They can't come to a consensus on how to continue.
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
- Thread starter Silva
- Start date
That's why they are basically on the fence, trying to be all things to all people: a little bit pro remain, with all that guff about "jobs first Brexit", and a little bit pro leave, with the respecting the outcome of the election and refusal to do anything that might facilitate a remain outcome.
To be honest I dont think the "sizable section of their voters who happen to be leavers" is the real issue at all, its a convenient excuse. The issue is the two most influential people in the Labour party right now spent their whole lives opposing the EU.
Lads why don't you just stay with us, I admit I was pissed at Britain quite a few times and thought EU will be better off without you, as you might be blocking some crucial reforms, but now I'm really too sad to see you go and to see all these drama. We're friends, stronger and more prosperous together, it's also more fun to be on the same boat. How beautiful it would be to keep going together?
I’ve written love letters like that...
you're a member of that boy band, aren't you?
One would imagine it stops at the 2nd. If Leave, then the options on the table are clearer now and the consequences stripped of the lies and fantasies of the 1st one. One imagines that parliament should be able to get it over the line.
If a Leave plan had been formulated that parliament could agree on, there'd be no talk of a 2nd referendum. The reasons are grounded in the utter lack of unclarity of what "leave" actually entailed at the time of the original referendum and how this is meant to be enacted. The UK is at a democratic impasse - Parliament can not decide on how to enact the referendum, the circumstances for all involved are by now quite changed after three years and the premises clearer. It is an impasse that essentially cries out for a democratic vote to clarify and empower the mandate that is to be carried out.
In what way? You seem to be upset that it might not happen, as opposed to how ignorant people might, or might not be.
EDIT: This is not a personal attack, it's just an observation. You have been very helpful whenever I've had a question about this subject. I just detected a tinge of bias I'd not seen before … I hope you are not offended. No offence intended
Just saw your amended post . No I'm very rarely offended.
I must admit there is a tiny part of me that wants to be able to prove that Brexit would be a disaster but I'm not that evil and really hope that it is cancelled.
Scenes when Trump calls for a 'People's Vote'
I heard he did the opposite … but it seems whatever I read on this subject gets turned on its head two seconds later!
From Donald Trump's meeting with Leo Varadkar … the President says he is opposed to a second referendum …
Thank you, again!
I'm the Sophie aged 6 and I can draw unicorns.
Many of us would love to stay. We'll still be pals. x
I do agree with you but resistance to a second vote is hardly baffling. There was plenty of information available before the last vote, which led a lot of us to the conclusion that Brexit was a really stupid idea. What has happened in the last two years vindicates what a lot of people were saying back then, it is not brand new information. True, it is a lot more obvious now, but I wonder whether it is any more obvious to the people inclined to vote for Brexit? I suspect, as i have said dozens of times before (tho I have no evidence to back it up) that it has merely made people who already opposed it even more certain of their view. I reckon the majority of people who wanted Brexit still do. And that is because people's opinions on this question derive from emotions, not rationality.
Also, while you didnt mention this aspect, a lot of the time when I talk to people about this they cite the lies that were told last time as a reason not to treat that result as sacrosanct. But does anyone think another election would be conducted with a greater spirit of honesty? There'll be just as many lies the next time around as there were last time. Different lies, I guess. Nobody could say German car manufacturers will ensure we get a great deal anymore with a straight face. But there'll be lies about how well Britain would fare trading on WTO terms, all that bullshit about eradicating all duties on imports and cheap trainers that JRM loves going on about.
And the fact that the vote was two years ago is only relevant if we are proposing to have ongoing votes every few years to confirm we are happy with our current EU membership status - in or out. We could have GEs and EU referendums, alternating like Euros and World Cups, one every 2 years. That way everyone gets to vote on the most accurate, up to date information.
And of course a Brexiter would also complain that if the result had gone the other way, they wouldnt be getting a second chance. Not an analogous situation of course because there is no confusion or uncertainty around continuing with the status quo. But every time there was a crisis in the EU, if there was a decision to set quotas for migrants or increase the budget or anything like that, Brexiters would say: "THE SITUATION HAS CHANGED! WE NEED ANOTHER VOTE."
Having said all that, I do think a second ref is the best - perhaps only - way out of this hole we've dug ourselves into.
Good job, thread title change guy!
We(the CAF) want to stay mate. I agree that we are better together.
Of course it’s not just you. The same inane argument against a second vote has been made since the original bloody vote itself.
I'm absolutely sick of Brexit to be honest.
I cannot contribute more than that unfortunately, as I would be absolutely lying if I pretended to have a clue of what is actually going on and what it even means for us.
I cannot contribute more than that unfortunately, as I would be absolutely lying if I pretended to have a clue of what is actually going on and what it even means for us.
That could definitely happen, it would take time and we would lose all the special privilidges we have accrued over the years, the rebate and all the rest of it. We'd be just another member, like all the others.
That could happen. I would go further and say I reckon it absolutely will happen once people realise this Global Britain dream they were sold was complete horseshit.
Yay, chlorinated chicken ahoy!
Make Brexit Great...Oh f*ck.
Only two things are unlimited according to Einstein and this tweet pretty much confirms his notion.
Believe me mate no one knows whats going on or how it will impact the country. This whole process has been total chaos from start to present and no one knows when it will finish.
Krusty's Pork Products™ ahoy.
washed down with some Covfefe with some super male vitality on the side
To paraphrase Churchill, I’d say a second referendum is the worst way of resolving this issue except for all the other ways. It would be vitriolic, the populists would frame it as the elite robbing the ordinary people of their victory and there is no guarantee Remain would win as a lot of voters would continue to stick their head in the sand about the consequences of leaving.
But I don’t think parliament could simply revoke Art 50 without a popular mandate (even though it could as a matter of constitutional law) and the other options all definitely lead to Brexit - from a damage limitation but rather pointless BINO, through May’s blind Brexit (at risk of highjack anyway when she is replaced as leader) all the way to the ERG/Britannia Unchained dystopia in which we make the US look like a socialist state.
But I don’t think parliament could simply revoke Art 50 without a popular mandate (even though it could as a matter of constitutional law) and the other options all definitely lead to Brexit - from a damage limitation but rather pointless BINO, through May’s blind Brexit (at risk of highjack anyway when she is replaced as leader) all the way to the ERG/Britannia Unchained dystopia in which we make the US look like a socialist state.
Best thread title yet!
Trump has spoken out against a 2nd referendum and supports Brexit.
Big flashing neon sign there folks. Just sayin...
Big flashing neon sign there folks. Just sayin...
It always amazes me that people think having a vote on anything could be undemocratic.
He's been talking to Leo about Brexit today.
He cannot be accused of not putting the interests of the United States first in this matter, for sure.
You're forgetting The Donald's massive a-brain
It would be funny if the result of all this nationalist, nostalgic bullsh*t is that in 10-15 years we end up fully integrated in a EU federalist project!
Just give up your NHS and your food standards, the world is yours.
It certainly would be. The law of unintended consequences strikes again.
That picture of the commons with Labour members abstaining 