SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

Ady87 said:
Little WFH update, I'm sure there was another thread for this kind of thing but can't find it...

Work gave us an update a fortnight ago that we would be planning a return to the office after 21st June. Since WFH work have bought a new office on the same street which none of us have been in yet. We've been told inductions in to the building (Managed space) will be from 21st June and the earliest we will be back in the office is 5th July.

They then sent out a survey to employees with options like:

Yes I'm happy to have my induction and return to office work.
Yes I'm happy to have my induction and return to office work but I have some concerns about COVID.
Yes I'm happy to have my induction but I would not like to return to office work just yet due to concerns about COVID.
No I don't want to have my induction or return to office work.

I picked the 3rd option and gave a ton of rationale. My personal circumstances have changed. Girlfriend went back off maternity last year and was made redundant instantly and lost her company car, we now have one. She started a new job last week and has 12 weeks training in the office then permanent work from home. I don't want to buy a second car for the sake of a few weeks commute. My son is also 22 months old now and we had to find a nursery at 10 days notice for this new job and so we don't have all the days we want and have had to patch it together with family etc. WFH makes it work.

Just got a call invite for Friday afternoon to discuss with the entire business unit. Typical shit house behaviour when they want to drop a bad message that people can't then act on or discuss in work time haha. Man, I'm really dreading a 1 hour commute each way and my freedoms being pulled from under me. We delivered our best ever performance last financial year too working from home.
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I had several people kindly reply so here is an update.

If Boris doesn't push back 21st June, then the office will complete a 2 hour induction to the new office leading up to 5th July. W/C the 5th we will be working 3 days at home, 2 in the office on a fortnightly rota with 2 teams doing Tue/Wed and 2 teams doing Thurs/Fri, rotating.

As of September, providing nothing material changes, we will be doing Mon/Fri WFH and Tue/Wed/Thurs in the office indefinitely.

Considering I have 35 days leave to take, like a truly horrible person refusing to accept reality, I've booked off my rota'd days in the office in August so they wont see me for a month. I feel better now.

It's also a compromise I wasn't expecting them to make and whilst I'm not 'happy', it could be worse!
 
Traub said:
What's the best approach with testing?

I know someone who came into contact with a Covid positive person last week Thursday (actually whole of last week). The Covid positive person went for a test yesterday and came back positive, and the positive person had symptoms since last Friday. The person I know also went for a test yesterday and came back negative. Should they go for another test in a few days?
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I would say yes, they should. Always best to follow whatever procedures they have in your country though.
 
FootballHQ said:
Read Hungary want to be at full capacity for the games they're hosting although don't know if that's 100%.

Had my thinking the other day....how are Italy and Spain doing now as you don't see the figures much in the press compared to 12 months ago so assume it's goodish news? Similar levels to here and variants haven't taken hold.
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Italy's doing pretty well. Cases yesterday were 1,896, deaths 102 (that figure was under 100 for the few days before). Everything's arranged regionally here, so some regions are under more restrictions than others. However, some are now in 'white' measures (you just have to wear masks), and all the others are in 'yellow', where the restrictions aren't too onerous.

Mask-wearing both inside and outside is still compulsory and at least where we live, is adhered to by everyone. Vaccinations have really got going and some regions are vaccinating teenagers now. The difference has partly been due to the opening of many more vaccination centres. Italy's generally gone for the big vaccination centre approach, rather than 'visit your doctor' - the latter wouldn't be easy here because of how things are organised (drop-in surgeries with no appointments, no admin or nursing staff in many places).
 
Ady87 said:
Little WFH update, I'm sure there was another thread for this kind of thing but can't find it...

Work gave us an update a fortnight ago that we would be planning a return to the office after 21st June. Since WFH work have bought a new office on the same street which none of us have been in yet. We've been told inductions in to the building (Managed space) will be from 21st June and the earliest we will be back in the office is 5th July.

They then sent out a survey to employees with options like:

Yes I'm happy to have my induction and return to office work.
Yes I'm happy to have my induction and return to office work but I have some concerns about COVID.
Yes I'm happy to have my induction but I would not like to return to office work just yet due to concerns about COVID.
No I don't want to have my induction or return to office work.

I picked the 3rd option and gave a ton of rationale. My personal circumstances have changed. Girlfriend went back off maternity last year and was made redundant instantly and lost her company car, we now have one. She started a new job last week and has 12 weeks training in the office then permanent work from home. I don't want to buy a second car for the sake of a few weeks commute. My son is also 22 months old now and we had to find a nursery at 10 days notice for this new job and so we don't have all the days we want and have had to patch it together with family etc. WFH makes it work.

Just got a call invite for Friday afternoon to discuss with the entire business unit. Typical shit house behaviour when they want to drop a bad message that people can't then act on or discuss in work time haha. Man, I'm really dreading a 1 hour commute each way and my freedoms being pulled from under me. We delivered our best ever performance last financial year too working from home.
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It looks like a company that does not like WFH and pretend to listen to employees, the joke.

A proper survey would have been something like that:

A) I would like to return to the office and personnally prefer to work in the office every day as soon as possible
B) I would like to return to the office and have the flexibility to work from home 1/2 days per week
C) I would like to return to the office and have the flexibility to work more than 3 days per week
D) I am not ready (short-term considerations)
D) I am not ready (long-term considerations)
 
Ady87 said:
I had several people kindly reply so here is an update.

If Boris doesn't push back 21st June, then the office will complete a 2 hour induction to the new office leading up to 5th July. W/C the 5th we will be working 3 days at home, 2 in the office on a fortnightly rota with 2 teams doing Tue/Wed and 2 teams doing Thurs/Fri, rotating.

As of September, providing nothing material changes, we will be doing Mon/Fri WFH and Tue/Wed/Thurs in the office indefinitely.

Considering I have 35 days leave to take, like a truly horrible person refusing to accept reality, I've booked off my rota'd days in the office in August so they wont see me for a month. I feel better now.

It's also a compromise I wasn't expecting them to make and whilst I'm not 'happy', it could be worse!
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35 days in the UK? Fantastic number of days.

Well done for August: best time to travel hopefully
 


Pretty fascinating and somewhat depressing data from the Zoe app:

1) R number of 6 which is double normal COVID - we’ll have over 20k cases by next week.
2) Symptoms have completely changed - headache is now the number 1 symptom, sore throat second, cough only 5th and loss of taste/smell not even top 10.
3) This is a young person epidemic - and somewhat reassuring to see the increases in people double dosed are still relatively flat - and even when infected they tend to have much milder symptoms.
 
I'm having my first jab on Saturday; getting a bit worried about this variant.
 
Mickeza said:


Pretty fascinating and somewhat depressing data from the Zoe app:

1) R number of 6 which is double normal COVID - we’ll have over 20k cases by next week.
2) Symptoms have completely changed - headache is now the number 1 symptom, sore throat second, cough only 5th and loss of taste/smell not even top 10.
3) This is a young person epidemic - and somewhat reassuring to see the increases in people double dosed are still relatively flat - and even when infected they tend to have much milder symptoms.
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That’s really interesting. Especially the change in the clinical picture. It looks as though anyone with any symptom of an URTI is in need of a test. If we’re serious about containing this variant that’s a message which needs to be hammered home to GP’s and the general public pronto. The guidance coming out from schools is that sniffles are not a reason to keep your kid at home, never mind get them tested.

I do wonder, though, could the testing capacity cope with every single head cold getting a covid test?
 
Also. I don’t want to tempt fate but does this variant seem slower than alpha to take off outside the UK? There have been cases reported throughout Europe, going back several weeks, but no other country is experienced the same surge we’re seeing in the UK now - despite lower vax rates. What’s that all about?
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Also. I don’t want to tempt fate but does this variant seem slower than alpha to take off outside the UK? There have been cases reported throughout Europe, going back several weeks, but no other country is experienced the same surge we’re seeing in the UK now - despite lower vax rates. What’s that all about?
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it's cause Meghan moved away obviously, all her fault.
 
Smoking gun is a pretty immature term for a scientist to use, and just screams of attention seeking.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Also. I don’t want to tempt fate but does this variant seem slower than alpha to take off outside the UK? There have been cases reported throughout Europe, going back several weeks, but no other country is experienced the same surge we’re seeing in the UK now - despite lower vax rates. What’s that all about?
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Look at the hotspots in the UK, it's areas with high vaccine hesitancy from ethnic groups. In Oldham, more than 40% of new cases to the end of May were from 17% of its population. The gov needs to find out why ethnic groups are so hesitant. The figures are on the gov's site, I looked at Oldham 'cos I'm from there and it was 'added' yesterday.

There isn't a massive rise generally, there are very localised, very specific rises.

Spain doesn't seem to be following, but we don't really have the same concentration of vaccine hesitant populations.

(the base numbers are pointless, but trends are OK I think fo comparison - nowhere reports cases the same way)
 
Penna said:
Italy's doing pretty well. Cases yesterday were 1,896, deaths 102 (that figure was under 100 for the few days before). Everything's arranged regionally here, so some regions are under more restrictions than others. However, some are now in 'white' measures (you just have to wear masks), and all the others are in 'yellow', where the restrictions aren't too onerous.

Mask-wearing both inside and outside is still compulsory and at least where we live, is adhered to by everyone. Vaccinations have really got going and some regions are vaccinating teenagers now. The difference has partly been due to the opening of many more vaccination centres. Italy's generally gone for the big vaccination centre approach, rather than 'visit your doctor' - the latter wouldn't be easy here because of how things are organised (drop-in surgeries with no appointments, no admin or nursing staff in many places).
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Nice to hear although deaths to cases ratio still looks a bit on high side but don't know the testing situation there and of course a little behind in vaccines but catching up.

Would be interested to know Italy and other countries plans going forward e.g. how much death per day would populations generally accept to open back as normal as possible. Anything close to 100 is still far too high really.
 
Ecstatic said:
35 days in the UK? Fantastic number of days.

Well done for August: best time to travel hopefully
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Yeah, 5 carry over from last year and 30 standard as it’s my 10th year! In fact, looking at my June 20th join date that’s looking spookily like the day I joined the company! :eek:

Agreed on the company position, they’re heavily invested in a country wide relocation strategy involving many hundreds of properties it owns, probably over a thousand. Leases have been signed, buildings have been bought and sold. There is no turning back I feel which is why we are surprised they’ve even attempted to meet us half way!
 
FootballHQ said:
Nice to hear although deaths to cases ratio still looks a bit on high side but don't know the testing situation there and of course a little behind in vaccines but catching up.

Would be interested to know Italy and other countries plans going forward e.g. how much death per day would populations generally accept to open back as normal as possible. Anything close to 100 is still far too high really.
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There are still quite a lot of people in their 60s and 70s not fully-vaccinated because of the slow start we had. Hopefully as that improves, that will start to have an impact on the deaths.

If I'd have had the jab in the UK, I'd have had the second one months ago.
 
Mickeza said:


Pretty fascinating and somewhat depressing data from the Zoe app:

1) R number of 6 which is double normal COVID - we’ll have over 20k cases by next week.
2) Symptoms have completely changed - headache is now the number 1 symptom, sore throat second, cough only 5th and loss of taste/smell not even top 10.
3) This is a young person epidemic - and somewhat reassuring to see the increases in people double dosed are still relatively flat - and even when infected they tend to have much milder symptoms.
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So much clearer and more honest than the information put out by government/mainstream media

paints a pretty negative picture about the next few weeks/months though
 
Nytram Shakes said:
So much clearer and more honest than the information put out by government/mainstream media

paints a pretty negative picture about the next few weeks/months though
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What I was hearing was this variant will speed up herd immunity in the young. Apart from long covid (is that even a thing nowadays? Seems to be a 2020 phenomenon) the real risk is to those that are deliberately choosing not to get immunised (a large minority), or are unable to medically - this should be a miniscule minority.

Any infection is negative news obviously. But in the context of the last six months is it as bad as we think? We've all seen bleak.
 
Dumbstar said:
What I was hearing was this variant will speed up herd immunity in the young. Apart from long covid (is that even a thing nowadays? Seems to be a 2020 phenomenon) the real risk is to those that are deliberately choosing not to get immunised (a large minority), or are unable to medically - this should be a miniscule minority.

Any infection is negative news obviously. But in the context of the last six months is it as bad as we think? We've all seen bleak.
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I had the mildest of infections over the past 10 days and I still can't smell or taste anything for a week now. I hope it comes back soon but its fecking hell in life if those senses are altered or damaged permanently. So the only decent scenario is no-infection.
 
Wednesday at Stoke said:
I had the mildest of infections over the past 10 days and I still can't smell or taste anything for a week now. I hope it comes back soon but its fecking hell in life if those senses are altered or damaged permanently. So the only decent scenario is no-infection.
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My mum had it last March and some things still taste weird to her, like onions now taste like metal for some reason
 
Snowjoe said:
My mum had it last March and some things still taste weird to her, like onions now taste like metal for some reason
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That's at least a good thing to know that the nerve cells are still relearning. Apparently if it lasts more than a year, its gone for good. I can't imagine eating bland food for the rest of my life.
 
Dumbstar said:
What I was hearing was this variant will speed up herd immunity in the young. Apart from long covid (is that even a thing nowadays? Seems to be a 2020 phenomenon) the real risk is to those that are deliberately choosing not to get immunised (a large minority), or are unable to medically - this should be a miniscule minority.

Any infection is negative news obviously. But in the context of the last six months is it as bad as we think? We've all seen bleak.
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well a projected 20'000 cases a day in the next few weeks is not good news. Of course, the question is how many of them turn into serious illnesses. The video says its currently estimated that only about 40 deaths a day would occur, which is of course so much better than was happening a few months ago

I guess as a country and as a world, we still haven't had a debate as to what level of death from covid are we willing to accept. We aren't going to get it down to Zero, so at what point is it ok to get on with life and open up fully? I genuinely don't know the answer.
 
Wednesday at Stoke said:
That's at least a good thing to know that the nerve cells are still relearning. Apparently if it lasts more than a year, its gone for good. I can't imagine eating bland food for the rest of my life.
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I’m sure you’ve googled this already but smell/taste training is an important part of recovery. Don’t be too disheartened if progress is slow. A friend of mine caught covid in the first wave and reckons his taste/smell is still slowly improving.
 
Nytram Shakes said:
well a projected 20'000 cases a day in the next few weeks is not good news. Of course, the question is how many of them turn into serious illnesses. The video says its currently estimated that only about 40 deaths a day would occur, which is of course so much better than was happening a few months ago

I guess as a country and as a world, we still haven't had a debate as to what level of death from covid are we willing to accept. We aren't going to get it down to Zero, so at what point is it ok to get on with life and open up fully? I genuinely don't know the answer.
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I don’t think anyone does. It’s a tough one. Worth bearing in mind that flu kills about 30,000 in a bad year in the UK. Is that what we should aim for? Or much lower, consider these deaths are in addition to flu? It’s an incredibly tough question that we’ll probably argue about for years.
 
I had my second shot of AZ yesterday. After the first one I got nothing but a very slight fatigue and feeling of not being 100%.

I was up a lot of last night being sick and with a cracking headache. I'm beginning to come round now, but after reading that AZ is often worse on the 1st one was hoping I'd get away with not having proper symptoms.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
I’m sure you’ve googled this already but smell/taste training is an important part of recovery. Don’t be too disheartened if progress is slow. A friend of mine caught covid in the first wave and reckons his taste/smell is still slowly improving.
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Yes I read that, the official medical advice here in Denmark is to wait 6 weeks and if there is slow or no improvement, they have a special ENT unit set up to diagnose and help with recovery of senses. I hope it doesn't come to it as my symptoms were very mild as compared to others.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
I don’t think anyone does. It’s a tough one. Worth bearing in mind that flu kills about 30,000 in a bad year in the UK. Is that what we should aim for? Or much lower, consider these deaths are in addition to flu? It’s an incredibly tough question that we’ll probably argue about for years.
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Yeah, I agree, its something the world and each country will struggle with for a long time and will cause a lot of angry disagreements.

I do worry that the debate hasn't really started yet and I think long-term that is going to cause more problems. It is very likely that given the current rise in cases there will be more deaths in around a month than we are experiencing now. Also over winter, with unlocking the rising number of variants, there is likely to be quite a lot of deaths even with a boaster jab. The question is are the numbers going to be at a level that the majority can accept and allow the health service to function, or will people deem the number of deaths outway the economic and social benefits of having a fully unlocked society

We really need to start having an honest debate as a country and a world as to what level of death is acceptable. Otherwise, we are going to get to this point and everyone is going to start screaming shouting, and blaming which isn't helpful to anyone.
 
Nytram Shakes said:
Yeah, I agree, its something the world and each country will struggle with for a long time and will cause a lot of angry disagreements.

I do worry that the debate hasn't really started yet and I think long-term that is going to cause more problems. It is very likely that given the current rise in cases there will be more deaths in around a month than we are experiencing now. Also over winter, with unlocking the rising number of variants, there is likely to be quite a lot of deaths even with a boaster jab. The question is are the numbers going to be at a level that the majority can accept and allow the health service to function, or will people deem the number of deaths outway the economic and social benefits of having a fully unlocked society

We really need to start having an honest debate as a country and a world as to what level of death is acceptable. Otherwise, we are going to get to this point and everyone is going to start screaming shouting, and blaming which isn't helpful to anyone.
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Agree 100% with all of this.

Although when I’m feeling optimistic I focus on the fact that these vaccines are way more effective than flu vaccines (and uptake of vaccines is in a completely different league) so there’s a good chance that - once vaccine roll-out is complete - cases can be maintained at a level where the deaths will only ever be a fraction of the level we see with flu. So there won’t be any tough decisions needed to be taken (other than how to ensure compliance with boosters)
 
Pogue Mahone said:
I don’t think anyone does. It’s a tough one. Worth bearing in mind that flu kills about 30,000 in a bad year in the UK. Is that what we should aim for? Or much lower, consider these deaths are in addition to flu? It’s an incredibly tough question that we’ll probably argue about for years.
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There's bound to be a joint flu / covid-19 vaccine at some point. There's will be a lot of overlap with flu and covid deaths due to the fact they both have higher mortality rates for older people so making the jab happen for the same people at the same time makes a lot of sense.

I think the question will be whether the jab needs to be brought to younger age groups for free. In the UK it's 50 or over this year (recently brought down from 65 because of coronavirus) and the question will be is there an acceptable tolerance of deaths for people without known health conditions and below that age group. The decision could be taken to reduce the age further, but the more it's reduced the more it costs and the longer it takes.

The debate will have to be had though as to what is "acceptable". When I had my vaccine yesterday when we were chatting the nurse thought that boosters will only be for the elderly this year which is interesting in itself, but does make some sense as they will be the ones who had it January / February.
 
Wednesday at Stoke said:
I had the mildest of infections over the past 10 days and I still can't smell or taste anything for a week now. I hope it comes back soon but its fecking hell in life if those senses are altered or damaged permanently. So the only decent scenario is no-infection.
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I had a nasty flu quite a few years ago and lost those senses for 4 months. I had lost hope of ever tasting a banoffee pie, or a Pepsi again. Food almost became a necessary inconvenience. Thankfully things restored themselves eventually but I did notice I lost quite a bit of fat during that time without even trying. :)
 
Balljy said:
I had my second shot of AZ yesterday. After the first one I got nothing but a very slight fatigue and feeling of not being 100%.

I was up a lot of last night being sick and with a cracking headache. I'm beginning to come round now, but after reading that AZ is often worse on the 1st one was hoping I'd get away with not having proper symptoms.
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Sugar honey iced tea! I've just had my second jab of AZ today. As I suffered heavily after the first jab I was hoping I could avoid all that after the second. Could do without nausea, hate that. :(

On the plus side, I walked into a packed hall of mainly young people (25-40, yes that's young for me, feck youse) and was guided straight to the AZ jab lady. Felt like proper royalty until I realised I was the grandad in the place. :(
 
Dumbstar said:
Sugar honey iced tea! I've just had my second jab of AZ today. As I suffered heavily after the first jab I was hoping I could avoid all that after the second. Could do without nausea, hate that. :(

On the plus side, I walked into a packed hall of mainly young people (25-40, yes that's young for me, feck youse) and was guided straight to the AZ jab lady. Felt like proper royalty until I realised I was the grandad in the place. :(
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The nurse asked me if I had symptoms after the first and when I said not really, she kind of shook her head in a feeling sorry for me way and said to expect something from this one :lol:

You hopefully might be OK if you had symptoms with the first one, but who knows. I felt rough last night, but have picked up really quickly over the morning and just feel tired now. It's amazing how quickly the symptoms come and go.

Both my vaccines have been get there, get assigned a room and have the jab. I was literally in and out in 5 minutes for both, with a 15 minute wait in the car afterwards to make sure you are OK. The clinic was AZ only, so oldies only at my place.
 
Dumbstar said:
Sugar honey iced tea! I've just had my second jab of AZ today. As I suffered heavily after the first jab I was hoping I could avoid all that after the second. Could do without nausea, hate that. :(

On the plus side, I walked into a packed hall of mainly young people (25-40, yes that's young for me, feck youse) and was guided straight to the AZ jab lady. Felt like proper royalty until I realised I was the grandad in the place. :(
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You'll be fine, I had a stronger reaction on my first AZ to my second. Just had general lethargy for 12-18 hours after.
 
The only symptoms I had for both doses was being savagely hungry for about three days afterwards :lol:
 
Balljy said:
The nurse asked me if I had symptoms after the first and when I said not really, she kind of shook her head in a feeling sorry for me way and said to expect something from this one :lol:

You hopefully might be OK if you had symptoms with the first one, but who knows. I felt rough last night, but have picked up really quickly over the morning and just feel tired now. It's amazing how quickly the symptoms come and go.

Both my vaccines have been get there, get assigned a room and have the jab. I was literally in and out in 5 minutes for both, with a 15 minute wait in the car afterwards to make sure you are OK. The clinic was AZ only, so oldies only at my place.
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F-Red said:
You'll be fine, I had a stronger reaction on my first AZ to my second. Just had general lethargy for 12-18 hours after.
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Thanks, that's comforting to know.
 
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