At least he can reassure himself that it's going to get much worse over the next few years. So make the most of the good times.
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At least he can reassure himself that it's going to get much worse over the next few years. So make the most of the good times.
No way! Who could have known?
I'm actually seeing the Express noticing that Brexit actually hasn't been the best idea over the last few days.
did you have a look at the article comments?
Full on delusional nutters that think anything bad for Brexit is an EU plot or "being salty that we got away" and the solution is to move FURTHER away from EU trade
did you have a look at the article comments?
Full on delusional nutters that think anything bad for Brexit is an EU plot or "being salty that we got away" and the solution is to move FURTHER away from EU trade
Yeah Express readers have been conditioned by decades of nonsense so I don't really expect any different. The editors, on the other hand, seem to have decided that they can ignore this no longer.
Also:
It's not just the single market, it's mainly leaving the Custom's Union. So the only way to avoid all these problems was to stay in the Single Market and the Custom's Union. Which would have meant the UK would still have been in the EU with no say.
Brexit could have never worked.
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There are many people who have convinced themselves of a falsehood.
What we seem to be witnessing now is the mental contortions of people who are trying to reconcile reality with their beliefs and are failing to do so without logical fallacies and shortcuts.
I hope this is the first in many steps back to accepting that reality, but you will have to wait a while before those people state explicitly that Brexit could never work (I expect them to get there via blaming the EU for sabotaging it first).
They are doing it on purpose, there is no other way.
Yes, they'll be blaming the EU and all sorts of people for the problems. The hardest part for them to accept will be that the idea of Brexit was never about a benefit for the British people, only for the benefit of certain politicians and tax avoiders and that they got conned into believing that these charlatans had their interests at heart.
how long do you reckon until there are serious calls for membership? Can your country actually stomach going back in or will this be a pride thing forever?
I mean Labour can't even weaponise its failures against johnson because it's so taboo. If it were possible, what? 20 years from now?
I mean Labour can't even weaponise its failures against johnson because it's so taboo. If it were possible, what? 20 years from now?
At least a decade.
The problem is that in theory, new membership comes without acquis which is logically nearly impossible to sell to the public even british people that are pro-EU.
At least, you'd imagine. We might need a generation to shift off the voting register first. Would also question European appetite- at least among the current cohort of MEPs.
At least 20-30 years. Probably never, unless a future government reform and regulate the media.
Would the EU want such a silly country back given the pain their idiocy has caused?
That is a different question. But there is no guarantee they would! And the terms would be atrocious compared to previous.
I think the EU would take the UK back despite all the shenanigans. The UK is still a huge economy and taking them back would no doubt strengthen the EU.
It's irrelevant, we are not going to rejoin.
It's impossible to predict the political landscape in 30 - 50 years time.
But I agree in the short to medium term, no chance (not that i particuarly want to rejoin, but better terms would be good).
Not until the boomers are the minority voting demographic anyway. Who knows what the EU will look like at that point, or what Britain will look like for that matter.
Down the line, but no way anyone can face those accession talks for a few years.
Indeed a long way off i think... the whole euro aspect of it for a start.
If anything something approaching a Norway style deal would ve the starting point.
Farrage would probably have a heart attack ... actually on 2nd thoughts let's start immediately
He would, despite him constantly using Norway as a reference point pre referendum, but he would of course conveniently forget that.
That might actually be the easiest route for them. If someone has to face being wrong, its usually easier to have someone to blame for it. If the Express-Brexiteers ever actually do get to that point, the blowback on the Tories is going to be apocalyptic.
I'm expecting serious calls for joining the EEA or EFTA to start within about the next 6 months. It is likely to be the way Britain solves some of its problems while losing less face than if they just rejoin the EU straight off.
There is zero chance the EU will accept the UK back in the single market, the custom's union or the EU until the UK radically change their attitude , their political system, the acceptance that they would have to rejoin on far worse terms than when they left.
This is going to take a very very long time if ever. The EU now don't have a whiny major partner expecting special treament all the time. It actually feels like a relief the Uk have left.
The only reason the EU are still indulging the UK's tantrums is because of Ireland. The only reason Westminster indulges the DUP with the Protocol dispute is because it's the only weapon they think they can use against the EU.
The problem is that there are going to be the same arguments that started before the referendum and are still going on now. Until the British people understand what they have voted for by voting for Brexit, there's not even a starting point. The UK joined the EEC nearly fifty years ago and because of the British media and governments they never understood what being in the EEC/EU meant.
All I can see is years of the same arguments, cherry picking and so on.
What is more likely is the break up of the UK and possibly Scotland joining at some point.
well it kinda goes without saying they’d have changed their attitude if they wanted back in
I think that’s impossible under the Tories current leadership though
If euro adoption is a deal breaker then it would take something pretty seismic for the UK to join.
But it's not just the Tories though. The Labour Party's attitude was just as bad. Remember Starmer expecting to have the same benefits outside the EU as inside it. There really has to be a massive change in British politics.
Yeah I know. Public opinion needs to be heavily pro-EU first, before the politicians fall in line. Can’t see it happening for a while but who knows what 5 or 10 years out of the EU will do.
I also think all of the Tory feckwits who were responsible for Brexit need to be out of government.
I guess the best chance is if public opinion sways massively and then a strong Labour leadership fight an election on rejoining the EU. Now I’ve written that out I’ve realised how hopeless it sounds.
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I could actually see public opinion swaying back to rejoining the EU. That is probably the least hard thing to achieve.
We're not even eighteen months into the UK leaving the EU properly and only the very start of the result of Brexit is having an effect. There are so many things that are going to happen over the next five years as grace periods end, more rules are introduced and by 2027 I expect a vast majority of the UK to be thoroughly sick of Brexit. Will that be enough to change British attitudes and politics, I'm not so sure.
lets say public opinion gets to 80%+ pro EU due to how terrible things go
why wouldn’t politicians change under those circumstances? If they don’t they’ll lose an election to someone who does
But if they did reach that point we'd all be back to the endless arguing amongst themselves as to what terms they would be willing to rejoin the EU, not taking into account what the terms the EU would accept them to rejoin. So even if the public wanted to rejoin they're not going to rejoin with the pound being consigned to history and all the benefits and rebates the UK had before they left no longer applicable. So maybe one party was pro rejoining the EU, they'd probably lose the subsequent election because they wouldn't be able to obtain the exceptional terms the British public would expect.
From what I was reading in last week's news about Croatia adopting the euro in 2023, every EU country that doesn't have the euro yet must sketch out a path towards adopting it (Denmark being the only exception). So that would be required from the UK as well upon rejoining: anything else could not be justified to other recent or new members. But then some countries, like Sweden, are only nominally on that path and don't actually intend to make progress; so I guess that's the approach the UK could take. They'd still formally be on a course towards adoption though, which probably would be a huge stumbling block in and of itself already.
(Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
)From what I was reading in last week's news about Croatia adopting the euro in 2023, every EU country that doesn't have the euro yet must sketch out a path towards adopting it (Denmark being the only exception). So that would be required from the UK as well upon rejoining: anything else could not be justified to other recent or new members. But then some countries, like Sweden, are only nominally on that path and don't actually intend to make progress; so I guess that's the approach the UK could take. They'd still formally be on a course towards adoption though, which probably would be a huge stumbling block in and of itself already.
(Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
Sweden joined in 1995 before the Euro. If the UK rejoined as new members they would need to adopt the Euro before they could. If the UK hadn't left they could have kept the Pound.From what I was reading in last week's news about Croatia adopting the euro in 2023, every EU country that doesn't have the euro yet must sketch out a path towards adopting it (Denmark being the only exception). So that would be required from the UK as well upon rejoining: anything else could not be justified to other recent or new members. But then some countries, like Sweden, are only nominally on that path and don't actually intend to make progress; so I guess that's the approach the UK could take. They'd still formally be on a course towards adoption though, which probably would be a huge stumbling block in and of itself already.
(Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
Only new members have to adopt the Euro, the others have the benefits of exemptions. In theory the UK would be a new member and have lost those exemptions when they left.
Even if the politicians were persuaded that moving to the Euro was OK, that would be nightmare fuel for anti-EU campaigners in the future. If they've managed to make a huge fuss about blue passports, I dread to think the havoc they'd cause about moving back to the pound.
We're in a right mess, left the EU, and no chance of getting the special conditions that meant we could join in the past.
We're in a right mess, left the EU, and no chance of getting the special conditions that meant we could join in the past.
I dont get why you're so attached to the pound really. If you were to join the euro you'd have far more influence on it than everyone but france and germany. If you did it before trashing your international reputation you'd have more influence than france and a similar level to germany.
You guys could do with a hard dose of pragmatism and shedding some of the sentimental, historical attachments of questionable value in todays world
You guys could do with a hard dose of pragmatism and shedding some of the sentimental, historical attachments of questionable value in todays world