Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

Do you think there will be a Deal or No Deal?

  • Total voters
    194
  • Poll closed .
Massive Spanner said:


Incredible stuff.
Click to expand...

I heard some moron on radio Ulster this morning saying that the alleged plans from UK were only stuff the Irish Government had already suggested. He forgot to mention that it was only in Irish plans for no deal preparation. There is absolutely no way the EU/Ireland will agree to anything close to this.

UK government thinks it's being clever saying there will never be a hard border 'at the border' they must think we are all idiots.
 
What do people think about this?

https://wingsoverscotland.com/the-divided-kingdom/

Basically NI and Scotland get special status allowing them to remain in the EU markets. This would mean that there would have to be a hard border between England and Scotland meaning you probably wouldn’t need one between NI and the UK

I haven’t explained that well so just read the link
 
golden_blunder said:
What do people think about this?

https://wingsoverscotland.com/the-divided-kingdom/

Basically NI and Scotland get special status allowing them to remain in the EU markets. This would mean that there would have to be a hard border between England and Scotland meaning you probably wouldn’t need one between NI and the UK

I haven’t explained that well so just read the link
Click to expand...
I don't see any explanation there as to how a border isn't still needed between NI and England/Wales in that scenario?
 
Some bloke poured petrol on himself outside parliament today and tried to set himself on fire. Police managed to hose him down before he managed too. It happened near the Brexit protests but no motive seems to be apparent.
 
golden_blunder said:
What do people think about this?

https://wingsoverscotland.com/the-divided-kingdom/

Basically NI and Scotland get special status allowing them to remain in the EU markets. This would mean that there would have to be a hard border between England and Scotland meaning you probably wouldn’t need one between NI and the UK

I haven’t explained that well so just read the link
Click to expand...

There still would be a border in the Irish Sea and only adds an additional border between England and Scotland which would be necessary if Scotland also remained in the EUCU/SM.
 
Massive Spanner said:
I don't see any explanation there as to how a border isn't still needed between NI and England/Wales in that scenario?
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Neither does anyone else!

The article was published in July 2018, I think Wings over Scotland flew too close to the sun on that one...!
 
sammsky1 said:
And that's before a campaign, which would this time, force each side to make only truthful statements to a much better educated audience.

Remain would win at least 57:43 and I think it would be 60:40
Click to expand...
Bold proposition
The real key would be the approx 1/3rd of people who didn't vote before as most (not all) who voted have become entrenched in their original position.
Polls really struggle to pick up occasional voters as typically they don't have sufficient in their samples ... Last time this was seen as a reason leave did better than predicted...

I think the biggest factor is what will the actual question be... It certainly won't be leve Vs remain as it proved last time that was too vague to provide certainty...
WTO Vs Mays deal
Mays deal Vs remain
WTO Vs remain
Norway type deal?
All options and a single transferable vote or simply most votes wins
Or a 2 stage question
All probably produce different percentages
 
sun_tzu said:
Bold proposition
The real key would be the approx 1/3rd of people who didn't vote before as most (not all) who voted have become entrenched in their original position.
Polls really struggle to pick up occasional voters as typically they don't have sufficient in their samples ... Last time this was seen as a reason leave did better than predicted...

I think the biggest factor is what will the actual question be... It certainly won't be leve Vs remain as it proved last time that was too vague to provide certainty...
WTO Vs Mays deal
Mays deal Vs remain
WTO Vs remain
Norway type deal?
All options and a single transferable vote or simply most votes wins
Or a 2 stage question
All probably produce different percentages
Click to expand...
You only have to read this thread to see how many would rig the poll to get the result they want. God knows what parliament will do.
 
sun_tzu said:
Bold proposition
The real key would be the approx 1/3rd of people who didn't vote before as most (not all) who voted have become entrenched in their original position.
Polls really struggle to pick up occasional voters as typically they don't have sufficient in their samples ... Last time this was seen as a reason leave did better than predicted...

I think the biggest factor is what will the actual question be... It certainly won't be leve Vs remain as it proved last time that was too vague to provide certainty...
WTO Vs Mays deal
Mays deal Vs remain
WTO Vs remain
Norway type deal?
All options and a single transferable vote or simply most votes wins
Or a 2 stage question
All probably produce different percentages
Click to expand...

How can remain be on the ballot, it lost last time?

Unfortunate as it may be, but the truth is that ship has sailed, there has been too much dallying by politicians, the public (of all shades of opinion and of none) is fed up, the constitution is under attack from all sides and people just want to move on.

If any progress at all is to be made, then any new ballot will only have a chance of legitimately being accepted if it pits credible leave options, against a 'No Deal'. Our politicians have done (to paraphrase) a Nero and fiddled whilst the national psychic changed. The Tories have within plain sight of our other dullard politicians captured and made their own, the spirit of an idea, i.e. whose time has come, "We have to get Brexit done" … wonder if it was Dominic Cummings who thought that one up?
 
Sweet Square said:
Would be nice but it's literally impossible to do(For both sides).
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In any new referendum, I think authorities should mandate for an independent fact checker, and any official claims must always be verified by said body. The same happens in medicine, pharmaceuticals, TV advertising etc, don't see why it shouldn't also be in place for official Government votes.

There has been so much more quantitative data modelling on economy and impact of migrants, EU judicial investigation about impact of staying or leaving: debunking false claims (by either side) would be so much easier.
 
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sun_tzu said:
Bold proposition
The real key would be the approx 1/3rd of people who didn't vote before as most (not all) who voted have become entrenched in their original position.
Polls really struggle to pick up occasional voters as typically they don't have sufficient in their samples ... Last time this was seen as a reason leave did better than predicted...

I think the biggest factor is what will the actual question be... It certainly won't be leve Vs remain as it proved last time that was too vague to provide certainty...
WTO Vs Mays deal
Mays deal Vs remain
WTO Vs remain
Norway type deal?
All options and a single transferable vote or simply most votes wins
Or a 2 stage question
All probably produce different percentages
Click to expand...
Did you watch that movie on Channel 4 a few months ago: was a synopsis on how Cummings won the vote. It showed many mistakes made by Remain, not least the absence of high tech big data analytics led advertising.

Plus this time, Remain will acquire many more activists and will fight for their lives: eg I will personally devote my time to winning over voters (never did last time).

It wont be the same this time around. Leave have no new arguments, Remain has 100s.
 
So it sounds like they have capitulated and gone with the border checks despite earlier in the day denying it. Of course what they meant was "oi we were going to frame it as something else".
 
sammsky1 said:
In any new referendum, I think an independent fact checker should be mandated, and any official claims be verified by said body. The same happens in medicine and pharmaceuticals, TV advertising etc, don't see why it shouldn't also be in place for official Government votes.

There has been so much more quantitative data modelling on economy and impact of migrants, EU judicial investigation about impact of staying or leaving: debunking false claims (by either side) would be so much easier.
Click to expand...
Who would that be ? So political campaigns have to report to independent body before making statements ? Putting a side that there is no such thing as a 'independent' body'(The ideas of the ruling class are in every epoch the ruling ideas :smirk:)and that such things as data modelling and investigations into the impact of staying or leaving aren't facts(They are mere opinions and predictions).



What stops someone like Farage setting up a unofficial campaign and avoiding this independent body ? Would this independent fact checker cover the newspapers, twitter accounts, Facebook posts ? Would this fact checking body be used in future elections ?

More importantly I don't think the EU referendum in 2016 had anything to do with Britain relationship with the EU. Leave did win because people in Sunderland failed to read x amount of guardian articles or didn't look at the predicted GDP growth chart. Leave won for such reasons as - Racism/Xenophobia, decades of neo liberalism, austerity, empire nostalgia, globalisation. No amount of fact checking will get rid of these issues.
 
Brexiter Gammons should be happy


Greggs stockpiles pork for sausage rolls ahead of Brexit
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49890034

Greggs stockpiles pork for sausage rolls ahead of Brexit
By Bill Wilson Business reporter, BBC News
_109039323_mediaitem109037251.jpg
Greggs
High Street bakery chain Greggs is stockpiling pork so that production of its sausage rolls is guaranteed in the event of a no-deal Brexit.

"We are preparing for the potential impact of the UK's departure from the European Union by building stocks of key ingredients," the firm said.

Around 20% of a Greggs sausage roll is made from pork.

It has previously said a no-deal Brexit may mean it has to find alternatives for fresh tomatoes and lettuce.

The bakery chain detailed its planning for the UK's departure from the EU in a trading update which showed that total sales had risen 12.4% in the past 13 weeks.

The Newcastle-based firm hailed "very strong" trading in the third quarter, but also warned that Brexit could put pressure on food and labour costs.

As well as stockpiling key ingredients the firm has also been acquiring some light equipment, "that could be affected by disruption to the flow of goods into the UK".
 
sammsky1 said:
And that's before a campaign, which would this time, force each side to make only truthful statements to a much better educated audience.

Remain would win at least 57:43 and I think it would be 60:40
Click to expand...

O sweet child
 
sammsky1 said:
Brexiter Gammons should be happy


Greggs stockpiles pork for sausage rolls ahead of Brexit
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49890034

Greggs stockpiles pork for sausage rolls ahead of Brexit
By Bill Wilson Business reporter, BBC News
_109039323_mediaitem109037251.jpg
Greggs
High Street bakery chain Greggs is stockpiling pork so that production of its sausage rolls is guaranteed in the event of a no-deal Brexit.

"We are preparing for the potential impact of the UK's departure from the European Union by building stocks of key ingredients," the firm said.

Around 20% of a Greggs sausage roll is made from pork.

It has previously said a no-deal Brexit may mean it has to find alternatives for fresh tomatoes and lettuce.

The bakery chain detailed its planning for the UK's departure from the EU in a trading update which showed that total sales had risen 12.4% in the past 13 weeks.

The Newcastle-based firm hailed "very strong" trading in the third quarter, but also warned that Brexit could put pressure on food and labour costs.

As well as stockpiling key ingredients the firm has also been acquiring some light equipment, "that could be affected by disruption to the flow of goods into the UK".
Click to expand...
So they dont use british pork? Boycott them then.
 
sammsky1 said:
Brexiter Gammons should be happy


Greggs stockpiles pork for sausage rolls ahead of Brexit
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49890034

Greggs stockpiles pork for sausage rolls ahead of Brexit
By Bill Wilson Business reporter, BBC News
_109039323_mediaitem109037251.jpg
Greggs
High Street bakery chain Greggs is stockpiling pork so that production of its sausage rolls is guaranteed in the event of a no-deal Brexit.

"We are preparing for the potential impact of the UK's departure from the European Union by building stocks of key ingredients," the firm said.

Around 20% of a Greggs sausage roll is made from pork.

It has previously said a no-deal Brexit may mean it has to find alternatives for fresh tomatoes and lettuce.

The bakery chain detailed its planning for the UK's departure from the EU in a trading update which showed that total sales had risen 12.4% in the past 13 weeks.

The Newcastle-based firm hailed "very strong" trading in the third quarter, but also warned that Brexit could put pressure on food and labour costs.

As well as stockpiling key ingredients the firm has also been acquiring some light equipment, "that could be affected by disruption to the flow of goods into the UK".
Click to expand...
Better get used to this sub standard food.
 
sammsky1 said:
Brexiter Gammons should be happy


Greggs stockpiles pork for sausage rolls ahead of Brexit
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49890034

Greggs stockpiles pork for sausage rolls ahead of Brexit
By Bill Wilson Business reporter, BBC News
_109039323_mediaitem109037251.jpg
Greggs
High Street bakery chain Greggs is stockpiling pork so that production of its sausage rolls is guaranteed in the event of a no-deal Brexit.

"We are preparing for the potential impact of the UK's departure from the European Union by building stocks of key ingredients," the firm said.

Around 20% of a Greggs sausage roll is made from pork.

It has previously said a no-deal Brexit may mean it has to find alternatives for fresh tomatoes and lettuce.

The bakery chain detailed its planning for the UK's departure from the EU in a trading update which showed that total sales had risen 12.4% in the past 13 weeks.

The Newcastle-based firm hailed "very strong" trading in the third quarter, but also warned that Brexit could put pressure on food and labour costs.

As well as stockpiling key ingredients the firm has also been acquiring some light equipment, "that could be affected by disruption to the flow of goods into the UK".
Click to expand...

Michael Gove: "People will get the food they need."
 
So today sounds like the day we actually decide to submit something to the EU, oh and its our final offer :rolleyes:
 
sammsky1 said:
Brexiter Gammons should be happy


Greggs stockpiles pork for sausage rolls ahead of Brexit
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49890034

Greggs stockpiles pork for sausage rolls ahead of Brexit
By Bill Wilson Business reporter, BBC News
_109039323_mediaitem109037251.jpg
Greggs
High Street bakery chain Greggs is stockpiling pork so that production of its sausage rolls is guaranteed in the event of a no-deal Brexit.

"We are preparing for the potential impact of the UK's departure from the European Union by building stocks of key ingredients," the firm said.

Around 20% of a Greggs sausage roll is made from pork.

It has previously said a no-deal Brexit may mean it has to find alternatives for fresh tomatoes and lettuce.

The bakery chain detailed its planning for the UK's departure from the EU in a trading update which showed that total sales had risen 12.4% in the past 13 weeks.

The Newcastle-based firm hailed "very strong" trading in the third quarter, but also warned that Brexit could put pressure on food and labour costs.

As well as stockpiling key ingredients the firm has also been acquiring some light equipment, "that could be affected by disruption to the flow of goods into the UK".
Click to expand...
Wow a whole 20% of their sausage rolls is actual pork.
 
So the EU/Ireland want something that permanently guarantees that there will be no hard border.

Johnson's offer is apparently for Ireland to have two borders for four years.

One senses this will not be an easy sell. :lol:

Though of course its actual purpose is probably to be rejected by the EU so the Tories can try blaming them for a no deal exit.
 
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sullydnl said:
So the EU/Ireland want something that permanently guarantees that there will be no hard border.

Johnson's offer is apparently for Ireland to have two borders for four years.

One senses this will not be an easy sell. :lol:
Click to expand...

And with a DUP veto :nervous:

Edit:
So yet another trial balloon being floated to make it look like they are trying to get a deal..

 
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Raulduke said:
And with a DUP veto :nervous:

Edit:
So yet another trial balloon being floated to make it look like they are trying to get a deal..

Click to expand...


I find it a tad interesting that there is a 'bigger role for Stormont' proposed when there is no activity in Stormont and no prospect of that changing for potentially many more years (if ever).
 
Have the evil EU unfairly struck down our perfectly reasonable suggestions and backed us into a no-deal scenario that we in no way wanted yet?
 
balaks said:
I find it a tad interesting that there is a 'bigger role for Stormont' proposed when there is no activity in Stormont and no prospect of that changing for potentially many more years (if ever).
Click to expand...

Yes that's interesting, if faith in Stormont is gone, and in particular it won't function again, isn't that in itself a breach of the GFA?
 
balaks said:
Have the evil EU unfairly struck down our perfectly reasonable suggestions and backed us into a no-deal scenario that we in no way wanted yet?
Click to expand...

I liked one of the lines that 70hrs has been spent on it as that's supposed to be an impressive number. We'd class that as a small project in my place :lol:
 
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