Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

Do you think there will be a Deal or No Deal?

  • Total voters
    194
  • Poll closed .
I still blame Cameron more than anyone else, though with Johnson in second place given that he cynically chose to campaign to leave for selfish career purposes, never actually wanted leave to win and was hoping for a narrow defeat.

His administration and his / their actions created or exacerbated the conditions that allowed leave to win, notably his undeliverable pledges re drastically cutting net migration, excessive austerity (meaning that many voters didn't care about his series of dire warnings as they were already struggling), repeatedly criticising the EU as PM and then thinking he'd the best person to convince people to vote to stay in it etc. I'm still convinced that enough people to swing the outcome of the referendum voted to leave, just to 'give him a kicking'.

Theresa May fundamentally misunderstanding how the single market worked, and thinking that we could leave it and then negotiate access to it afterwards, was also catastrophic.
 
Buster15 said:
To be quite honest with you I am just as livid as the LBC presenter.
And his description of a Nobel Prize in lying is a good one.
Like so many, I had forgotten most of what he has reminded me of.
It is about time Labour made a big play of this. But they won't because they would be afraid of upsetting the so called gullible Red Wall voters they want to attract back.
So why not the LibDems then.
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Labour got this all wrong from Day One, before the referendum, nearly seven years ago. What have they gained by going along with it? Now I hear Starmer is going to "Make Brexit Work."
Maybe they'll get back in at the next election. Even that is not so certain. If they do, how do they get the country of the mess that increases day by day? Few people seem aware that the worst of the consequences of Brexit are still to come.

Labour should have made a big play of it from the beginning but with Corbyn and then Starmer as unconvincing Remainers it was never going to happen.

The only route I can see is for the UK to start realigning as soon as possible with the EU. That seems many years away.

The Tories are still going on about immigrants. Investment zones. Reducing Corporation Tax etc. It's more of the same hogwash as O'Brien calls it.

For companies to invest in the UK, there are more important things than Corporation Tax to consider. First of all to pay Corporation Tax, they have to make a profit. To make a profit, amongst many other things, they have to have a market to sell to. The UK have put up so many barriers that unless the company investing in the UK only sells in the UK, why would they chose the UK?

There are more barriers going up everyday. Unless these barriers are removed they will continue in the downward spiral. But there's a long way to go before that.

I really don't think the gravity of this decision to leave the EU has hit most people. Twenty-two months since they left the transition period has given them a taster.
 
GuybrushThreepwood said:
I still blame Cameron more than anyone else, though with Johnson in second place given that he cynically chose to campaign to leave for selfish career purposes, never actually wanted leave to win and was hoping for a narrow defeat.

His administration and his / their actions created or exacerbated the conditions that allowed leave to win, notably his undeliverable pledges re drastically cutting net migration, excessive austerity (meaning that many voters didn't care about his series of dire warnings as they were already struggling), repeatedly criticising the EU as PM and then thinking he'd the best person to convince people to vote to stay in it etc. I'm still convinced that enough people to swing the outcome of the referendum voted to leave, just to 'give him a kicking'.

Theresa May fundamentally misunderstanding how the single market worked, and thinking that we could leave it and then negotiate access to it afterwards, was also catastrophic.
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Agreed.
I would put Cameron as the chief culprit because he was so stupid by not remembering the first lesson:
Don't ask a question if you don't know what to do with the answer.
He was naive in the extreme and totally culpable in the outcome.

Boris Johnson is a very close 2nd though because once the vote was to leave, he made a political career out of absolutely fcuking up the outcome.
Get Brexit done with zero thought of what that meant.
And the Red Coach with £350millions for the NHS.
Oven Ready solution to the Northern Ireland Protocol. Remember that.

Those 2 and the rest of the Vote Leave Campaign lies team should be subject to a full Independent Inquiry into the lies they told the people of the UK.
Won't get anywhere. But it would expose them for what they are to those they lied to.
Bastards.
 
Paul the Wolf said:
Labour got this all wrong from Day One, before the referendum, nearly seven years ago. What have they gained by going along with it? Now I hear Starmer is going to "Make Brexit Work."
Maybe they'll get back in at the next election. Even that is not so certain. If they do, how do they get the country of the mess that increases day by day? Few people seem aware that the worst of the consequences of Brexit are still to come.

Labour should have made a big play of it from the beginning but with Corbyn and then Starmer as unconvincing Remainers it was never going to happen.

The only route I can see is for the UK to start realigning as soon as possible with the EU. That seems many years away.

The Tories are still going on about immigrants. Investment zones. Reducing Corporation Tax etc. It's more of the same hogwash as O'Brien calls it.

For companies to invest in the UK, there are more important things than Corporation Tax to consider. First of all to pay Corporation Tax, they have to make a profit. To make a profit, amongst many other things, they have to have a market to sell to. The UK have put up so many barriers that unless the company investing in the UK only sells in the UK, why would they chose the UK?

There are more barriers going up everyday. Unless these barriers are removed they will continue in the downward spiral. But there's a long way to go before that.

I really don't think the gravity of this decision to leave the EU has hit most people. Twenty-two months since they left the transition period has given them a taster.
Click to expand...

Understand and agree with all of that.

I am saddened by what is happening to the UK Motor Manufacturing as an example.

Only a few years ago, we were producing almost 1.7 million vehicles a year.
Since then:
Vauxhall has ceased producing cars.
Honda has ceased producing cars.
BMW is transferring Mini Electric to China, leaving petrol and diesel only.
Ford has transferred Transit production to Turkey.
And Ford engine plants in the UK don't produce Electric powertrains.
And these facilities supported millions of support and supply jobs.

Ok. Not all of this is totally due to Brexit. But it certainly has not helped to improve the situation.
 
Buster15 said:
Understand and agree with all of that.

I am saddened by what is happening to the UK Motor Manufacturing as an example.

Only a few years ago, we were producing almost 1.7 million vehicles a year.
Since then:
Vauxhall has ceased producing cars.
Honda has ceased producing cars.
BMW is transferring Mini Electric to China, leaving petrol and diesel only.
Ford has transferred Transit production to Turkey.
And Ford engine plants in the UK don't produce Electric powertrains.
And these facilities supported millions of support and supply jobs.

Ok. Not all of this is totally due to Brexit. But it certainly has not helped to improve the situation.
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The Blyth battery gigafactory comes to mind. It survives for the time being although nothing physical really exists at the moment.
If you put yourself in the shoes of an investor, why would you invest in the factory?

There are now many barriers both importing and exporting materials that weren't there even two years ago. Gigafactories are being built across Europe. No barriers to the rest of Europe. Three in Northern France alone, with possibly a fourth. Many other countries too.

From next year there is supposed to be the UKCA certification coming through which means that the battery will have to have a CE certification to sell it in the EU, which is also recognised elsewhere in the world. But it will also have to have a UKCA certification to sell it in the UK and all the materials imported will have to have a UKCA and an EU certification as well.

Instead of Global Britain the government is turning it into Isolated Britain.

Complete and utter madness.
 
GuybrushThreepwood said:
I still blame Cameron more than anyone else, though with Johnson in second place given that he cynically chose to campaign to leave for selfish career purposes, never actually wanted leave to win and was hoping for a narrow defeat.

His administration and his / their actions created or exacerbated the conditions that allowed leave to win, notably his undeliverable pledges re drastically cutting net migration, excessive austerity (meaning that many voters didn't care about his series of dire warnings as they were already struggling), repeatedly criticising the EU as PM and then thinking he'd the best person to convince people to vote to stay in it etc. I'm still convinced that enough people to swing the outcome of the referendum voted to leave, just to 'give him a kicking'.

Theresa May fundamentally misunderstanding how the single market worked, and thinking that we could leave it and then negotiate access to it afterwards, was also catastrophic.
Click to expand...

Yet if he doesnt resign you lot probably would ended up with him as PM for the second time.
 
Buster15 said:
Agreed.
I would put Cameron as the chief culprit because he was so stupid by not remembering the first lesson:
Don't ask a question if you don't know what to do with the answer.
He was naive in the extreme and totally culpable in the outcome.

Boris Johnson is a very close 2nd though because once the vote was to leave, he made a political career out of absolutely fcuking up the outcome.
Get Brexit done with zero thought of what that meant.
And the Red Coach with £350millions for the NHS.
Oven Ready solution to the Northern Ireland Protocol. Remember that.

Those 2 and the rest of the Vote Leave Campaign lies team should be subject to a full Independent Inquiry into the lies they told the people of the UK.
Won't get anywhere. But it would expose them for what they are to those they lied to.
Bastards.
Click to expand...

Agreed. And Theresa May deserves a huge amount of blame as well.

She deserves zero sympathy for ‘inheriting the mess left behind by Cameron’, given that 1) she voluntarily stood to succeed him as PM, 2) she as the Home Secretary during his administration wash hell-bent on them keeping the undeliverable ‘cut net migration to the tens of thousands pledge’ which helped doom the remain campaign and was a huge gift to the leave side and 3) she to her discredit blatantly underestimated how difficult the withdrawal negotiations would be. I knew when the leave vote came in that the negotiations would be incredibly difficult, given that the EU would want to protect the interest of their remaining 27 members, and prevent a domino effect.

She triggered Article 50 too early without making sufficient preparations, she misunderstood how the single market worked, she made that ridiculous speech at Lancaster House in early 2017 placating the right-wing media and ERG and setting completely unnecessary redlines, which doomed her as they held her to those promises etc. She arrogantly thought that she’d win a landslide during the 2017 GE putting in the bare minimum campaigning effort and despite releasing a cr*p manifesto with ‘half-baked, uncosted policies’, and lost her majority 10-11 days before the formal exit talks began. And her and her team seemed to approach those talks in an abrasive, careless and unprepared manner.

As James O’Brien said, we as a country voted to impose economic sanctions on ourselves.
 
Jericholyte2 said:
Nah they just do a Catherine Tate and ask if they’re bothered. Case in point…

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The i should publish this response in their next edition and say it's the government response. It is an elected member of parliament responding to one of their journalist's statements, after all.

These cnuts get away for too easily with spouting anything they want without repercussions.
 
And then you have a Herbert from one of them think tanks doing the exact same thing…

Project Fear 2 aka reality.

 
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Jericholyte2 said:
And then you have a Herbert from one of them think tanks doing the exact same thing…

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This is the guy who - suggested that treason laws should cover British citizens with "extreme loyalty" to the European Union.[11] This comment led to widespread criticism, with Labour Party MP Virendra Sharma alleging that he was "suggesting putting the knife into free speech" and European Parliament Brexit representative Guy Verhofstadt calling his comments "insane"

He of course benefits from a pension for being an ex-MEP still, now, being paid for by the Brexit voters and other British citizens for doing absolutely nothing for them.
 
Frosty said:
I still think it is going to take a few decades to rejoin, if at all.
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In 10-30 years all of the EU will be far-right and we'll be living in the Republic of Corbynistan so they'll want to join us.
 
Jericholyte2 said:
I'd like to run on a platform of "Rejoing the EU so we can retake control of our borders" and watch the gammon's heads explode!
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A lot of people say that would be political suicide but I don't think so. Truly think people are pissed off and realise it was a mistake. Lot of Brexit voters in my office are now all moaning about it and talking about rejoining - also claiming they never voted Brexit as well :lol:
 
https://www.theguardian.com/society...ng-on-tampon-tax-savings-to-women-report-says

UK retailers not passing on tampon tax savings to women, report says
Exclusive: Abolition of 5% VAT on period products only resulted in 1% cut in prices at most, research finds


This reminds me of that Brexit poster a while back celebrating leaving the EU because the UK would reduce VAT on tampons by 5% before the EU did.

It was the only benefit he could name, if I remember, although I never worked out why a middle-aged man would sacrifice so much just to save a few pence on a packet of tampons.
 
Whether Suella Braverman New Immigration Deal with France will have any effect remains to be seen.
But what I am most hopeful for is that this might bring about a new Entent Cordial between the UK and our closed and dearest neighbours.

The previous administration policy of isolationism while at the same time wanting Global Britain was both imbecilic and self defeating in equal measures.

Brexit has been a self inflicted disaster of monumental proportions.
But there is no going back. So we have to try to make the best out of a very bad deal and not be so stupid.
 
Buster15 said:
Whether Suella Braverman New Immigration Deal with France will have any effect remains to be seen.
But what I am most hopeful for is that this might bring about a new Entent Cordial between the UK and our closed and dearest neighbours.

The previous administration policy of isolationism while at the same time wanting Global Britain was both imbecilic and self defeating in equal measures.

Brexit has been a self inflicted disaster of monumental proportions.
But there is no going back. So we have to try to make the best out of a very bad deal and not be so stupid.
Click to expand...

Doubt it will make a lot of difference to the crossings so the government will start blaming the French government.
If the UK government keeps advertising that they house immigrants in four-star hotels (even if it's not true for most) they'll be more and more crossing.

With problems on the NI protocol almost sure to re-start because the ERG and DUP will never be happy plus the EU Entry/Exit system due to start next May upsetting a lot of Brexiters, I'm not over-optimistic.
 
Buster15 said:
Whether Suella Braverman New Immigration Deal with France will have any effect remains to be seen.
But what I am most hopeful for is that this might bring about a new Entent Cordial between the UK and our closed and dearest neighbours.

The previous administration policy of isolationism while at the same time wanting Global Britain was both imbecilic and self defeating in equal measures.

Brexit has been a self inflicted disaster of monumental proportions.
But there is no going back. So we have to try to make the best out of a very bad deal and not be so stupid.
Click to expand...

WTF has squash got to do with this?
 
Paul the Wolf said:
Doubt it will make a lot of difference to the crossings so the government will start blaming the French government.
If the UK government keeps advertising that they house immigrants in four-star hotels (even if it's not true for most) they'll be more and more crossing.

With problems on the NI protocol almost sure to re-start because the ERG and DUP will never be happy plus the EU Entry/Exit system due to start next May upsetting a lot of Brexiters, I'm not over-optimistic.
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Agree with you on both points.
But it is at least a tiny step in the right direction.
I read that Macron and Sunak seemed to get off to a better start than with Boris.
We can but hope.
 
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...de-deal-not-actually-very-good-george-eustice

Flagship post-Brexit Australia trade deal ‘not actually very good’, MPs hear
Former minister George Eustice tells Commons senior civil servant in charge of negotiations should be replaced

At the time in 2021, Boris Johnson, then prime minister, hailed the deal as “global Britain at its best” but environmental groups warned it would be catastrophic for the environment.
 
Paul the Wolf said:
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...de-deal-not-actually-very-good-george-eustice

Flagship post-Brexit Australia trade deal ‘not actually very good’, MPs hear
Former minister George Eustice tells Commons senior civil servant in charge of negotiations should be replaced

At the time in 2021, Boris Johnson, then prime minister, hailed the deal as “global Britain at its best” but environmental groups warned it would be catastrophic for the environment.
Click to expand...
 
London loses position as most valuable European stock market

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63623502

Britain's stock market has lost its position as Europe's most-valued, with France taking the top spot, data shows.

A weak pound, fears of recession in the UK and surging sales at French luxury goods makers are thought to be behind the shift, according to data from Bloomberg.

It's the first time Paris has overtaken London since records began in 2003.

It comes as the UK is expected to fall into recession this year, although the French economy is also under pressure.

The combined value of British shares is now around $2.821 trillion (£2.3 trillion), while France's are worth around $2.823 trillion, Bloomberg calculates.

It marks a huge reversal of fortunes for the London Stock Exchange, which was worth about $1.4 trillion more than its Parisian rival back in 2016.
 
Paul the Wolf said:
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...de-deal-not-actually-very-good-george-eustice

Flagship post-Brexit Australia trade deal ‘not actually very good’, MPs hear
Former minister George Eustice tells Commons senior civil servant in charge of negotiations should be replaced

At the time in 2021, Boris Johnson, then prime minister, hailed the deal as “global Britain at its best” but environmental groups warned it would be catastrophic for the environment.
Click to expand...

Here in AUS we always assumed you guys did this purely out embarassment for the way brexit was going. The only winner was us :lol:
 
Frosty said:
London loses position as most valuable European stock market

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63623502

Britain's stock market has lost its position as Europe's most-valued, with France taking the top spot, data shows.

A weak pound, fears of recession in the UK and surging sales at French luxury goods makers are thought to be behind the shift, according to data from Bloomberg.

It's the first time Paris has overtaken London since records began in 2003.

It comes as the UK is expected to fall into recession this year, although the French economy is also under pressure.

The combined value of British shares is now around $2.821 trillion (£2.3 trillion), while France's are worth around $2.823 trillion, Bloomberg calculates.

It marks a huge reversal of fortunes for the London Stock Exchange, which was worth about $1.4 trillion more than its Parisian rival back in 2016.
Click to expand...

It's amazing that the economy and world at large are in such a mess that we still haven't got round to looking at whether the Brexit deal might be a bit shit yet.
 
TwoSheds said:
It's amazing that the economy and world at large are in such a mess that we still haven't got round to looking at whether the Brexit deal might be a bit shit yet.
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this-is.gif
 
WPMUFC said:
Here in AUS we always assumed you guys did this purely out embarassment for the way brexit was going. The only winner was us :lol:
Click to expand...


It was out of desperation. There is no trade deal on Earth (even all added together) that will make up for what the UK has thrown away.

I also saw Eustice's other comment today :
He also said that, if necessary, the UK should be prepared to spend a decade negotiating joining the Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership (CPTPP).

The desperation and stupidity is not over yet. The CPTPP, haha! Tragically hilarious.

PS I stopped being one of the 'you guys' :)
 
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