Fair enough that you disagree, but if you were one of the many posters here calling for more open and deeper discourse (rather than memes and name-calling) then it would be incumbent upon you to rebut.
The Trump Presidency | Biden Inaugurated
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Trump hasn't been very Conservative. That's the joke of all of this. MSNBC has a couple liberal host in the evening. They are not pro dems, they are pro libtards. So if and when the dems go centrist or even a bit to the right they freak out and slam the dems.
That's the difference. Trump isnt a Conservative. There's no Conservative party at the moment. They are basically pro trump and go along with whatever the administration does even if it doesn't adhere to Conservative values and regularly coordinate with the Trump administration to get their agenda across instead of having a non bias view on things even from a Conservative mind set. Sean Hannity is basically his spokes man. Being biased to Conservative or Liberal values is one thing. Being a national propaganda machine is dangerous.
The first steps to denuclearisation have been achieved many times. They were offered to Obama in 2016, negotiated under Obama in 2012, under Obama in 2008/9, under Bush in 2004/5/6/7, under Clinton in 2000, with Clinton (and Carter) in 1994, under Bush in 1992 and Reagan in 1985
https://www.armscontrol.org/factsheets/dprkchron
Obama was and is impressive as a person, hugely likeable and pretty much a celebrity (more than Trump will ever be ironically). People who didn't even know anything about politics liked him (if not loved him) just because of how he came across. That's not a cult.
There was no r/thebarack going on.
Looks like the winder uppers legged it. Complain about lack of intelligent responses and when they come, hit and run.
Why. Because you disagree with the posters views? I don't see the poster being hostile and being derogatory. Poster should be allowed to give their views even if it's not what the majority agree with
Probably because they are not particularly similar. Obama used populism as a campaign tool and then governed as a traditional, moderate leader. Trump used populism as a campaign tool and then governs like an out of control moron who has no respect for the established rules of politics or diplomacy.
He is dodging questions. I don't see a proper debate.
He didn't say get rid of or silence him, he said he's best ignored and he's right because the poster in question willfully ignores genuine points of discussion in favour of memes or bemoaning a meltdown that isn't happening.
If someone refuses to engage in conversation and instead makes stupid strawman arguments and quips about Obama and Hillary then he's unquestionably best ignored as attempting to talk to them leads nowhere.
Why have they been banned or something? Or do you mean nobody should be allowed to call out their bullshit?
Fair if he's dodging. But I can understand its hard to respond to 15 messages at once.
Not sure what you're asking. Im only saying that it's not necessary to ignore posters just because you don't agree with their view. Definitely call out their bullshit
Trump didn't even insist on anyway to verify Kim doing what he's pledged to do.
Kim didn't even state what his current nuclear capabilities are.
Testing nukes should not be responded to with an invitation to talk. Iran doesn't have nukes as far as I know.
As for the deal, Iran kept their part of the bargain according to the teams present. Even then you can decide to pull the plug, but perhaps you can talk about it with your allies instead of doing everything like a bull in a China shop?
I’d say that’s slightly cultish behavior.
Absolutely perfect.
My mum loved him just because he was handsome and had a great voice. I don't think she's in a cult.
Trump has handed KJU a huge PR victory for agreeing to exactly what KJU had alrwafy agreed with South Korea.
KJU only agreed to what he did becausevhe now has limited ICBM nuclear strike capacity after destroying his only nuclear test site while the country goes bust.
Trump had a pre-condition of denulcearitation in the region but has nothing like that agreement. He is all mouth and trousers. A used car salesman messing with world politics.
I hope we can get rid before we have a nuclear war due to an overgrown orange toddler's tantrum.
KJU only agreed to what he did becausevhe now has limited ICBM nuclear strike capacity after destroying his only nuclear test site while the country goes bust.
Trump had a pre-condition of denulcearitation in the region but has nothing like that agreement. He is all mouth and trousers. A used car salesman messing with world politics.
I hope we can get rid before we have a nuclear war due to an overgrown orange toddler's tantrum.
If true then this looks like a shocking miscalculation and failure from Trump.
I hope you're wrong.
Well it's hardly "shocking".
This could probably sum up most Trump fans on here. Make a bunch of blanket statements, get called out on them, then come up with some reason to avoid an actual detailed political discussion.
Touche
Those annoying little details.
I do notice this and I can see why their is frustration and name calling when it happens. Unfortunate as its always good to hear a rational informed response from those who think he's doing well.
The only person who's been able to make rational informed arguments on behalf of Trump doesn't actually believe the arguments he was making and was playing devil's advocate for the sake of the debate.
Whats there to discuss. I listed his accomplishments and that poster either said Obama was responsible or he/she disagreed with the ideological basis of them being positives.
From a Republican stand point Trump has done a lot of what he promised before he was elected and attempted the other things like the wall and repealing Obamacare.
Therefore his supporters say he has done well from their point of view.
I might be wrong but consider this.
NK did not reveal their current nuclear capabilities and America has no way of knowing. The Americans are entering negotiations blind right from the get-go.
If NK eventually claims to have denuclearised, how the feck can you verify it when you have no idea what they had in the first place?
They also have not given any timeframe to denuclearizing. That alone tells me it's not happening anytime soon.
Hitler and Stalin did well from the point of view of their supporters.
You listed a bunch of things and solely attributed them to Trump, with no actual substance behind your statements. Trump may be partially responsible for some aspects of economic growth; nevertheless it's rarely the case that one individual can be completely praised for the improvement of the economy, especially when that economy was mostly doing alright under the previous President anyway. And short-term economic growth isn't always positive in that it can with caveats depending on how you do it - will Trump's approach of cutting taxes for the rich while putting more money into the military etc lead to long-term problems with debt? If so, how does he plan to deal with that?
A lot of the things you listed aren't positives either. ICE have been acting horrendously by cruelly separating families in moves that'd remind you of fascist regimes. Withdrawing from the Paris Agreement clearly isn't a good move unless you're scientifically ignorant. Plus he's not actually fully repealed Obamacare and has given no indication as to what his healthcare plan will be and how it'll work better than Obamacare.
I don't suspect you'll actually give a proper response to this though, because as you stated you can't really be arsed to debate political issues with any actual substance because you mostly (probably) know feck all. You're like Trump himself in that regard - make a controversial statement, cause a stir, and let it fester while knowing you don't contribute to political discourse in the slightest.
I'm old and cynical. When I hear this talk about cutting through the paperwork and bull and getting face to face for a handshake and a gentleman's agreement I hear a con man. It sounds like the sales pitch from someone trying to sell me a bridge or a piece of prime swampland, or that Prince I got an email from who just needed a bit of help to unlock a fortune.
Sometimes change does get signalled by seemingly trivial events, random meetings that have no obvious first result than a giant panda arriving at a foreign capital zoo.
It's just hard to believe that someone who deliberately, unilaterally pulled out of an agreed deal on nuclear weapons development in Iran is interested in anything beyond a photo opportunity and a meaningless declaration. Two con artists shake hands for the entertainment of their local TV news stations.
Whether he's actually got the personnel with the power and the ability to take it further I guess we'll find out, but that could take years to play out.
Sometimes change does get signalled by seemingly trivial events, random meetings that have no obvious first result than a giant panda arriving at a foreign capital zoo.
It's just hard to believe that someone who deliberately, unilaterally pulled out of an agreed deal on nuclear weapons development in Iran is interested in anything beyond a photo opportunity and a meaningless declaration. Two con artists shake hands for the entertainment of their local TV news stations.
Whether he's actually got the personnel with the power and the ability to take it further I guess we'll find out, but that could take years to play out.
Yeah, this is the big one for me. If there's no frame for when they need to get rid of their nukes it gives them all sorts of scope to make excuses when they don't do it. They'll say it's taking too long, or that so-and-so is upping tensions with them and they're wary to hold to the agreement anymore because conditions have changed.
It's Trump. It's nothing other than window dressing and distraction from the ongoing investigations. It's Wizard of Oz style levels of bs.
Now, imagine if NK doesn't even have nuclear weapons.
1. It was heading that way because of all the work Obama did. If you look at the trends, Trump didn't really do anything here
2-3 Same as 1
4. That is not much of an accomplishment considering all it does is increase the tensions and didn't advance peace in any way
5. Watching ICE tear children away from their families and mistreat human beings is not an accomplishment. ICE should be thoroughly investigated for human rights violations.
6. After the Republicans performed one of the most unconstitutional obstructions to unlawfully prevent Obama from executing his Constitutional powers. Gorsuch never should have been a SC nomimee. This again was breaking the spirit of the constitution to pursue gutter trash partisan politics. Gorsuch is an unlawful judge who should step down if he had an ounce of integrity.
7. Very bad thing. Should have kept it
8. All we really know is that Trump can buddy up with totalitarian dictators
9. Tax cuts for the rich that were not economically responsible and could very well do far more damage than good
10. Nothing to do with Trump
11. Which is meaningless without true health care reform, just wanking over undoing something that Obama did with no real plan or foresight into the issue
12. Another very bad thing. Radical deregulation directly led to all the biggest economic disasters not hte least of which was the grand recession of 2008 caused by the deregulation in the FSMA and CFMA of 99 and 00.
13. Another potentially disastrous move
14. can you list all the hostages released negotiated by all Presidents of the last 40 years?
15. Not sure you even know what this own means
16. Absolutely horrible idea. Cutting federal funding for abortion is going to directly lead to increased crime. Way to increase crime Trump
17. I haven't seen him stand up to Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh the most biased and corrupt of all media
Totally agree. Unlike some here, I think the people who bash the Iran deal have a point but you can't bash the Iran deal and support what happened last night.
It looks to me like a political opportunity both leaders couldn't miss out on.
The only problem is that it has real consequences for South Korea and Japan.
The only meaningful outcome of what happened yesterday is that Foal Eagle has ended.
On point.
This entire thing feels like a massive photo up between a dictator and a demagogue - both with long track records of deception and both in desperate need to get a win for domestic consumption.
Kim is almost certainly playing the long game of being friendly with Trump in exchange for the things he wants - a cessation of US/South Korean exercises, lifting of sanctions etc - with the expectation that Trump won't be around much longer and that whoever replaces him won't be so desperate to make a deal.
Kim is almost certainly playing the long game of being friendly with Trump in exchange for the things he wants - a cessation of US/South Korean exercises, lifting of sanctions etc - with the expectation that Trump won't be around much longer and that whoever replaces him won't be so desperate to make a deal.
On the contrary:
- Economy is in fantastic shape - Obama's legacy
- Lowest Black/Latino American unemployment in many years - Obama's legacy
- Lowest general unemployment in many years - Obama's legacy
- Moved embassy to Jersualem - utter disaster designed to sabotage even the vaguest possibility of middle east peace
- Restricted illegal immigration by giving ICE more powers - ineffective racist dog whistling
- Judicial appointments in particular Gorsuch to the Supreme Court. - more right wing nutters. Great.
- Ended Iran deal - another attempt to destabilise the middle east
- Negotiated peace with North Korea
- Tax reform - destroy any chance of social mobility
- Isis destroyed yes - an orange toddler did that
- Individual mandate repealed - swaping a flawed Obama care for something far worse and more expensive.
- Deregulation - money for the Trumps ($75 million to his daughter and family already) and his rich mates - feck the poor.
- Withdrew from Paris Accord.- the opposite of a good idea
- Negotiated release of three American hostages back from North Korea - have a biscuit. KJU's bitch deserves one
- Cracked down on Sanctuary cities - because he wants to increase crime and because "dark people, migration, splutter".
- Cut federal funding for Abortion - a morally repugnant act and an infrigement of women's human rights.
- Stood up to a corrupt and biased media - do feck off. Fox news wouldn't know real news if it introduced itself wearing a t-shirts saying "investigative journalism"
Trump is a huge orange toddler with an ego the size of a planet and his finger on the nuclear button. He makes Dubya seem competent.
In the immediate term, I see SK and NK benefitting the most with both leaders able to point to "wins." Trump gets his photo op but not sure what else benefits the US substantially. China and Russia should have cover to reduce sanctions now and not be out of line.
That seemed to be the point of all this - appease Trump's ego a bit and get him to back down on things that actually hurt the key players. The US retreat from global leadership continues with Russia and China coming to fill the void.
That seemed to be the point of all this - appease Trump's ego a bit and get him to back down on things that actually hurt the key players. The US retreat from global leadership continues with Russia and China coming to fill the void.
The only thing he can partially claim is a strong economy and extremely low unemployment rate, which were both already in motion under Obama but have increased under Trump.
He has not repealed Obamacare and he has not built a wall - both things he endlessly bloviated about during the campaign. Repealing the individual mandate without an alternative has simply made healthcare worse.
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