SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

Has anyone had no reaction to the initial two jabs but then an adverse effect from the booster?

I had the booster 2 days ago and have slowly felt worse since. Symptoms are achy bones (by far the biggest symptom), a runny nose and a small bit of coughing.

I did an antigen test and its negative.

Also I think I might be improving a bit now but I might just be trying to persuade myself.
 
Has anyone had no reaction to the initial two jabs but then an adverse effect from the booster?

I had the booster 2 days ago and have slowly felt worse since. Symptoms are achy bones (by far the biggest symptom), a runny nose and a small bit of coughing.

I did an antigen test and its negative.

Also I think I might be improving a bit now but I might just be trying to persuade myself.
You’ll be fine after a few days
 
Has anyone had no reaction to the initial two jabs but then an adverse effect from the booster?

I had the booster 2 days ago and have slowly felt worse since. Symptoms are achy bones (by far the biggest symptom), a runny nose and a small bit of coughing.

I did an antigen test and its negative.

Also I think I might be improving a bit now but I might just be trying to persuade myself.
I had my booster on Tuesday morning.

Tuesday afternoon/evening: standard achy arm.
Wednesday: woke up with a dry throat.
Wednesday evening: bit of a cough developed.
Yesterday: Fatigue in the morning, still a bit of a cough but went out with friends in the evening and wasn’t too bad.
Today: Still got a cough and feeling really low on energy, been on the sofa or in bed all day. Not feeling ill really just drained of any energy and motivation to do anything. Turned down the offer to meet friends again as I don’t want to push it and ruin tomorrow.

I’ve done two LFT, one on Wednesday and one yesterday and both negative so it’s either the vaccine has wiped me out or I’ve been unlucky and picked up another bug.
 
Has anyone had no reaction to the initial two jabs but then an adverse effect from the booster?

I had the booster 2 days ago and have slowly felt worse since. Symptoms are achy bones (by far the biggest symptom), a runny nose and a small bit of coughing.

I did an antigen test and its negative.

Also I think I might be improving a bit now but I might just be trying to persuade myself.
I don't think a cough is common side effect?

Could be too early to show on the test, as often don't show until after 2 days of symptoms. Or it could be a cold. People ill at the moment is about 50% covid and 50% colds.
 
I don't think a cough is common side effect?

Could be too early to show on the test, as often don't show until after 2 days of symptoms. Or it could be a cold. People ill at the moment is about 50% covid and 50% colds.

Yeah I'll lay low but hopefully it'll work out.

You’ll be fine after a few days

Here's hoping.

I had my booster on Tuesday morning.

Tuesday afternoon/evening: standard achy arm.
Wednesday: woke up with a dry throat.
Wednesday evening: bit of a cough developed.
Yesterday: Fatigue in the morning, still a bit of a cough but went out with friends in the evening and wasn’t too bad.
Today: Still got a cough and feeling really low on energy, been on the sofa or in bed all day. Not feeling ill really just drained of any energy and motivation to do anything. Turned down the offer to meet friends again as I don’t want to push it and ruin tomorrow.

I’ve done two LFT, one on Wednesday and one yesterday and both negative so it’s either the vaccine has wiped me out or I’ve been unlucky and picked up another bug.

Very similar to my experience! Was offered the chance to go to the pub today with a few friends but thought better of it.
 
Fair enough, I agree it's a stretch.

Other than our general risk tolerance / preference, I think the main place we diverge here is our assessment of vaccine efficacy. You're sure there's going to be a shit-load of breakthrough infections post-booster, and if that is the case then my entire argument is at least redundant, and probably stupid. Inevitably booster + mild infection would be better than 2nd dose + mild infection.

I'm much more optimistic that the booster will prevent infection in the short-term. I've just not seen the evidence that the risk of breakthrough infection post-booster is that high. We'll definitely find out soon!



Not really, mostly for practical reasons. From the PHE study (pages 6-8) we saw immunity start to wane 10 weeks after the second dose, which echoes what they're saying now about the booster. We don't have much data after 10 weeks as the booster roll-out started properly in the beginning of October, 12 weeks ago.

While that makes for an interesting headline, it doesn't tell us much. Even though the level of protection against symptomatic disease started to drop 10 weeks after the 2nd dose, it didn't drop by much: for AZ it dropped from 65% to 60%, for Pfizer it dropped from 90% to 80%. And more importantly, protection against hospitalisation hardly dropped at all: from 95% to 90% for AZ, and from 98% to 96% for Pfizer (or thereabouts). Or as PHE put it:


When you get to 6 months the declines were more substantial after dose 2, and no-one in the UK has been boosted for that long. Israel might have some data on that but I've not seen any.

One other thing worth mentioning about the "immunity begins to wane after 10 weeks" headline is that we know immunity wanes quicker among more vulnerable populations, and it's the more vulnerable populations that got boosted first. So we should assume it'll wane slower for the general population than whatever the waning is now. And given how much the booster multiplied the number of antibodies, it's waning from a much higher bar so it seems reasonable to assume protection will last longer post-booster than post-dose 2. Even with Omicron's capacity for immune escape, from what I can tell. EDIT: Maybe not with Omicron.

It's worth saying that immunity isn't really a binary thing either, so there won't be a point that immunity will last until. There'll likely be some level of immune response for years to come from that second vaccine dose - that's what they saw post-MERS trials - it just becomes less effective as the volume of immune first responders (antibodies, B-cells, T-cells) declines. The dose of infection we get varies so a low-dose infection can still be fought off by a low-dose immune response.

The figures about waning immunity look at the average person with the average dose of infection, which is useful at the population level but less useful at the individual level. In other words we shouldn't think about those timings as cut-off points for when we suddenly stop being immune to covid, it's more complicated than that.

Thank you for the detailed reply. Much appreciated.
 
Anyone have any information the drug that can be given to early on to people who are vulnerable and have tested positve for Covid? Mainly how long after exposure is it is worth having?

Long story short, my brother has had issues with low platelets for unknown reasons since May this year, had transfusions, injections every week, etc, white blood cells also affected, anyway he has managed to pick up Covid, certain he got on Saturday, tested positve on the lateral flow on Tuesday, no PCR confirmation 72 hours on, which apparently flags up this sort of treatment, but time is getting on now surely.
 
Anyone have any information the drug that can be given to early on to people who are vulnerable and have tested positve for Covid? Mainly how long after exposure is it is worth having?

Long story short, my brother has had issues with low platelets for unknown reasons since May this year, had transfusions, injections every week, etc, white blood cells also affected, anyway he has managed to pick up Covid, certain he got on Saturday, tested positve on the lateral flow on Tuesday, no PCR confirmation 72 hours on, which apparently flags up this sort of treatment, but time is getting on now surely.
Is he waiting for a PCR test or a result, if it's a result how long ago was the test and was it done at a centre or was it a postal one? I'm only asking because it sounds like something has gone wrong and he needs to test again.

The earlier the better is the rule for most of these early treatments and they aren't available for every condition. If he can get in touch with the specialist team managing his bloodwork, he should do that, even if it's just off the back of a couple of lateral flow tests. I don't know how the system works for people in his position, but it may be that it can be bypassed when there's a delay in getting a PCR result.

Good luck to him.
 
Do you make Covid tests prior to meeting the family over Xmas? Our test center in town has extra times over Xmas so that you can get a rapid test without any cost. We all did today before the gathering around the tree at Xmas eve (in Germany we open the presents Xmas eve).
 
Is he waiting for a PCR test or a result, if it's a result how long ago was the test and was it done at a centre or was it a postal one? I'm only asking because it sounds like something has gone wrong and he needs to test again.

The earlier the better is the rule for most of these early treatments and they aren't available for every condition. If he can get in touch with the specialist team managing his bloodwork, he should do that, even if it's just off the back of a couple of lateral flow tests. I don't know how the system works for people in his position, but it may be that it can be bypassed when there's a delay in getting a PCR result.

Good luck to him.

Yes he's waiting for the PCR result, it was a drive through one, and it was on Tueaday night, it does seem like a long time ago, but just assuming they are very busy, maybe staff off with Covid, and the Christmas period, etc. three lateral flow tests all positive, so he''s got it for sure.

The specialist just said it's early days for the treatment and was a bit vague, and also said a positive PCR should flag him up on the system, he is well known to the hospital now and they have been excellent, so I'm sure they are doing their best for him, but it seems a bit slack at a potentially critical moment.

Anyway he's got fairly mild symptoms so far, so hopefully things will be fine.

Thank you for your reply.
 
Yes he's waiting for the PCR result, it was a drive through one, and it was on Tueaday night, it does seem like a long time ago, but just assuming they are very busy, maybe staff off with Covid, and the Christmas period, etc. three lateral flow tests all positive, so he''s got it for sure.

The specialist just said it's early days for the treatment and was a bit vague, and also said a positive PCR should flag him up on the system, he is well known to the hospital now and they have been excellent, so I'm sure they are doing their best for him, but it seems a bit slack at a potentially critical moment.

Anyway he's got fairly mild symptoms so far, so hopefully things will be fine.

Thank you for your reply.
I've read that tests in some areas are taking 3-4 days to process, so a Tuesday night test result could arrive anytime now really.

They're being honest when they say it's still early days for the treatments - a lot of them are only really being used on a trial basis while they work out who does benefit from them and who doesn't.

Fingers crossed it stays mild.
 
You ok buddy?

yeah, feeling a bit better now thanks.. hoping I'm over the worst

got myself a pulse oximeter which has been very helpful, thanks for the tip @Pogue Mahone

the reading was at 95/96 for a little while and the doc told me if it worsened I should go to A&E but it's recovered to 97 this past 24 hours or so..
 
Negative pcr done on Thursday. Negative lateral flows (1x Thursday 3x Friday) but just done another this morning incase and it was positive. Shiteeee
 
Son and his GF came to visit. She just learned after arriving she was exposed earlier in the week while visiting family who KNEW they had covid but did not tell anyone. I found some LFT which my son and I took yesterday. Both negative. His GF is staying at her parents house but tested positive. They shared a 12 hour car ride before arriving. It's inevitable that we all get it now I guess. We're all triple vaxxed so not expecting anything bad.
 
Son and his GF came to visit. She just learned after arriving she was exposed earlier in the week while visiting family who KNEW they had covid but did not tell anyone. I found some LFT which my son and I took yesterday. Both negative. His GF is staying at her parents house but tested positive. They shared a 12 hour car ride before arriving. It's inevitable that we all get it now I guess. We're all triple vaxxed so not expecting anything bad.
There is stupid, then there are anti-vaxxers and then there are these. How inconsiderate do you need to be to do something like that at this point of time.
 
Also seems like the hospital turnover is a lot quicker, at least for those not in ICU. One of the main problems in our ICU in previous waves was that once someone got admitted we knew they’d be occupying a bed for at least two weeks.
 
Anyone know what the “release criteria” is for people in self-imposed isolation?

3rd day for the mother-in-law on the antigen kits showing positive. She reckons it’s coming up on her 10th day since catching it (so she thinks)
 
Anyone know what the “release criteria” is for people in self-imposed isolation?

3rd day for the mother-in-law on the antigen kits showing positive. She reckons it’s coming up on her 10th day since catching it (so she thinks)

Heard its infinite for mother-in-laws.
 
Anyone know what the “release criteria” is for people in self-imposed isolation?

3rd day for the mother-in-law on the antigen kits showing positive. She reckons it’s coming up on her 10th day since catching it (so she thinks)
Feels like a good opportunity to make a number up like… two months?
 
In Ireland it looks like 10 days from symptom onset (and I guess from first positive test if asymptomatic). How is she doing?
She’s got a mild cough and pretty much ok apart from that. So she tells us anyway! Though she did let the cat out of the bag last night about feeling unwell before she flew but assumed she was ok because her PCR was negative
 
there's an incubation period of 5/6 days
Should that not still be caught by a pcr though? I'm totally new to this so maybe that's a stupid question, but I thought the pcr should pick it up at all though
 
Should that not still be caught by a pcr though? I'm totally new to this so maybe that's a stupid question, but I thought the pcr should pick it up at all though

yeah it picks it up sooner I think, but there's still a period where you have it and it won't pick it up

edit: I'm an idiot and don't know anything so please don't take anything I say as a trusted source
 
yeah it picks it up sooner I think, but there's still a period where you have it and it won't pick it up

edit: I'm an idiot and don't know anything so please don't take anything I say as a trusted source
I've another pcr booked for tomorrow for confirmation but all 4 lateral flows today have been positive
 
How does that happen ?

Hopefully you'll be OK.
It's fecking annoying because once the pcr came back negative plus the 4 lateral flows over Thursday Friday, my parents said come on up, so I was home from last night with parents and brother.

Then just done another test to be sure to be sure this morning and it was positive so now those 3 plus the wife are all close contacts.
 
She’s got a mild cough and pretty much ok apart from that. So she tells us anyway! Though she did let the cat out of the bag last night about feeling unwell before she flew but assumed she was ok because her PCR was negative
I'm in the same boat as her. Felt a bit lethargic yesterday but pcr and 4 lateral flows said no so I carried on
 
Couple of positive mates that still live at home are moving into a married friends house who are also positive.

Isolation houses, good idea.
 
Monday Boris will make his next decision...... Which party shall I deny going to.... I mean Further restrictions yes or no.

It's going to be close.

It's seems regardless, the Government are going against science recommendations and I'd expect them to do the same again.
 
yeah it picks it up sooner I think, but there's still a period where you have it and it won't pick it up

edit: I'm an idiot and don't know anything so please don't take anything I say as a trusted source

Jojojo’s post on that (below) with the FT graphic as a reference point is good. Basically the LFTs and PCR’s both give negative results in the pre-infectious period, and that’s not a design flaw it’s just a result of the way the virus infects us.

There’s very little infectious material to detect for 3-4 days, then it grows exponentially. So while the PCR test is more sensitive and can detect it at an earlier stage, it’s not much earlier due to that growth curve. it varies a bit but the rough estimate is that a PCR test can identify you on day 3 while an LFT test can identify you on day 4.

So an LFT test today is more useful than a PCR test two days ago, particularly for people without symptoms / people who are in the pre-infectious period.

Because we've had a lot of talk about tests recently a couple of observations.

With infection rates high, the odds of a LFT giving a false positive are lower than the odds of a PCR test giving a false negative. If the LFT says you're infected and the PCR says you aren't, you need to be suspicious - at least do another LFT test to make sure.

A PCR done one morning can be too early to pick up an infection that's visible on LFT the next day. A negative PCR done two days ago is basically useless today. PCRs can see a lower viral load, which means they can pick up an infection maybe a day earlier than a LFT and they may continue to give a positive result for days (or weeks) after the LFT goes back to seeing negatives again - in general though those late PCR positives are seeing dead viral material not the infectious kind. The early PCR positives are obviously useful though, and PCRs can pick up asymptomatic cases that LFTS miss - provided you get the timing right.

The FT did a graphic based on the data:

FHNjOiVWQAQer7C
 
Whilst this new variant of Covid is moving around in england - is the more deadly version of Covid going around too?