Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

Do you think there will be a Deal or No Deal?


  • Total voters
    194
  • Poll closed .
The last few days have been the (not so) slow realisation from the Tories that the reason Boris puts on a front of being an ignorant, fumbling buffoon, is because he is one...and they've allowed him to become their Prime Minister.

He's acting like he thinks this is all some game of chess he can win but then keeps being caught out because he doesn't understand the rules. The proroguing move could really work against him now, and I can't figure out how it was ever going to work out well.

Particularly amused by him being called out on his remarks about Muslims. Had nothing to do with what was going on but it made him look like a complete moron.

Best he can do now is try to force through an election but can't see that happening without it being on Labour's terms. He's just turfed out a chunk of his own party for no real reason. Trying to rule through fear on some of the others. It's like he challenged himself to make Theresa May look competent.

All I can think is that they didn’t factor in that Corbyn and the others might refuse an election. Everything else makes a twisted kind of sense up to that point, but now they just look stupid. Although probably worth remembering that most people aren’t nerding on this stuff like we are, and may well buy into Boris’s obvious election gambit of trying to paint the Tories as the defenders of the people’s will.
 
The Lord's will let it through. If they don't they will effectively sign the death warrent for the House of Lords by stopping legislation approved by the elected house. They simply don't do that.
The end of the Lords might be the only good thing to come out of this if so. We still have hereditary members for feck's sake. Unbelievable.
 
All I can think is that they didn’t factor in that Corbyn and the others might refuse an election. Everything else makes a twisted kind of sense up to that point, but now they just look stupid. Although probably worth remembering that most people aren’t nerding on this stuff like we are, and may well buy into Boris’s obvious election gambit of trying to paint the Tories as the defenders of the people’s will.


Why have an Election now when Boris is now a lame duck Prime Minister with no majority ?

Better to wait and get rid of No Deal first
 
The Telegraph is a fanzine these days:
The Tory party is dead; long live the Tory party. The seismic realignment that was supposed to take place in 2016 is finally upon us, and a tougher, rougher, non-deferential conservatism is making its explosive debut.

[...]

Right now, Johnson and Cummings are still on a path to success, even if they have had to recalibrate their journey several times as obstacles have emerged. The situation is tense, the PM is feeling the pressure and much of the Cabinet is in a state of shock. But Boris hasn’t been “humiliated”. He hasn’t been “wrong-footed”.

The semi-prorogation didn’t “backfire”: it flushed out his hardcore opponents and allowed him to expel them. He knew he would have to do something drastic at some stage and there was no way that those committed to derailing his plans would ever have been allowed to stand under Tory colours at the election. His party was already split de facto, if not de jure; he was always leading a minority government in all but name. The sackings merely formalised this.

[...]

Last but not least, engineering a delay in Brexit would simply encourage the Government to go for broke. If they were to back a no-deal Brexit, Nigel Farage would step aside and the Leave vote would unite. I am sure those in No 10 genuinely and rightly want a deal. But they may not have a choice if furious voters begin to turn to the Brexit Party again. Do the Remainers really want to goad Downing Street in this way?

Johnson’s gamble was breathtaking in its ambition: he would take over a fatally divided Tory party with no majority, forcibly reform it in his image and gain a pro-Brexit majority. For all of the madness of the past few days, I’m still predicting that he will pull it off.
 
Why have an Election now when Boris is now a lame duck Prime Minister with no majority ?

Better to wait and get rid of No Deal first

They will, but it doesn’t need to take that long. They just need this bill to get royal assent, then they’re good to go. There’s really no point in waiting until Oct 31st is past, as if the Tories win the election after an extension is agreed, they could just cut it short and leave immediately anyway.
 
I was hoping that, by now, Rees-Mogg would be in the back of a removal van.
:nono: now now, Steve. There's no need to call Rees-Mogg a cnut. I mean, I guess he is a cnut but you can't just call someone a cnut simply because he is a cnut.
 
:nono: now now, Steve. There's no need to call Rees-Mogg a cnut. I mean, I guess he is a cnut but you can't just call someone a cnut simply because he is a cnut.
Sorry, mate - I couldn't spell 'cnut'.
 
Anna Soubry comments on David Gauke's tweet:

This is utterly disgraceful and I cannot believe that the likes of @AmberRuddHR @NickyMorgan01 @RobertBuckland @MattHancock are standing by, mute & letting this happen the #ConservativeParty is making the Corbynistas look like a bunch of pussy cats.

David Gauke

@DavidGauke
Just received a text to say that my Association Chairman has been told that I am no longer a member of the Conservative Party. First I’d heard of that.

Not even a member of the Conservative Party?

I finally have something in common with Dominic Cummings.
 
It's like banging your head on a brick wall, but you can't blame people, the BBC just said again today's vote outlawed no deal. No it didn't.

I don't/can't watch BBC but get Sky News and it's the same - either they are deliberately misleading people or the journalists don't understand themselves - I actually think it's the latter.
 
I didn't say the Tory government in general... I was questioning the perceived accepted notion that over the last couple of months the government has become far more right wing; when the evidence shows the contrary.

I'm guessing the answer is simply that it's an easy attack to say the government has become "far right" over the last couple of months, despite little evidence.



In my view it's far more nuanced than that. I don't believe Tony Blair was any of the terms you've described (no fan of him either by the way) however his huge mandate meant he could push through policies that could be deemed undemocratic or totalitarian. But to suggest he moved his party anywhere apart from bolt centre would be incorrect.

I don't think a party can be deemed "moving to the far right" if the entirety of their policy message is in fact moving towards the centre of messages of spending, immigration, social issues etc.

It's a lazy miscategorisation is my only point (coming from someone who dislikes Johnson).

What evidence to the contrary? You’re talking out of your arse or just wumming.
 
Nobody has really talked about the possibility of the EU ruling out an extension. Macron was firmly against and compromised on an October deadline, would he be any more likely to approve one now?

The only reason I can I can of that he might change is that Germany has become increasingly vocal about the negative effects of Brexit on them. Is that even Macron's concern?
 
The leader of the pirates speaks:
PM tells Peston on his purge of rebels: ‘These are friends of mine.’ He takes ‘no pleasure’ in withdrawing whip but they were warned of the consequences.
 
I was referring to Johnson's entire lack of wit and decorum. And how the old-school connections which have haunted England for centuries enable chancers like Johnson to prosper and succeed.
Look Steve, we get it. "Rees-Mogg is a cnut". You don't have to keep going on about it!
 
Rees-Mogg is a cnut.

Why do ordinary people vote for priviledged dickheads like Rees-Mogg and BoJo who don't even try hard to pretend they only want to look after the very top end of town? I just don't get it.

These cnuts hate us all and just want us to enrich them and their peers.
 
Last edited:
Why have an Election now when Boris is now a lame duck Prime Minister with no majority ?

Better to wait and get rid of No Deal first

If I were Corbyn, I'd push for post October 17th election. ie: Make BJ go to October 17th EU Summit, where he has to play nice with EU PMs, and politely request an extension (something he's explicitly promised he'd never ever do), and then report back to parliament that UK will not be leaving on 31st October (something he's explicitly promised he'd never ever do). Both instances would lose him votes.

Those two bits of VDO would then provide Corbyn 'dynamite' material for a negative campaign against BJ proving him to be unreliable, not capable of delivering promises, and a liar

BJ vs Corbyn Election would be the UK's first ever 'presidential' style election, where the vote is really about the party leader, rather than the party manifesto, so will become the most savage character examination that we've ever seen in UK election history. I've no doubt both will tear lumps out of each other. I'm sure Corbyn can handle it, but I fear it may mentally destroy BJ.
 
Last edited:
Rees-Mogg is a cnut.
Agreed, although the backstop will continue to prove a major talking point for Boris during any election debates. What you mention about the uncertainty regarding his own ability to stay cool under pressure here;

really highlights the uphill battle Boris faces provided that the right questions in the debate are asked. It reminds me of May, who somehow managed to live off of a "strong and stable" impression her marketing team had managed to pull off until she had to speak in front of the cameras and the electorate realised it was all false.

But I offer a counter claim to yours; Rees-Mogg is a cnut.
 
Why do ordinary people vote for priviledged dickheads like Rees-Mogg and BoJo who don't even try hard to pretend they only want to look after the very top end of town
Even Johnson's tax cut for the well off as his first act after ending austerity hasn't deterred people. How much clearer can he make it?
 
Agreed, although the backstop will continue to prove a major talking point for Boris during any election debates. What you mention about the uncertainty regarding his own ability to stay cool under pressure here;

really highlights the uphill battle Boris faces provided that the right questions in the debate are asked. It reminds me of May, who somehow managed to live off of a "strong and stable" impression her marketing team had managed to pull off until she had to speak in front of the cameras and the electorate realised it was all false.

But I offer a counter claim to yours; Rees-Mogg is a cnut.
:lol::lol:
 
Been in meetings most of the day, Just catching up on stuff. Good to see BJ get a kicking off Clarke, was like seeing a little boy being berated by his uncle :lol::lol:

But have to say, this speech from Jess Phillips was the speech of the day for me. She has serious talent, and would make for an excellent Home Minister in a future Labour government.

 
But have to say, this speech from Jess Phillips was the speech of the day for me. She has serious talent, and would make for an excellent Home Minister in a future Labour government.


It was and she would. The Momentum lot hate her though, so she might have a wait on her hands.
 
Last edited: