We could have a vote of no confidence before the bill passes and May out of power and Johnson demanding that the agreement be scrapped.
I'm not sure of anything until this is voted on.
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
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I'm not sure of anything until this is voted on.
I think if they thought they could pull that off they would have done it already. But the hardline Brexiteers are a minority even in the Tory party, if they bring May down they are more likely to find themselves fighting a general election than enjoying the coronation of their chosen candidate.
I think you need to remember that none of this was supposed to happen. The country was expected to vote remain and whichever way you look at it we're in damage limitation mode now.
Switzerland has been a partner outside of the EU from the beginning though, carefully negotiating their positions over decades and creating their niché (Over time UK could do the same, but I wouldn't expect it to go fast). Also the Swiss certainly don't feel like they can pick and choose which parts of the EU they like, they have often had to make concessions to get the access they have.
I can't see that from the 96 points being listed . Am I missing something?
However:
Means the UK need to get a very ambitious trade deal, otherwise the bill might grow another ~25% in sterling (the 25% is a complete guess, think the fall in sterling would be significant though if the trade deal was no where near what the conditions today are).
Yes, that's what I think, I may not have put it well though. So, can one make extrapolations, assumptions or whatever out of fudge? Caftards here seem to think so, they all seem sure of what it all means. Not me though, right or wrong
Yeah. It was a way to win back voters from UKIP that momentously backfired.
I was talking about NI
If NI stays in the EU you could use an ancestral link to claim you are from NI and get an EU passport surely?
The DUP will probably want some further concessions for NI. This whole deal could work out very well for NI, the possibility of financial institutions relocating there for dual access to the UK and EU markets perhaps?
To attempt to try and look on the bright side Perhaps we would be able to sign some more bespoke trade deals with countries that have the relevant standards to satisfy the EU or can we not have bilateral trade deals with countries already with an EU trade deal?
Not sure tbh, below just says "born in".
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...eep-eu-citizenship-irish-border-a8099176.html
Maybe they dont, Im kind of with you to be honest, I think it would be pretty naive to think anything has been set in stone today (apart from that other news about the guy who cemented his head inside the microwave, but that is for another thread.)Yes, that's what I think, I may not have put it well though. So, can one make extrapolations, assumptions or whatever out of fudge? Caftards here seem to think so, they all seem sure of what it all means. Not me though, right or wrong
I think the UK said what it had to say to move things along to the next stage of the process. And I think, if it got what it wanted out of the next stage of the process, it will accept the EU interpretation of what has been agreed today. Quid pro quo. (That is more extrapolation, but it a reasonable educated guess, I reckon, on the basis that if it gets what it wants on trade it wont want to rock the boat.) If it doesnt get what it wants from the next stage the threat will still be that we walk away from the deal. And if we walk away from the deal, by definition everything that has been agreed during the negotiation of that deal would surely be void.
Hopefully that answers what @Abizzz asked me above as well. Its not that there are items in the agreement setting out what happens if nothing is agreed. It is the fact that if nothing is agreed then (presumably) nothing in this document is binding anyway. It is just a way of getting to the next stage.
Again, though, that is what the DUP explicitly rejected.
Never underestimate the wide gap between their ambition and their intelligence.
Or it is significant leverage for them going forward. I can't help but think that it why they crashed the deal so late in the day.
Yes, makes perfect sense when you put it like that, thank you.
Edit: Alternatively this could be used as basis for David Davis' "No deal deal" though too. The one where he said basic things like aviation would be covered but trade etc. wouldn't.
True
Guardian said:
Well that's a big feck you to Gibraltar then.
The thing is that whether it is two years ago, yesterday , tomorrow or in two year's time, if there is no hard Irish border then the Uk are in the Customs Union, despite some people pretending otherwise.
Even the government are trying to pretend otherwise because if they admit it that means these fantastic independent deals they were signing up with other countries can't happen. People still believe this government despite all the lies they have told and continue to tell.
If NI is in the Customs Union, or full alignment as they call it, then so is the rest of the UK.
Nothing is set in stone, however, and the UK could still pull out and fall off the cliff edge. The humiliation would be even greater than pretending they had the strong hand in the first place.
The main thing is if businesses and the City are convinced by this, if they are not , fun and games in the New Year.
As yet, since the beginning nothing has happened to remotely surprise me.
What exactly has been agreed? Am still confused. All I see is tweets and posts re: might as well stay now. Sounds like she sold out? Soft-Brexit?
I just hope we are forced to adopt the EU tax avoidance regulations in 2019. Should wipe the smirk off of all those Leave donors.
Those cnuts are literally cutting off their nose to spite their face.
I think those conclusions are a little premature, things are still up in the air.
Let's say that by choosing the "no border" option, the UK limited their deal options to no deal and a brexit arguably softer than EFTA.
Hmm so why the warm hugs, high fives and agreement to move on talks?
Sorry I am struggling to find a succinct clear paragraph on what exactly happened / was agreed!
Interesting. Will be interested to see how this goes down with different groups of folks (remainers, hard brexiteers, soft brexiteers etc)
It's going down like a sack of shit on the Mail Online comments section, which makes today a good day.
Thanks for the reminder!
*basks in warm glow of heat emerging from "disgusted of Tunbridge wells" in comments section*
We need quotes
I'm a unionist here but I'm pretty certain I'll be getting an Irish passport when my current GB one expires shortly. Purely for flexibility (considered getting both but not sure I'll end bother with a GB passport). I'm definitely not the only one - think they were fresh out of application forms when the referendum result first came in. Usually a cheaper passport anyway - plenty of people get it instead when renewal comes up. Might not wave it around in a Rangers bar but I'm not convinced I'm welcome in there anyway.
Additionally, I was on a course in Birmingham this week and some of English and Scottish attendees said their family was looking into their Irish heritage to see if they could wrangle one.
That said, hopefully all of this won't be a big deal in the end.
At little bit, but unlike their usual mental panic and nonsense, the economic border on the sea is a very real fear of the UK distancing themselves from NI to the point were a United Ireland is in actuality if not name.
I think it would have been more profitable short-term, but I can understand their actions on this one, even if the reasoning presented was utter crap.
"time to take this to the streets" was a personal favourite - no doubt after they have been to the post office to pick up their Winter fuel allowance!Your wish is my command.
In summary, the UK government have wasted all this time for nothing and have little time left to negotiate any kind of deal.
That's it really. You can dislike the DUP (and I personally do) while being understanding why they would never agree to an Irish sea border. As you say, it's a big push towards a United Ireland from then on.
I have English friends, with some Irish ancestry, who live and work abroad with wife and family and they've done the same. Brits and Irish can have dual nationality, I think. In my family tree there's an O'Gorman but it goes back over a hundred years and isn't a grandparent. What are my chances ?
Not sure about that one.
No need.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...eep-eu-citizenship-irish-border-a8099176.html
No chance. You need at least a grandparent born in Ireland.
Sounds good. Still always a chance something might breakdown I guess.
EDIT: Just read into this - is this not just confirming that if people exercise their 'Irishness' by getting an Irish passport they maintain EU citizenship? If that's so - nothing has really changed.
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You do realise that May is a remainer?
True. My mistake.