I agree with this. When I first started sim racing Max's move is precisely what I used to do because I was crap: drive my car too fast into the corner hit the brakes, block the car then have to crank on full lock to get back on line. For me that's not a racing move, you're basically parking on the corner and saying "hey, I made the corner and kept on the track".
F1 2021 Season
- Thread starter pauldyson1uk
- Start date
Yeah, even "one of the best lawyers in the world 'la!" can't work with stuff like this.
Some people are so blinkered it's actually hilarious
they can take away his position but they can never take away his integrity.
It's a utter and complete joke and the FIA know it by basically claiming the race director has overriding control of the rules to do as he sees fit.
They aren't even arguing that they haven't picked the winner. They are just saying it's in their rights to do so.
A day after my opinion is that they fecked up because they didn't let all the cars go by at the moment when they announced no cars will be let go. There were enough time for it.
But on the other hand information that the track was completely clear didn't come through yet and that's why they didn't do it so they went with the controversial middle ground and I can understand. Just imagine they let all the cars unlap themselves and 2 guys would be fighting while Lewis would be catching them successfuly defending Max just to be slowed down again and passed because of that.
They basically did the best to finish the race under the green flag without influencing any of races of the drivers which fought for WC.
Not enough praises were said for Max to keep calm and successful passed Lewis who is great driver when it was clear than even with tire advantage it's not easy to pass another driver on this track as we saw from the battle between Checo and Lewis.
But on the other hand information that the track was completely clear didn't come through yet and that's why they didn't do it so they went with the controversial middle ground and I can understand. Just imagine they let all the cars unlap themselves and 2 guys would be fighting while Lewis would be catching them successfuly defending Max just to be slowed down again and passed because of that.
They basically did the best to finish the race under the green flag without influencing any of races of the drivers which fought for WC.
Not enough praises were said for Max to keep calm and successful passed Lewis who is great driver when it was clear than even with tire advantage it's not easy to pass another driver on this track as we saw from the battle between Checo and Lewis.
Sure that's why they fecked up. Either that or because if they would have stuck by the rules there would have been a different winner. 1 of the 2.
Erm what? Look, Lewis was leading by 13 seconds or something like that. Their actions reduced that gap as much as possible, and by taking any other action the result would be closer to the result the race was heading towards without all this.
You're using 1 lap in a weird session, where he wasn't actually faster, as an example?
Yup, agreed. There is no perfect measure but I think it is reasonable to make that comparison, as the cars are generally all in equal configurations at that point (max engine mode, no fuel etc).
I won't list out every race but I certainly don't think the Mercedes were materially slower in all the other 10 races. There's a few where they were comfortably quicker and a few where they were comfortably slower. You could perhaps make an argument their car had a narrower working window (word from Mercedes mid-season was that that was true) - off the top of my head, if you take Monaco, Bottas had no trouble getting the Mercedes to work but Lewis had no speed for reasons unknown.
NB - Max only had more poles due to Sprint racing. Mercedes were actually fastest qualifiers at Silverstone and Monza, where Max was awarded pole.
Yeah well that just about summarizes everything. F1 is a joke, everything is so staged it's actually hilarious witnessing all this as someone who only started following the sport in April.
I love it
Yeah, this was really weird to me. Max’s attempted overtake on lap 1 was a desperate lunge which obviously should be penalised (or at best not rewarded). We seem to now be in a position where he’s been doing this “yield or we crash” approach for so long that it’s been normalised. Hopefully they’ll somehow start to clamp down on him now he’s got a world title.
Yeah, what an insane piece of world class performance that was from Max, just shows that he is the greatest racer if not sporstsman of all time being able to pass Lewis in such a pressured moment. Granted, he had fresh softs whilst Lewis had very old hards, but Max needs to be hailed as the second coming of Jesus himself after driving past Lewis on that straight. The way he pushed the pedal all the way in and kept the steering wheel straight whilst passing him is a rare glimpse of what humans are capable of when pushing their abilities to the maximum. It really was the pinnacle of human performance, and we'll never see anything like it ever again. If aliens don't come and visit us now then nothing will bring them.
after the max’s driving performance on that last lap, maybe they are already here…
it begs the question was it masi’s fault or did the aliens (verstappens) do a mind control on him to ensure the odds were forever in their favour?
He lost the start on the better tires, trailed all race and yet somehow came up winner. The more I think of it the more impressive it is really. It's almost as impressive as Juve getting relegated despite winning the championship back when that happened.
Yep. If Hamilton doesn't see him coming and continues on his path Verstappen takes him out and gets a penalty.
People can say "he made the corner" but that isn't really important when you've forced another driver off the track.
Of course it's a great example. Russell should be getting nowhere near a 'superior' driver in a much better car. If Russell was in the Mercedes he smashes Verstappens lap to pieces that day.
People saying the likes or Russell/Leclerc/Norris won't be able to match Verstappen are maybe over rating Verstappen and under rating the other young drivers.
These boys are all top class racers. Give them the better car and they'll win. Look at Leclercs first year at Ferrari, he finished 6 points behind Verstappen in similar cars.
If Ferrari has the best car next year, he wins the title.
It was 1 lap.
If we're using that metric, Latifi smashed Russell's lap to pieces on Saturday so he should be able to compete with Russell and Verstappen aswell.
Leclerc's first year at Ferrari was when the Ferrari had the illegal engine, in no way were those cars similar. That Ferrari blew the Red Bull out the water. Although you could argue that Ferrari's strange strategy calls also cost Leclerc.
As for the bolded you could say the same about Williams and Albon, doesn't make him better than Verstappen either.
I'm sorry but it came down to the last race. If the rules were followed Max wouldn't have won. Therefore should he deserves it? No, in my opinion. Admittedly it is a fine margin and Max had a great season. But the answer from me remains the same.
Just like Hamilton wouldn't have deserved it if the roles were reversed.
neither, both masi and the verstappens are reptilians from another world.
Fair points.
For me though, I think the brake checking should've had a more severe penalty and the last race was a gift in the final laps, so 60/40 Hamilton was the better driver in 2021.
Edit. Forgot to add the half points fiasco giving Max a net 5 point advantage also was it?
Why do you think Max should have won before the last race? I am not sure I agree with that.
18/22 races he finished 1st or 2nd, and the 4 he didn't:
Baku - tyre blew, nothing he could do. Arguably team should have brought him in after what happened with Stroll. Lewis threw away 25 points here given what happened at the restart.
Silverstone - stewards adjudged Lewis was at fault for this (not sure I agree with them) but they don't put any blame on Max for that incident. Lewis gained 25 from this
Hungary - taken out by Bottas, nothing he could do. Mercedes lost Lewis 7 points here (potentially 8 as he would likely have been so far ahead he would have got fastest lap as well) with the non pitstop and Max couldn't have done anything else given half the floor was missing.
Monza - his fault causing that collision (according to stewards, but not sure I fully agree with them on that), but it actually helped him as he didn't lose any points to Lewis when he almost certainly would have done.
The above is why Red Bull claim they have had no luck etc all year. Not sure I agree with that in total but I do believe there wasn't much more Max could have done all season. Unfortunately for Lewis, he made THE big error of the season at Baku where he lost the 25 points - Max didn't make an error anywhere near that magnitude.
I will agree with that, so maybe 52-48 Lewis
The half points was another farce, race should have been null and voided.
I think you are spot in with this assessment.
You forgot to write Max. Corrected that for you.
I'm not really sure what you're arguing against here.
I believe Russell, Norris or Leclerc can challenge Verstappen. If you don't that's your choice. As usual in F1 it's whoever has the best car that makes the extra difference, and then we see the gap between Hamilton/Bottas or Verstappen/Perez.
We will see how close Russell runs Hamilton next year, but I bet he will be closer than Bottas ever was. When Hamilton retires he will have plenty of competition.
Tbh I'm not 100% sure i'm even arguing
I think those 3 have the potential to challenge Verstappen but if it was equal(ish) machinery, similar to Merc/Red Bull this year, that Verstappen would win.
All those 3 mentioned currently have a problem with consistency in races. They're all great qualifiers so clearly have the pace, they just need to string it all together over an entire season. I do rate all 3 of them highly, I'd even include Sainz in that group too.
It does seem as if the FIA are trying to prevent 1 team dominating with the new regs, so hopefully we'll find out over the next 2-4 years.
Really great interview about yesterday's race.
"What it did give is it gave us what we wanted"
Truer words have never been spoken unintentionally.
Personally, I would just be embarrassed to claim that I'd won that race if I were Verstappen.
However you want to argue the case, the fact is, he'd been totally dominated by Hamilton the entire race, couldn't get anywhere near him, and was almost 12 seconds adrift.
Due to a technical decision by the officials, he is gifted the decision.
For me, that's completely hollow, and absolutely no way to "win" any sporting contest.
However you want to argue the case, the fact is, he'd been totally dominated by Hamilton the entire race, couldn't get anywhere near him, and was almost 12 seconds adrift.
Due to a technical decision by the officials, he is gifted the decision.
For me, that's completely hollow, and absolutely no way to "win" any sporting contest.
This makes it very hard for him to plead ignorance. Makes it look more and more like yesterday was a manipulated result.
I'd say not only a clown, but corrupt.
It's a pretty obvious thing to suggest, but he should be investigated for sport betting irregularities.
Definitely a hollow win. Unfortunately for Max, until he wins it properly he will be thought of as a false champion.
That's pretty damning for him.
It's basically going to come down to yes he was wrong to make that decision but as per the rules he's allowed to make wrong decisions.
It won't matter to his fans, but it'll definitely cast a shadow over his win unless he backs it up with another couple.