Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

Do you think there will be a Deal or No Deal?

  • Total voters
    194
  • Poll closed .
africanspur said:
Sigh... I honestly... I can't even. This is reminiscent for me when I spent about an hour trying to convince a brexiteer that her voting to leave the EU didn't mean we'd be kicked out of the Euros. When I told her about some of the countries that compete in the Euros (some of whom aren't even physically in Europe, let alone in the EU), she refused to accept she could be wrong, despite the evidence in front of her.

This is what I feel now. By some distance the most strangely frustrating conversation I have ever had online and I have had some superb ones with Trump supporters, brexiters and Sisi supporters.

Firstly, I never said people of all colours can't be bigoted.

Secondly, what? When did I say they don't want Europeans taking their jobs? More strawmen.

I honestly don't know how many more ways I can say this. They already have their jobs. They just wanted future Indians to compete on an equal footing with Europeans. Which now they will be.

The UK' s agreement is within that very same page. And Mike has already pointed out one of those deals to you, which you would have seen had you bothered to read it further, as opposed to trying to score points as an 'impartial observor'.

You're asking me, a remainer, to explain the reasons for why people did something I fundamentally disagree with. Despite this, I gave a list of reasons, some of them related to immigration, some not. Pretty much all of them I personally disagree with (or at least don't think they're worth the price). But they're there.

Whether you choose to even bother accepting them or go down some weird rabbit hole where you spend days bending over backwards trying to prove Europeans and non Europeans are on an equal footing or not in the EU and making up silly straw men arguments is of course your prerogative.

This thread mostly goes round in circles, where you come in, bemoan how stupid the decision was (it is) in a totally un constructive way. Ask questions I don't believe you really want an answer to. Everyone talks about how the UK is about to become Somalia. And we repeat ad infinitum.

For the most part, I don't bother getting involved because I don't have the time and because I'm still partly distraught at what's happening. I foolishly answer a question in good faith and end up in a multi day discussion over whether Indians (or let's say... Syrians...) have the same opportunities to work in the EU as Europeans do or not.
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africanspur said:
It helps them by putting them on a level playing field to the Europeans. That is what they wanted. Not to be automatically disadvantaged when applying for a job in the UK compared to a European.

Their thinking is that currently, if they want a job in the UK, they have to compete (at a disadvantage) compared to British and European applicants. Now they are on a level field with the Europeans.
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The people applying for a job in the UK voted in the referendum to leave the EU? - not possible -
They are competing at an unfair disadvantage with British and European applicants - how did voters in the UK (British citizens) have an unfair disadvantage with other British citizens or European citzens? No sense if they are already British citizens.

Yes I do understand that their relatives voted to prevent Europeans under the same circumstances coming to the UK so that their relatives might come instead. Another problem with that is that non-EU immigrants were rising long before the referendum and only dipped during May's "hostile environment" but is not related to EU immigration which btw has also risen recently, probably to get in before it's too late. What was the plan for British citizens with the unfair advantage?

I missed the Korean agreement but saw the Iceland/Norway agreement has been cancelled.
As Mike said and I also said the Uk could negotiate, sign and ratify international agreements during the transition period.
The others seemed to have been signed before the WA and PD were signed and thus before the transition period. Some investigation needed.
 
Paul the Wolf said:
The people applying for a job in the UK voted in the referendum to leave the EU? - not possible -
They are competing at an unfair disadvantage with British and European applicants - how did voters in the UK (British citizens) have an unfair disadvantage with other British citizens or European citzens? No sense if they are already British citizens.

Yes I do understand that their relatives voted to prevent Europeans under the same circumstances coming to the UK so that their relatives might come instead. Another problem with that is that non-EU immigrants were rising long before the referendum and only dipped during May's "hostile environment" but is not related to EU immigration which btw has also risen recently, probably to get in before it's too late. What was the plan for British citizens with the unfair advantage?

I missed the Korean agreement but saw the Iceland/Norway agreement has been cancelled.
As Mike said and I also said the Uk could negotiate, sign and ratify international agreements during the transition period.
The others seemed to have been signed before the WA and PD were signed and thus before the transition period. Some investigation needed.
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NO. They did not. Some Indians and Pakistanis, who are now naturalised British citizens, but who are ethnically, culturally, linguistically Indian and Pakistani, voted in the EU to open the door, in the future to allow more Indians and Pakistanis in.

To give a short list, as we've already gone over this but you've brought it up again, having not understood the last time:
  • No, it isn't the recent immigrants who voted to leave but those who have been here a while and now hold British nationality
  • No, these Indian origin people don't want to kick out Europeans
  • Yes, they are now British citizens
  • They are not the ones at a disadvantage compared to Europeans. It is prospective arrivals who are at a disadvantage. Which I've already told you I've experienced personally, both myself and with my wife's family, if you could get out of point scoring mode for just one second.
  • When they first arrived, they were at a disadvantage.

There is no plan for British citizens with an unfair advantage. Just as there is no plan for France, China, USA, Canada, Italy, Chile or Japan. Pretty much every country, rightly or wrongly, imposes some kind of blocks on immigration and provides an advantage for its own citizens. It is why we don't have free movement across the world. It is why the EU doesn't allow free movement of all 7 billion people and why some of their member states are currently teargassing and trying to drown Syrian refugees.

Also, again false. EU net immigration is at its lowest level for 13 years. Gross arrivals from the EU are lowest since 2013. Though its a wonder any of them would want to get in 'before its too late' if the racist UK and its racist population with its racist government is about to become a wasteland of employee rights?

And yes of course May's policy was scummy. As I said though, net migration from the EU has been rising steadily since 2013 (despite the policy) and gross migration is the highest since the 70s.

So, as I said, whether their reason is stupid or not, they are pretty much getting their wish. That has literally been my point the entire time.
 
africanspur said:
NO. They did not. Some Indians and Pakistanis, who are now naturalised British citizens, but who are ethnically, culturally, linguistically Indian and Pakistani, voted in the EU to open the door, in the future to allow more Indians and Pakistanis in.

To give a short list, as we've already gone over this but you've brought it up again, having not understood the last time:
  • No, it isn't the recent immigrants who voted to leave but those who have been here a while and now hold British nationality
  • No, these Indian origin people don't want to kick out Europeans
  • Yes, they are now British citizens
  • They are not the ones at a disadvantage compared to Europeans. It is prospective arrivals who are at a disadvantage. Which I've already told you I've experienced personally, both myself and with my wife's family, if you could get out of point scoring mode for just one second.
  • When they first arrived, they were at a disadvantage.

There is no plan for British citizens with an unfair advantage. Just as there is no plan for France, China, USA, Canada, Italy, Chile or Japan. Pretty much every country, rightly or wrongly, imposes some kind of blocks on immigration and provides an advantage for its own citizens. It is why we don't have free movement across the world. It is why the EU doesn't allow free movement of all 7 billion people and why some of their member states are currently teargassing and trying to drown Syrian refugees.

Also, again false. EU net immigration is at its lowest level for 13 years. Gross arrivals from the EU are lowest since 2013. Though its a wonder any of them would want to get in 'before its too late' if the racist UK and its racist population with its racist government is about to become a wasteland of employee rights?

And yes of course May's policy was scummy. As I said though, net migration from the EU has been rising steadily since 2013 (despite the policy) and gross migration is the highest since the 70s.

So, as I said, whether their reason is stupid or not, they are pretty much getting their wish. That has literally been my point the entire time.
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Yes I do understand what you're saying and have all along. I quoted what you wrote but you still ignore what you said originally plus my original question was "a reason not connected with foreigners"
You don't consider Commonwealth citizens at an unfair disadvantage when they got British passports until the UK decided to stop it.
However, EU net immigration rose in the latest figures but yes had been falling since 2015. You missed it, came out a week or so ago.

By the way some of the EU member states or ex-member states were part of the reason the refugees are trying to come in the first place , maybe they could take in some refugees.

Anyway Truss is at the wheel, so you should be in safe hands.
 
Paul the Wolf said:
Yes I do understand what you're saying and have all along. I quoted what you wrote but you still ignore what you said originally plus my original question was "a reason not connected with foreigners"
You don't consider Commonwealth citizens at an unfair disadvantage when they got British passports until the UK decided to stop it.
However, EU net immigration rose in the latest figures but yes had been falling since 2015. You missed it, came out a week or so ago.

By the way some of the EU member states or ex-member states were part of the reason the refugees are trying to come in the first place , maybe they could take in some refugees.

Anyway Truss is at the wheel, so you should be in safe hands.
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Just because you quote what I wrote, does not mean that you understood it. You have not shown an understanding of it at all.

I have given reasons not connected with foreigners, including the perception of there being less red tape post Brexit, the dislike of supranational bodies overall, some peoples' preference for more local governance and the feeling that, while they could talk to and impact their MP's position on topics, there was absolutely no equivalent in the EU parliament. Some people on the left who feel that the EU absolutely screwed the likes of Greece, Italy and Spain during the financial crash and don't want to be part of what they see as a supranational corporate system. And so on and so forth.

Again, you can disagree with those reasons ( I pretty much do) but I provided more than a few reasons that don't boil down to 'Oh I hate Mariusz or Jorge'.

Jesus christ, again with the making up of strawmen arguments I've literally never uttered. When did I say this? Yes, I would consider that an unfair disadvantage as well. Unlike you, I can bring myself to criticise the place I live in.

Another thing I find funny is that you are talking to me as if I am Mr Middle England and can't seem to adjust your debate style or your discussion points away from that. The commonwealth point seems lifted straight out of a conversation with a little Englander, where you're trying to get one over on them for supporting the commonwealth rather than the EU and want a return to empire. As opposed to you talking to someone who hails from Africa, came to the UK as a refugee and won asylum and am married to a half Egyptian, half Dutch woman. I'm struggling to understand where you think it fits into this conversation?

Yep, I'd love it if the UK took in more refugees. Unsurprising considering I was one! And have worked with refugees, in the UK previously and including quite recently in Greece as well. Would be great if European countries (including the UK) didn't do stuff like fire tear gas at them though and try to sink them too. It would be really really great. It would also be great if, in the first sign of trouble with reorganising these refugees around Europe, South Eastern Europe didn't shut up shop and the UK didn't act like asses and refuse to take their share too.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...t-level-brexit-ons-figures-work-a9362531.html

You'll have to help me with the figures then, this article from 4 days ago said the EU net migration is the lowest its been for 16 years

Thankfully, unlike you Paul, I've never even thought to give any party left of the Labour party my vote so feel no need to defend the buffoons who hold power currently.
 
With the latest news from Greece the real sadness for me is that those who voted for brexit for ’immigrant’ reasons will be convinced that their stance was correct particularly as without doubt the possibility of up to 4 million refugees entering the EU will present huge problems for some member states. Worrying times. :confused:
 
Virgil said:
With the latest news from Greece the real sadness for me is that those who voted for brexit for ’immigrant’ reasons will be convinced that their stance was correct particularly as without doubt the possibility of up to 4 million refugees entering the EU will present huge problems for some member states. Worrying times. :confused:
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Seems a logical conclusion to draw.
 
africanspur said:
There is literally no point. The government website has it all, in black and white, and he still argues otherwise.
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Sorry was away yesterday but after a little investigation - all these were signed before the UK left the EU and were just copy and paste efforts substituting UK for EU.

They seemed to be signed in the event that the UK crashed out without a deal and prevent reverting to WTO rules (hope Brexiters are happy with that) and have nothing directly to do with the WA or transition period . Hence the Iceland/Norway deal was cancelled but if no negotiations are completed during the transition period they would come into force when it ended. Believe the UK had to wait for the SA one to be finalised by the EU before they could copy and paste. So the reason I was supposed to be wrong isn't the reason, as I said. Legal expertise needed.

Digging a little deeper into the Korean one as it's the only one of significant amount and seen some views of various trade experts who have reviewed it, as I said it's just copy and paste and intended for the whole EU rather than individual countries which could possibly mean that the UK won't reach the TRQ's to benefit and there are some issues with rules of origin being disputed by the EU, should be interesting. Thus as it is not a bespoke deal for the UK there are due to be talks between the UK and Korea during the transition period for a proper FTA.
Same applies to the others but not all are FTA's but have some elements of trade within them.

More smoke and mirrors and half-truths but seem to have served their purpose.
Now they do actually have to start negotiating by themselves.

On the other points, thanks for the information, but to clarify I did not think you didn't vote remain, nor have I voted communist but had voted for all three major parties in the UK but not during this century and the stats were December not September released on 27 Feb but can't now find but maybe I imagined them but not really important. Some commendable mental gymnastics too.
 
Paul the Wolf said:
Sorry was away yesterday but after a little investigation - all these were signed before the UK left the EU and were just copy and paste efforts substituting UK for EU.

They seemed to be signed in the event that the UK crashed out without a deal and prevent reverting to WTO rules (hope Brexiters are happy with that) and have nothing directly to do with the WA or transition period . Hence the Iceland/Norway deal was cancelled but if no negotiations are completed during the transition period they would come into force when it ended. Believe the UK had to wait for the SA one to be finalised by the EU before they could copy and paste. So the reason I was supposed to be wrong isn't the reason, as I said. Legal expertise needed.

Digging a little deeper into the Korean one as it's the only one of significant amount and seen some views of various trade experts who have reviewed it, as I said it's just copy and paste and intended for the whole EU rather than individual countries which could possibly mean that the UK won't reach the TRQ's to benefit and there are some issues with rules of origin being disputed by the EU, should be interesting. Thus as it is not a bespoke deal for the UK there are due to be talks between the UK and Korea during the transition period for a proper FTA.
Same applies to the others but not all are FTA's but have some elements of trade within them.

More smoke and mirrors and half-truths but seem to have served their purpose.
Now they do actually have to start negotiating by themselves.

On the other points, thanks for the information, but to clarify I did not think you didn't vote remain, nor have I voted communist but had voted for all three major parties in the UK but not during this century and the stats were December not September released on 27 Feb but can't now find but maybe I imagined them but not really important. Some commendable mental gymnastics too.
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What are the mental gymnastics you're seeing from me exactly?

Nobody has said that they were new, bespoke agreements. In fact, in the documents themselves, it says that they're just a continuation of the EU trade agreements.

Seeing as you think a failure to sign a trade agreement with the EU will leave the UK without any agreements. And seeing as you think the UK will potentially not be able to sign agreements at all if/ when it drifts away from EU regulatory standards, I'm wondering how you think South Korea manages to maintain FTA with the following economies:

EU
Canada
China
India
USA

Why would the agreement come into play if there was a no deal... And then not be valid later if a no deal happens?

Voted communist? Where on earth has that come from?

I guess we'll see in December and the following few years what happens. And I suppose it will delight you if everything does go wrong. Such is your impartiality on the matter of course. :)

Edit : Would be good to see those assessments by trade experts too. I'd like to read a bit about the post brexit trade prospects from experts. Thanks.
 
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africanspur said:
What are the mental gymnastics you're seeing from me exactly?

Nobody has said that they were new, bespoke agreements. In fact, in the documents themselves, it says that they're just a continuation of the EU trade agreements.

Seeing as you think a failure to sign a trade agreement with the EU will leave the UK without any agreements. And seeing as you think the UK will potentially not be able to sign agreements at all if/ when it drifts away from EU regulatory standards, I'm wondering how you think South Korea manages to maintain FTA with the following economies:

EU
Canada
China
India
USA

Why would the agreement come into play if there was a no deal... And then not be valid later if a no deal happens?

Voted communist? Where on earth has that come from?

I guess we'll see in December and the following few years what happens. And I suppose it will delight you if everything does go wrong. Such is your impartiality on the matter of course. :)
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africanspur said:
Thankfully, unlike you Paul, I've never even thought to give any party left of the Labour party my vote
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Communist?;)

Think you've missed the point again.
Yes we all know they are continuation of EU agreements. And I haven't said any of the rest you said. I said they haven't negotiated any deals yet other than continuity copy and paste agreements which were signed whilst as a member of the EU ie not during the transition period and or in relation to the WA.
What I said was I wanted to know how they managed to do so and maybe some legal expert can advise.

I get the message, don't criticise the UK government.
 
Covid 19 in the UK will be a preview of life in 2021, particularly in regards to supermarkets being low on stock. Bojo will peddle some mantra like "we survived corona, and we'll survive this!" Any economic downturn can be attributed to the virus and not Brexit. Brexiters will probably say that the economy is doing bad because of corona and it's affecting to all of Europe.

I think this crisis could work out in his favour and spare Boris' blushes.
 
Sir Iain Duncan Smith, the former Conservative leader, held a debate on this in Westminster Hall this morning and he said Huawei should be excluded from the 5G network within three years. He said:

We’re in a mess and the only way to get out of that mess is ... to ensure that Huawei reduces from its present position not to 35% that the government wants but simply down to 0%. I recognise that may take a little bit of time but I say in the next two to three years that should be the purpose of the government.
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Can I just simply say, imagine in 1939 had we been we developing our radar systems, we decided actually to have one of the Nazi companies in Germany involved directly in doing it. This is the level. ‘Oh, but we reduced to the 35% of the involvement, so only 35% was controlled by them.’ I wonder how ridiculous that is.

New negotiating strategy from UK. Truss, Eustice and now IDS - threaten and insult your prospective trade partners.
 
The Ryanair chief was less worried about the Brexit negotiations, as he believes the EU will get exactly what it wants because "the Brits have no negotiating f*cking power."

"This will finish in only two ways," O'Leary said. "The British walk away, in which case they'll be abandoned and there will be no food in the supermarket f*cking shelves. There will be riots in the streets and [Prime Minister Boris] Johnson will be out of power."

"Or they will roll over at the end of the day ... they will sell whatever deal they can f*cking do."
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https://www.politico.eu/article/ryanair-boss-curses-eus-geopolitical-ambitions/
 
Paul the Wolf said:
Sir Iain Duncan Smith, the former Conservative leader, held a debate on this in Westminster Hall this morning and he said Huawei should be excluded from the 5G network within three years. He said:


Can I just simply say, imagine in 1939 had we been we developing our radar systems, we decided actually to have one of the Nazi companies in Germany involved directly in doing it. This is the level. ‘Oh, but we reduced to the 35% of the involvement, so only 35% was controlled by them.’ I wonder how ridiculous that is.

New negotiating strategy from UK. Truss, Eustice and now IDS - threaten and insult your prospective trade partners.
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What did you expect? He's thick as pig shit.

Comparing China to Nazis. fecking hell Iain, lay off the sauce.
 
horsechoker said:
Covid 19 in the UK will be a preview of life in 2021, particularly in regards to supermarkets being low on stock. Bojo will peddle some mantra like "we survived corona, and we'll survive this!" Any economic downturn can be attributed to the virus and not Brexit. Brexiters will probably say that the economy is doing bad because of corona and it's affecting to all of Europe.

I think this crisis could work out in his favour and spare Boris' blushes.
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I was thinking exactly the same thing and about to post that but you beat me to it.

This government will (like the rest) spin any outcome to their own advantage.
Covid19 gives them a perfect scapegoat.
 
Buster15 said:
I was thinking exactly the same thing and about to post that but you beat me to it.

This government will (like the rest) spin any outcome to their own advantage.
Covid19 gives them a perfect scapegoat.
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Someone at work said that this proves immigration is a problem, because if nobody travelled to and from other places the virus wouldn't have spread. Technically he wasn't wrong, but his whole argument for closing our borders was let down by the fact that all his clothes were made in China and he drives a German car.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Someone at work said that this proves immigration is a problem, because if nobody travelled to and from other places the virus wouldn't have spread. Technically he wasn't wrong, but his whole argument for closing our borders was let down by the fact that all his clothes were made in China and he drives a German car.
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AIDS wouldn't be a problem if nobody shagged.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Someone at work said that this proves immigration is a problem, because if nobody travelled to and from other places the virus wouldn't have spread. Technically he wasn't wrong, but his whole argument for closing our borders was let down by the fact that all his clothes were made in China and he drives a German car.
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Exactly that.
Honestly. The sheer naivity of some people is beyond comprehension. I could have used more colourful language.

China is responsible for over a quarter of global manufacturing. I wonder where his mobile phone was made..
 
Buster15 said:
Exactly that.
Honestly. The sheer naivity of some people is beyond comprehension. I could have used more colourful language.

China is responsible for over a quarter of global manufacturing. I wonder where his mobile phone was made..
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I actually asked him that once and he told me straight faced "Carphone Warehouse".

This guy is a manager ffs.
 
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-fishing-brexit-vessels-protect-a9374496.html

The environment secretary has warned the EU that the UK has taken “sufficient” steps to protect its waters after Brexit, as fears grow of a French blockade.

The royal navy boasts three extra vessels, the Home Office will provide a further four and the government can call in help from the private sector, George Eustice said.

A new control centre has been launched, 50 extra fishery protection officers have been recruited and there will be “aerial surveillance”, a House of Lords inquiry was told.

“We have significantly increased our enforcement capability,” Mr Eustice said, adding: “We think that is sufficient.”

The extra muscle was set out after the controversy of access for EU boats emerged as a key dispute in the post-Brexit trade talks, with Brussels demanding an agreement by the end of June.
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Gerrov our fish!!
 
NWRed said:
As if the initial comment wasn't enough, now it's attack the person instead of addressing the point.
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You have to be thick skinned to join in this thread - ffs, I should know.

You made a comment about my post and, by inference, about me.

I made a comment about some of your posts, and by inference, about you.

Something wrong with that ?
 
Full bodied red said:
You have to be thick skinned to join in this thread - ffs, I should know.

You made a comment about my post and, by inference, about me.

I made a comment about some of your posts, and by inference, about you.

Something wrong with that ?
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Don’t you ever get tired of being the way you are?
 
Virgil said:
Playing devils advocate. Taken over a timescale of several years 4 billion against 350 million per week becomes feck all
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Yes, that’s the basic maths of it which would be fantastic if the £350m a week existed. Then you’ve got the small matter of trillions wiped off the economy and the divorce bill.

We are objectively worse off.
 
Pexbo said:
Yes, that’s the basic maths of it which would be fantastic if the £350m a week existed. Then you’ve got the small matter of trillions wiped off the economy and the divorce bill.

We are objectively worse off.
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Yes that’s the basic flaw in the argument but again playing devils advocate where are these trillions wiped off the economy. Originally that was going to happen once we voted to leave the EU. Then the goalposts were moved to say that we were still in the EU as our politicians for 3 years could not make a decision. Now we have left the EU the goalposts have been moved again to the end of December 2020 or perhaps beyond. For a simpleton such as myself it’s impossible to isolate fact from fiction.:rolleyes:
 
711 said:
No one on the entire forum goes on about the history of the British empire more than you devilish. If anyone is living in the past it is most definitely you. :)
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He mentioned Napoleon. Not me.

All I said is that if the French are cut off English waters then they will retaliate and sure as hell they have the means to make the British pay. For example, by having supply in and out of the UK move at snail pace can really hurt the farming industry and any other industry relying on near real time supply chain. Not to forget that all that fish needs to be sold somewhere and high tariffs cause of WTO rules will really hurt the sector. Then there's of course financial passporting. The UK will be relying on equivalence to make its financial sector work within the UK and France is a big player in the EU. What if it uses its clout alongside those who will be hit by this (Holland etc) to constantly change the game? Ah that would hurt. So its really worth all this hassle for a tiny industry that represent just 0.1% of UK's GDP?

The difference between the 19th century and now is that most of Europe will want France (erm the EU) to win not the UK.
 
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devilish said:
He mentioned Napoleon. Not me.

All I said is that if the French are cut off English waters then they will retaliate and sure as hell they have the means to make the British pay. For example, by having supply in and out of the UK move at snail pace can really hurt the farming industry and any other industry relying on near real time supply chain. Not to forget that all that fish needs to be sold somewhere and high tariffs cause of WTO rules will really hurt the sector. Then there's of course financial passporting. The UK will be relying on equivalence to make its financial sector work within the UK and France is a big player in the EU. What if it uses its clout alongside those who will be hit by this (Holland etc) to constantly change the game? Ah that would hurt. So its really worth all this hassle for a tiny industry that represent just 0.1% of UK's GDP?

The difference between the 19th century and now is that most of Europe will want France (erm the EU) to win not the UK.
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Its UK waters, the UN statute is clear the UK decides on matters in its EEZ. If the EU wants to try and coerce the UK into giving access I guess it can try to do so.

You have to make your mind up though, is it such a trifling little industry that you want to blow trade worth 65 billion a year net to the EU to secure an EU right to set quotas it doesn't have a right to have a say in? Rather than let the countries involved sort it out themselves under the UN remit.

All your posts these days are over the top ill thought out threats and wet dreams about how the UK should be /could be treated post Brexit. Personally I can't see the Dutch wanting to close Eindhoven in the new Devilish inspired continental system but I might be wrong.
 
Don't Kill Bill said:
Its UK waters, the UN statute is clear the UK decides on matters in its EEZ. If the EU wants to try and coerce the UK into giving access I guess it can try to do so.

You have to make your mind up though, is it such a trifling little industry that you want to blow trade worth 65 billion a year net to the EU to secure an EU right to set quotas it doesn't have a right to have a say in? Rather than let the countries involved sort it out themselves under the UN remit.

All your posts these days are over the top ill thought out threats and wet dreams about how the UK should be /could be treated post Brexit. Personally I can't see the Dutch wanting to close Eindhoven in the new Devilish inspired continental system but I might be wrong.
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Fishing rights are politically charged and will probably play a larger symbolic part of negotiations than the pure economics would dictate... Essentially a proxy issue for a bigger pissing contest.

I'm sure the SNP will also be politicing the sell out of Scottish fishing waters by Westminster (even though ironically they want to remain in the EU)

It shouldn't be insurmountable as an issue in the context of a broader deal but will probably involve a lot of rethoric and some creative language / spin at the end so both sides can say they won

Probably some "joint mechanism" for agreeing quotas and then EU fishermen get acces to our waters... We get access to theirs and no tariff access to each others markets... UK spin it that with the joint mechanism we decide if our EU friends play by our rules they can continue to fish ... EU spins it as no change other than there needs to be a joint mechanism to rubber-stamp EU policy because the UK has chosen to leave and take rules not partake in making rules (presumably with some system of implementing fines in each other when rules are inevitably broken on both sides but that's a few years away)

The brexit mob will sing rule Britannia and remoaners like me will call it out as bullshit
 
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