Erik ten Hag | 2024/25 | Votes can now be changed

[LawCharltonBest]

Ratcliffe said that the decision to keep him was made before the new SLT was in place.

Berada has said the decision didn’t involve him because it was 2 months before he started.

Ashworth said the decision was made before he joined.


They’ve all washed their hands of him in public already. I think they will all be chomping at the bit to get their own man into the job.


I honestly think that the decision was made to keep him because they didn’t want to be lumbered with a new manager that Ashworth had no involvement in hiring. The new manager will represent the real start of the new era and will be chosen carefully.

This is the first opportunity the complete team have to sack him - it sounds like it will always be taken at these SLT meetings which happen once a month so the last one would have been at the start of September - too early if we were giving ETH a chance to prove himself.


He’s had his chance, he’s failed and they will be very much looking forward to getting their own hire in.

I think Ashworth, Berrada not being in place was a big factor. But I would say that there being no standout attainable hire is a bigger one

If there was an opportunity like when Liverpool and city got Klopp and Guardiola, then I think United would have taken it during the summer regardless of who was in place

If, as seems likely, Ten Hag survives the International break and is here for Brentford then I say it's due to there being nobody available who United are desperate to get. If Klopp called Ashworth today and said he'd be open to managing United then I think they'd shove Ten Hag's bicycle up his bum and boot him down the street.

 

[TsuWave]

Need to keep Gary Neville as far as away as possible from Manchester United

I don't think I've ever seen Gary have a good opinion regarding the club

 

[NinjaZombie]

If it's a "long term project" like he said post match vs Villa, why do we persist with Bruno?

 

[Fortitude]

Big, big issue at this club. Extends to fans too. Everyone seems to be more concerned with "optics" than doing what's required. I have held a theory that "back the manager" and "the united way" and the way sections of the United fanbase irrationally hold on to those notions are largely exercises on "not wanting to be like them other clubs." Nonsensical dogmas. Other clubs chop and change managers til they find one that works - at United sacking a manager has to be a ponderous process regardless of how awful or bad we're doing. We're 14th on the table, and there's people in this thread talking about "I want him sacked but only for the right manager" - what the feck does that even mean? Almost as bad as "we need to see him under a proper footballing structure" - when we're getting ran ragged by any team with a pulse and finishing 8th.

And this guy still gets applauded off the pitch at OT regardless of what shite he dishes out. Club just doesn't have that dawg in them.

The reality for all United supporters is that we have only known true success via managerial gods who both warrant shrines for their accomplishments. We de facto aren’t like other clubs because nobody else has all their European Cups and [post war] league titles via 2 managers. We are inherently and intrinsically unique and it has done a number on us as a supporter base - we talk the talk, but the reality is we are questing for The One, who picks up the baton from SAF, who in turn had it passed on from Busby because we know no different. Sentiment to the contrary is a bunch of words with no value.

The only way the collective mindset can change is if we run through a succession of relatively short-term appointments who buck the trend and win the major titles and move on, but the reality is, whoever comes to United and wins either will be given the keys to the city and anointed the next Neo in our matrix.

All of us, past and present are locked in that genjutsu whether knowing or unknowingly; many don’t seem to be aware, so the haughty stance isn’t so much about thinking we’re different; it’s in having zero connective tissue to the historical context of anyone else.

I know some posters really try to drive home the point that we need to get with the times and realities of modern football and the swiftness of the cull, but it’ll take a footballing structure from outside of the club’s dogma to come in and shatter that with total disregard for our past and how and why the pervading conscious and subconscious mindset exists; it’ll never come from the inside out because we are intrinsically woven into a tapestry created before most who post were born, and, by a magnitude of order, augmented by SAF for the rest.

A Di Matteo or Benitez of our own bumbling to a major trophy would do wonders for the collective psyche, for example, letting us know that truly, there is another way and it doesn’t have to be an anointed god who stays forever who can bring success or be a bridge along the way… but this swings back to the above; we’ll give a CL winning manager the keys to the city in a way other major clubs do not.

 

[dwd]

Ratcliffe said that the decision to keep him was made before the new SLT was in place.

Berada has said the decision didn’t involve him because it was 2 months before he started.

Ashworth said the decision was made before he joined.


They’ve all washed their hands of him in public already. I think they will all be chomping at the bit to get their own man into the job.


I honestly think that the decision was made to keep him because they didn’t want to be lumbered with a new manager that Ashworth had no involvement in hiring. The new manager will represent the real start of the new era and will be chosen carefully.

This is the first opportunity the complete team have to sack him - it sounds like it will always be taken at these SLT meetings which happen once a month so the last one would have been at the start of September - too early if we were giving ETH a chance to prove himself.


He’s had his chance, he’s failed and they will be very much looking forward to getting their own hire in.

So what your saying is it’s a big day?

 

[TheReligion]

Ratcliffe said that the decision to keep him was made before the new SLT was in place.

Berada has said the decision didn’t involve him because it was 2 months before he started.

Ashworth said the decision was made before he joined.


They’ve all washed their hands of him in public already. I think they will all be chomping at the bit to get their own man into the job.


I honestly think that the decision was made to keep him because they didn’t want to be lumbered with a new manager that Ashworth had no involvement in hiring. The new manager will represent the real start of the new era and will be chosen carefully.

This is the first opportunity the complete team have to sack him - it sounds like it will always be taken at these SLT meetings which happen once a month so the last one would have been at the start of September - too early if we were giving ETH a chance to prove himself.


He’s had his chance, he’s failed and they will be very much looking forward to getting their own hire in.

This is obviously what has happened.

I’m surprised many are too dense to see it.

 

[Shinjch]

If it's a "long term project" like he said post match vs Villa, why do we persist with Bruno?

The options to replace him are either permanently injured or totally unproven unfortunately.

 

[Berbaclass]

 

[Robbie Boy]

Is this actually true? I saw the pic of the comparison but would be great to have the proof in front of me. @RedSky

@RedSky needs to be paid a hefty consultancy fee for all the stats he provides!

 

[laughtersassassin]

If he survives this international break it's clearly just Ineos being stubborn about their decision I'm the summer.

They know he is shit and won't be good enough, everyone knows that so there is no reason not to sack him other than they are too embarrassed about how wrong they got it.

Was clear he should have been sacked in the summer but they fecked up and they know that.

 

[Berbaclass]

 

[Freak]

 

[Robbie Boy]

Fantastic advertising strategy from Dominos. Well played.

 

[TheReligion]

You must wonder who will be next to get a pizza the action

 

[Marwood]

But that's a fact for everybody. There is so much data and footage available that you severely limit yourself with a manager-driven approach to scouting. Sure it's good to have the manager looking at potential players to see if they fit his ideas, but any further involvement of the manager in the scouting process would just be stupid.

Neither Pep, Klopp or Arteta has had the final authority over transfers at their clubs. Seems to me to work rather better than our model.

Of course, what they have had is a good, close working relationship with a highly qualified management leadership group driven by similar ideas on what the club needs. Maybe that would be worth trying. Starting with hiring a manager who buys into that concept, as opposed to refusing a contract extension in order to keep a transfer regime based on the managers right to veto.

Agree guys it shouldn't be on the manager as the primary finder of talent.

My point is if a manager is a poor judge of a player that's a major problem. To me it's a fundamental part of his job.

Because they do have a say. None of us really know how it works but nobody can tell me Pep didn't have a major say for example in getting rid of Joe Hart.

 

[Fallon d'Floor]

What’s our win/loss record for the calendar year 2024 (and only including this years results is being generous)?

Surely all they need to do is look at that see all the evidence they need to make a call.

16 wins
11 draws
8 losses
1 penalty shootout win
1 penalty shootout loss
45.7% win rate

Of those 16 wins, they include wins over the likes of Wigan, Newport, Sheffield Utd, Southampton and Barnsley.

​	Games​	W​	W%​	D​	D%​	L​	L%​	GF​	GA​	GD​
All Comps​	35​	17​	48.6%​	9​	25.7%​	9​	25.7%​	68​	53​	+15​
PL Only​	25​	11​	44.0%​	5​	20.0%​	9​	36.0%​	40​	39​	+1​

Penalty shootouts are technically separate events to decide a game. The game usually goes down as a draw in the record books. That means it's 16 wins, 11 draws and 8 defeats. A win rate of 45.7%.

 

[devilsadvoca8]

You must wonder who will be next to get a pizza the action

Pizza gate at Old Trafford again. The good ol days. Arsenal fight in the tunnel.

 

[Blood Mage]

I do feel like it's only United managers who get subjected to these brutal public humiliations when they fail, but I guess it's inevitable given the size of the club.

 

[hellhunter]

I do feel like it's only United managers who get subjected to these brutal public humiliations when they fail, but I guess it's inevitable given the size of the club.

It is incredibly harsh, but it also comes with the terrain of not putting failing managers out of their misery sooner

 

[Sarni]

Our fixtures post international break all look quite winnable. I can see him getting a result against Brentford and Leicester, and the pendulum swinging in his favor once more.

 

[Robbie Boy]

I do feel like it's only United managers who get subjected to these brutal public humiliations when they fail, but I guess it's inevitable given the size of the club.

True. But, it's probably also to do with the fact that we allow things to get to absolute rock bottom.

 

[Skills]

The reality for all United supporters is that we have only known true success via managerial gods who both warrant shrines for their accomplishments. We de facto aren’t like other clubs because nobody else has all their European Cups and [post war] league titles via 2 managers. We are inherently and intrinsically unique and it has done a number on us as a supporter base - we talk the talk, but the reality is we are questing for The One, who picks up the baton from SAF, who in turn had it passed on from Busby because we know no different. Sentiment to the contrary is a bunch of words with no value.

The only way the collective mindset can change is if we run through a succession of relatively short-term appointments who buck the trend and win the major titles and move on, but the reality is, whoever comes to United and wins either will be given the keys to the city and anointed the next Neo in our matrix.

All of us, past and present are locked in that genjutsu whether knowing or unknowingly; many don’t seem to be aware, so the haughty stance isn’t so much about thinking we’re different; it’s in having zero connective tissue to the historical context of anyone else.

I know some posters really try to drive home the point that we need to get with the times and realities of modern football and the swiftness of the cull, but it’ll take a footballing structure from outside of the club’s dogma to come in and shatter that with total disregard for our past and how and why the pervading conscious and subconscious mindset exists; it’ll never come from the inside out because we are intrinsically woven into a tapestry created before most who post were born, and, by a magnitude of order, augmented by SAF for the rest.

A Di Matteo or Benitez of our own bumbling to a major trophy would do wonders for the collective psyche, for example, letting us know that truly, there is another way and it doesn’t have to be an anointed god who stays forever who can bring success or be a bridge along the way… but this swings back to the above; we’ll give a CL winning manager the keys to the city in a way other major clubs do not.

Good post.

For such a huge club with our resources and attraction, our ceiling is actually quite low. Unless we land on another Ferguson or Busby (which we have no right to do - and ignores the fact, most modern managers don't have any interest or ability to manage a club long term) our potential/ceiling is closer to Spurs than Real Madrid.

We desperately needed the Qatari's, and as usual in the last 10 years - when it came down to it, we ended up with the worst of the 2 choices on offer.

 

[Tiber]

Ratcliffe will bottle it. Ten Hag needs to go but sacking him now involves admitting Ineos massively fecked up.

It will likely drag out until Christmas, leaving the next guy with less chance to get some sort of improvement out of the squad

 

[UnitedSofa]

I do feel like it's only United managers who get subjected to these brutal public humiliations when they fail, but I guess it's inevitable given the size of the club.

Feels distasteful to me

 

[RedSky]

@RedSky needs to be paid a hefty consultancy fee for all the stats he provides!

Neville managed 28 Games (all comps). He only had a 35.7% win rate at Valencia so if you compare his record to all of ETH's results then no it's not remotely close. If however you look at ETH's previous 28 games managed then it's as follows:

Manager​	Games​	W​	W%​	D​	D%​	L​	L%​	GF​	GA​	GD​
ETH​	28​	11​	39.29%​	8​	28.57%​	9​	32.14%​	49​	44​	+5​
Neville​	28​	10​	35.71%​	7​	25.00%​	11​	39.29%​	39​	38​	+1​

Still not as bad as Neville but not far off. If you compare their league form, Neville managed 16 La Liga games, so taking ETH's previous 16 League games you get:

Manager​	Games​	W​	W%​	D​	D%​	L​	L%​	GF​	GA​	GD​
ETH​	16​	5​	31.25%​	5​	31.25%​	6​	37.50%​	22​	26​	-4​
Neville​	16​	3​	18.75%​	5​	31.25%​	8​	50.00%​	15​	25​	-10​

So again, not as bad as Neville. But not as far away as you might think.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

 

[horsechoker]

I do feel like it's only United managers who get subjected to these brutal public humiliations when they fail, but I guess it's inevitable given the size of the club.

And arguably because we keep them on too long.

 

[Tiber]

Our fixtures post international break all look quite winnable. I can see him getting a result against Brentford and Leicester, and the pendulum swinging in his favor once more.

If his positive spin involves clinging on on a week by week basis by squeezing out an occasional win against a bottom half side Just put the poor man out of his misery ffs

Though he is so arrogant he would no doubt find a way to spin beating a newly promoted side as some sort of great achievement

 

[Tom Van Persie]

Feels distasteful to me

It's shite humour but some of these brands will do anything to go viral.

 

[laughtersassassin]

I do feel like it's only United managers who get subjected to these brutal public humiliations when they fail, but I guess it's inevitable given the size of the club.

It wouldn't happen if they got sacked much quicker. We drag it out by months or years which is what causes this shit.

 

[DJ_21]

The only reason he’s still in a job is because they don’t want to pay out the compensation. After giving him a new deal in the summer they’d look stupid. Although it’s going to affect us in the longer term.

 

[pratyush_utd]

How is this allowed? Isnt this harassment ?

 

[RedRover]

I think Ashworth, Berrada not being in place was a big factor. But I would say that there being no standout attainable hire is a bigger one

If there was an opportunity like when Liverpool and city got Klopp and Guardiola, then I think United would have taken it during the summer regardless of who was in place

If, as seems likely, Ten Hag survives the International break and is here for Brentford then I say it's due to there being nobody available who United are desperate to get. If Klopp called Ashworth today and said he'd be open to managing United then I think they'd shove Ten Hag's bicycle up his bum and boot him down the street.

Other clubs don't need a "standout candidate" lined up to sack a manager who is objectively failing.

I've made this point a few times on here. Klopp and Pep are the elite managers in world football. Below them are a load of mostly younger, talented managers, one or two of whom will be the next elite managers. Our "best in class" footballing structure need to do their job and identify who we should get.

Liverpool lost Klopp and have made a call on a replacement. Chelsea have changed their manager. Spurs and Villa did it to some measure of success. None of those managers are "standout candidates", especially Slot at Liverpool after Klopp.

Sticking with Ten Hag is rewarding failure. We're not getting an elite manager - the football people need to do the job they're handsomely paid for. It's what Ratcliffe alluded to in the interview last week, he's paying people to make these decisions.

Sacking him is the right decision. If they're paralysed by indecision the future under INEOS looks bleak.

 

[Shark]

It wouldn't happen if they got sacked much quicker. We drag it out by months or years which is what causes this shit.

After we finished bottom of that CL group I'm convinced that was the time 90% of clubs at our stature would have gotten rid. Not even our stature.

 

[RedRover]

The only reason he’s still in a job is because they don’t want to pay out the compensation. After giving him a new deal in the summer they’d look stupid. Although it’s going to affect us in the longer term.

He didn't get a new contract, they activated an option.

 

[Skills]

I do feel like it's only United managers who get subjected to these brutal public humiliations when they fail, but I guess it's inevitable given the size of the club.

In terms of humiliation nothing will really top "Ole's at the Wheel" ringing out of the away section at OT after Liverpool put 5 past us.

 

[Skills]

After we finished bottom of that CL group I'm convinced that was the time 90% of clubs at our stature would have gotten rid. Not even our stature.

Most clubs would actually sack him to try and salvage that group in the first place. Should've gone in October.

 

[FrankDrebin]

I do feel like it's only United managers who get subjected to these brutal public humiliations when they fail, but I guess it's inevitable given the size of the club.

I remember Emery being mocked quite heavily at Arsenal.

 

[stevoc]

The reality for all United supporters is that we have only known true success via managerial gods who both warrant shrines for their accomplishments. We de facto aren’t like other clubs because nobody else has all their European Cups and [post war] league titles via 2 managers. We are inherently and intrinsically unique and it has done a number on us as a supporter base - we talk the talk, but the reality is we are questing for The One, who picks up the baton from SAF, who in turn had it passed on from Busby because we know no different. Sentiment to the contrary is a bunch of words with no value.

The only way the collective mindset can change is if we run through a succession of relatively short-term appointments who buck the trend and win the major titles and move on, but the reality is, whoever comes to United and wins either will be given the keys to the city and anointed the next Neo in our matrix.

All of us, past and present are locked in that genjutsu whether knowing or unknowingly; many don’t seem to be aware, so the haughty stance isn’t so much about thinking we’re different; it’s in having zero connective tissue to the historical context of anyone else.

I know some posters really try to drive home the point that we need to get with the times and realities of modern football and the swiftness of the cull, but it’ll take a footballing structure from outside of the club’s dogma to come in and shatter that with total disregard for our past and how and why the pervading conscious and subconscious mindset exists; it’ll never come from the inside out because we are intrinsically woven into a tapestry created before most who post were born, and, by a magnitude of order, augmented by SAF for the rest.

A Di Matteo or Benitez of our own bumbling to a major trophy would do wonders for the collective psyche, for example, letting us know that truly, there is another way and it doesn’t have to be an anointed god who stays forever who can bring success or be a bridge along the way… but this swings back to the above; we’ll give a CL winning manager the keys to the city in a way other major clubs do not.

That's a big worry to be honest. Look at the reaction from sections of the fanbase because Ten Hag won the FA Cup.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Neville managed 28 Games (all comps). He only had a 35.7% win rate at Valencia so if you compare his record to all of ETH's results then no it's not remotely close. If however you look at ETH's previous 28 games managed then it's as follows:

Manager​	Games​	W​	W%​	D​	D%​	L​	L%​	GF​	GA​	GD​
ETH​	28​	11​	39.29%​	8​	28.57%​	9​	32.14%​	49​	44​	+5​
Neville​	28​	10​	35.71%​	7​	25.00%​	11​	39.29%​	39​	38​	+1​

Still not as bad as Neville but not far off. If you compare their league form, Neville managed 16 La Liga games, so taking ETH's previous 16 League games you get:

Manager​	Games​	W​	W%​	D​	D%​	L​	L%​	GF​	GA​	GD​
ETH​	16​	5​	31.25%​	5​	31.25%​	6​	37.50%​	22​	26​	-4​
Neville​	16​	3​	18.75%​	5​	31.25%​	8​	50.00%​	15​	25​	-10​

So again, not as bad as Neville. But not as far away as you might think.

@spwd