Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

[Classical Mechanic]

That was based on a survey of just 456 zero-hours workers. It also said that 15% of people on zero-hours contracts want another job compared to 5% of people on normal contracts.

Here's a few interesting comments from the people who conducted it..





If you depend on that job to pay your rent/morgage, then you're living in permanent uncertainty. If you're not then presumably that's much more manageable. Not only would I like to see a survey done with the normally acceptable number of polling recipients, but also one that broke down a lot deeper into the lifestyles of the people being polled. A youngster still living at home is likely to give you extremely different responses to a parent for instance.

All that aside they don't come close to making up the UK - France employment rate disparity.

@JPRouve

That is correct. They work for a lot of people but some people are badly exploited on them. They should be better regulated rather than outlawed IMO.

Mike Ashley who owns Newcastle United was one of those exploitative employers through his Sports Direct company. He now claims to have cleaned up his act and offers guaranteed hours.

 

[Kentonio]

All that aside they don't come close to making up the UK - France employment rate disparity.

I'm sure they dont, and France has plenty of problems of its own. What I don't accept however is that the UK with its exploding growth of zero hour contracts, stagnating wages and diminishing workers rights is some champion of employment, while France who actually have good working conditions are the ones doing it wrong.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

I'm sure they dont, and France has plenty of problems of its own. What I don't accept however is that the UK with its exploding growth of zero hour contracts, stagnating wages and diminishing workers rights is some champion of employment, while France who actually have good working conditions are the ones doing it wrong.

I never said that the UK was a champion of employment. I was simply contrasting criticisms aimed at the UK and its economy.

 

[JPRouve]

All that aside they don't come close to making up the UK - France employment rate disparity.

@JPRouve

That is correct. They work for a lot of people but some people are badly exploited on them. They should be better regulated rather than outlawed IMO.

Mike Ashley who owns Newcastle United was one of those exploitative employers through his Sports Direct company. He now claims to have cleaned up his act and offers guaranteed hours.

On the employment rate in France, there are jobs but most of them are in or around Paris and not necessarily well paid, so since Paris is fairly expensive when it comes to rents, people aren't keen to move.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

On the employment rate in France, there are jobs but most of them are in or around Paris and not necessarily well paid, so since Paris is fairly expensive when it comes to rents, people aren't keen to move.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2006/apr/10/france.internationalnews

According to that it is broadly to do with French labour laws. Granted it is from 2006 but the unemployment rates have changed little.

@Kentonio look away now.

More recent, same story.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/hsbc-note-on-the-french-labour-market-and-economy-2016-3

 

[Kentonio]

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2006/apr/10/france.internationalnews

According to that it is broadly to do with French labour laws. Granted it is from 2006 but the unemployment rates have changed little.

@Kentonio look away now.

More recent, same story.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/hsbc-note-on-the-french-labour-market-and-economy-2016-3

Why would I look away? I'd rather have a 'stagnant' economy where people are properly paid and protected, than a 'vibrant' economy where the workers are treated like shit but the stockholders are getting great dividends.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Why would I look away? I'd rather have a 'stagnant' economy where people are properly paid and protected, than a 'vibrant' economy where the workers are treated like shit but the stockholders are getting great dividends.

But screw the poor saps that can't get a job at all right. London now has a French population as large as France's 6th largest city because there is nothing for them over there anymore.

What are these great rights that you get over there anyway?

 

[JPRouve]

But screw the poor saps that can't get a job at all right. London now has a French population as large as France's 6th largest city because there is nothing for them over there anymore.

What are these great rights that you get over there anyway?

I'm going to insist on that one, the reason for high unemployment isn't the contracts. It's the lack of mobility, the obsession with experience, the obsession with diplomas and a deficiency in professional training which makes careers changes more difficult.

And there is no particular great rights, other than an employer has to respect the contract he signed whether it is a CDI(undetermined duration contract) or a CDD(determined duration contract), you can only fire someone for serious misconduct.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

I'm going to insist on that one, the reason for high unemployment isn't the contracts. It's the lack of mobility, the obsession with experience, the obsession with diplomas and a deficiency in professional training which makes careers changes more difficult.

And there is no particular great rights, other than an employer has to respect the contract he signed whether it is a CDI(undetermined duration contract) or a CDD(determined duration contract), you can only fire someone for serious misconduct.

As an aside, what is the deal with property ownership there, do most people rent? If you do rent what bills or upkeep are you liable for?

 

[JPRouve]

As an aside, what is the deal with property ownership there, do most people rent? If you do rent what bills or upkeep are you liable for?

58% own their home which is in the low end in Europe. As for the bills, the usual gas, electricity, home insurance, syndic(I think that it's called trustee?).

 

[Stanley Road]

Thanks, in theory it looks like something that could be a good idea but I suspect that a lot managers abuse their flaws.

Oh totally, I'd never sign one. A day here a day there, feck that.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

58% own their home which is in the low end in Europe. As for the bills, the usual gas, electricity, home insurance, syndic(I think that it's called trustee?).

What if you get into retirement are with no property ownership does the state provide good accommodation?

 

[JPRouve]

What if you get into retirement are with no property ownership does the state provide good accommodation?

Not really but you can always ask for a HLM.

 

[Kentonio]

And there is no particular great rights, other than an employer has to respect the contract he signed whether it is a CDI(undetermined duration contract) or a CDD(determined duration contract), you can only fire someone for serious misconduct.

In most places RTT would be considered a pretty big perk. Also the compulsory bonus for profit sharing.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

In most places RTT would be considered a pretty big perk. Also the compulsory bonus for profit sharing.

What are the details?

 

[Kentonio]

What are the details?

RTT is a system that gives you a day off every month. On top of your normal holidays which are already good. The compulsory bonus thing I don't know the legal details, but its something like if your company is publicly listed and they make a decent profit they have to give you some of it. Last year a month after our normal yearly bonus we suddenly got given about a months pay because of this rule. Which was nice.

 

[JPRouve]

In most places RTT would be considered a pretty big perk. Also the compulsory bonus for profit sharing.

To be fair, I'm unable to make any comparison.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

RTT is a system that gives you a day off every month. On top of your normal holidays which are already good. The compulsory bonus thing I don't know the legal details, but its something like if your company is publicly listed and they make a decent profit they have to give you some of it. Last year a month after our normal yearly bonus we suddenly got given about a months pay because of this rule. Which was nice.

That would be nice. My company gives a profit related bonus at the end of the year only about 25% of a monthly salary in recent years though. What are the standard holidays over there?

 

[Kentonio]

The rules around sick days are the only area I think Britain have it better. I was shocked when I heard you have to have a doctors note for a single day off work in France. Also having a note when someone has died. That freaked me out.

 

[Kentonio]

That would be nice. My company gives a profit related bonus at the end of the year only about 25% of a monthly salary in recent years though. What are the standard holidays over there?

@JPRouve will probably be better able to tell you the details, I don't really concentrate enough. I just see days free and then use them.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

@JPRouve will probably be better able to tell you the details, I don't really concentrate enough. I just see days free and then use them.

36 days, 25 paid leave and the rest paid public holidays. The UK is 28 days leave but no obligation for the employer to pay the 8 days of public holiday, though my employer does.

The Yanks get 0 days paid holiday by law and 0 days paid public holidays!

 

[JPRouve]

That would be nice. My company gives a profit related bonus at the end of the year only about 25% of a monthly salary in recent years though. What are the standard holidays over there?

To make it simple, you have 2.5 days per months(or period of 24 days). The RTT are based on negotiations within the company or the branch you are working for.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

To make it simple, you have 2.5 days per months(or period of 24 days). The RTT are based on negotiations within the company or the branch you are working for.

So you can get 9.5 weeks of paid leave plus bank holidays! It is too much really. Not surprising it comes at a cost to the wider economy.

 

[JPRouve]

So you can get 9.5 weeks of paid leave plus bank holidays! It is too much really. Not surprising it comes at a cost to the wider economy.

You missed something or I did something wrong. https://www.french-property.com/news/french_life/france_holidays_rtt/

 

[Classical Mechanic]

You missed something or I did something wrong. https://www.french-property.com/news/french_life/france_holidays_rtt/

I got that off wiki. Stated as the maximum possible.

 

[JPRouve]

I got that off wiki. Stated as the maximum possible.

At the exception of teachers, no one get that.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

At the exception of teachers, no one get that.

Apparently you can get it working for Orange too!

 

[JPRouve]

Apparently you can get it working for Orange too!

Yeah, I forgot about Orange and EDF. In the case Orange it's disappearing and unjustified but in the case EDF their technicians are available 24/7, a few years ago half of the town went without electricity around 11PM, I was out with friends and we saw 6 or 7 EDF trucks within 15mn.

 

[Stanley Road]

I'm sure they dont, and France has plenty of problems of its own. What I don't accept however is that the UK with its exploding growth of zero hour contracts, stagnating wages and diminishing workers rights is some champion of employment, while France who actually have good working conditions are the ones doing it wrong.

And the Netherlands, we have zeros in abundance. Dont lets pretend its a uk thing.

 

[Stanley Road]

The rules around sick days are the only area I think Britain have it better. I was shocked when I heard you have to have a doctors note for a single day off work in France. Also having a note when someone has died. That freaked me out.

I had to show my mum and dads death certs to claim days off when they died. Humiliating.

 

[Chorley1974]

I'm sure they dont, and France has plenty of problems of its own. What I don't accept however is that the UK with its exploding growth of zero hour contracts, stagnating wages and diminishing workers rights is some champion of employment, while France who actually have good working conditions are the ones doing it wrong.

Have you any idea of how many global corporates are pulling their operations out of France because of the relatively massive pay offs etc?

 

[Kentonio]

Have you any idea of how many global corporates are pulling their operations out of France because of the relatively massive pay offs etc?

My global corporation is quite happy there. If a global corporation wants to leave because they don't want to look after staff in a decent manner though, good riddance to them. I'm tired of this attitude that we have to constantly reduce the standards of how normal working people get to live their lives, just to allow for larger profit margins.

 

[Kentonio]

I had to show my mum and dads death certs to claim days off when they died. Humiliating.

With me it wasn't someone quite that close, but it still made me genuinely angry when they asked. Then I realized that it really isn't anything strange there, it's just the system they are used to. Part of getting used to a new country I guess.

 

[Dobba]

Michael Caine has said he voted Brexit because he'd "rather be a poor master, than a rich servant".

...during a contractually obliged press day for his new film, written by Ted Melfi and directed by Zach Braff.

 

[onemanarmy]

So, as of 15th june, all roaming costs for mobile phones in the EU are disappearing. I guess due to the Brexit, this doesn't apply to the UK?

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

So, as of 15th june, all roaming costs for mobile phones in the EU are disappearing. I guess due to the Brexit, this doesn't apply to the UK?

It will apply for a little while at least until the UK leave. No chance after that I'd say.

 

[Fully Fledged]

Michael Caine has said he voted Brexit because he'd "rather be a poor master, than a rich servant".

...during a contractually obliged press day for his new film, written by Ted Melfi and directed by Zach Braff.

And when was the last time he was poor? He has no idea what it would be like being poor.

 

[Fully Fledged]

Is Mr Reckless who keeps changing political party a real person or a character from the Mr Men series?

 

[Cheesy]

Is Mr Reckless who keeps changing political party a real person or a character from the Mr Men series?

Reckless is a fantastically appropriate surname, but it might not be quite as good as the MEP who punched a guy whose surname is Hookem.

 

[devilish]

Reckless is a fantastically appropriate surname, but it might not be quite as good as the MEP who punched a guy whose surname is Hookem.

They only need Nigel to change his surname to idiot and the UKIP are done