It's not a huge sum in the grand scheme of countries and their economies, but it isn't insignificant either. It's more than our entire yearly military budget for example.
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It's not a huge sum in the grand scheme of countries and their economies, but it isn't insignificant either. It's more than our entire yearly military budget for example.
A really big bouncy castle.
Strong and Stable.
Yes but it's payable over years , not in one go. If the UK left without a deal it would reduce to about 24bn or so. And the UK would lose a hell of lot more than 39bn in future trade and goodwill notwithstanding the world watching on.
Agreed
Don't agree at all.
Firstly you say that 39bn is not a massive sum of money. Really. Ask the schools or NHS or Police or the electorate whether they agree. I think I know the answer.
Secondly. Why not threaten it. Remember. I did not say we should not pay it. I simple said that faced with an unacceptable withdrawal bill we should decide on the terms of the payment.
As I said the withdrawal agreement is not going to change so threatening is a bit of a waste of energy, it would just mean that the future relationship would be soured.
As I said it's over years that it is paid not in one go - The Uk are losing far more than £39bn by leaving the EU, the NHS Police and schools are short of money because of the Tory policies not because the UK are in the EU. When the Uk have left the government will have lost its scapegoat.
It's not all about money.
One customer we had was putting a lot of business our way. However, they turned out to be the most unholy pain in the arse. Literally on the phone every five minutes, generally about nothing or stuff that turned out to be their fault.
They then sent in a different package work for us to quote on which, in money terms at least would be more lucrative than the previous one.
We concluded that the aggro wasn't worth it. So we stuck in ridiculous prices and said if they want us to do it then that's what they would have to pay.
They found somebody else.
We were prepared to take the hit for the reduction in hassle.
The ERG headbangers that think walking away will have the EU running after us are deluded.
David Davis claiming on QT last night that WTO is jolly fine and dandy (notice he didn't mention that it flies in the face of the GFA), is either thick or has money staked on the outcome he is trying to force this country into.
This is as good as it gets and unless we are is prepared to put it back to the people, and accept whatever is decided (after having spent tens of millions cleaning up the UK streets and rebuilding damaged premises), then we should take what is on the table.
One customer we had was putting a lot of business our way. However, they turned out to be the most unholy pain in the arse. Literally on the phone every five minutes, generally about nothing or stuff that turned out to be their fault.
They then sent in a different package work for us to quote on which, in money terms at least would be more lucrative than the previous one.
We concluded that the aggro wasn't worth it. So we stuck in ridiculous prices and said if they want us to do it then that's what they would have to pay.
They found somebody else.
We were prepared to take the hit for the reduction in hassle.
The ERG headbangers that think walking away will have the EU running after us are deluded.
David Davis claiming on QT last night that WTO is jolly fine and dandy (notice he didn't mention that it flies in the face of the GFA), is either thick or has money staked on the outcome he is trying to force this country into.
This is as good as it gets and unless we are is prepared to put it back to the people, and accept whatever is decided (after having spent tens of millions cleaning up the UK streets and rebuilding damaged premises), then we should take what is on the table.
Will it though? It's not hard to imagine them switching their scapegoat from "the EU" to "the terrible deal the EU gave us".
well we will be spending 87bn on education next year
https://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/uk_education_spending_20.html
Of the 39bn some of this extends out to 2064 though about half falls in 2019 and 2020
https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainers/eu-divorce-bill
so lets say about 10bn in 2019
so around 11% of the education budget
or around 1% of total government spend
or if you like half a percent of our UK debt
So when you look at the bigger picture I think its fair to say its actually not a massive sum of money is it.
This isn't really true. The UK is utterly incompetent over Brexit but there's an element of self-flagellation in some remainers that is just as deluded.
Firstly, plenty of countries have opt-outs in the EU for all manor of things, this is not unique at all to Britain.
Secondly, it ignores the reason these opt out and special measures exists in the first place. Britain's rebate for example wasn't some Britain throwing a childish tantrum. Rather Britain already disproportionately contributed to the budget, and secondly the CAP, a huge use of funds, and a completely incompetent policy, was not much use to Britain with its small agricultural section, but countries like France who benefit massively blocked reform despite the issues being there for all to see.
Britain's rebate is in response to this.
Well yes, probably, it's always someone else's fault.
The pound's collapse against all major currencies since the Brexit vote has cost the country and its people way WAY more than the £39bn. I don't need to ask schools, police or the NHS anything about that either. I find it quite humorous when Brexiteers (don't mean you specifically) bring up the issue of EU payments in one sentence making a big deal of it. While in the next sentence they non-nonchalantly mention they'd be OK with the country taking a financial hit from loss of trade in the short/medium term, if it results in UK regaining full sovereignty. I mean do you care about money, or do you not?
A threat that you're not willing to follow through with, is an empty threat. And when following through could likely lead to a breakdown of bilateral trade relations and loss of trade for both, but primarily the UK, it's akin to cutting of your nose to spite your face.
It will somehow end up being the fault of the disabled, followed by a lot of shit about "helping people who need help".
Aren't those 39bn payments that the UK already commited to before Brexit happened? I don't know what legal steps the EU would have to go after that money, but at best the UK would be screaming to the whole world (especially the parts that they then desperately have to negotiate trade deals with) that they have no problem breaking their word or even contracts. Not to mention what could happen if one of the biggest trading blocs, that makes up all your neighbours gets vindictive.
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Yeah let's not pay our debts before we go out to the world for trade agreements including to the one we've refused to pay. What could go wrong.
Defaulting on our debts won't send the best message to the world markets at all. I'd be interested to see if it had any impact on gilts for instance
I think the application is probably more hassle than paying €7. Maybe this will sound elitist but if you quibble over €7 you probably shouldn't be going abroad.
Not so mad Mike as you make a good argument. By the way I voted to remain pretty much for the reasons you make.
I have no affinity for the EU. My primary reason for voting to remain was an economic one. I simply could not envisage a way that we would be better off by leaving. Certainly not in the short term anyway.
Moreover, the UK economy was still struggling to come out of recession following the global financial crisis and IMHO the referendum could not have come at a worse time.
I lay the blame for that firmly with David Cameron who took this country into the referendum for the wrong reasons.
Seven euros.... That might be like 20 grand by the time Johnson or Corbyn is pm
Who said we should default on our debts.
I was making the case for using the settlement as part of the negotiation and if pushed we should extend the payment timescales. That was all.
Do you think that Italy or Spain for example would be so cooperative?
If one quibbles about twenty-thousand British pounds, they ought not to go on holiday.
I'm pretty sure Spain is a net recipient from the EU so I guess the negotiations would be totally different?
this time next year we will all be millionaires
If one quibbles about twenty-thousand British pounds, they ought not to go on holiday.
this time next year we will all be millionaires
You never know, if Sterling collapses and we get hyper inflation
indeed - thats kinda where i was going with it...You never know, if Sterling collapses and we get hyper inflation
I have a a feeling my holiday homes might be worth more than my actual home in 12 months
If one quibbles about twenty-thousand British pounds, they ought not to go on holiday.
Wait till they get their mobile phone bill when they get back home - 5 gazillion pounds
was it Ian Hislop who said this?
In fairness he's a very decent writer (I enjoyed reading The Churchill Factor, even if it is obvious he's a fanboy) and in some ways think he is probably an intelligent man, but in terms of helping govern a country?
No ... just no.
nah - there wont be any planes to get us back home
Come on...the guy shops in Primark, FGS...
A bit like starving the Irish..........
I see easyjet have started advertising flights after march from uk to Europe, that was not the case a few weeks ago. How can they be sure they can honour these tix?
London is the world's busiest air-hub and if all the Brit's are having to fill out visa's (and vice versa?) go to to EU countries, god knows the absolute chaos it's going to cause at the start.
Anyway, enjoy being in the customs line lads, I'll be off through the EU citizens gates, see you in about 2 hours.
Anyway, enjoy being in the customs line lads, I'll be off through the EU citizens gates, see you in about 2 hours.
I cant even remember showing my visa when I went to oz
The EU have insisted yet again that the withdrawal agreement will not be amended. So what are British parliament going to do? Still dream of unicorns.
yeah but you're old and forgetful Stanley.