Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

Do you think there will be a Deal or No Deal?

  • Total voters
    194
  • Poll closed .
fishfingers15 said:
I read Ninjafletch's post and I think Corbyn should do something and I read other posts and I think Labour should hold on and let this government destroy themselves. :(

Although I'm not living in England so I'm not affected by this immediately.
Click to expand...

Problem is, the government has been destroying itself for a year and nothing's changed. It might, under any normal scenario, be a good play, but we're far beyond normal.

Dobba said:
So if I'm more positive, the Tories who can't be bothered to rally hard enough to trigger a party leadership challenge will vote against May? Even Anna Soubry, who also on James O'Brien's show last week tried to make out that (other than Brexit) the Tories were doing great things, will vote against May? Is that all that's been stopping the Tories from being defeated, me knowing how two-faced Tory twats work?
Click to expand...

It doesn't matter if it's them or backbenchers. It doesn't matter if they're Remainers or hardline cultist No Dealers, it doesn't matter if they're pissed and stagger in to the wrong lobby. We're talking wafer thin margins and almost unprecedented hostility from within the Conservative party towards their own leader.

They may fall into line and vote with the government, but then they would be the ones who should be criticised. Failing to even attempt to exploit absolutely blatant divisions in the Conservative party at the cost of absolutely nothing is a gigantic missed opportunity.
 
NinjaFletch said:
It doesn't matter if it's them or backbenchers. It doesn't matter if they're Remainers or hardline cultist No Dealers, it doesn't matter if they're pissed and stagger in to the wrong lobby. We're talking wafer thin margins and almost unprecedented hostility from within the Conservative party towards their own leader.

They may fall into line and vote with the government, but then they would be the ones who should be criticised. Failing to even attempt to exploit absolutely blatant divisions in the Conservative party at the cost of absolutely nothing is a gigantic missed opportunity.
Click to expand...
The two people you picked out earlier have already done just that when given a chance to bring the government down on Brexit and they will do so again. As Soubry said on LBC, 'Corbyn is a much greater threat to our country [than Brexit]. No doubt at all.'
 
Don't see how any of this resolved amicably..

1. NI backstop option will never pass parliament
2. EU won't accept deal without backstop..
3. Could do second referendum.. but then you ignite a political civil war.. what's to stop a third referendum if remain wins?

The only way it could work is if the EU compromises on the backstop.. but realisitically there's no feasible way to align NI and Ireland trade without border checks in the case of a no deal. The only way really everything works in terms of trade is if the UK remains, but then you go against the first referendum and a lot of the Conservative leavers.. very messy.. as you'd expect in a situation where half the country wants to leave and half wants to remain, more than half of politicians want to remain but a significant amount want to carry out the result of the referendum.. and the EU have no incentive to comprimise.. very hard to see how a deal is done.

I think 90% of what goes through parliament will be rejected as there's no real solution to the NI issue.. so the most likely outcome will be a No Deal. Will be interesting to see how it plays out. I'd love to short the pound but just too many variables to really be certain of how it plays out.
 
Dobba said:
The two people you picked out earlier have already done just that when given a chance to bring the government down on Brexit and they will do so again. As Soubry said on LBC, 'Corbyn is a much greater threat to our country [than Brexit]. No doubt at all.'
Click to expand...

example
[ig-zam-puh l, -zahm-]

noun
  1. one of a number of things, or a part of something, taken to show the character of the whole
  2. a pattern or model, as of something to be imitated or avoided
  3. an instance serving for illustration; specimen
You'll also note that it was an example deployed specifically in the context, both times, of Conservatives needing to take flak for putting party before country.
 
sun_tzu said:
I'm sure somehow it would be Blair's fault...
Click to expand...
There's some weird conversations going on regarding no confidence. MPs do on occasion vote against their own party's official line, they also call for a new party leader sometimes, but it's extremely unlikely any would vote against their own party in a no confidence motion, and no one would seriously expect them to do so. What Corbyn could do is persuade the other opposition parties to join him and vote no confidence, and there are enough of them to win, although he would have to time it for when the DUP were so pissed off with May they would join him. Or bribe them, whichever.
 
711 said:
There's some weird conversations going on regarding no confidence. MPs do on occasion vote against their own party's official line, they also call for a new party leader sometimes, but it's extremely unlikely any would vote against their own party in a no confidence motion, and no one would seriously expect them to do so. What Corbyn could do is persuade the other opposition parties to join him and vote no confidence, and there are enough of them to win, although he would have to time it for when the DUP were so pissed off with May they would join him. Or bribe them, whichever.
Click to expand...

No one is arguing otherwise. We're full-blown in the midst of a constitutional crisis, though, and that tends to make weird things happen.
 
I mean France rioted and got what they wanted plus increased minimum wage.....so....balaclava time?
 
Dobba said:
He's far too busy somehow being the poster boy for a movement that is trying to make mass marches through London into events politicians shouldn't ignore, with a straight face. That's before we get onto his lucrative work with the House of Saud.
Click to expand...

David Icke made a great point recently regarding the direction of the Labour party over the past 10-15 years. He says that the Labour Party was formed to protect the urban, working-class, people from the 'elite'. But people like Blair, & dare I say it, Corbyn, are now becoming the elite. There isn't that much democracy anymore here in the western world. We basically have 2 choices, with neither of them really offering anything that remotely resembles a brighter future. I shudder to think what the years ahead will hold for my children & my grandchildren if the EU's plans for a superstate come to fruition. We have very little say in what happens now regarding our country's affairs. It's little wonder that people are looking to the extreme choices in order for their voices to be heard.
 
redman5 said:
David Icke made a great point recently regarding the direction of the Labour party over the past 10-15 years. He says that the Labour Party was formed to protect the urban, working-class, people from the 'elite'. But people like Blair, & dare I say it, Corbyn, are now becoming the elite. There isn't that much democracy anymore here in the western world. We basically have 2 choices, with neither of them really offering anything that remotely resembles a brighter future. I shudder to think what the years ahead will hold for my children & my grandchildren if the EU's plans for a superstate come to fruition. We have very little say in what happens now regarding our country's affairs. It's little wonder that people are looking to the extreme choices in order for their voices to be heard.
Click to expand...

Not really sure how you can call Corbyn "elite", misguided and ineffective perhaps but "elite" seems like a square peg in round hole.

Surely you should be Corbyn's biggest fan since he is trying to protect your grandchildren from the super duper scary EU superstate. I mean if that's your biggest fear for them then frankly they're quite lucky!
 
Stanley Road said:
It doesnt matter how many partys there are, people will still vote a tory govt in cos they are thick. Then they can blame their stupidity in there not being any opposition, bit like now .
Click to expand...

My problem with him is not his party or politics, it's my opinion of him as a leader. He also always seems to be reading speeches, badly, nothing off the cuff.
What if Labour were currently in power, they'd be having even more ridiculous negotiations with the EU negotiating for more impossible targets.

The Tories are at their weakest at this moment with the most terrible leader since the war and he still can't look good.

One can see the UK heading for a No deal and someone's going to have to pick up the pieces. Is this the job Corbyn wants?
 
DUP said they'll support a censor motion against May but I'm assuming that almost means they won't support a no confidence vote.

Emergency debate been granted for tomorrow.
 
The cnuts in r/UKpolitics got me so excited for a second with their giddiness for SO24. Turns out it doesn’t have any meaningful impact apart from soundbites.
 
redman5 said:
David Icke made a great point recently regarding the direction of the Labour party over the past 10-15 years. He says that the Labour Party was formed to protect the urban, working-class, people from the 'elite'. But people like Blair, & dare I say it, Corbyn, are now becoming the elite. There isn't that much democracy anymore here in the western world. We basically have 2 choices, with neither of them really offering anything that remotely resembles a brighter future. I shudder to think what the years ahead will hold for my children & my grandchildren if the EU's plans for a superstate come to fruition. We have very little say in what happens now regarding our country's affairs. It's little wonder that people are looking to the extreme choices in order for their voices to be heard.
Click to expand...

This David Icke?

"At the heart of Icke's theories lies the idea that the universe is made up of "vibrational" energy, and consists of an infinite number of dimensions that share the same space. He believes that an inter-dimensional race of reptilian beings called the Archons (or Anunnaki), have hijacked the Earth, and that a genetically modified human/Archon hybrid race of shape-shifting reptilians, also known as the "Babylonian Brotherhood", the Illuminati, or the 'elite', manipulate global events to keep humans in a constant state of fear, so the Archons can feed off the 'negative energy' this creates. He claims many prominent figures belong to the Babylonian Brotherhood, and are propelling humanity towards an Orwellian global fascist state, or New World Order; a post-truth era where freedom of speech is ended. Icke believes that the only way this 'Archontic' influence can be defeated is by humanity waking up to 'the truth', and filling their hearts with love. Critics have accused Icke of being a Holocaust denier and his "reptilians" and other theories of being antisemitic, claims he denies."
 
FlawlessThaw said:
Not really sure how you can call Corbyn "elite", misguided and ineffective perhaps but "elite" seems like a square peg in round hole.

Surely you should be Corbyn's biggest fan since he is trying to protect your grandchildren from the super duper scary EU superstate. I mean if that's your biggest fear for them then frankly they're quite lucky!
Click to expand...

That's the thing with Corbyn though. I've listened to his strong anti-EU rhetoric for many years, but now we're on the cusp of exiting the union he's gone very shy about the whole thing. My personal feelings is that he's like a lot of senior politicians nowdays. More interested in the power of the role than the power to make changes for the people of the UK.
 
redman5 said:
That's the thing with Corbyn though. I've listened to his strong anti-EU rhetoric for many years, but now we're on the cusp of exiting the union he's gone very shy about the whole thing. My personal feelings is that he's like a lot of senior politicians nowdays. More interested in the power of the role than the power to make changes for the people of the UK.
Click to expand...

He's shy about it because most of his followers and constituents are generally quite keen on remaining. He also seems to be the type of politician who can lose power on the cusp of grabbing it.

Both factors don't really scream "elite" to me.
 
2cents said:
This David Icke?

"At the heart of Icke's theories lies the idea that the universe is made up of "vibrational" energy, and consists of an infinite number of dimensions that share the same space. He believes that an inter-dimensional race of reptilian beings called the Archons (or Anunnaki), have hijacked the Earth, and that a genetically modified human/Archon hybrid race of shape-shifting reptilians, also known as the "Babylonian Brotherhood", the Illuminati, or the 'elite', manipulate global events to keep humans in a constant state of fear, so the Archons can feed off the 'negative energy' this creates. He claims many prominent figures belong to the Babylonian Brotherhood, and are propelling humanity towards an Orwellian global fascist state, or New World Order; a post-truth era where freedom of speech is ended. Icke believes that the only way this 'Archontic' influence can be defeated is by humanity waking up to 'the truth', and filling their hearts with love. Critics have accused Icke of being a Holocaust denier and his "reptilians" and other theories of being antisemitic, claims he denies."
Click to expand...

So what about his theory relating to my post regarding his comments on the EU. Did you miss that ?
 
redman5 said:
David Icke made a great point recently regarding the direction of the Labour party over the past 10-15 years. He says that the Labour Party was formed to protect the urban, working-class, people from the 'elite'. But people like Blair, & dare I say it, Corbyn, are now becoming the elite. There isn't that much democracy anymore here in the western world. We basically have 2 choices, with neither of them really offering anything that remotely resembles a brighter future. I shudder to think what the years ahead will hold for my children & my grandchildren if the EU's plans for a superstate come to fruition. We have very little say in what happens now regarding our country's affairs. It's little wonder that people are looking to the extreme choices in order for their voices to be heard.
Click to expand...

Wow David Icke said that?
 
Pexbo said:
Wow David Icke said that?
Click to expand...

Not all of it, but certainly the bit relating to Tony Blair & the Labour Party. The rest is just my opinion based on what I've read & witnessed over the years. Here's the clip of David Icke. So whilst I don't go along with all his stuff about reptilians living amongst us etc, he does make some thought-provoking comments about things that are probably easier to digest & take seriously.

 
2cents said:
This David Icke?

"At the heart of Icke's theories lies the idea that the universe is made up of "vibrational" energy, and consists of an infinite number of dimensions that share the same space. He believes that an inter-dimensional race of reptilian beings called the Archons (or Anunnaki), have hijacked the Earth, and that a genetically modified human/Archon hybrid race of shape-shifting reptilians, also known as the "Babylonian Brotherhood", the Illuminati, or the 'elite', manipulate global events to keep humans in a constant state of fear, so the Archons can feed off the 'negative energy' this creates. He claims many prominent figures belong to the Babylonian Brotherhood, and are propelling humanity towards an Orwellian global fascist state, or New World Order; a post-truth era where freedom of speech is ended. Icke believes that the only way this 'Archontic' influence can be defeated is by humanity waking up to 'the truth', and filling their hearts with love. Critics have accused Icke of being a Holocaust denier and his "reptilians" and other theories of being antisemitic, claims he denies."
Click to expand...
Does he reject flat earth though?
 
redman5 said:
Not all of it, but certainly the bit relating to Tony Blair & the Labour Party. The rest is just my opinion based on what I've read & witnessed over the years. Here's the clip of David Icke. So whilst I don't go along with all his stuff about reptilians living amongst us etc, he does make some thought-provoking comments about things that are probably easier to digest & take seriously.

Click to expand...


Thanks for taking the time to share, I’ll definitely watch this and take it seriously.
 
Guardian said:
May's decision to stay on is one based on her own self-interest and that of her party rather than the country. The prime minister is now a diminished figure, with her authority draining away on the most important issue facing Britain. It is galling to hear her claim that the 2016 referendum vote was a cry for help from left-behind Britain when it was Tory austerity that hollowed out deprived regions.
Click to expand...
 
Jippy said:
Does he reject flat earth though?
Click to expand...

I think this youtube comment sums up the difficulties he faces in that field:

"David icke is intelligent enough to realize the Earth is flat. The problem is that flat Earth challenges his narritive and past theories, like the hollow Moon, Aliens from distant planets, planet Saturn and the Saturn-Moon matrix, etc. If he agreed that the Earth is flat, he must rewrite a lot of his own material, because a lot of it would be contradicting."

 
redman5 said:
So what about his theory relating to my post regarding his comments on the EU. Did you miss that ?
Click to expand...

Sorry, but you can't directly reference a quote by David "Literal Lizard People Rule the World" Icke and not expect people to immediately disregard whatever it is he had to say. He's simply not a reliable source on... well, anything. And certainly not on political science. You're obviously free to make the point yourself, but it should be blindingly obvious that including David Icke as some source of authority on the matter isn't going to help your argument. If anything it seriously calls into question your critical thinking ability.

Honestly, I'm just surprised that Striker10 isn't the first person to bring up David Icke in the CE.
 
Paul the Wolf said:
My problem with him is not his party or politics, it's my opinion of him as a leader. He also always seems to be reading speeches, badly, nothing off the cuff.
What if Labour were currently in power, they'd be having even more ridiculous negotiations with the EU negotiating for more impossible targets.

The Tories are at their weakest at this moment with the most terrible leader since the war and he still can't look good.

One can see the UK heading for a No deal and someone's going to have to pick up the pieces. Is this the job Corbyn wants?
Click to expand...
Being a good speaker is what gets you a shit leader in the end. Blair, Cameroon, Rutte, Macron, Tsipras and perhaps Obama. Blair part 1 was good thou.
 
redman5 said:
David Icke made a great point recently regarding the direction of the Labour party over the past 10-15 years. He says that the Labour Party was formed to protect the urban, working-class, people from the 'elite'. But people like Blair, & dare I say it, Corbyn, are now becoming the elite. There isn't that much democracy anymore here in the western world. We basically have 2 choices, with neither of them really offering anything that remotely resembles a brighter future. I shudder to think what the years ahead will hold for my children & my grandchildren if the EU's plans for a superstate come to fruition. We have very little say in what happens now regarding our country's affairs. It's little wonder that people are looking to the extreme choices in order for their voices to be heard.
Click to expand...

Even a stopped watch is accidentally correct twice a day.
 
I'm really surprised that the backstop is such a big issue for people that live on the island of Britain. Maybe they want to see a return to way things were before the GFA? The backstop is really a vote on the GFA, either we keep it, or we go back to how things were before. I know which future I'd prefer to see.
 
Smores said:
DUP said they'll support a censor motion against May but I'm assuming that almost means they won't support a no confidence vote.

Emergency debate been granted for tomorrow.
Click to expand...
The DUP are loving their moment in the sun... they want this shambles to continue because if it ends they might have to go back to NI and reinstate the NI Assembly and share power with "Tagdhs" and the "Paps". They definitely don't want that!
 
Green_Red said:
I'm really surprised that the backstop is such a big issue for people that live on the island of Britain. Maybe they want to see a return to way things were before the GFA? The backstop is really a vote on the GFA, either we keep it, or we go back to how things were before. I know which future I'd prefer to see.
Click to expand...
I hate how flippant they are with it.
Ireland gave up their claim to NI for the GFA to pass and it looks as if it'll he taken away by the whim of Brexiteers.
Tossed aside as if it never mattered In the first place.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.