The same question would arise, who'll replace him? Unless we get this dude Raya at the end of his contract you're probably looking at a world record fee for a keeper. I personally can't justify that until we spend a world record fee to finally get a no.9 to replace Rooney.
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Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 58
- Clean sheets
- 25
- Goals
- 0
- Assists
- 0
- Yellow cards
- 2
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) look forward to a new life under Ruben Amorim. What system will we be playing? What players will impress? and how will it all go? We also say goodbye to Ruud Van Nistelrooy and review United's 3-0 win at home against Leicester City.
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You mean the one de gea saved with his right hand after a defensive error by malacia?
Wait, someone is blaming him for 2012 debacle?
Am I reading this right?
Am I reading this right?
Yeah he made a good save but it still sort of could have gone in
Crazy take, just crazy. That didnt ultimately cost us the league. The fact Kompany was all alone in the box did. Oh and threwing a 8 point lead with 6 games to go, blewing a 4-2 lead vs Everton at home and ultimately playing cowardly for the draw against City.
Yeah, that sir is in fact an unfair criticism.
That's why he's still no1. Because there are many people and managers that neglect the gk situation because you have a "competent" one.
Guardiola could have stayed with Hart for many more years. He wouldn't be nearly as successful as he has been.
He doesnt entirely depend on that though.
Dont remember that save, do you jave a gif?
Who said we played well? I said he was at fault for the only goal of the game. Which he was.
I've literally seen that goal used in countless professional courses as an example of what NOT to do as goalkeeper. And in the interests of fairness the De Gea of today would definitely deal with this very differently.
Yeah DDG lost the title that year definitely.
It's not even difficult to explain how it's poor goalkeeping. I'll spoiler it due to it being 5 images but see below (and I know you'll defend him regardless because that's what people like you do) but the jist is that he positions himself the wrong side of two players and the only way he could go around them to win the ball was by going the long way round, which as a goalkeeper you are never doing in the situation, as such he's basically allowed himself to be blocked; he doesn't then drop to his line until it is far too late because he can't see the ball:
Initial set up as City are preparing to take the corner:
As Silva begins his run up to take the corner, he is looking to be proactive:
As Silva strikes the corner, he cannot see the ball at this point:
As the ball comes into the shot he is still the wrong side of two players and not protecting his goal:
He finally drops back Kompany heads the ball:
As Silva begins his run up to take the corner, he is looking to be proactive:
As Silva strikes the corner, he cannot see the ball at this point:
As the ball comes into the shot he is still the wrong side of two players and not protecting his goal:
He finally drops back Kompany heads the ball:
I'm not saying he was the *only* reason we lost the title, of course not, there were several factors - the Everton game was crushing. But his inability to deal with an aerial ball was the major reason that we lost the critical game in the title race.
See spoiler pics above. Not unfair at all. Didn't say anything about the previous games which clearly were big issues but the goal that settled the biggest game of the season was poor goalkeeping. But for that poor goalkeeping we'd have got the draw we went there for.
Look at it another way, Ederson is an average shot stopper (eyes and all the stats agree on this) yet one of the greatest managers of all time, with one of the most dominant league sides England has ever seen, persists with him.
Perhaps his sweeping means he deals with shots he never ends up facing and allows the back four to push up meaning more control of the game.
Perhaps they concede very few from set pieces due to his excellent ability on crosses.
Perhaps his excellent distribution discourages teams from pressing them high because he’ll easily ping one out to a winger in space in the channel.
Or maybe Guardiola doesn’t know what he’s doing and should replace him with Oblak, Navas or another “traditional” keeper.
Shot stopping past a certain level of competence is overrated.
You dont know that, you dont know if we would concede anway and the way we played we probably would have.
This is a definition of agenda, you're putting pictures from a game from 11 years ago. Jesus.
Also you dont count that was his first season and no, ultimately we didnt lose the leage cause of DDG error. You didnt mention previous game, well you should have cause it makes your point redundant.
Very true . Also you need a certain level of calmness at the back . I feel like we are in constant panic mode when Maguire & DDG play together
DDG can be replaced, it won't be easy but it's not an impossible job, what matters the most is that the club makes the right choice in replacing DDG.
I think that's down to one more than the other. We aren't in constant panic when de gea is in goals with varane and martinez in front of him.
See, maybe this is where I'm wrong, but I don't think spending 50 plus mil on an ederson replacing de gea would be good value for us. If we got a keeper the standard of allison then yea sign me up.
That's not me necessarily saying de gea is better than ederson, I just don't think he's 50/60/70 mil worse.
A GK is a part of the defensive unit, an absolutely vital cog in it infact. Clean sheets and goals conceded are a reflection of the whole teams performance more so than any individual.
It's why PSGxGA is the stat that tends to get used to to try measure how well a GK is performing at there main job of keeping the ball out of the net. De Gea has largely been pretty average in that regards ln the last couple of season, in terms of clean sheets and goals conceded he must of been truly awful last season if those are the stats we want to use to make an informed decision on him.
A GK can get a clean sheet from doing very little or they could concede 2-3 goals despite having a fantastic game it just isn't very reliable.
His performance of Sunday was fine he made a couple of decent saves, but he didn't command his area and his distribution was iffy again. That's pretty much what we have come to expect. He has an issue in that he does so little in terms of shot prevention that he generally has to be having well above average shot stopping performances consistently for him to be worthwhile. And he just hasn't in the last 5 years.
That too.Year 2023 and still images are used to make the point
In response to an image being used to make the exact alternate point, funnily enough you didn't have an issue with that one. General point being that if we're going to big him up for being a PL winner 10 years ago it's relevant to point out failings in his game from the same period.Year 2023 and still images are used to make the point
In response to a picture from the same fecking game which you have conveniently ignored. And it wouldn't make the point redundant, the previous games led to us losing our comfortable lead, losing that game led to us actually conceding control of the title race. I also said he had excellent seasons following, although neither of those first two seasons were at the required level which is why he lost his place to Andes Lindegaard several times during those two seasons, who was the epitome of average.
The general point is relevant because he's no better at dealing with balls into the box today than he was 11 years ago. But that's good enough for some people apparently.
Oh I have cronies, didnt know that. Hey cronies where are you?
You can argue we lost the title cause he conceded some goals he shouldnt have but you can say he saved us few times also, so it goes both ways. In any case he wasn't at fault for us losing a fekin 8 point lead leading to City game and us playing cowardly for the draw and he wasn't at fault Kompany ended up alone in the box like a ghost to.
And that wasn't your general point. Your point is his mistake that day cost us the title with you not mentioning previous games in a situation those games should definitely be mention. Thus your point is completely redundant.
To be clear, seeing as you're clearly incapable of reading a post without seeing alternate meanings, I said: "do you mean letting Kompany score the goal that ultimately cost us the league title because he was incapable of leaving his line to deal with a ball properly 4 yards from his goal" regarding supposed "unfair criticism" early in his United career.
Why the feck would I mention the previous games? I simply didn't say we lost the title because De Gea was shite, I agreed we'd been poor in previous games hence giving up a significant lead, but the game that ultimately lost us the title was losing at City; I'm sorry if you disagree with that but it's a fact, we were in control of the title race until we lost that game. If we'd gone away with the draw we played for we'd have won the title. We lost the game 1-0, the goalkeeper was badly at fault for the goal; I didn't say any more or any less than that. If you want to continue making things up you crack right on.
You seem to be really tense. Relax a bit, breath some fresh air and then come back if you want to have a normal conversation. You seem to lose track of your own points. Not to mention its completely bizarre you even brought a game from 2012 to prove a point which is redundant.
Tbf we weren't in constant panic when Maguire was ahead of Henderson either.
A world record fee would probably be for the best keeper in the world or close
We don't even need that to improve upon ddg ,the obvious example is looking at arsenal
I agree a number 9 is first priority but imo second priority is the goalkeeper. The keeper is one of the most important players in the team and it showed how we struggled in the phase after schmeichel to VDS.
@JB7 I would argue that sir Alex team selection and set up cost us that match against city not ddg. If we're blaming ddg on that occasion we also have to blame the man who let kompany have that header (smalling?)
Ah so you've realised you have completely misread the situation so you've resorted to trying brush it off by attempting to look like a clever dick and failing miserably. The 2012 game was brought up as an example directly in reference to a poster talking about "unfair criticism" early on in it's United career.
Completely relaxed btw, holiday time is here, great day out yesterday despite our mate Dave giving them their best chance of the game by kicking the ball into his own six yard box instead of his picking it up like a normal person (but we can all happily ignore that because they didn't score and feck Leeds) and we're off to Barcelona in the morning. This week is a good week. I'm sure I'll see you there.
Mate I'm not disagreeing with you. My issue with De Gea in that game is specifically related to the goal because he puts himself in a terrible position. All the other factors leading up to the game and during the game I don't disagree with because we shouldn't have been the position where that result mattered but the reality is there was only one goal in the game and it was an error.
I didnt misread, its you who made a right mess from your own post and point about us losing a title because of that goal. And then you tried to change the narrative and it failed.Ah so you've realised you have completely misread the situation so you've resorted to trying brush it off by attempting to look like a clever dick and failing miserably. The 2012 game was brought up as an example directly in reference to a poster talking about "unfair criticism" early on in it's United career.
Completely relaxed btw, holiday time is here, great day out yesterday despite our mate Dave giving them their best chance of the game by kicking the ball into his own six yard box instead of his picking it up like a normal person (but we can all happily ignore that because they didn't score and feck Leeds) and we're off to Barcelona in the morning. This week is a good week. I'm sure I'll see you there.
Yeah, see you in Barcelona mate, dont worry (talk about acting like a dick).
You did misread. Either that or you've read something I haven't said:
" By "unfair criticism" do you mean letting Kompany score the goal that ultimately cost us the league title because he was incapable of leaving his line to deal with a ball properly 4 yards from his goal? And I'm also presuming by saying "bounced back winning a PL medal" that you mean "got dropped twice during the season and was part of the worst title winning defensive record since the year 2000"? De Gea has had a couple of really outstanding seasons for the club, 12/13 was not one of them and it's ok to admit that without having to make out that he was responsible for us winning the league. "
" It was the only goal in the biggest game of the season. We won our final two games, had we gone away with the draw that night we'd have won the league. "
" Who said we played well? I said he was at fault for the only goal of the game. Which he was. "
" I've literally seen that goal used in countless professional courses as an example of what NOT to do as goalkeeper. And in the interests of fairness the De Gea of today would definitely deal with this very differently.
" It's not even difficult to explain how it's poor goalkeeping. I'll spoiler it due to it being 5 images but see below (and I know you'll defend him regardless because that's what people like you do) but the jist is that he positions himself the wrong side of two players and the only way he could go around them to win the ball was by going the long way round, which as a goalkeeper you are never doing in the situation, as such he's basically allowed himself to be blocked; he doesn't then drop to his line until it is far too late because he can't see the ball: "
" I'm not saying he was the *only* reason we lost the title, of course not, there were several factors - the Everton game was crushing. But his inability to deal with an aerial ball was the major reason that we lost the critical game in the title race. "
" See spoiler pics above. Not unfair at all. Didn't say anything about the previous games which clearly were big issues but the goal that settled the biggest game of the season was poor goalkeeping. But for that poor goalkeeping we'd have got the draw we went there for. "
" It was the only goal in the biggest game of the season. We won our final two games, had we gone away with the draw that night we'd have won the league. "
" Who said we played well? I said he was at fault for the only goal of the game. Which he was. "
" I've literally seen that goal used in countless professional courses as an example of what NOT to do as goalkeeper. And in the interests of fairness the De Gea of today would definitely deal with this very differently.
" It's not even difficult to explain how it's poor goalkeeping. I'll spoiler it due to it being 5 images but see below (and I know you'll defend him regardless because that's what people like you do) but the jist is that he positions himself the wrong side of two players and the only way he could go around them to win the ball was by going the long way round, which as a goalkeeper you are never doing in the situation, as such he's basically allowed himself to be blocked; he doesn't then drop to his line until it is far too late because he can't see the ball: "
" I'm not saying he was the *only* reason we lost the title, of course not, there were several factors - the Everton game was crushing. But his inability to deal with an aerial ball was the major reason that we lost the critical game in the title race. "
" See spoiler pics above. Not unfair at all. Didn't say anything about the previous games which clearly were big issues but the goal that settled the biggest game of the season was poor goalkeeping. But for that poor goalkeeping we'd have got the draw we went there for. "
I've been pretty consistent in saying that was the goal that ultimately cost us the title as we were still ahead of City until that point, and it was poor goalkeeping. At no point did I say or insinuate De Gea was solely to blame for us not winning that title. It was you, not me, that started talking about the Everton game and the 8 point lead, all things I don't disagree with being major players in us not winning the league but the fact of the matter is the title remained in our hands until that night at City. Why the hell would I mention other games when one specific game is being referred to?
Fair enough, I get your point. I didnt analyse that game too much on individual performances. I think SAF messed up (and we looked better when Welbeck came on and we had an extra attacker).Ah so you've realised you have completely misread the situation so you've resorted to trying brush it off by attempting to look like a clever dick and failing miserably. The 2012 game was brought up as an example directly in reference to a poster talking about "unfair criticism" early on in it's United career.
Completely relaxed btw, holiday time is here, great day out yesterday despite our mate Dave giving them their best chance of the game by kicking the ball into his own six yard box instead of his picking it up like a normal person (but we can all happily ignore that because they didn't score and feck Leeds) and we're off to Barcelona in the morning. This week is a good week. I'm sure I'll see you there.
Mate I'm not disagreeing with you. My issue with De Gea in that game is specifically related to the goal because he puts himself in a terrible position. All the other factors leading up to the game and during the game I don't disagree with because we shouldn't have been the position where that result mattered but the reality is there was only one goal in the game and it was an error.
Shame...
He is our gk until we get a world class ball playing replacement. His shot stopping has been phenomenal.
The way we have been playing of late, we need someone who has good concentration because we don‘t give away much. He has that.
There are not many out there who are an upgrade on him, so he is nailed on to stay for now.
The way we have been playing of late, we need someone who has good concentration because we don‘t give away much. He has that.
There are not many out there who are an upgrade on him, so he is nailed on to stay for now.
So you're saying if it ended 0-0 we would have won the last 2 games? You understand it doesn't work that way?
Anyway, enjoy your time in Barcelona, this talk is pointless.
We did win the last 2 games. But yes, agreed.
If he signs a new deal, he will stay on as no1 and utd will look for a new no2 to replace henderson. Seeing as a elite striker is the no1 priority for the club and then a CM. I doubt they will have the money to buy a elite ball playing goalie and a new no2. Zero chance de gea goes to being a no2 on 250k a week or whatever his new deal would be.
Cheers.
You are so full of crap it’s embarrassing.Who said we played well? I said he was at fault for the only goal of the game. Which he was.
I've literally seen that goal used in countless professional courses as an example of what NOT to do as goalkeeper. And in the interests of fairness the De Gea of today would definitely deal with this very differently.
It's not even difficult to explain how it's poor goalkeeping. I'll spoiler it due to it being 5 images but see below (and I know you'll defend him regardless because that's what people like you do) but the jist is that he positions himself the wrong side of two players and the only way he could go around them to win the ball was by going the long way round, which as a goalkeeper you are never doing in the situation, as such he's basically allowed himself to be blocked; he doesn't then drop to his line until it is far too late because he can't see the ball:
Initial set up as City are preparing to take the corner:
As Silva begins his run up to take the corner, he is looking to be proactive:
As Silva strikes the corner, he cannot see the ball at this point:
As the ball comes into the shot he is still the wrong side of two players and not protecting his goal:
He finally drops back Kompany heads the ball:
I'm not saying he was the *only* reason we lost the title, of course not, there were several factors - the Everton game was crushing. But his inability to deal with an aerial ball was the major reason that we lost the critical game in the title race.
See spoiler pics above. Not unfair at all. Didn't say anything about the previous games which clearly were big issues but the goal that settled the biggest game of the season was poor goalkeeping. But for that poor goalkeeping we'd have got the draw we went there for.
Can you please enlighten us, on these “professional courses” what did they say on the 2 CBs defending the initial cross pictured in the first image?
Interesting that he didn't make Luis Enrique's top 5 options for the World Cup. Here's what Luis Enrique had to say:
""A goalkeeper should start the play and generate the first superiority, they must dominate the aerial play," Enrique said in June 2022. "I need a goalkeeper that transmits peace and calmness to me - and that doesn’t mean they won’t make mistakes, errors are part of football."
https://www.sportingnews.com/us/soc...hy-kepa-david-de-gea/xluizk7oxztgelegvtfzcj7y
""A goalkeeper should start the play and generate the first superiority, they must dominate the aerial play," Enrique said in June 2022. "I need a goalkeeper that transmits peace and calmness to me - and that doesn’t mean they won’t make mistakes, errors are part of football."
https://www.sportingnews.com/us/soc...hy-kepa-david-de-gea/xluizk7oxztgelegvtfzcj7y
That’s about as good an assessment of DDG as I can think of
Funnily enough, with it being a goalkeeping course, the focus was the goalkeeper rather than the defenders. But you keep on thinking he's great, that's totally fine. I'll just look forward to not having to watch him week in week out next year.
What Luis Enrique is saying also applies to us because of who our head coach is and how similar their fundamentals are when it comes to zonal and positional control.
A keeper should absolutely be generating the first superiority in the first phase of the build up against teams who are adept at pressing from the front. And the game against Leeds yesterday is just another example of how bad we can be in the defensive third against a coordinated press and our keeper is a non entity in that regard.
Leeds setup in a midblock off the ball and pressed our two midfielders and fullbacks, which left the two CBs unmarked. The CBs now have to either break the press via baiting and resisting the first line of the opponent's pressure or look for a line breaking pass which is likely going to turn over possession due to Leeds being setup tactically to anticipate such a situation occurring.
A goalkeeper who is good with the ball at his feet has the ability to take charge in such a situation and help create the numerical advantage by baiting the press whilst one of the CBs drops in alongside Fred and Sabitzer which creates the numerical superiority. The two Leeds forwards pressing on to Sabitzer and Fred are then out numbered because the 11th outfield player (the keeper) has created the first superiority and broken the first line of pressure. And not having that option in the team puts extra pressure on the outfield players to progress the play.
De Gea is also weak when it comes to commanding his area and along with being weak with the ball at his feet, it makes him completely unsuited to the positional play principles which require all 11 players to be proactive with and without the ball.
Post Fergie we've been left behind by rival teams who have backed managers with a clear idea on how to implement a proactive brand of football. Whilst we at United backed managers with a reactive brand of football. And I believe those reactive managers have allowed a number of players to maybe last alot longer at the club than maybe they should've. That has meant we haven't evolved as a proactive team whilst our rivals have created/developed proactive teams with success. We have a proactive coach now, and imo the time is ticking on the keeper who has huge flaws in his game for the positional play principles of Erik ten Hag.
Getting Raya for 15-20m is the most obvious transfer for ages.
I still recall that one year ago there was a similar debate on McTominay "I know that McTominay is mediocre, but are there any realistic options for us to upgrade on him? Splashing 120M on Rice?" If someone come up with the name of Casemiro, he would have been laughed off as dreaming and wishful thinking
I remember "he is a good/decent squad player" phrase that was used a lot but not this "not realistic options to upgrade on him".
There are so many, from cheaper price to awesome one.
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