So you were fine when we invaded Iraq?
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
- Thread starter Silva
- Start date
I fear you are right and defending the status quo against meaningless promises is difficult but the ray of hope I cling to is that Johnson is a hopeless when faced with the public. Seriously though, and speaking as someone who grew up in the north west of England, if the people of the non-metropolitan north fall for his bullshit (after voting leave), they deserve what’s coming.
where did I say anything about Iraq? Are we not allowed to agree with bLiar on anything, because we despise him for Iraq?
And for the record, No I'm wasn't fine with Iraq, was at the protest march and did countless other things at the time.
None of that means he's wrong about what he said in this VDO: You can be the devil incarnate, and still be right about stuff.
Last edited:
He wouldn't have but it's a useful narrative to use when it can't be tested.
What can be tested however is this idea of calling the Tories chicken because its been done a thousand times in parliament and TV interviews. Blair is not making some wise pitch no one else has thought of here.
There's not a person on these shores that doesn't understand the 2nd ref argument or the leave/remainers positions on it. Neither the public or MPs views are much swayed and parliament has not at any point had the numbers to pass it so it's irrelevant.
Surely we all know the Tory response to 2nd ref question verbatim by now?
IF you’re right, then I expect upcoming GE to be pretty identical to 2017 GE result.
You literally can’t say anything about Blair without some idiot screaming Iraq in your face.
I’d take Blair over any of this lot nowadays.
Which is exactly why this GE will be pointless.
I'm afraid you guys are being optimistic (or pessimistic depending on your own view).
Labour are going to have their working class vote squeezed by the Brexit Party and to a lesser extent the Tories, and their middle class vote sqeezed by the Lib Dems and Greens. Their attempt to placate both with their renegotiate then 2nd ref policy appeals to neither as it just proves they don't know, can't agree or won't admit what they want, so proving they can't be trusted to deliver for either and therefore driving those voters even further away.
Meanwhile the Tories have a clear message on Brexit which appeals to all but the craziest Brexiteers, and they have been positioning themselves for a GE by touting their new policies for months. Labour could win by attacking the Tories on the details of the deal, such as todays projection of the UK being £70bn p.a. worse off in 10 years, but not having a clear position themselves makes this much harder without drawing attention to their own weak position.
The only hope for a Tory defeat is a pact between the SNP, the Lib Dems, the Greens and Labour, but Labour will never do that.
I baffled anyone thinks this is going to be like the last GE. Labour are going to be hit badly. Last time they played the same line as the tories and promised to back the referendum result. No second Ref. They kept the vote in leave areas - This time well, for certain leave voters will not trust them, centrists don't like the direction Corbyn takes them in, Libdems are giving a clearer message for remainer's.
The only thing stopping the Tories gaining a large majority is if the Brexit vote is split in the same way Peterborough was, allowing Labour back in. I don't see that happening in the North East or Wales. Libdems might gain a few at Labour's expense too.
The only thing stopping the Tories gaining a large majority is if the Brexit vote is split in the same way Peterborough was, allowing Labour back in. I don't see that happening in the North East or Wales. Libdems might gain a few at Labour's expense too.
Just because Brexit dominates the headlines doesn't mean that's what people care about. Most people are sick of it and want to talk about the real issue in their lives. Like not being able to afford housing, bills or food. That's what people care about, but the Brexit media fascade isn't allowing that to come through. The narrative will change once policies come out. Those who care only about Brexit will vote single issue parties like The Brexit Party or the Lib Dems and those who care about what direction this country takes and how it will affect their lives will vote Labour and the Conservatives. If Conservatives will become a single issue party and allow Brexit to dominate their campaign they will be decimated.
The narrative is going to almost 100% Brexit and changing parliament for the better. Anyone who tries to move it away from that will be accused of not understanding the electorate. If you ignored your last manifesto, how do you get people to believe your new one? If you obstructed getting past brexit to the things most people care about how are going to make them believe you are capable of doing it?
I don't see how you can come to the conclusion the tories will be decimated when they have got exactly what they want even the exact day. The remain alliance capitulated from one day to the next, now it's just about picking up seats of each, bollocks to brexit indeed. The Brexit vote is going to be huge in England, people have been waiting to show exactly what they think of the last three years.
I don't see how you can come to the conclusion the tories will be decimated when they have got exactly what they want even the exact day. The remain alliance capitulated from one day to the next, now it's just about picking up seats of each, bollocks to brexit indeed. The Brexit vote is going to be huge in England, people have been waiting to show exactly what they think of the last three years.
But Brexit will have the biggest effect on people's lives whether they want it over and done with or not. Whatever promises any of the parties give they have to factor in Brexit - which if it happens could mean austerity x 2 or massive government borrowing or increasing taxes - the parties aren't going to say that are they? If Brexit happens it's not going to be a minor inconvenience, especially for the poor.
It doesn't matter. People up and down the country are incensed that Brexit is dominating everything while people are suffering. A lot don't care what happens with it and just want it over whichever way. What they want is for their lives to be improved and they don't see Brexit as a factor, as wrong as that may be it's just not a factor for the majority of people. Its the media that keeps asking the question so they only get the answers on Brexit. I'm hoping Labour will strongly campaign for their policies and leave Brexit as a footnote in their manifesto, this is what will win them votes and I strongly believe if the Conservatives will make theirs about Brexit that's what will lose them votes in the key Midland areas.
I'd prefer George W Bush.
They probably should do, given their ridiculous approach to it, but failing to recognise it's the only thing that people really care about would be our folly.
Believe me it looks that way because that's all what the media talk about but people are sick of it. They couldn't care less. In the Midlands, the key battlegrounds they care why can't they afford heating this winter or why their kids are going to school hungry or why teachers are asking for donations, not why isn't Brexit sorted yet. I talk to people who are long life Conservatives in very safe South East seats that are considering voting Labour because the state of services in this country is absolutely appalling.
All people in midlands can't feed their kids or afford to heat their houses? I didn't think it was that bad but maybe you are right if that's the case.
That's not what I've found. For my wife and I, plus most of the people we know, Brexit is the number one issue by a mile. Up in the Midlands and the like, that's where the GERRONWIVIT crowd are, spittle-flecked mouths, curved in rage. Highly doubt bleating about countryside broadband speeds will wash with them.
Maybe they are incensed but their suffering can only get worse because of Brexit.
But if Labour promise to make their life better with more spending on health or welfare etc where is this money coming from, especially if there is less money available than there is now, because of Brexit. Taxing the rich will just make the rich leave the country as they did in the 60s. In their 2017 manifesto it said their spending was fully costed, it wasn't because they thought they would carry on as before outside the EU with their fantasy proposal. If Labour said Brexit would be cancelled and they could then implement their policies, that would be more credible.
@Ultimate Grib
Surely the fact that people are sick of hearing about Brexit and just want it finished plays into Tory hands given they can campaign on a "vote for us and our deal so we can move on" basis, as opposed to Labour's "yet more negotiations and another referendum" approach? If Labour are depending on people simply ignoring Brexit as an issue then they're going to get stung. The fact that they're sick of Brexit and want it finished is an issue in and of itself.
Surely the fact that people are sick of hearing about Brexit and just want it finished plays into Tory hands given they can campaign on a "vote for us and our deal so we can move on" basis, as opposed to Labour's "yet more negotiations and another referendum" approach? If Labour are depending on people simply ignoring Brexit as an issue then they're going to get stung. The fact that they're sick of Brexit and want it finished is an issue in and of itself.
Possibly - though to be frank nobody should let that go un-challanged as simply put the real brexit negotiations for a free trade deal will probably be 5 to 10 years and there has to be a decision in summer 2020 as to if we extend the trade talks beyond the proposed 18 months... if the opposition parties are incompetent enough to let that narrative gain traction then they dont deserve power anyway
You can be the devil incarnate, and still be right about stuff.
Its what Boris tells himself everyday!
...I think this is the last chance...this is the last chance...is the last chance...last chance....chance …...echo continues to reverberate ...
Sorry I meant, I know it's the last chance.
There's that classic "I can only understand things in the simplest of terms" ideology that has helped the UK out quite well these last ten or so years.
Irony anyone?
Happy Brexit Day to one and all.
It's 2nd one we've had this year!Happy Brexit Day to one and all.
Can’t wait to leave the EU at 11pm
Brave man, declaring certainty about anything to do with Brexit is an act of total belief...ask Boris, especially today.
By the way has he been seen near any ditches?
Congratulations to the UK on your glorious independence.
Wait, I cannot remember whether an extension was approved or not?
Well either Boris will win a majority and the Uk leave or another hung parliament like now and the EU says "we've had enough, you've run out of excuses, stay or go but do something."
Any sign of Mark Francois or the promised riots and nationwide civil chaos?