Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

Do you think there will be a Deal or No Deal?


  • Total voters
    194
  • Poll closed .
It does show how shifting the time-frame just a few days can massively change the picture though.
Yeah, true.

But saying that the pound is just a vit weaker than last Friday is a bit misleading IMO. Pound got stronger in the last few days because it looked like UK is staying in EU. Now, it lost all that and more. Today it had the biggest drop in 30 years.
 
Still struggling to get my head around this, had taken it for granted that the vote would be Remain. Stupid cnuts.

Genuine question though, there seems to be agreement that the political parties are out of touch with what the average man in Little England wants, which has probably been the consensus for decades. Can anyone actually define what the average man wants though? Where is the end game for the Leave campaign, where do they see things going from here?

We should start making a list of pros for Brexit, I'll start

1. Magaluf will now be a lot nicer.

Someone to blame.

I don't think its any surprise that the parts of the country that voted to Remain are the parts of the country that pass the buck for their ailments onto Westminster. So when the electorate want to give someone a kick in England they blame the people that the government here have historically passed the buck onto: the EU.
 
You have to respect the decision of the British electorate - 1.3m is a fair win. The only reason for another referendum is if the EU decide to offer us a deal that doesn't include freedom of movement. You can't just keep asking the question until you get the answer you want. I really doubt there were 1m people who had a reasonable excuse for not being able to vote yesterday, let alone 1m who would have voted remain.

This.

The whole "democracy is great, as long as the result tips the way we want it to" vibe going on in here is strange to say the least.

Altso the ostracizing of elder people who voted leave. So, you are likely to die in the next 15 years? You shouldn't have the democratic right to vote then.
 
Who are you friends with?

The others were comments on less tarded (only in a grammatical way) statuses.

This one was a chav who I used to work with when I had a part time job in uni. I got rid of most idiots when I made a new Facebook recently, but a few made the cut because I thought they were alright idiots.
 
Not sure how valuable the opinions of experts are though. Financial experts in the US laughed at people saying the housing market was in serious trouble. If you had believed Frederic Mishkin, one of the more known economic experts in the world, you'd think Iceland's economy was a stable one, yet they spectacularly collapsed. (note: he got paid a nice amount for his paper).The nuance in all this is self-interest. Who benefits from what?
 
London was flooded. When the capital is flooded (not rain, actual flooding) and the turnout is way lower than expected then you have a problem. You can't decide such an important decision by a difference of a few percent when the Capital isn't fairly represented.
There wouldn't have been 1.3m more votes for 'Stay' than for 'Leave' yesterday, even if London wasn't flooded.
 
I guess that the average man in Little England wants a job that pays enough to live modestly and allows him to have modest holidays from time to time.

Really? Is that genuinely it? Does the average man in Little England not have access to that?

What I'm trying to get at is that people complain that nobody is listening to them and what they want - is it a case that nobody is listening, or is it a case that what the average person thinks is best for them is either 1) completely I achievable, 2) completely ridiculous, or more likely 3) each person has such a different view of what they want from the next person that satisfying everyone on a macro scale is impossible?

I think 3) is the answer, which in turn leads to everyone feeling pissed off and disenfranchised to a degree that protest votes are almost coming the norm rather than the exception. It's worse than the very now due to every nutter having a voice on scocial media - you're bound to find a natter or 2 that you slightly agree with which in turn will colour your own opinion.

This is just turning into a mental society that we live in.
 
Not sure how valuable the opinions of experts are though. Financial experts in the US laughed at people saying the housing market was in serious trouble. If you had believed Frederic Mishkin, one of the more known economic experts in the world, you'd think Iceland's economy was a stable one, yet they spectacularly collapsed. (note: he got paid a nice amount for his paper).The nuance in all this is self-interest. Who benefits from what?
You can trust the common sense though. And the common sense says that the big financial institutes won't have their headquarters for Europe in a country which isn't part of the biggest market of Europe. It would be like putting North America financial headquarters in Toronto.

And with UK being so depended on financial services, all the other predictions will follow. Sure, they are conjectures, but it is hard to see them not happening.
 
90% of the people that voted leave weren't swayed by proper arguments, but by good old fashioned racism.

15-16million Britons are voted based on racism? Don't be daft. The geographical and socio-economic picture is far more revealing than these reactionary slights on voters. Communities had been left behind for too long, and their concerns ignored, they weren't going to sit idle forever. We've seen it with the rise of UKI;P and the Green,m the election of Corbyn to leader, and now this momentous referendum.
 
Someone to blame.

I don't think its any surprise that the parts of the country that voted to Remain are the parts of the country that pass the buck for their ailments onto Westminster. So when the electorate want to give someone a kick in England they blame the people that the government here have historically passed the buck onto: the EU.

If it's just someone to blame then we, as a people, are fecked forever more.

Completely agree with the second piece.
 
London was flooded. When the capital is flooded (not rain, actual flooding) and the turnout is way lower than expected then you have a problem. You can't decide such an important decision by a difference of a few percent when the Capital isn't fairly represented.

Do you really think that there are 1.3m remain voters that were prevented from voting because of flooding?
 
Nigel Farage said it was a victory for decent people. This is a victory for hate. It sickens me to think that the people I live with that surround me hate this much.

What a bastard -- means that those who had voted to remain are not decent human beings! Way to unite people after a referendum.
 
Not sure how valuable the opinions of experts are though. Financial experts in the US laughed at people saying the housing market was in serious trouble. If you had believed Frederic Mishkin, one of the more known economic experts in the world, you'd think Iceland's economy was a stable one, yet they spectacularly collapsed. (note: he got paid a nice amount for his paper).The nuance in all this is self-interest. Who benefits from what?

Come on VorZakone. This is rubbish. When you go to a hospital I'm sure you want someone who's a specialist in whatever is wrong with you. When you get mortgage advice I'm sure you want an expert. When you send your kids to school I'm sure you'll want someone knowledgable in the subject teaching them. Just because a few experts made a mistake all those years ago does not even in the slightest bit negate the legitimate relevance of expert opinion.
 
This.

The whole "democracy is great, as long as the result tips the way we want it to" vibe going on in here is strange to say the least.

Altso the ostracizing of elder people who voted leave. So, you are likely to die in the next 15 years? You shouldn't have the democratic right to vote then.

after getting the benefits of free education, free healthcare, great pensions, social mobility, freedom of employment and enjoying big financial gains, all the while leveraging this all on younger generations to be burdened with, all of which who don't have anywhere near the same opportunities now, then yeah, they can go feck themselves. that was a vote for themselves. if the country "has gone to pot" i'd suggest they looked a little closer to home than brussels. i'm sure some had their reasons, i'm sure some are informed, but this wasn't a vote to give anything back, this wasn't a vote in the country's best interest. this was a vote with their own interests in mind. interests which don't align with the future or their grandchildren. interests that they have always looked out for, regardless of the cost to others who have to pick up the bill. they can go feck themselves.
 
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Really? Is that genuinely it? Does the average man in Little England not have access to that?

What I'm trying to get at is that people complain that nobody is listening to them and what they want - is it a case that nobody is listening, or is it a case that what the average person thinks is best for them is either 1) completely I achievable, 2) completely ridiculous, or more likely 3) each person has such a different view of what they want from the next person that satisfying everyone on a macro scale is impossible?

I think 3) is the answer, which in turn leads to everyone feeling pissed off and disenfranchised to a degree that protest votes are almost coming the norm rather than the exception. It's worse than the very now due to every nutter having a voice on scocial media - you're bound to find a natter or 2 that you slightly agree with which in turn will colour your own opinion.

This is just turning into a mental society that we live in.

To me the problem is about money, people are afraid of ending up without a roof and without food on the table, we are living in an era where getting a job is harder, getting a promotion is harder and that despite the fact that people are more educated. I still hear people shocked that when they were 20 they could easily have a job in banking without a bachelor, now with a bachelor you are a cashier.
 
UPDATE: Morgan Stanley denies reports that it would move 2,000 investment banking staff from London
 
Come on VorZakone. This is rubbish. When you go to a hospital I'm sure you want someone who's a specialist in whatever is wrong with you. When you get mortgage advice I'm sure you want an expert. When you send your kids to school I'm sure you'll want someone knowledgable in the subject teaching them. Just because a few experts made a mistake all those years ago does not even in the slightest bit negate the legitimate relevance of expert opinion.
I realise that. I should have nuanced my post more. But those are significantly different situations though. A doctor has little personal gain in screwing you over with shitty advice because you simply won't go to that doctor anymore and neither would others. I guess the difference here is finance because self-interest is a bit greyer there. IKB Bank got royally screwed by Paulson and Goldman Sachs for example.
 
Lord Ashcroft poll to Remain and Leave voters


I checked the raw polling data on this. Between ~20-50% of Leavers think feminism, the green movement, multiculturalism and LGBT rights are forces for ill


Of 6420 Leavers

- 47% multiculturalism = force for ill
- 23% feminism = force for ill
- 30% green movement = force for ill
- 37% LGBT rights = force for ill

Well done Britain

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To me the problem is about money, people are afraid of ending up without a roof and without food on the table, we are living in an era where getting a job is harder, getting a promotion is harder and that despite the fact that people are more educated. I still hear people shocked that when they were 20 they could easily have a job in banking without a bachelor, now with a bachelor you are a cashier.
I don't agree with the assumption it's harder to get a job. It may be that it's harder to get your dream job from the off, and the system has made it so easy for so long to be out of work.
 
I work in finance, we just had this email...

Dear Team Member,

You will all be aware that the result of the European Union Referendum was announced this morning, with the UK voting to leave the EU. We know that many of you will wonder whether this decision will affect our business.

As you would expect, prior to the vote we had undertaken our own analysis of both possible outcomes and we feel confident that this result will not have a direct impact upon our business.

While there will be a level of uncertainty both politically and economically, we are a strong, growing and resilient Group, with operations in an increasing number of countries and well-established national companies in each.

This means it is very much business as usual. We remain positive and united in our goal of building the best international credit management organisation by delivering the best possible service for our clients and consumers.

And now Morgan Stanley are denying the reports about the movement of their investment bankers. I think some people are just seeing doom and gloom and jumping the gun without allowing things to settle down.
 
I realise that. I should have nuanced my post more. But those are significantly different situations though. A doctor has little personal gain in screwing you over with shitty advice because you simply won't go to that doctor anymore and neither would others.

The same goes for any other expert. Doctors also have a lot to gain by prescribing you certain things, at least in the US. But the point stands, they made a mistake a few years ago, shit happens. Their opinion is still based on extensive education and extensive knowledge with an understanding of many underlying factors that you or I simply do not have. Anyone saying 'yeah but you can't trust experts then' is basically saying just let fate decide. There's no point in any of us going to University because being an expert on something is useless etc.

Many financial advisors also make their personal gains based on your personal gains. So the argument still doesn't make sense.
 
15-16million Britons are voted based on racism? Don't be daft. The geographical and socio-economic picture is far more revealing than these reactionary slights on voters. Communities had been left behind for too long, and their concerns ignored, they weren't going to sit idle forever. We've seen it with the rise of UKI;P and the Green,m the election of Corbyn to leader, and now this momentous referendum.

Without being facetious, what communities, and what concerns? And how does voting out of the EU address those concerns?
 
My first thread in the CE forum for Months.

I feel for the young who are the future of both UK and Europe. This vote has consequences beyond the UK. I was always brought up and seen myself strength is in unity. I've only felt this bad only when about a political decision when UK invaded Iraq. It's as though I've lost someone from the family.
 
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Do you really think that there are 1.3m remain voters that were prevented from voting because of flooding?

You obviously don't realise the importance of London. I've only just started looking at their numbers, but there's already 8 districts with a Turnout less than 70%. I'll do the maths for you shortly with averages so you can see the difference.
 
Predictably, the Chinese have held this up as another example of how western democracy doesn't work:

In classic fashion, the Global Times has swooped in to offer opinion aplenty on the #Brexit, with this editorial from Wang Yiwei, published this morning, lamenting the referendum and Western-style democracy in general.

"Democracy is at its roots the achievement of human political civilization, but today it's become a game to be played," he writes."This is a tragedy."

Wang goes on to say that the vote proves China is going about things the right way, saying: "In terms of productivity, China has won; in terms of resilience, China will win."

Wang, a professor of international relations at Renmin University of China, also criticizes the EU's constant tendency towards ballots and referendums, arguing that they lead to populist hijacking:


Europe has been playing the 'referendum' game, which proves that democracy is hijacked by nationalism and populism, showing more and more negative effects. Under the negative impact of globalization, democracy lacks institutional resilience.

He argues that the referendum will ultimately lead "people [to] lose faith in democracy" and that "democracy's waywardness makes it suspect."
He has a point.
 
I don't agree with the assumption it's harder to get a job. It may be that it's harder to get your dream job from the off, and the system has made it so easy for so long to be out of work.

That's true, but I'm thinking about jobs that aren't at the minimum wage.