SNP for me too and I'm in England.
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
- Thread starter Silva
- Start date
Could start getting some branches going down south. Can start in Berwick, basically ours anyway.
Alright, thanks a lot. So just to follow up: If you're very pro independence, the best to hope for would perhaps be that the UK manages a sort of deal with the EU wich would allow Scotland and England to have no border, while also not being comprehensive enough to undermine the pro-EU sentiment in Scotland, allowing the build-up for another referendum?
Who could have seen that coming?
Oh wait.
Oh wait.
Guardian said:
I don't know how people haven't understood yet that he has absolutely no desire to lead the country or help it any way. All he wants is to be a thorn in the government's side, and that's all he's ever wanted since the 70s. He will attempt to derail any and every Brexit plan the government comes up with.
A lot of the Leavers in those constituencies already were voting Tory/UKIP though. Around a third of Labour voters opted for Brexit - in plenty of those constituencies that third would've been enough to tip them over the edge. This sort of logic is the type that was used in 2017 by people who thought that a ton of Labour constituencies in the north would swing to UKIP because they'd voted to Leave.
Which is the most annoying thing for almost two years nothing has been done regarding Brexit absolutely nothing of note and people such as myself, yourself and others are being used as pawns.
Yes I could go for German Nationality I have lived here long enough, I am married to a German but in the time period left it wouldn't be through before Brexit and normally according to German Law I cannot have two if the UK is no longer in the EU, there are some exceptions possible but whether I would qualify for both I do not know and being honest I am loathe to give up my British Nationality if it came to choosing.
Pretty sure Corbyn won the leadership to stop this kind of approach to policy making.
Thanks for the link Oates I could access the page and have voted as such a thing would be beneficial to the people living in another country after Brexit retaining the right to live and work where you will. I would certainly hope that nothing changes regarding the health and social services seeing that I have been paying into the German system for almost thirty years now and would be mightily peeved if there were changes there.
That tells us nothing useful. It’s not as though Leave won by a landslide and for all we know the non-Labour voters that they need to win over in those constituencies (e.g. young people) could be most tempted to jump ship by a Labour party that is pro-EU.
And his own MPs kept trying to replace him with someone who would reach out to all sides of the party. To be fair to them most of his biggest rebels are on his side regarding this there's only a minority who want Labour to only represent remainers.
Indeed, there's a bizarre assumption wherein Labour Brexiteers (the minority) will leave the party the moment they stop backing Brexit, whereas the majority of Remainers will remain faithful no matter what. In spite of the fact that many of those Brexiteers were voting for the pro-EU party in spite of their own anti-EU sentiments, and in spite of the fact that they continued to vote for the party in 2017 even though there were much stronger pro-Brexit options they could've went for.
I'm not sure how that applies to the point he's making though. When Corbyn came in polling numbers and projections were ignored because members believed he was ultimately doing the right thing, and that the results would come once his policies and ideology were explained properly. Now Remainers make the same arguments about Brexit but are dismissed by polling numbers, previous results and projections. Almost as if those previous arguments concocted by some of Corbyn's fans were just excuses to justify his failings.
Unfortunately you can’t triangulate remain and leave and at some point Labour will have to come out with a concrete policy (not the waffle Starmer came out with yesterday).
IMO, that means offering a Second Referendum if Labour is elected, campaigning for Remain in that campaign and making it clear that, under Labour, there will be no return to June 2016 and they will start addressing the social and regional inequalities that fuelled Leave and were cynically exploited by Cummings and Farage and wrongly blamed on the EU. Unfortunately, however, I think Corbyn genuinely wants to Leave and I am not even sure he is that interested in governing.
I took the decision in April 2017 after A50 was triggered to apply for French nationality and it came through after 16/17 months so now I have both. I had no intention of becoming a pawn in anyone's game.
I was more concerned about travelling within the EU than anything.
If I had to choose now I would rescind my UK citizenship without any concern.
No mention at all that Corbyn and McDonnell are lifelong Brexiters who are too cowardly to admit it to their own party, and their supporters just can't face up to this so have to pretend they're for Brexit out of some cunning electoral masterplan, however much they don't believe in it, and however much damage it will cause. How's that for 'a bit of perspective'?
The sooner the Labour left admit they've a problem, ditch their current leaders, and replace them with someone to the left but honest and at least vaguely competent the better it will be for all of us.
David Lammy talking sense again:
All I'm saying is that it's not surprising that a leader who faced constant attack to be more electable has now chosen to go with the option that doesn't alienate a considerable number of Labour voters.
I don't like him turning his back on the membership but it's what the majority of his MPs wanted and they got what they wished.
Well yes but he isn't choosing the root that makes him more electable because there's little evidence to suggest their current approach is working, either through current polling or in what will happen afterwards. And the argument he's doing this to make him more 'electable' again becomes more suspicious when you remember he's spent most of his life as a bit of a Brexiteer anyway.
The great majority of Labour MPs are anti-Brexit aren't they?
Possibly, motive matters little its still the outcome most of his MPs want.
The polling would be way worse if they'd been stronger on a referendum or cancelling brexit. Of course they could come out with some master brexit plan that solves all the issues but there isn't one so moving towards even a permanent customs union is a win over Mays plan.
Party, individual and constituency politics are all very seperate things. If they're all for cancelling brexit they're doing a bad job of showing it.
Yes but many are MPs of Leave areas.
On a wider point, an issue with politics from 2015 onwards has been the too simplistic view from many “Liberal” types that:
Remain = Left Wing and Good
Brexit = Right Wing and Bad
There should have been more nuance in the discussion.
Tory MPs (and some Labour) who allowed the disenfranchisement and helped put in the foundations for an idea like Brexit are screaming about the dangers of it and trying to get the disenfranchised back on side. Perhaps if they had engaged more before...
They are indeed different things, and yes the MPs are doing a bad job of showing it, it's understandable you were misled.
Indeed. If only the dear leader could be as sensible, and as honest, the UK's prospects would look much better.
This is fair but also doesn't really help when Brexit is a matter of literal weeks away, and is a process that will feck over the disenfranchised far more than anything that's come before if it isn't dealt with properly.
I think for younger folk you have a point with this, the older ones amongst us remember that it used to be very much the left wing of Labour that were very anti-Europe, and the centrists were pro. Corbyn and McDonnell are of course the remnants of that.
Yes but screaming “racist” or “bigot” at anyone (hello James O’Brien) who is anti EU didn’t work in 2016 and it won’t work now.
If you stopped Brexit now, you’d see support for Far Right groups/parties increase because people will feel even more like they’re not being listened to. They’ll jump into supporting Tommy Robinson and co
It’s been interesting seeing the obvious backlash from that Tory MP being called a Nazi. That and “Fascist” are often overused by many Centrists, Liberals etc to describe anyone whos even slightly critical of certain elements of the EU or Globalisation.
Of course not, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't call out racist or bigotry when it's actually displayed. And plenty has been on show. Similarly the stupid of certain politicians trying to implement Brexit should be called out as well.
So Brexiters who supposedly are not rascists or bigots would support a rascist and a bigot. OK then.
It's probably your negative posts causing the pound to fall.
Should be interesting next week. A bit of movement I suspect.
Corbyn is a hopeless case.
Bizarre, isn't it?
"I'm not a racist. So to prove I'm not, I'm going to...become a racist!"
We should always call out Racism and Bigotry.
The issue is many (some potentially reasonable) issues that people have with the EU are all seen as the same as the "let's get rid of all the foreigners".
What time is the vote expected to happen?
I work for a foreign exchange company and they're warning us that we might have to work longer on Tuesday/Wednesday if the pound plummets.