SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)
- Thread starter Don't Kill Bill
- Start date
Can't imagine the trauma they're having to deal with on a daily basis. As a society there's no way we can pay our debt to these people but we have to at least try our absolute best to stop the spread.
Absolutely, but also this tendency for large swathes of the population to view restrictions as something to sidestep or get around. My village was absolutely nuts today and I barely saw a mask at all and our region is getting worse too.
So if, as in your case with your liver, there is a reason you might be concerned, just as you would be with any medication, drug or treatment then it is logical that you would have concerns. However, why would you and others even think about a vaccine affecting fertility? Nobody goes to the doctor and gets an antibiotic or anti-inflamatiry or statins or whatever and ask the doctor if it will affect their fertility. Asking such a specific question when there is no specific reason to must come from somewhere, so some social media rumor or similar seems likely to me.
It does feel bad I agree, but it’s not the fault of winter and nor is it everything to do with Boris Johnson, who for all his delays and inaction and flip flopping and whatever else, isn’t infecting people.
The situation is hopeless because large portions of the uk population cannot or will not act accordingly. We have all known for 8 months now, quite clearly, how this virus spreads and how we can minimise the chances of infection. I see it with me own eyes.
Not just this thread.
It feels worse because it is worse. Also, it's very disheartening knowing so much as been done to try and stem the tide only for it all to be thrown away by Boris and his idiots with mixed Christmas messaging.
I feel so sorry for the NHS staff, the government have betrayed them over Christmas. All to try and not be the party who canceled Christmas.
While a agree that compliance seems to be struggling at the moment, I think that is in part down to the mixed messaging from Boris. As soon as he said people could mix for 5-days over Christmas people thought well Mays well now...
I don't agree with it, we haven't seen any family or friends this Christmas, we know so many people who have though, and now the flood gates have opened I can't see people just cutting ties again.
Thank you, hope this all will end soon.
From my experience, a lot of them are selfish, thick as pig shit, morons.
Because those medicine that we are prescribed are based on years of tests/use. This vaccine, isn't. And as someone who isn't of a scientific background, that just feels slightly scary. And as I said, the fertility thing is the top of my mind for personal reasons, along with my friends due to our life stages.
It's pretty insulting to assume it's social media. People can have independent thought, questions and concerns. I know you probably didn't mean it in an insulting way, but it's why it feels pointless ever raising questions.
For most people like me who don't know how it works, this vaccine is something that was developed in 9 months and tested quickly on small samples with no long term effects noted cos of it (this is not to say this is not standard etc. but this is what the common person will think). The medicine we get now has been around years and ultimately you just trust because of that. I am in no way saying that's the right way to think but I am sure most people (like me who have no real scientific knowledge) would think. Hence why I am asking questions I have to be put at ease.
I get it must be frustrating for people who know or have read about all this to see such "stupid" questions, but if they want to help their cause, help people understand it and answer their questions without feeling like you are insulting them. Most people just want to feel at ease, not doubt it.
When you go to a doctor and ask them questions. They don't call you stupid and tell you just to listen. They may still think your stupid but will answer your concerns. Same with good teachers. Same with good bosses/colleagues. Same with good mechanics etc.
You are missing my point. Why worry about something so random? Individuals can of course have random thoughts which is normal. However, when multiple people do so that suggests it isn't random.
And then you see this happening, hope they were fined:
So much for tier 4 meaning stay in your local area...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-55474533
So much for tier 4 meaning stay in your local area...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-55474533
I completely disagree. For all the faults of Boris, and this government, the messages have not been mixed in their basic form since March.
Keep your distance
Don’t breath the same air
Don’t touch the same things
Don’t be in large, close knit groups
Blaming the government is the laziest form of nonsense. How much better would we be off if Jeremy Corbyn had won the election or if Kier Starmer was running things?
People know, they absolutely know what to do and what this virus is but they do what they want anyway. Gatherings, no masks and the countless fools that continue to think holidays are necessary.
I have played by the rules just like you but I see people who don’t every single day. It is their fault, not Boris’s. They would be the same idiots under any government.
Eh?
Christmas will be 5 days to see your family
Christmas is cancelled
Furlough will be ended
Furlough is extended (with literally hours notice after thousands of employers have made employees redundant)
Travel corridors will allow people to go on holiday
Travel corridors routinely ended with hours notice (creating a mad rush for people to get home, and holidays ended with hours notice)
Face coverings not needed in shops (June)
Face coverings needed in shops (July)
Face coverings not needed in schools
Face coverings needed in schools
Stay at home
Eat out to help out
Work from home
Get back to work to save the economy.
Work from home (again)
ALL of this (and much more) has been since April. There is no consistent message, there is no plan.
Incompetent, incoherent, idiotic.
I’m not condoning the words or actions of this government but I have the same prime minister as countless other people in the uk and I can think for myself and judge what I should do.
Ive stuck to the rules throughout, regardless of what the government have subsequently said. Blaming them for everything is just lazy and it really gets on my nerves.
I agree with both of you.
The leadership has been an incoherent mess and (a large number but probably a minority of) the public have been crap at following fairly obvious rules.
I know doctors and nurses and pharmacists that routinely break the rules now.
Part of it is exhaustion. It varies depending on whom I'm talking about, but often it's easier to see family and sleep at families house after a long shift (if they are closer to the hospital) than it is to go home
Part of it is the laissé a faire attitude at work creeps in. The pharmacist I am referring too works in hospital and they know they routinely have COVID outbreaks amongst people that go in. One sad case was an elderly lady who had been putting off coming in to hospital for a routine thing because COVID. She was convinced to go in though and promptly got COVID and died. When you know that you're living with COVID everyday, and chances are you've already had it, I guess your attitude slips.
Still us non NHS staff have to do our part. Stay at home, save lives, hands, face, space. And for the most part people do, but you'll have to forgive someone for seeing an elderly relative who is going downhill. You'll have to forgive those that check up on their sibling who suffers from depression and is possibly suicidal. You'll have to forgive those that suddenly find themselves in a dead relationship or start a new one.
How can it be the public's fault when the government has been this incompetent. The public are just trying to survive.
Yeah, @rcoobc isn’t wrong but ultimately, unless we lived in a totalitarian state where we’re controlled completely the populace have to grow some and do what’s right. For me, the message has been crystal clear since March and I’m no genius. I just have a modicum of self control and social responsibility.
And with this virus all is need is a reckless and selfish minority to help it spread.
Obviously the EU and Britain are connected differently to how AU and NZ are connected to the rest of the world although the issues are broadly the same.
In the case of the scenario you mention it depends on which perspective you are talking about. If the UK decided to go to full lock down then engineers would either not be allowed out, or allowed out and not back in, allowed out but must quarantine on their return or some special arrangement as AU use with aircrew at the moment.
Ireland's perspective might be different as they need the engineers from the UK. Maybe a negative covid test within 48 has of arrival and then some sort of restricted access to work under supervision and escorted to/from quarantine every day including full ppe when out of the quarantine hotel?
In the end it is a matter of political will and I'm not sure that would ever exist with flip flopping incompetents like Boris in charge. They may have also blown the opportunity for mass cooperation with events to date. They also have to be prepared to arrest, fine and imprison (in extreme cases like skipping quarantine) rules breakers.
Not surprised. I saw many fans in the stands do the same in previous games.yeah he was a shocking example but it’s really not that uncommon in the UK. Idiotic is the only word
And there it is. I'm sick and tired of that utterly irrelevant piece of whataboutery.
I agreed with most of your post until this bit.
Like I said in a previous post, I’ve literally been a prisoner in my own home today. I’ve seen out of my window hundreds, if now a few thousand people all descended on my village.
Lots of families, clearly meeting other families and friends and making large groups of people. These are not people low on IQ, judging by cars and clothes, lots of middle class, well educated and well paid people literally choosing to do what they were doing among loads of other affluent and likeminded people. Barely a mask or 2 metres in sight.
What struck me is the breath mist, it was cold today, there were groups of people literally surrounded by each other’s breath in big clouds. No one seems concerned.
This is just one village. These idiots are all over the country and I view these as the main driving force behind these rising numbers. They aren’t doing what they’re doing because of mixed messages, they’re doing it because they want to.
I would just say that I really struggled living in a tiny box room at university.
Living in a tiny box room with no escape would have been hell on earth.
I miss meeting my mates and friends but at least I have my partner and kids. Being alone, with no partner and no social contact would be ridiculous.
One of my mates said she completely broke down when they said Christmas was cancelled. After losing her job a few weeks ago, and losing her grandad in the Spring, she had been planning on seeing her family for the first time in a year.
This has been a long, tough year. I was like you at the start, people need be sensible, people need common sense. Wear a mask even if you don't have to. Give people space. Don't do stupid stuff that could spread COVID.
But at some point you've got to give people an emotional break.
Its the hope that kills. My kids are maybe too young to get badly hurt by missing proper Christmas but they are also.. not. My kid sister is really really really struggling for lack of social contact with anyone her own age.
It's just poo. It's crap. Everyone has there own story @Volumiza. Judge not a man until you have walked a mile in his shoes.
But there is one group of people who's job it is to keep us safe from viruses. Who get paid hundreds of thousands of pounds a year to set good sensible rules to make and keep us safe. They haven't done that in my opinion. I don't care whether you are labour or Tory or right or left they haven't done that.
We've had a positive R number for months and months, essentially since September 3rd when the schools went back. If they had kept the R number at 1.0, perhaps this new strain wouldn't have appeared at all (because if you have 10x fewer people with the disease then you have 10x fewer potential mutations) but even if it still did, then they'd have bought themselves time to react.
Sorry but I'm done blaming the public. They aren't the ones you should hold to account.
And? What about it? It’s a pretty straightforward whataboutism if you ask me.
How many thousand British citizens would have had to unnecessarily die for you to be critical of the government btw?
Because it's clear their incompetence mean it's many thousands more than needed to have, so I'd like to know where the line is.
We’ve all struggled.
I think Pogue posted this previously. Anyone with doubts about taking a vaccine should read it.
https://www.theguardian.com/comment...9-vaccines-so-quickly-without-cutting-corners
https://www.theguardian.com/comment...9-vaccines-so-quickly-without-cutting-corners
Let me ask you this: am I allowed to meet up with a friend to go for a cycle.
I live in Kent, tier 4. So does he.
First question am I allowed to? Second much harder question, should I?
Mate, I’d have decked the economy months ago and had us locked down. I don’t agree with much of the government’s actions but we all have to take ownership at some point.
Indeed. Lets just get the vaccine. Give me all the freaking vaccines, one after another, directly into my spine!
No and no, now ask me a difficult question.
I don't think we need to make it an either/or argument. People who do the wrong thing should be put in Dara O'Brian's sack and beaten with sticks.
The government's incompetence, flip flopping and mixed messaging means the bag must be far far bigger as it has facilitated people's bad behaviour and hugely exacerbated the problem.
For anyone interested, there is a game called "Plague inc" available on the Play Store and Apple App store, that has a new game mode called "the Cure"
You may remember this as the evolution of that Pandemic Java game that was popular online a few decades ago where you had to kill the whole world with a disease.
Well the new update that has "The Cure" flips the table and allows you to act as the government(s) locking countries down, opening them up again, advising people to wear masks, etc as your pandemic of choice unfolds. I have found it quite interesting to look at it as a very hard and fast simulation, even it is very unscientific.
You may remember this as the evolution of that Pandemic Java game that was popular online a few decades ago where you had to kill the whole world with a disease.
Well the new update that has "The Cure" flips the table and allows you to act as the government(s) locking countries down, opening them up again, advising people to wear masks, etc as your pandemic of choice unfolds. I have found it quite interesting to look at it as a very hard and fast simulation, even it is very unscientific.
Tbh, I have no idea of the rules anymorr because I'm not constantly refreshing the government page. I can't blame people for not knowing half the shite considering you can live 5 mins away from a different tier with different rules.
However, on the other hand, it's amazing how many people were bang into fitness and walking during lockdown, then lockdown ended and nobody gave a feck anymore, until this tier 4 came in and now everyone is a hiker / runner / jogger again. Absolute knobs.
I'm not going to act like it is not an either/or. But given Volumiza wanted to start a discussion about things 'getting on our nerves' nothing does it more than Johnson cheerleaders trying to downplay just how terribly they've handled just about everything whilst moaning about Labour.
Current guidance on tier four allows individual exercise with one person from another household outdoors, with distancing - https://www.gov.uk/guidance/tier-4-stay-at-home