Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

Do you think there will be a Deal or No Deal?

  • Total voters
    194
  • Poll closed .
Steven Seagull said:
I think it’s an easy sell. If you’re officially out the EU nobody can really argue without having a proper debate, which we all know nobody in the media or government is capable of. Everybody ends up a little bit unhappy which unfortunately is the best case scenario
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But it means you can't reduce immigration which is what a lot of Brexiteers want. Getting the Tory party to support it is a difficult sell before even getting to the public.
 
Steven Seagull said:
You need to stop deciding what everybody voted for. That is YOUR theory.
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No that's what the government has decided and as Leavers keep pointing out they all voted for the same thing and they all knew what they voted for and what's more they haven't the first clue as to what they voted for.
I know they voted for all different reasons .

Even those responsible like Farage can't remember what they said before the referendum.
 
Labour have left this all too late. If they took this stance from the get go then they could potentially have forced a GE earlier/won the last GE and changed the course of negotiations. If they're only considering backing Remain now, then let's assume there is a GE and they win, are they a) going to have the time to do anything about it anyway & b) have any coherent plan as to how they will prevent Brexit? Will UK not be too far down the line with the EU by this point in time, or would they freeze everything pending to outcome of the GE?

On the GFA I am under the impression that both sides of the border must share the same trading position, so if UK leaves EU and therefore free trade, then either Ireland has to leave too or the whole situation completely reneges the GFA? Plus if the GFA is reneged on, how in hell can the government actually monitor and control the borders?
 
I've heard some idiotic things coming out of the UK in the last 3 years but this has to take the biscuit.

Len McCluskey, the Unite general secretary, has single-handed done his best to slam the brakes on Labour’s (admittedly, quite tentative) shift closer to backing a second referendum on Brexit. He has told BBC 5 Live’s Pienaar’s Politics that, if there has to be a referendum, voters should just get a choice between leaving the EU without a deal, and leaving with a deal.

OK I'll vote to leave with a deal, err which deal, there isn't one, oh.
 
Paul the Wolf said:
I've heard some idiotic things coming out of the UK in the last 3 years but this has to take the biscuit.

Len McCluskey, the Unite general secretary, has single-handed done his best to slam the brakes on Labour’s (admittedly, quite tentative) shift closer to backing a second referendum on Brexit. He has told BBC 5 Live’s Pienaar’s Politics that, if there has to be a referendum, voters should just get a choice between leaving the EU without a deal, and leaving with a deal.

OK I'll vote to leave with a deal, err which deal, there isn't one, oh.
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I heard the interview
Basically he said labour should (in his opinion) have the same stance to a general election and a second referendum
That the first referendum result will be respected and we will leave... But that the public should decide if to accept the deal on offer
The reasoning seeming to be that to offer the chance to stay in the EU may cost labour too many marginal seats in a general election
I think this seems to tie in with the perception that Corbyn would rather leave than stay
Wouldn't surprise me is this ended up as their position... Depends how it is spun (I predict very poorly) but could end up alienating both camps as it may be seen as not giving the 48% the question they actually want... But still undermining the original vote
 
Cheesy said:
Ultimately if we're still in the customs union people will be outraged on the leave side and if we aren't it fecks the NI issue.
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People will be outraged no matter what the outcome is. This is one of the most divisive events in the recent history of the UK.
 
sun_tzu said:
I heard the interview
Basically he said labour should (in his opinion) have the same stance to a general election and a second referendum
That the first referendum result will be respected and we will leave... But that the public should decide if to accept the deal on offer
The reasoning seeming to be that to offer the chance to stay in the EU may cost labour too many marginal seats in a general election
I think this seems to tie in with the perception that Corbyn would rather leave than stay
Wouldn't surprise me is this ended up as their position... Depends how it is spun (I predict very poorly) but could end up alienating both camps as it may be seen as not giving the 48% the question they actually want... But still undermining the original vote
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What I took from it as well.
Brexit has broken this country. Naturally Corbyn would try to avoid the topic but that would be impossible in a November GE. He'd be run out of town if it looked like he was trying to avoid discussing brexit. Both sides would take it badly.
 
Adisa said:
What I took from it as well.
Brexit has broken this country. Naturally Corbyn would try to avoid the topic but that would be impossible in a November GE. He'd be run out of town if it looked like he was trying to avoid discussing brexit. Both sides would take it badly.
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Could be why they seem to be moving more towards a second referendum, perhaps deciding that if an election is looming they need to make the issue a priority and be seen to devise a clear stance.
 
Cheesy said:
Could be why they seem to be moving more towards a second referendum, perhaps deciding that if an election is looming they need to make the issue a priority and be seen to devise a clear stance.
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I've been very critical of him but starting to see why he's been avoiding it like the plague.
As toxic as brexit is for the Tories, it's even more toxic for Labour.
In terms of sheer numbers, Labour members want to remain but those that voted out are spread across many seats.
It's a pretty fecked up situation.
The sad part is Tory voters wo desperately want to remain, will never vote for Corbyn, no matter how desperate they are. The propensity of losing voters depending on how the party goes is still significantly on Labour's side.
Nationalism is a like a drug that corrods the brain. The fact that there are some Labour voters prepared to vote Tory just for brexit and regardless of austerity is a tragedy .
 
Adisa said:
I've been very critical of him but starting to see why he's been avoiding it like the plague.
As toxic as brexit is for the Tories, it's even more toxic for Labour.
In terms of sheer numbers, Labour members want to remain but those that voted out are spread across many seats.
It's a pretty fecked up situation.
The sad part is Tory voters wo desperately want to remain, will never vote for Corbyn, no matter how desperate they are. The propensity of losing voters depending on how the party goes is still significantly on Labour's side.
Nationalism is a like a drug that corrods the brain. The fact that there are some Labour voters prepared to vote Tory just for brexit and regardless of austerity is a tragedy .
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Eh I dunno actually - the fact Labour won some fairly liberal Tory areas in London in the last election demonstrates there's room for them to pick up disaffected Tories who lean right but despise the more nationalistic elements of the party and who'll prop for Labour if need be, and if they've got a decent local candidate. Similarly there's an argument some Labour voters supported Brexit merely because they want change, and that Corbyn offering change, albeit of an altogether different kind, may allow some to remain with the party. There are still plenty of people out there who just plop for Labour no matter what. Albeit the party shouldn't allow room for complacency in that regard like in Scotland.
 
sun_tzu said:
I heard the interview
Basically he said labour should (in his opinion) have the same stance to a general election and a second referendum
That the first referendum result will be respected and we will leave... But that the public should decide if to accept the deal on offer
The reasoning seeming to be that to offer the chance to stay in the EU may cost labour too many marginal seats in a general election
I think this seems to tie in with the perception that Corbyn would rather leave than stay
Wouldn't surprise me is this ended up as their position... Depends how it is spun (I predict very poorly) but could end up alienating both camps as it may be seen as not giving the 48% the question they actually want... But still undermining the original vote
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Agree with what you say other than the fact there is nothing for the public to have a referendum on.
There is unlikely to be a deal but even if there is it will be BINO so they may as well have the stay option in and if there is no deal there will be no referendum of that nature.

Then whoever in government has to implement what is voted for in the referendum and everyone starts going round in circles and arguing with each other again.

In the meantime the EU are getting on with life and will have new elections on 23rd May 2019 and the UK politicians will probably be still fighting with each other.
 
Concerning, the way a lot of people are now saying we should leave without a deal because of how the EU have tested May.
This country...
 
Adisa said:
Concerning, the way a lot of people are now saying we should leave without a deal because of how the EU have tested May.
This country...
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People actually said the Tories would spin it to make the EU look like the bad guys when negotiations failed and they were right.
 
@Oscie

If we get a GE and Corbyn runs on the promise of a second referendum, will you vote labour?
 
I wish all of you who are unaware about who the DUP are and how they are heavily influencing the whole Brexit process would read up on them. All their scandals and skullduggery that they get away with. Especially literally burning hundreds of millions of pounds of British tax payers money in a fraudulent heating scheme. Also Ian Paisley MP who got away with taking money and holidays from a genocidal regime in Sri Lanka in exchange for lobbying the UK government to not look into it. Not to mention their involvement in getting illegal dark money to help the leave campaign
 
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Ramshock said:
I wish all of you who are unaware about who the DUP are and how they are heavily influencing the whole Brexit process would read up on them. All their scandals and skullduggery that they get away with. Especially literally burning hundreds of millions of pounds of British tax payers money in a fraudulent heating scheme. Also Ian Paisley MP who got away with taking money and holidays from a genocidal regime in Sri Lanka in exchange for lobbying the UK government to not look into it. Not to mention their involvement in getting illegal dark money to help the leave campaign
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Arlene Foster looks like a bare knuckle boxer.
 
horsechoker said:
People actually said the Tories would spin it to make the EU look like the bad guys when negotiations failed and they were right.
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It was obvious and they left clues about that strategy from the beginning, just look at the "divorce" bill.
 
Has anyone else seen the rumour that Ted Heath was a strident supporter of the Common Market because German intelligence had dirt on him?
 
Pexbo said:
@Oscie

If we get a GE and Corbyn runs on the promise of a second referendum, will you vote labour?
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For me it would depend... Is stay in the EU on the referendum... Or as per the briefings today is it we leave whatever it's just a vote on how we leave... If so what's the point

I would also say whichever pm brings us out and be that a hard or a soft brexit (or even deciding to stay in) for any party will be gone within a year of that decision... It's too decisive for them to be able to govern properly afterwards
 
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Adisa said:
Some people who voted remain are saying it too. Were fecked.
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According to a poll overseen by John Curtice, the majority of Brits will likely blame the EU if, as many expect, Brexit is a catastrophe. John Foreigner is obviously intent to screw this up for us. Not that we screwed ourselves. Guess a little bit of deflection may help us not kill each other.
 
buchansleftleg said:
I'm not sure he's competent enough to manage that. He actually believes Brexit will create a socialist uprising.

Given that the EU did more to improve working conditions than the UK unions ever managed to achieve it's quite amazing that the unions seem so keen to throw that progress away.
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If they manage to sabotage the vote tonight, they’ll be paying for it for a very long time.
 
buchansleftleg said:
I'm not sure he's competent enough to manage that. He actually believes Brexit will create a socialist uprising.

Given that the EU did more to improve working conditions than the UK unions ever managed to achieve it's quite amazing that the unions seem so keen to throw that progress away.
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Illusion of control. There are some in Labour that think they'll be the ones running things after brexit.
 
Green_Red said:
I'm starting to question this border issue. What would happen if Britain leaves and the Irish government and British government stay true to the GFA and don't put a hard border in place? Who exactly is going to fine either government. Also, why is it primarily the British governments responsibility? Surely it's as much the EUs responsibility as it is Britain's if it is a requirement of WTO rules? I'm just asking what exactly happens if they don't put a hard border in.
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It's a good question, who would want a hard border more, Ireland or the UK? I can see Britain would want to have control over a potential immigration route, somewhere, but I've no idea about goods.
 
711 said:
It's a good question, who would want a hard border more, Ireland or the UK? I can see Britain would want to have control over a potential immigration route, somewhere, but I've no idea about goods.
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TBH I don't think either want one... I've always said that I think the border issue is a red herring designed to stall any negotiations. How do you solve the unsolvable? The EU played barely any role whatsoever in the GFA and rarely stepped into the ring when the conflict was at its most bloody. In fact, in my own lifetime I have crossed a hard border between NI and Ireland when both Britain and Ireland were members of thr EU... Why now are the EU so concerned about one? That's just my own opinion on it though.
 
Green_Red said:
TBH I don't think either want one... I've always said that I think the border issue is a red herring designed to stall any negotiations. How do you solve the unsolvable? The EU played barely any role whatsoever in the GFA and rarely stepped into the ring when the conflict was at its most bloody. Why now are they so concerned? That's just my own opinion on it though
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Because the UK unilaterally decided to take away the tool that allows the GFA to work.
 
Green_Red said:
TBH I don't think either want one... I've always said that I think the border issue is a red herring designed to stall any negotiations. How do you solve the unsolvable? The EU played barely any role whatsoever in the GFA and rarely stepped into the ring when the conflict was at its most bloody. In fact, in my own lifetime I have crossed a hard border between NI and Ireland when both Britain and Ireland were members of thr EU... Why now are the EU so concerned about one? That's just my own opinion on it though.
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People seem to forget that the GF agreement is an international treaty, agreed under international scrutiny between 2 nations whilst both were in the EU.

It required tacit approval from the EU for that reason, but they steered well clear at the time beacuse it was largely led by Clinton's administration with support from Major and Aherne for both sides.

All of these political heavyweights obviously didn't plan for the UK government making such a ludicrous move as threatening to leave the EU, knowing it would invalidate the GFA.

The EU quite righly points out that this hurdle could be overcome by allowing NI more autonomy and allowing them to remain in EU.

This option would also be requested by Scotland. This would leave England on it's own in Brexit, putting the burden of hard borders firmly onto the English.

So we would have to try and negotiate new trade rules across the world, having just demonstrated to the world that we will ignore treaties as and when it suits a small minority of lunatic fringe within one of our political parties.

I'm not into capital punishment but Cameron should be keelhauled around every inch of the UK coast for fecking up the country so much.
 
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