Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
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Blair says everything Corbyn should be saying. Instead Corbyn is at the Kebab Awards
If you're taking any of Tony Blairs comments at face value, then you're very naive or have a short memory.
Even if the Labour MPs (in vote leave constituencies ) abstained, its doubtful May would win.
There has been a tremendous hoax perpetrated on the public in the UK, i.e.the belief that we could leave with 'good deal'. It was never going to be possible, a) because of the way A50 is set up; b) because the EU cannot afford to let us walk away without some penalty. Whether its good or bad for us to have a no deal, that is what the vast majority of Leavers voted for, economic consequences didn't come into it, at least for most of them. Hence it was always going to be 'No deal' or 'No Brexit' as in the referendum itself.
If, as seems the case, most MPs want to Remain, then they have to have the courage of their convictions (regardless of party/loyalty etc.) and to vote or otherwise manoeuvre the Government into revoking A50.
There is no other choice for them or the nation except 'No Deal' and this has been the case from day one. The EU cannot, never mind will not, give us a 'good deal' either in the WA or in any follow up Trade agreements. However, our political class being 'politicians' and ever mindful of their own jobs and that "Turkeys, don't...etc." they have pretended to fight for democracy, or to interpret the Will of the people (but only those in their own image and likeness, etc.) and to generate lots of public appearances, flogging their own brand of how to fool at least some of the people, all of the time!
Ask not for whom the bell tolls!
Donald Tusk statement coming in 1 minute.
This is either going to be really good, really bad or neither.
You’re welcome for that insight.
You’re welcome for that insight.
it could be both, think before you post sir
That leaves No Deal. If we take your confidence motion scenario: by the time a new government is voted in, no deal Brexit will have happened.
If we are not crashing out with no deal and we are not getting an extension then the only option left is to revoke it and then figure out the conditions of if and how it gets invoked again.
This is incredibly disingenuous, and not for the first time in this thread. Both your reasons basically put the blame squarely on the EU for a "good deal" being impossible. A good deal is mostly impossible because of the UK's red lines in the negotiations. That's it. There is no penalty. The UK is not being penalised by the Withdrawal Agreement: it aims to make sure the UK respects the Good Friday Agreement, a binding international treaty.
Revoke Article 50 has to be the priority now. It can always be triggered again later, there's nothing to stop the Government doing that as far as I know.
Always thought of him as the Bruce Springsteen and E Street member first
An extension is only possible if May's deal gets through parliament according to Tusk.
It won't so no extension is possible.
We're screwed.
It won't so no extension is possible.
We're screwed.
That is the sensible option, the problem is this government is fecked.
When you bash out all the details and negotiate in good faith you realise that a good deal for everyone is what EU Membershio looks like.
If it's triggered again in a short time, it's unlikely the EU will negotiate again. Even the current Withdrawal Agreement might be off the table in that case.
The only scenario where I can see the EU being willing to negotiate with the UK again is if there is a new government, one that triggers Article 50 with a clear plan that involves much softer red lines than May's (for example, the four freedoms would remain in place).
Tusk says EU will agree to short extension subject to positive commons vote, May is supposedly making an address to the nation. Therefore, May will say something like she will step down in order for the motion to get through the commons or something similar.
EU wont appreciate revoking and invoking, it leads to more uncertainty. I know that they would begrudgingly have to accept it legally, but whatever deal they offer after that would still be worse and hence rinse and repeat.
I don't think anything can change that now.
A new government can happen within a day with the FTP act. Don't need a GE if a simple majority of MPs (from any Party) agrees to form a new government within 14 days of the Gov losing a confidence vote.
Seems a lot of confusion.
May's deal can't even be put to a vote before the new session in September, without "substantial changes".
An extension could be agreed, if the UK agrees to a 2nd referendum (or something else all EU27 agree). I believe that is what Macron (and others) will demand.
Withdrawing article 50 is possible.
Nothing happening, and WTO / no deal is possible.
And you had the best possible deal even within that. Rebate, middle-of-the-road contribution per capita, no Schengen or Euro, more opt-outs than anyone else...
Now that I come to think of it, I understand why the WA feels like punishment compared to that. But it's self-inflicted.
Blair says everything Corbyn should be saying. Instead Corbyn is at the Kebab Awards
Tony Blair? cmon ffs
Labour now with a big decision to make - support May's deal or we're crashing off the cliff edge next week.
Corbyn has clearly gotten to Tusk.
Yeah , nothing could stop the government from fully transforming the UK into an untrustworthy international partner.
No its not, I've put the blame on our own politicians, for pretending to the UK public that it could ask the EU for something it cannot give, even if it wanted to, which I maintain is debateable. There was no possibility, spelled out by the EU, of discussing the Trade element of 'a deal' before the WA was signed and sealed, why, because under A50 we would still be members of the EU. This stance, by the EU, was not negotiable and the phrase "nothing's agreed until every things agreed" appeared for the first time... seems to have disappeared now?
You seem to be reading my text in your own image and likeness, are you a politician by any chance?
That's easy, they don't support the deal and blame the ensuing chaos solely on the Torries .
I'm guessing the statement will be her spinning her record and also begging people to pressure their MP into supporting her deal.
I think from Tusks statement he expects it to fail and a new direction arranged with haste next week. Although why we're waiting til next week feck knows, it'll fail as it should and we move onto indicative votes, put ref and soft Brexit to the house.
I think from Tusks statement he expects it to fail and a new direction arranged with haste next week. Although why we're waiting til next week feck knows, it'll fail as it should and we move onto indicative votes, put ref and soft Brexit to the house.
she calls no deal and there is a confidence motion... who exactly passes any laws and agrees anything with the EU in the next 9 days... certainly not the new government which is 14 days away...by which time no deal has happened
She offers to resign after getting her deal through next week as a suitable change to let it be voted on again?
Yes, the EU would not discuss a trade deal until the UK actually left the EU. A "good deal" is still possible, you just need to leave first. Hence the withdrawal agreement, where the EU accommodated pretty much every British request during the negotiations.
Now address the part about the "penalty".
So the EU are saying it HAS to be leave 
Crash out with no deal or agree the deal on offer and leave in 50 days. But feck off either way!
Pathetic reaction … the first opportunity the EU have had to play a pro-active part in this and they've shown their hand immediately.
All that crap about "We're stronger together" … "We'll fight to keep you until the end" goes out the fecking window when they get a whiff of the cash available to be divvied up!.
This weekend will be most embarrassing for Macron! While his countrymen are burning down Paris restaurants, chic coffee capsule vendors and fashion houses in their breakdown jackets. Good European people will be peacefully marching in huge numbers in London to show Europe what they are turning their backs on … it will be epic! And if there is even a hint of violence it will be orchestrated by the other side and be mis-reported and blown out of all proportion in the usual rags come Sunday morning.
£900bn in jobs, infrastructure and assets removed from the British finance sector to date … was always going to go this way!
Crash out with no deal or agree the deal on offer and leave in 50 days. But feck off either way!
Pathetic reaction … the first opportunity the EU have had to play a pro-active part in this and they've shown their hand immediately.
All that crap about "We're stronger together" … "We'll fight to keep you until the end" goes out the fecking window when they get a whiff of the cash available to be divvied up!.
This weekend will be most embarrassing for Macron! While his countrymen are burning down Paris restaurants, chic coffee capsule vendors and fashion houses in their breakdown jackets. Good European people will be peacefully marching in huge numbers in London to show Europe what they are turning their backs on … it will be epic! And if there is even a hint of violence it will be orchestrated by the other side and be mis-reported and blown out of all proportion in the usual rags come Sunday morning.
£900bn in jobs, infrastructure and assets removed from the British finance sector to date … was always going to go this way!
Because we’ve spent two fecking years grandstanding like the EU should be glad to fecking have us. After all this is over, regardless of the outcome, there should be a serious inquiry into what happened during these two years for it to get to a week before the deadline for everyone to realize they actually need to do a bit of work now. It’s not a university essay, it’s the lives of millions of people and our country’s future generations.
If we remain in the EEA, I’m thinking of getting out of here at this point. Don’t feel welcome any more despite being a native Brit.
The feck are you talking about?So the EU are saying it HAS to be leave
Crash out with no deal or agree the deal on offer and leave in 50 days. But feck off either way!
Pathetic reaction … the first opportunity the EU have had to play a pro-active part in this and they've shown their hand immediately.
All that crap about "We're stronger together" … "We'll fight to keep you until the end" goes out the fecking window when they get a whiff of the cash available to be divvied up!.
This weekend will be most embarrassing for Macron! While his countrymen are burning down Paris restaurants, chic coffee capsule vendors and fashion houses in their breakdown jackets. Good European people will be peacefully marching in huge numbers in London to show Europe what they are turning their backs on … it will be epic! And if there is even a hint of violence it will be orchestrated by the other side and be mis-reported and blown out of all proportion in the usual rags come Sunday morning.
£900bn in jobs, infrastructure and assets removed from the British finance sector to date … was always going to go this way!
What exactly could the EU have done? Force a referendum on the UK? Or what? Just grant an extension on the basis of... what exactly?
So the EU are saying it HAS to be leave
Crash out with no deal or agree the deal on offer and leave in 50 days. But feck off either way!
Pathetic reaction … the first opportunity the EU have had to play a pro-active part in this and they've shown their hand immediately.
All that crap about "We're stronger together" … "We'll fight to keep you until the end" goes out the fecking window when they get a whiff of the cash available to be divvied up!.
This weekend will be most embarrassing for Macron! While his countrymen are burning down Paris restaurants, chic coffee capsule vendors and fashion houses in their breakdown jackets. Good European people will be peacefully marching in huge numbers in London to show Europe what they are turning their backs on … it will be epic! And if there is even a hint of violence it will be orchestrated by the other side and be mis-reported and blown out of all proportion in the usual rags come Sunday morning.
£900bn in jobs, infrastructure and assets removed from the British finance sector to date … was always going to go this way!
There is literally always the option of revoking article 50, which is what they have said all along. They even clarified that we would go back to status quo if that were to happen.
So the EU are saying it HAS to be leave
Crash out with no deal or agree the deal on offer and leave in 50 days. But feck off either way!
Pathetic reaction … the first opportunity the EU have had to play a pro-active part in this and they've shown their hand immediately.
All that crap about "We're stronger together" … "We'll fight to keep you until the end" goes out the fecking window when they get a whiff of the cash available to be divvied up!.
This weekend will be most embarrassing for Macron! While his countrymen are burning down Paris restaurants, chic coffee capsule vendors and fashion houses in their breakdown jackets. Good European people will be peacefully marching in huge numbers in London to show Europe what they are turning their backs on … it will be epic! And if there is even a hint of violence it will be orchestrated by the other side and be mis-reported and blown out of all proportion in the usual rags come Sunday morning.
£900bn in jobs, infrastructure and assets removed from the British finance sector to date … was always going to go this way!
This is the UK's decision to leave.
What seems to be escaping everyone is that there is only one withdrawal agreement. If the UK want to go in a different direction afterwards that's up to them.