NHS because we'll pay so much to extract ourselves from the EU and the economy will suffer to the point where we'll have less for the public services all round.

"Let's spend the money we get from leaving the EU on the NHS!"

Good idea Jeremy, let's!

Don't get it. Are we now accepting there will be extra money for the NHS depending on who's saying it? Anyone talking about a boon for public services as a result of Brexit is doing the dirty work of the extreme right wing of the Tory party.

 

[Silva]

"We'll have £350m a week for the NHS!"

Lies. We'll have less money for the NHS because we'll pay so much to extract ourselves from the EU and the economy will suffer to the point where we'll have less for the public services all round.

"Let's spend the money we get from leaving the EU on the NHS!"

Good idea Jeremy, let's!

Don't get it. Are we now accepting there will be extra money for the NHS depending on who's saying it? Anyone talking about a boon for public services as a result of Brexit is doing the dirty work of the extreme right wing of the Tory party.

We’ll give the NHS resources it needs as we will raise tax on those with the broadest shoulders to pay for it – not by making up numbers and parading them on the side of a bus.

you seem to have missed his point

 

[Oscie]

"We will use funds returned from Brussels after Brexit to invest in our public services and jobs of the future, not tax cuts for the richest"


Don't think I have. One side is saying there will be more money for public services as a result of leaving the EU, the other side is saying there will be more money for public services after leaving the EU. Partisanship has people insisting that when the other side says there'll be more money for public services as a result of leaving the EU they're lying, but when the other side say there'll be more money for public services as a result of leaving the EU they're telling the truth.


Of course he said they'll give NHS more money in other ways too, but my point is he is pushing the Boris/Mogg/Redwood/Hannan line of leaving the EU being directly linked to having more money for public services. Bizarre in any event, especially when Labour's positioning on Brexit appeared to have been softening as a direct result of internal pressure his own cabinet and MPs.

 

[Sweet Square]

I think he does make some fair points in regards to how often you'll complaints of "Just get on with it!" on Question Time etc. There's definitely an obsession with simplifying the whole process, and trying to strip it of all complexity when doing so isn't really possible.

I agree that these people make up a part of the Brexit vote(Ultra nationalist thatcherites or in other words Gammon - http://www.huckmagazine.com/perspectives/opinion-perspectives/defence-calling-people-gammon/)

But he firstly miss the mark in viewing the Remain and Leave camps as something other than a small faction of voters with a very loud voice due to their media presence. There was a reason why Labour during the election could so easily turn the conversation away from Brexit and onto issues such as NHS, education, etc. The rest of his thread is just nonsense that makes like him feel better e.g. people who voted Brexit are just stupid.

 

[Abizzz]

I agree that these people make up a part of the Brexit vote(Ultra nationalist thatcherites or in other words Gammon - http://www.huckmagazine.com/perspectives/opinion-perspectives/defence-calling-people-gammon/)

But he firstly miss the mark in viewing the Remain and Leave camps as something other than a small faction of voters with a very loud voice due to their media presence. There was a reason why Labour during the election could so easily turn the conversation away from Brexit and onto issues such as NHS, education, etc. The rest of his thread is just nonsense that makes like him feel better e.g. people who voted Brexit are just stupid.

Spoiler

At some point Brexiteers will need to comprehend that non-Brexiteers will view them as stupid until proven wrong.

You cannot vote yourself into a complete mess by listening and believing Johnson, Mogg, Farage and their ilk and expect others not to have a opinion on it. Everything happening in the Brexit "negotiations" now was predicted by everyone who had the slightest knowledge about the EU before the referendum. The only ones who where predicting anything else are the ones who are now living in a fantasy world of "unaligned alignment" "e-boarder" etc.


They may not be stupid individuals one by one, but this choice was monumentally stupid. That it was such was clear to see for anyone not indoctrinated by Murdoch and Dacre. Since so many of them define themselves as "brexiteers", hence define themselves via that choice, I think it's more than fair to call them stupid individually too.

 

[Sweet Square]

Spoiler

At some point Brexiteers will need to comprehend that non-Brexiteers will view them as stupid until proven wrong.

You cannot vote yourself into a complete mess by listening and believing Johnson, Mogg, Farage and their ilk and expect others not to have a opinion on it. Everything happening in the Brexit "negotiations" now was predicted by everyone who had the slightest knowledge about the EU before the referendum. The only ones who where predicting anything else are the ones who are now living in a fantasy world of "unaligned alignment" "e-boarder" etc.


They may not be stupid individuals one by one, but this choice was monumentally stupid. That it was such was clear to see for anyone not indoctrinated by Murdoch and Dacre. Since so many of them define themselves as "brexiteers", hence define themselves via that choice, I think it's more than fair to call them stupid individually too.

Of course it was a stupid choice but then so is voting for any tory government, voting lib dem or voting for Hilary Clinton in the PRIMARIES. People make stupid choices all the time but hey that's 30 odd years of neoliberalism and capitalism alienation for you.

My point is that yes the ones who ring up radio stations, appear in the audience of question time are part of the Brexit vote but they are not the majority. To have any sort of analysis of why Brexit happened, we have to look at the country as a whole, the deep issues, the past etc. But to do would require a lot of hard self analysis by liberals, so instead people get called stupid.

 

[Steven Seagull]

Of course it was a stupid choice but then so is voting for any tory government, voting lib dem or voting for Hilary Clinton in the PRIMARIES. People make stupid choices all the time but hey that's 30 odd years of neoliberalism and capitalism alienation for you.

My point is that yes the ones who ring up radio stations, appear in the audience of question time are part of the Brexit vote but they are not the majority. To have any sort of analysis of why Brexit happened, we have to look at the country as a whole, the deep issues, the past etc. But to do would require a lot of hard self analysis by liberals, so instead people get called stupid.

It’s been 18 months and people still think it was Russian bots wot won it. I wouldn’t hold your breath

 

[devilish]

"We will use funds returned from Brussels after Brexit to invest in our public services and jobs of the future, not tax cuts for the richest"

That's quite hilarious considering that the Tory plan for a hard brexit is to remove as much tariffs as possible and open the doors to their market as much as possible. How the hell are they going to recoup the tax needed for the public service if the British market is swarmed by cheaper products which will kill of the local industry, there's no money made out from tariffs and the NHS end up being challenged in court by US corporations?

 

[Abizzz]

My point is that yes the ones who ring up radio stations, appear in the audience of question time are part of the Brexit vote but they are not the majority. To have any sort of analysis of why Brexit happened, we have to look at the country as a whole, the deep issues, the past etc. But to do would require a lot of hard self analysis by liberals, so instead people get called stupid.

I simply don't buy that line that liberals have done something oh so terrible to the brexiteers that absolves the brexiteers from blame for their own action.

Also it is truly bizarre to blame "liberals" (in the sense of the word that I think that you are using it, i.e the way it is predominantly used in the US) for neoliberalism. Neoliberalism is a conservative fetish. Yes they got a lot of help from the center-left, but lets not forget who's child it is.

 

[GloryHunter07]

Can we please just stop calling people stupid.

 

[Drifter]

Jeremy Corbyn backs permanent customs union after Brexit

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-43189878

 

[Abizzz]

Can we please just stop calling people stupid.

Not when they invent grievances and peddle fantasies.

Case in point from @Drifter source:

Brexit Secretary David Davis ... accused Mr Corbyn of "selling snake oil".

Proposing to keep the economic relationship as close to the status quo as possible is "snake oil"... From the minister who talked about impact assessments being done in “in excruciating detail” only to later admit there are none at all.

 

[Silva]

Can we please just stop calling people stupid.

no

 

[Paul the Wolf]

Of course it was a stupid choice but then so is voting for any tory government, voting lib dem or voting for Hilary Clinton in the PRIMARIES. People make stupid choices all the time but hey that's 30 odd years of neoliberalism and capitalism alienation for you.

My point is that yes the ones who ring up radio stations, appear in the audience of question time are part of the Brexit vote but they are not the majority. To have any sort of analysis of why Brexit happened, we have to look at the country as a whole, the deep issues, the past etc. But to do would require a lot of hard self analysis by liberals, so instead people get called stupid.

It's not the same thing. Whatever your political persuasion, if you vote Tory you know roughly what you're going to get, the same for Labour, the same for LibDem or Communist or whatever. People who voted Trump knew roughly what they were going to get, there are no surprises.

Believing the obvious rubbish the Brexiters were and still are spouting is beyond belief. It took very little investigation to find out it was pure lies and fantasy.
Why not send your bank details to a Nigerian Prince who emailed you, I'm sure he'll transfer all that money he promised you.

 

[GloryHunter07]

Rise above.

Not when they invent grievances and peddle fantasies.

Case in point from @Drifter source:

Proposing to keep the economic relationship as close to the status quo as possible is "snake oil"... From the minister who talked about impact assessments being done in “in excruciating detail” only to later admit there are none at all.

no

 

[Abizzz]

Rise above.

No, for the time being I won't. The politicians who campaigned for Brexit profited hugely in the run up to the vote by being given respect that their conduct didn't warrant. Be it Boris, Fox, Davis or Farage, they all spread falsehoods about the UK's relationship with it's partners, invented grievances towards Brussels and played the ill informed electorate like a fiddle by promising a vague, but fantastic future should their invented grievances be removed.

You can respect them, don't expect me to please. I think the respect they've previously received by people who should have known better contributed to this mess.

 

[Cheesy]

I agree that these people make up a part of the Brexit vote(Ultra nationalist thatcherites or in other words Gammon - http://www.huckmagazine.com/perspectives/opinion-perspectives/defence-calling-people-gammon/)

But he firstly miss the mark in viewing the Remain and Leave camps as something other than a small faction of voters with a very loud voice due to their media presence. There was a reason why Labour during the election could so easily turn the conversation away from Brexit and onto issues such as NHS, education, etc. The rest of his thread is just nonsense that makes like him feel better e.g. people who voted Brexit are just stupid.

The problem is that Brexit has a direct impact on all of those things insofar as if it significantly hurts the economy it's going to hurt all of those things. I do agree a more substantial path of discussion is needed than branding those who voted Brexit 'stupid' but likewise issues like the NHS and education can't be discussed in a vacuum as if Brexit's not a thing that's happening.

 

[GloryHunter07]

No, for the time being I won't. The politicians who campaigned for Brexit profited hugely in the run up to the vote by being given respect that their conduct didn't warrant. Be it Boris, Fox, Davis or Farage, they all spread falsehoods about the UK's relationship with it's partners, invented grievances towards Brussels and played the ill informed electorate like a fiddle by promising a vague, but fantastic future should their invented grievances be removed.

You can respect them, don't expect me to please. I think the respect they've previously received by people who should have known better contributed to this mess.

Oh call politicians idiots by all means, but not voters you dont agree with.

 

[Paul the Wolf]

Jeremy Corbyn backs permanent customs union after Brexit

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-43189878

Equally meaningless nonsense as per the Tory stance, just doesn't want to be seen as the breaker of the GFA.

There are only 3 choices:
1. Totally out, hard borders everywhere including Ireland.
2. In the (not "a") CU and SM so in the EU in all but name but no say
3. Cancel Brexit.

 

[Sweet Square]

I simply don't buy that line that liberals have done something oh so terrible to the brexiteers that absolves the brexiteers from blame for their own action.

Also it is truly bizarre to blame "liberals" (in the sense of the word that I think that you are using it, i.e the way it is predominantly used in the US) for neoliberalism. Neoliberalism is a conservative fetish. Yes they got a lot of help from the center-left, but lets not forget who's child it is.

The majority of people who voted Brexit on July are not ''brexiteers'', so with that noted we have to ask ourself why so many people voted for something we all think is completely stupid.

A couple of examples

1)Immigration -

It clearly played the biggest role, why do so many people think immigration is a problem(Even if the all the evidence shows it isn't). Well it could possible have to the with maybe the last essentially liberal coalition government(Cameron tories idealises Blair by the way) constantly using racism and xenophobia to bait people in voting for them - the immigration vans or maybe we could go back further to when New Labour were pushing racism and xenophobia - ''British Jobs for British People'' to quote Gordon Brown.

Let's not forget the BNP in 2009 European election got almost 1 million votes, the racist and xenophobic vote had been on the rise long before Brexit.

The infamous Nazi like sign that Leave used showing lines of middle eastern people with the words Breaking Point underneath, why would the British(Well English)public have such a racist view towards people from the middle east - the whole war on terror put forward by the liberals in the 2000's might have something to do with it

2)The economy -

While New Labour had slightly different continuation of the Thatcher era, the slight differences being actual quite important, it was in the end a continuation. When this model failed badly in 2008, the response by coalition government to this failure was to used ''austerity'' as a cover for class war.

So almost 30 odd years of a political and economic consensus that not all destroyed huge part of the UK and left people completely alienated but also try to destroy any idea that there could be a alternative to this consensus(When this alternative came in the form of the movement be hide Corbyn, the far right all the way to the centre left would attack it).

My argument is that the effects of neoliberalism have played a major reason to why Brexit happened and without adding this into the analysis you won't understand why people seemingly voted for something so stupid.

 

[Abizzz]

Oh call politicians idiots by all means, but not voters you dont agree with.

Alright, can I just call those who believe those politicians gullible then? I actually agree that we just can't disqualify someone else's vote by calling it stupid in general, that wouldn't be very helpful to a working democracy... But in this particular case it isn't really a difference of opinion, as the other side simply makes things up to justify their opinion (and has done so for as long as I can remember).

The majority of people who voted Brexit on July are not ''brexiteers'', so with that noted we have to ask ourself why so many people voted for something we all think is completely stupid.

A couple of examples

1)Immigration -

It clearly played the biggest role, why do so many people think immigration is a problem(Even if the all the evidence shows it isn't). Well it could possible have to the with maybe the last essentially liberal coalition government(Cameron tories idealises Blair by the way) constantly using racism and xenophobia to bait people in voting for them - the immigration vans or maybe we could go back further to when New Labour were pushing racism and xenophobia - ''British Jobs for British People'' to quote Gordon Brown.

Let's not forget the BNP in 2009 European election got almost 1 million votes, the racist and xenophobic vote had been on the rise long before Brexit.

The infamous Nazi like sign that Leave used showing lines of middle eastern people with the words Breaking Point underneath, why would the British(Well English)public have such a racist view towards people from the middle east - the whole war on terror put forward by the liberals in the 2000's might have something to do with it

2)The economy -

While New Labour had slightly different continuation of the Thatcher era, the slight differences being actual quite important, it was in the end a continuation. When this model failed badly in 2008, the response by coalition government to this failure was to used ''austerity'' as a cover for class war.

So almost 30 odd years of a political and economic consensus that not all destroyed huge part of the UK and left people completely alienated but also try to destroy any idea that there could be a alternative to this consensus(When this alternative came in the form of the movement be hide Corbyn, the far right all the way to the centre left would attack it).

My argument is that the effects of neoliberalism have played a major reason to why Brexit happened and without adding this into the analysis you won't understand why people seemingly voted for something so stupid.

I actually agree with most of that. My quip with it is that those who had the wisdom to vote for change (brexit) to address this also still vote for those responsible for it in the first place (tories). I know which word you wouldn't use to describe that, but which one would you use?

(I would be more understanding if Labour were still dominated by Blairites, in the sense that you'd rather take the original (tories) than a bad copy of it dressed up with a smile, but that's not the case anymore).

 

[Paul the Wolf]

When I were a lad, the Tories looked after the poor, there were no slums and all working class people lived in big houses and were highly paid.
There were very few foreigners and those people that benefited from encountering the occasional overseas visitor welcomed them with open arms.
Look what's happened to this country in the last 30 years, that's why I voted Brexit.

 

[Drifter]

Is that a quote or your opinion?

 

[Paul the Wolf]

Is that a quote or your opinion?

Neither, I feel that history is being rewritten by the under 30s/even under 40s.

Alternatively, it is not acceptable to call someone stupid when they are stupid but apparently it is quite acceptable to hope they die soon so their vote will be irrelevant.

 

[Cheesy]

Neither, I feel that history is being rewritten by the under 30s/even under 40s.

Alternatively, it is not acceptable to call someone stupid when they are stupid but apparently it is quite acceptable to hope they die soon so their vote will be irrelevant.

In what sense, out of interest?

 

[Paul the Wolf]

In what sense, out of interest?

A few examples.
There have always been deprived areas, poor people, neglected people, neglected areas, not just in the recent past but since time immemorial.
There has always been a resentment of foreigners from British people, it certainly was there when I was younger.
The Tories have never been a friend of the less well off.

To justify people voting for Brexit for any of these reasons makes no sense. It's been like this for donkeys years, long before the EU ever came about.

Another odd point is now Blair is out of favour with Labour voters it seems hardly anyone now admits to voting for him.

 

[nickm]

The majority of people who voted Brexit on July are not ''brexiteers'', so with that noted we have to ask ourself why so many people voted for something we all think is completely stupid.

A couple of examples

1)Immigration -

It clearly played the biggest role, why do so many people think immigration is a problem(Even if the all the evidence shows it isn't). Well it could possible have to the with maybe the last essentially liberal coalition government(Cameron tories idealises Blair by the way) constantly using racism and xenophobia to bait people in voting for them - the immigration vans or maybe we could go back further to when New Labour were pushing racism and xenophobia - ''British Jobs for British People'' to quote Gordon Brown.

Let's not forget the BNP in 2009 European election got almost 1 million votes, the racist and xenophobic vote had been on the rise long before Brexit.

The infamous Nazi like sign that Leave used showing lines of middle eastern people with the words Breaking Point underneath, why would the British(Well English)public have such a racist view towards people from the middle east - the whole war on terror put forward by the liberals in the 2000's might have something to do with it

2)The economy -

While New Labour had slightly different continuation of the Thatcher era, the slight differences being actual quite important, it was in the end a continuation. When this model failed badly in 2008, the response by coalition government to this failure was to used ''austerity'' as a cover for class war.

So almost 30 odd years of a political and economic consensus that not all destroyed huge part of the UK and left people completely alienated but also try to destroy any idea that there could be a alternative to this consensus(When this alternative came in the form of the movement be hide Corbyn, the far right all the way to the centre left would attack it).

My argument is that the effects of neoliberalism have played a major reason to why Brexit happened and without adding this into the analysis you won't understand why people seemingly voted for something so stupid.

Immigration was clearly a factor. It is too simplistic say it was politicians stirring racism/xenophobia. People have seen their communities change rapidly in a short space of time, perhaps too short. Did politicians pander to it a bit? Probably. Did they do enough to address some of the concerns that might have been triggered by rapid social change? Arguably, not enough.

The economy nearly crashed because the banks ran out of money, partly because they were badly regulated or not regulated at all. Austerity was because the Labour govt was running a deficit during a late stage boom, which is the opposite of what they should have been doing, and austerity was also politically popular. The Tories surprisingly won a majority with Cameron at the helm, partly because of it. So why suddenly does it become an issue a few months later?

Surelly what Brexit is, if nothing else, is resurgent English nationalism unleashed by badly designed referendum, amplified by an out of date constitutional settlement in the UK, at a time when other nationalisms have been on the rise. The reasons behind that rise... who knows. The dominance of London. The rise of Scots separatism. Poor democratic representation in the EU. Various EU debt and monetary crises. Globalisation. Rapid technological change. It’s much, more complicated than ‘neoliberalism’, whatever that is.

 

[nickm]

How do you know?

That’s what Tories do, if allowed.

 

[RedSky]

No, for the time being I won't. The politicians who campaigned for Brexit profited hugely in the run up to the vote by being given respect that their conduct didn't warrant. Be it Boris, Fox, Davis or Farage, they all spread falsehoods about the UK's relationship with it's partners, invented grievances towards Brussels and played the ill informed electorate like a fiddle by promising a vague, but fantastic future should their invented grievances be removed.

You can respect them, don't expect me to please. I think the respect they've previously received by people who should have known better contributed to this mess.

Who the feck can respect those toss bags? The people you've listed lied to the general public and brushed it off as a laughing matter. cnuts of the highest order who should be prosecuted imo.

 

[Sweet Square]

Immigration was clearly a factor. It is too simplistic say it was politicians stirring racism/xenophobia. People have seen their communities change rapidly in a short space of time, perhaps too short. Did politicians pander to it a bit? Probably. Did they do enough to address some of the concerns that might have been triggered by rapid social change? Arguably, not enough.

The most anti immigrate communities are the ones with the least amount of immigration, yes their communities have been change but that has to with the changing nature of capitalism and the neoliberal policies that were put in place. Anti immigration sentiment is completely fear driven, the pandering isn't just a little bit, I've already mentioned the dystopian immigration vans but other such things as Blair doing a anti immigration speech at the white cliffs of dover, the media of course which both major parties(Until recently) has been firmly in the pocket of for the last 30 odd years.

The economy nearly crashed because the banks ran out of money, partly because they were badly regulated or not regulated at all. Austerity was because the Labour govt was running a deficit during a late stage boom, which is the opposite of what they should have been doing, and austerity was also politically popular. The Tories surprisingly won a majority with Cameron at the helm, partly because of it. So why suddenly does it become an issue a few months later?

Austerity was literally never needed, it was nothing but a way to hide class war and to cut the social state. As for the tory election win 2015, well simply the tory won because there wasn't a alternative anti austerity party, so people stayed home or just simply voted tory because they didn't have a alternative answer. When this alternative came about in 2017 in form of the Left win Labour Party, a hell of a lot of people voted for it.

It’s much, more complicated than ‘neoliberalism’, whatever that is.

Well yes that why I said it's played a major factor(It's of course not the only reason). Anyway if you have some spare time this stuff is worth checking out

Spoiler: Populism And The Limits Of Neoliberalism

http://blogs.lse.ac.uk/lsereviewofb...he-limits-of-neoliberalism-by-william-davies/

Spoiler: Neoliberalism - The Ideology At The Root Of All Our Problems

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2016/apr/15/neoliberalism-ideology-problem-george-monbiot

Spoiler

It Was The Democrats' Embrace Of Neoliberalism That Won It For Trump
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/nov/09/rise-of-the-davos-class-sealed-americas-fate

Spoiler: David Harvey - Neoliberalism

 

[Adebesi]

The Tories surprisingly won a majority with Cameron at the helm, partly because of it. So why suddenly does it become an issue a few months later?

Because people think/thought of austerity as the government no longer handing out free money to the feckless and undeserving poor. Until it affects them directly, with their waiting times for the GP rising, their local hospitals cutting certain services, their local libraries closing down or people they know losing their jobs. At which point they think "I didnt realise I was going to be affected by it."