That would only have any chance of happening if we were moving towards a total wipe out of our trade deals with the EU via a hard brexit which is probably how May has persuaded the cabinet to accept this deal.
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That would only have any chance of happening if we were moving towards a total wipe out of our trade deals with the EU via a hard brexit which is probably how May has persuaded the cabinet to accept this deal.
Irrespective of the finer details this essentially means we'll be retaining freedom of movement and following EU regulations in most cases. As was always going to be likely. Hence it's a sensible move but an utterly pointless process in general. I'd have a shred of sympathy for the hard Brexiteers if they'd ever put forward any sensible or viable proposals for their own version of Brexit.
We would not be total rule takers under the same agreement as Norway. That is a total myth
Assuming the "feck this I'm UKIP now" reaction on twitter and the comments sections of our favourite cesspits aren't all Russian bots, the right wing vote's gonna be split at the next election.
If anything might be a win for those who argue for further integration in the long-term...if we ever want to go back in then we'll probably be expected to accept the Euro, follow more regulations and not be given as many exceptions etc like we were before. Presuming this happens it's a major win for the EU - they've been able to get rid of an unruly, Eurosceptic member with a significant number of Eurosceptic MP's, all while ensuring we don't actually diverge from them at all.
What rules will we no longer follow that we did before? Certainly the biggest point of contention for most Leavers during the referendum was freedom of movement and that isn't going to change here.
It'll be interesting to see how this manifests itself. You'd presume a lot of voters would fluctuate back to UKIP, but the problem for UKIP right now is that they've mostly fallen apart and I imagine will struggle to fund themselves. There aren't really any similar alternatives who have any traction.
Similarly, will be interesting to see what happens on the left. I imagine most will stay with Corbyn because he's an anti-establishment type candidate himself anyway, but there may be some discontented Leavers who go back to UKIP-style options. And if Corbyn does do well, that may deter some hard-right Tories from going to UKIP to ensure Corbyn stays out of power. Although it's potentially a decent situation for him.
I'm wondering if they are thinking that the longer term plan may be to take the EU deal as it is now and give themselves the opportunity to move further away in the future as they are no longer tied to the EU. They've probably realised that a hard Brexit now is impossible but pulling out of the EU (in name) may give them an opportunity to take it further going forwards.
Don't see what room they'll have to change things after the deal is done, won't benefit the EU at all who will be happy what they've gotten. We've shown quite clearly need we can't afford to opt for a hard Brexit and have seceded on basically everything.
Aye @Cheesy is right, if this is how we end up then it would have to take for the entire EU project to fall down for us to consider going for a Hard Brexit. So that's one piece of comfort for Brexiteers.
Won’t follow the ECJ anymore and Norway take about 30% of EU rules. I don’t know the details about how old rules would be repealed but that’s why this is a smart option. It’s now a process instead of an event
You are right. It's why I was hoping they'd tell May to feck off cause that was the best chance of staying. This agreement now almost ensures we leave.
Well...yeah, exactly. We already follow EU regulations in most cases, so unless people are aware of which specific rules and regulations they want to be repealed, and areas in which they want to diverge, the whole things seems incredibly pointless and unnecessary. We won't need to follow EU regulations...but we're probably going to keep on doing so anyway, because in most cases those regulations are fine and we don't have any issue with them. The only difference now will be that we no longer have any say in creating those rules, many of which we'll continue to take anyway.
I don't disagree that it's by far the best option for Brexit. But thus far I've yet to see anyone give me some specific things which we're going to benefit from when it comes to this, other than some vague rhetoric about not having to follow certain regulations which we already follow and will continue to follow.
With May or Bojo in power I'm happy that we lose our vote. I think this is a win win.
I think that will hinge on allowed trade agreements outside of the EU. If we're not allowed any there is no way we can re-negotiate. If we somehow (which would be highly doubtful) manage to persuade the EU that we can negotiate our our own trade agreements with other countries then we could think about it in the future.
Aye, to be honest, if this country is hell bent on having a right wing government... I’ll be delighted to be under EU rules and them have no say.
Sounds like a pretence to me. From what I read, it sounds like the ECJ would still have enormous influence but with us pretending to make the rules.
And just tanked our economy, possibly irreversibly for a few years. This conservative government has probably cost us more money, than the Labour government they were blaming for the global financial crisis to get themselves into power.
Cameron will go down as by far the worst and most damaging Prime Minister we've ever had, closely followed by May.
Yeah, we've sort of helped the EU play an accidental blinder here, the way things are going. They can now turn to other Eurosceptic nations and point out that one of the least committed/tied members has left without actually really leaving at all...and that as a result any nation who is already in the Euro etc will face even bigger problems if they try to do the same. The fear beforehand for some was that the EU would deliberately makes mugs of us and be harsh to send a message...they've not even needed to do that in the end, since our government's continued incompetence has resulted in us having basically no hands to play and seceding at every turn.
The key issue is if we are able to sign a free trade deals with other countries. Otherwise Brexit will be completely pointless.
Hehe
Pretty much. As has been tirelessly pointed out by swathes of people, the EU is now one of the world's major trading blocs, and irrespective of whether or not we're in it, we're rights on its doorstep. As a result, in most cases we'll have no choice but to adopt the rules and regulations they impose upon us for continued smooth trade with them. Unless we want to start imposing tariffs etc. Which we clearly do not want to do.
I wonder where this will leave us in terms of an exit bill. An exit bill plus no more benefits for our poorest regions.
We'd at least have to keep EU employment law which I'm more than happy with.
Yeah that’s what people keep saying. Why do Norway only take ~30%? We’ll have to see how many we take.
Who is this waste of space?
Because they're not already in the EU?!
Again, which rules/regulations do we plan to no longer follow? And why won't we be following them? I've yet to see people articulate which ones they actually find problematic.
I think the main one I here is fishing waters.Because they're not already in the EU?!
Again, which rules/regulations do we plan to no longer follow? And why won't we be following them? I've yet to see people articulate which ones they actually find problematic.
Because they're not already in the EU?!
Again, which rules/regulations do we plan to no longer follow? And why won't we be following them? I've yet to see people articulate which ones they actually find problematic.
The EU farming subsidies are controversial. Don’t they incentivise landowners to hoard land and do nothing with it?
Because they are not EU members, most new laws concern EU members. Though, EFTA members don't really argue against EEA rules which mainly come from the EU..
A rational policy that he couldn't make happen if not in government. We really have gone full circle from the days that Corbyn was 'only interested in a party of protest and not leading'.
Finally after 2 years we have.... a plan. Agreed by the cabinet, not even the whole Tory party.
9 months to get this agreed by 26 countries..
9 months to get this agreed by 26 countries..
So it’s not accepting all the rules? Or anything like all the rules with no say. Which is what people keep repeating.
Which rules are you talking about EEA or EU? They accept EEA rules but they are not asked to accept EU rules because they are not members.
I know that. How many is it?
The Tory Brexiters have accepted May's proposal today, but they met together yesterday and will have agreed a strategy. We just don't know what it is yet.
£5 says this 'agreement' doesn't last through until Monday. Be surprised if by the time we wake up tomorrow there aren't cabinet ministers claiming the agreement means something different to what another cabinet minister thinks it does.
Probably discussing best ways to sell their morals. That's one slightly admirable thing about the right, how they can covalence despite even personal or political differences for the benefit of keeping power.
EU will reject it. The big question now, and probably always has been, what comes next after that. If the EU really wanted to play hardball they could give the option of UK crashing out with no deal or staying in with current arrangement. If they wanted to be nice they could offer a chance of continued negotiation.
They could try and remove her. She will not resign and it will be out to a confidence vote. Think she would win quite easily, then Boris and co are toast forever.
Why I think she told them to put up or shut up today. The brexiteers are fecked.
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