Maaaaan I feel like we’re gonna get battered
Final | Spain vs England
- Thread starter top1whoisman
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No more wild than assuming that nothing bad will happen for 70 minutes playing an immobile striker against a team that is likely to dominate us and require us to play on the counter. Everything is speculation but I think that we have two mobile forwards in Watkins and Toney and we have one static one who has shown almost nothing all tournament. I know who I would be playing...
What has Kane given the side so far this tournament would be my question. We have Toney and Watkins. The fact Kane has been so ineffective has required us to throw all these hail marys and rely on luck at the end of games. Personally I think you go out there with a positive game plan and your subs are there to change the game and fix any issues. You don't go out from the start with the assumption you will need to change the game. Currently thats what it feels like playing Kane. "When should we take him off".
Last time we felt like that, we won the FA cup final.
I didn't think City would batter us. I feel England are incapable of beating Spain though.
For one, harry kane is not immobile I'm not sure where youve got this from.
For two, he's a genuine goal threat and one of the best finishers in the world regardless of this tournament. He's capable of finding the net, he's more than capable of scoring against Spain which you seem to be ignoring. Subs are there to change a game, as you said. Why would you logically bring on a striker that, as you call it, is immobile late in a game against a tired defence?Surely logically you'd bring on someone that will stretch their legs and open up space?
You're taking a position that it's impossible for England to be winning this game in the 70th minute if they start kane. That's objectively crazy.
Doubt [X]
Thought they'd probably beat us similar to the year before. Didn't think they'd blow us away. Having Martinez and Varane encouraged me.
This is a game where England could have reaped so much dividends from a skilled long range passer hitting the channels repeatedly. There is joy be had in isolating those fullbacks and stretching the midfield to go and aid - Saka has a big role to play, and it would be even larger if he could be hit ear and consistently.
England don’t have to win the midfield battle to give that midfield lots to be preoccupied with.
England don’t have to win the midfield battle to give that midfield lots to be preoccupied with.
England have got too the final playing crap
better against the Swiss, abit more better against the Dutch
England being the underdogs and written off is fine with me, because if, if!!! They turn it on even more so against Spain, it’s game over imo.
Spain have been fabulous this tournament, by far the better team, but it’s always so dangerous playing a team that have also made it too the final that have been no where near their best in England.
this will be very interesting
better against the Swiss, abit more better against the Dutch
England being the underdogs and written off is fine with me, because if, if!!! They turn it on even more so against Spain, it’s game over imo.
Spain have been fabulous this tournament, by far the better team, but it’s always so dangerous playing a team that have also made it too the final that have been no where near their best in England.
this will be very interesting
5-4 England.... and that's without extra-time or penalties
This game has goals all over it, could be the most exciting Euro final in years, both teams need to attack from the start........... I know I know, I'm dreaming!!!
This game has goals all over it, could be the most exciting Euro final in years, both teams need to attack from the start........... I know I know, I'm dreaming!!!
Watkins could cause Spain all sorts of problems. Mainoo could work exceptionally well against their high press as well, assuming they don't double/triple mark him. I think Kane needs to be dropped and I wouldn't mind seeing Bellingham dropped in favour of Gordon either.
Can you really see Gareth doing that.... although the Spanish will know Bellingham's weaknesses as well as his strengths... would they know as much about Gordon?
It won't happen but it should. He's scored 2 good goals but has been utter shit otherwise.
I said before the FA Cup final, we won't get battered as finals are usually cagey affairs because of how much is at stake. Same again here. First goal wins, I reckon.
How mental are we going if Mainoo scores the winner?
How mental are we going if Mainoo scores the winner?
The issue is not that England doesn't have a chance. On paper I'd potentially even favor them. The problem is the type of team that is required to beat this Spain team won't be fielded by Southgate sunday. Spain is very vulnerable to pace and being stretched defensively by runners. But Southgate pretty obviously won't be starting Gordon or Watkins, nor will he play Trent on the right to help add another long passing threat.
So I think England's best hope is a bolt from the blue moment of magic and to hang in the game while nicking it after subs are on. Kane will be a non factor, as will Foden/Jude most likely because England won't be able to slowly plod and possess the ball endlessly against Spain.
Yeah, I think there’s channels to hit all day vs Spain with mobile, pacy runners, but Southgate won’t play those players, and will instead play into Spain’s hands with slow as molasses Kane up front and no width on the left of the attack.
Can’t agree about Trent as he’s a defensive liability, and whatever he gives going forward is offset by him being a black hole going backward - Williams would have a field day vs him.
I reckon we see two banks sat deep, and Kane wandering around doing nothing in particular, with England playing for set pieces or pens.
One plus we have in our favour is Spain aren’t particularly clinical. Perhaps the game goes on long enough in a game state at 0-0 with the starting XI for Southgate to get some pace on in the second half.
I don't really support England but I hate it when Spain wins everything
C'mon England. Score some fecking goals
C'mon England. Score some fecking goals
Shania Twain’s less successful song.
I think that’ll be more his line of thinking than going out meet them initially, sure. Yamal’s shooting has overall been tame during the competition, but obviously, when he gets it right, you’re looking at peaches. Williams can get a bit preoccupied with running with the ball than shooting at the right times; Morata is Morata, and Olmo is capable of the ridiculous, in bursts, but the one that concerns me personally is Rodri ghosting from deep and doing his thing.
England have the personnel to keep Spain honest and pin Rodri back, but they won’t start the game, and maybe it’s a question of whether there’ll still be something to play for by the time he thinks about bringing them on.
Bit of pop psychology - I'd liken it to being angry at Daddy; essentially a childish mentality.
Give the Newbie a like - this is absolutely spot on
For the record I meant Trent as a wing back, not in a back 4 (The past two games it's been a pseudo back 5 anyways with Foden on the right and Saka wide of him doing a bunch of defensive work).
And England playing for set pieces is pretty funny considering it's a pretty bad set piece team in general.
Spain just played France and mostly dealt well with their pace actually. Might be it was down to France not playing well, but it's the only precedent we have. What we've actually seen them being vulnerable to are size and physicality in the box
You need to send your CV to the FA
The way Trent switches off, I’d be really uncomfortable with him even at WB because I think he leaves his RCB too much to cover and will end up drawing them out too far wide without assisting them. Just gives me the feeling of a player who is going to be the catalyst for something bad happening on his side of the pitch.
But France had nobody able to hit the flanks well and early, which is a key component in getting in behind the fullback repeatedly, eventually forcing them to stay back (and giving you more chance to play in front of them). One of the biggest benefits if you can get into those pockets of space often is in forcing the midfielders to track back and try to prevent open passing lanes on the inside, which would obviously be hugely beneficial against Spain.
England don’t have to win the midfield battle to win the midfield battle - if they can have them preoccupied with covering the aforementioned space, I think it would be a very different game. The more they’re stretched, the less rapid passing opportunities, which would obviously be beneficial.
So what is it you propose then. How do england make that happen
This Sunday, Mainoo is comin' like
Southgate won’t, imo.
It’ll be bus parked and set piece attempts for the win or going for penalties.
Thing is, if the ball is played well and early, Saka has the potential to be a match winner in a matter of moments, and even set up poorly, that’s a threat all game. I just believe Spain can be got at if you circumvent Rodri and stretch that backline. You don’t have to play the game straight through them, invariably playing to their strengths.
If we can play in a more classic Italian style, I believe the game will be won in a flash moment of brilliant play by either side. If England are in the game past 70min, the tables turn due to the subs, so it will be interesting to see how it plays out in actuality.
ok but what would *you* do. You say england have the means to play a specific game plan, how could they do that in your opinion
My worry is that Spain will pass us into exhaustion, and we'll be shifting side to side slowly having the stamina drained of us. We'll be forced to sit back and counter by default from deep, but the vertical runs will be expected to cover 3/4 of the field per sprint, and it'll result in pretty much everything we've come to expect from England against top teams when the likes of Saka, Foden and Bellingham have nothing in the tank. Bellingham has already gone on record to say he's exhausted. If we can't maintain a press effectively and retain the ball excellently, then it's going to be a match where Spain jab us repeatedly, we'll make wild swings and be the ones drained.
Same thing could be said about Holland, if they’d made it to the final though.
Going 1-0 down to France inside ten minutes isn't a difficult situation? France's only good point in this tournament was how defensively strong they were and Spain scored twice in five minutes.
If you can beat Germany in their own backyard in final moments of extra time and then defeat France than playing England isn't really going to unduly worry Spain imo although of course a one off final can create nerves.
Southgate's solution in the previous 2 attempts was to come out swinging for the fences and try to win the game in the first 20 minutes, and it failed both times...
Surprised at how many people want Spain to win. I'd want the United lads to win whoever they played for.
Could see Rodri scoring a goal from a corner, that was a real weak spot from England the other night as Dumfries won countless headers from corners at the near post.
Leave that unguarded and Rodri will get on the end of them as he tends to score 3-4 times a season for Man. City in that fashion.
Well, it sure didn't look like swinging to me. Southgate thinking he's Kimbo Slice when he's more like pizza slice.
Yes this is what I think will happen, still England's big issue against the elite in World Football. Spain won't be too concerned if it's 0-0 at half time as long as they've had 60 + possession as England have pretty much dropped off in every game from the hour mark.
Were very good first half v the Dutch but Holland were certainly stronger from hour up to 80th minute when both teams were just accepting extra time.
Have 20 minutes off it v Spain and you're asking for serious trouble and hoping they're profligate infront of goal as they will create decent chances.