The RedCafe Boxing Thread

[ivaldo]

I don't see that at all. Wilder even shook his head to let him know this. He knew Ortiz had a limited gas tank and allowed him to gradually gas over the first 9 rounds while softening up his head here and there throughout to where when he did land, Ortiz had difficulty taking it.

Yeah he shook his head as he was staggering backwards after almost hitting the deck. Boxers do that all the while, it doesn’t mean he wasn’t hurt, otherwise he wouldn’t have been desperately trying to clinch and wobbling around all over the place.

Regardless, this doesn’t take away how he struggled against a bloke that was born in the 70s ffs.

Despite being taller, faster and far far younger he still really struggled to avoid Ortiz’s laboured attacks. How’s he going to fare against someone like Joshua when he comes after him? You’re massively overrating Wilders ability here.

 

[Irrational.]

Wilder v AJ preview

I raise you a preview of Canelo-GGG:

 

[Raoul]

Yeah he shook his head as he was staggering backwards after almost hitting the deck. Boxers do that all the while, it doesn’t mean he wasn’t hurt, otherwise he wouldn’t have been desperately trying to clinch and wobbling around all over the place.

Regardless, this doesn’t take away how he struggled against a bloke that was born in the 70s ffs.

Despite being taller, faster and far far younger he still really struggled to avoid Ortiz’s laboured attacks. How’s he going to fare against someone like Joshua when he comes after him? You’re massively overrating Wilders ability here.

He didn't hit the deck though and came out fresh after the bell, which isn't exactly the demeanor of someone who was on the cusp of getting stopped by TKO. Wilder knew exactly how much time was left in the round and rather than mount some sort of response, just allowed Ortiz to punch himself out. If Ortiz, one of the hardest punchers in the game, wasn't able to fell Wilder then I think we can safely assume his chin will be fine against other top opponents.

Also, I don't know what being born in the 70s has feck all to do with anything. Klitschko is significantly older and just felled AJ when they fought and AJ is being touted to possibly fight Povetkin who .......wait for it.....was also born in the 70s.

 

[Raoul]

I raise you a preview of Canelo-GGG:

Forgot about that one.

 

[ivaldo]

He didn't hit the deck though and came out fresh after the bell, which isn't exactly the demeanor of someone who was on the cusp of getting stopped by TKO. Wilder knew exactly how much time was left in the round and rather than mount some sort of response, just allowed Ortiz to punch himself out. If Ortiz, one of the hardest punchers in the game, wasn't able to fell Wilder then I think we can safely assume his chin will be fine against other top opponents.

Also, I don't know what being born in the 70s has feck all to do with anything. Klitschko is significantly older and just felled AJ when they fought and AJ is being touted to possibly fight Povetkin who .......wait for it.....was also born in the 70s.

Just because he didn’t hit the deck doesnt mean he wasn’t hurt. Stumbling around and missing with attempts to clinch is hardly the demeanour of a boxer who isn’t in trouble either, is it? That’s a boxer who doesn’t have a clear enough head to defend himself properly.

Because he’s nearly 40 and has already had over 350 fights, and wasn’t a top class professional boxer even in his prime. Come on, the comparisons to Klitschko, who actually had pedigree, are crazy. There’s a reason Wlad retired: it’s because age caught up with him. Yeah, that Povetkin who was in trouble against Price. We could also bring into the discussion Browne who is ancient too, who lost to Whyte (a man who Wilder is actively ducking). Are you seeing a theme here?

 

[Andersons Dietician]

Therein lies the misdiagnosis imo. Wilder's style is viewed as lacking in fundamentals and therefore he is vulnerable against a fighter who fights as we think a great fighter should. I think we have to look at Wilder and throw out all the conventional wisdom about technique and simply ask ourselves whether we think he can land a solid punch on whichever opponent he is fighting, as that will tell us whether or not the opponent can escape getting knocked out.

I get what your saying but I don’t really agree, there is a reason why people speak of good technique and why it’s so important, it’s tried and tested over hundreds of years. If you can throw a shorter tighter punch it’ll land quicker than the large looping shots that Wilder throws. Example Ricky Hatton getting knocked out by Mayweather, that check hook was a thing of beauty. Ricky springs in recklessly and Mayweather times it. That’s the same sort of stuff Wilder does.

You mention this can he land a solid punch, can AJ land a solid punch they both hit hard. Difference unlike Ortiz, AJ will/should have the energy to close the fight if he doesn’t end it in one. After getting rocked by Ortiz, Wilder took the next round off trying to recover from it as he was still on wobbly legs. If Ortiz had the gas he would have pressed the issue and just beaten Wilder in to submission. Wilder is easily hittable, in a way his style is reminiscent of a knock off Naseem and we saw what happened when Naseem went up and took on people with good fundamentals.

I watched a Wilder fight yesterday when he is fighting a guy who looks more like a Sumo wrestler than boxer, he had T-Rex arm syndrome from the looks of it. Rocks Wilder with a nothing punch. Wilder just has a punchers chance and that is it for me. I do think AJ will finish him under 6 rounds. I think a lot of boxers would. Parker,Whyte,Povotkin heck even Bellew.

I just want to see this fight get made ASAP tho, it’s an intresting fight. I kinda feel Wilder will want to avoid AJ as long as he can and will probably not agree to the fight later this year. Then we’ll get all the boxing politics and so on and it’ll be a year or 2 before it can be made again.

 

[Raoul]

Just because he didn’t hit the deck doesnt mean he wasn’t hurt. Stumbling around and missing with attempts to clinch is hardly the demeanour of a boxer who isn’t in trouble either, is it? That’s a boxer who doesn’t have a clear enough head to defend himself properly.

Because he’s nearly 40 and has already had over 350 fights, and wasn’t a top class professional boxer even in his prime. Come on, the comparisons to Klitschko, who actually had pedigree, are crazy. There’s a reason Wlad retired: it’s because age caught up with him. Yeah, that Povetkin who was in trouble against Price. We could also bring into the discussion Browne who is ancient too, who lost to Whyte (a man who Wilder is actively ducking). Are you seeing a theme here?

The point is you're making Ortiz out to look like some sort of scrub when he was widely viewed as a hard punching KO artist with decent chance of beating Wilder. Ultimately being 38/39 isn't a problem as long as you have the cardio and training to back it up like Wlad has had, but not necessarily Ortiz, who is chunkier and more prone to gassing. Being perceived as having limited cardio is a weakness that most opponents will obviously attempt to exploit as Wilder did.

 

[Raoul]

I get what your saying but I don’t really agree, there is a reason why people speak of good technique and why it’s so important, it’s tried and tested over hundreds of years. If you can throw a shorter tighter punch it’ll land quicker than the large looping shots that Wilder throws. Example Ricky Hatton getting knocked out by Mayweather, that check hook was a thing of beauty. Ricky springs in recklessly and Mayweather times it. That’s the same sort of stuff Wilder does.

You mention this can he land a solid punch, can AJ land a solid punch they both hit hard. Difference unlike Ortiz, AJ will/should have the energy to close the fight if he doesn’t end it in one. After getting rocked by Ortiz, Wilder took the next round off trying to recover from it as he was still on wobbly legs. If Ortiz had the gas he would have pressed the issue and just beaten Wilder in to submission. Wilder is easily hittable, in a way his style is reminiscent of a knock off Naseem and we saw what happened when Naseem went up and took on people with good fundamentals.

I watched a Wilder fight yesterday when he is fighting a guy who looks more like a Sumo wrestler than boxer, he had T-Rex arm syndrome from the looks of it. Rocks Wilder with a nothing punch. Wilder just has a punchers chance and that is it for me. I do think AJ will finish him under 6 rounds. I think a lot of boxers would. Parker,Whyte,Povotkin heck even Bellew.

I just want to see this fight get made ASAP tho, it’s an intresting fight. I kinda feel Wilder will want to avoid AJ as long as he can and will probably not agree to the fight later this year. Then we’ll get all the boxing politics and so on and it’ll be a year or 2 before it can be made again.

I don't see why Wilder would be in any way incentivized to duck Joshua when its the latter who has a majority of the belts that Wilder obviously wants. The real problem in all of this would be if AJ fights Povetkin and gets knocked the feck out, at which point we would be back to square one in all of this.

 

[ivaldo]

The point is you're making Ortiz out to look like some sort of scrub when he was widely viewed as hard punching KO artiest with dec chance of beating Wilder. Ultimately being 38/39 isn't a problem as long as you have the cardio and training to back it up like Wlad has had, but not necessarily Ortiz, who is chunkier and more prone to gassing. Being perceived as having limited cardio is a weakness that most opponents will obviously attempt to exploit as Wilder did.

Precisely. The vast majority of boxers aren’t still in the ring at 40, and the ones who are competitive are freaks of nature: like Wlad, like Hopkins.

Ortiz, a boxer who has gone more rounds than any of them, is categorically not in the same league as those aforementioned boxers. So to have Wilder struggle against him - and he did - should raise alarm bells. Despite your refusal to believe so the vast majority of reports and writers who witnessed the fight, believe Wilder was hurt. He didn’t going to get those opportunities to record against Joshua. This was Wilders first decent (not top class) opponent and he was outboxed and wobbled up until the point Ortiz’s age became a critical factor.

 

[Raoul]

Precisely. The vast majority of boxers aren’t still in the ring at 40, and the ones who are competitive are freaks of nature: like Wlad, like Hopkins.

Ortiz, a boxer who has gone more rounds than any of them, is categorically not in the same league as those aforementioned boxers. So to have Wilder struggle against him - and he did - should raise alarm bells. Despite your refusal to believe so the vast majority of reports and writers who witnessed the fight, believe Wilder was hurt. He didn’t going to get those opportunities to record against Joshua. This was Wilders first decent (not top class) opponent and he was outboxed and wobbled up until the point Ortiz’s age became a critical factor.

I just don't think Wilder struggled at all any more than AJ "struggled" against Klitschko. In both instances, they were up against very good competition and it was a proper fight. Wilder clearly made it his strategy to absorb Ortiz's energy in the earlier rounds and then go to work in the latter ones. AJ and Klitschko each had varying strategies as well, but in both instances each fighter had his ups and downs during the fight because of the level of competition they faced.

 

[G-manc]

I don't follow boxing much these days. Are the people AJ has beaten any good and is he a good boxer and not a boxer looking good because his opponents suck...

Heavyweights suck. Poor skillsets and dubious fitness - i don't get the fascination.

AJ is the best of an awful bunch. He won at the weekend essentially throwing a one-two and has less angles than circle.

 

[ivaldo]

I just don't think Wilder struggled at all any more than AJ "struggled" against Klitschko. In both instances, they were up against very good competition and it was a proper fight. Wilder clearly made it his strategy to absorb Ortiz's energy in the earlier rounds and then go to work in the latter ones. AJ and Klitschko each had varying strategies as well, but in both instances each fighter had his ups and downs during the fight because of the level of competition they faced.

Come on, Klitschko was on a completely different level to Ortiz. The man was the second longest ever reigning heavyweight champion (longest combined) and still had the physique of Adonis in his 40s. Ortiz hadn’t had a professional fight until he was 30 and his toughest oppponent up until Wilder was, what, Tony Thompson? Ortiz is a good fighter but it’s simply not comparable.

 

[Andersons Dietician]

I don't see why Wilder would be in any way incentivized to duck Joshua when its the latter who has a majority of the belts that Wilder obviously wants. The real problem in all of this would be if AJ fights Povetkin and gets knocked the feck out, at which point we would be back to square one in all of this.

Because the belt makes him relevant. He has a very poor following. If AJ loses, he’ll be fine, he has a massive following, if Wilder loses then he likely becomes the next Hasim Rahman. He either wants a massive money incentive from AJ’s camp or he doesn’t want it at all. He can easily just demand whatever then when AJ’s camp refuse to meet it then say he’s ducking me.

If he really wanted it then he should have been at the fight Saturday to show he was serious. Anyway hope they can sort it out and Wilder isn’t running so we can just watch it and see what happens.

Edit: weird coincidence I just went in to the MMA thread and saw you’ve referenced Rahman.

 

[Raoul]

Come on, Klitschko was on a completely different level to Ortiz. The man was the second longest ever reigning heavyweight champion (longest combined) and still had the physique of Adonis in his 40s. Ortiz hadn’t had a professional fight until he was 30 and his toughest oppponent up until Wilder was, what, Tony Thompson? Ortiz is a good fighter but it’s simply not comparable.

I'm not knocking Klitschko at all. Just making the obvious statement that Ortiz came into the Wilder fight with very good credentials to where various pundits seemed to think he should win the fight. What Klitschko or Ortiz did before these fights and what their physiques looked like are totally different topics.

 

[ivaldo]

I'm not knocking Klitschko at all. Just making the obvious statement that Ortiz came into the Wilder fight with very good credentials to where various pundits seemed to think he should win the fight. What Klitschko or Ortiz did before these fights and what their physiques looked like are totally different topics.

I don't think so. I think it's very relevant to how we view these performances. Having a bloke who has never beaten any top class fighters and, as you say wasnt in any condition to last a full 12 rounds, and then another who will go down as one of the all time greats shows you are incomparable the two are. People didn't think Ortiz had a real chance because he was some great boxer, it was because Wilder had sod all on his record in terms of names and is hugely lacking in many areas. Being outboxed and wobbled by a 2nd tier boxer approaching retirement doesn't put those doubts to bed.

 

[Inter Yer Nan]

Any kind of Boxing skill is going to outbox Wilder. Wilder has no ring IQ, awful footwork and poor technique. His power in his right hand is an equalizer though and gives him an extra 20/30% chance. Joshua can win 6 rounds easy then walk into one. That said if Joshua fights a measured pace and disciplined behind his jab his power and what he'll be able to land on Wilder (as opposed to Parker who's much better defensively and more skilled) should be enough if he doesn't go crazy following up for the KO.

 

[Inter Yer Nan]

It's kind of funny that Wilder is an inch taller but will still be giving up two stone in weight. And of course, fundamentally, Joshua is a much better boxer. Easy night for him, in my opinion. Wilder has a puncher's chance but that's about it.

I agree with your assessment but a punchers chance in the Heavyweight division is a lot more than any other division. If you put these two fighters in Welterweights bodies I'd be 95% for Joshua but I think it's around a 70/30 fight in Joshua's favor. He's a big puncher himself and Wilder is vulnerable.

 

[Kag]

Wilder isn't beating Whyte or Povetkin, never mind Joshua.

 

[Inter Yer Nan]

Wilder isn't beating Whyte or Povetkin, never mind Joshua.

I don't see him beating Povetkin. Whyte I'd give a 40% chance. He'd outbox Wilder but could and probably would walk into one.

I think Parker would box his ears off and not get tired.

 

[The Bloody-Nine]

In my opinion Povetkin would stop Wilder.

Whyte, I think Wilder probably stops him.

Parker, I think would probably decision him.

 

[Utdstar01]

Wilder isn't beating Whyte or Povetkin, never mind Joshua.

They'd all be very competitive fights imo, no doubt.

 

[Raoul]

 

[Raoul]

They'd all be very competitive fights imo, no doubt.

No doubt about it. Impossible to predict who would win.

 

[Fortitude]

No, it's shows the complete disregard I have for someone with the technique of Wilder.

Well of course it matters. He's got no chin, no defense and no boxing abilty to keep an accurate puncher at bay. Joshua isn't great defensively, but he's very good offensively. One properly landed punch and it's lights out for Wilder.

What dont you get?

Wilders has dynamite hands, so does Joshua. Joshuas defense is poor, so is Wilders. Joshua has a better shot armoury, a better jab, a slightly better chin, better accuracy, better balance, better footwork, better fight management, a better temperament. How is it even close?

Yea but you keep talking about technique in a fighter who essentially doesn't need it in such a flawed division as we see with the modern heavyweights; the one element of technique Joshua actually needs in this fight he doesn't have, which is head movement and reflexive motion. It brings the other elements you mentioned down because he can be displaying all of that for nigh on 90%+ of the fight and still get caught because he can't move - the way he leaves his head in place is perfect for a looping shot, which is about the only speciality Wilder has, wingy, off-balance and unorthodox, or not.

If Joshua opens up he's going to get caught, imo, not because Wilder's amazing, rather AJ will not get out of the way and he'll also expend energy he can't afford to and gas, which is kryptonite to someone who can't move even with a full tank. If he actually can keep Wilder on the end of his jab all night, it's by far the smartest thing for him to do.

 

[The Bloody-Nine]

Yea but you keep talking about technique in a fighter who essentially doesn't need it in such a flawed division as we see with the modern heavyweights; the one element of technique Joshua actually needs in this fight he doesn't have, which is head movement and reflexive motion. It brings the other elements you mentioned down because he can be displaying all of that for nigh on 90%+ of the fight and still get caught because he can't move - the way he leaves his head in place is perfect for a looping shot, which is about the only speciality Wilder has, wingy, off-balance and unorthodox, or not.

If Joshua opens up he's going to get caught, imo, not because Wilder's amazing, rather AJ will not get out of the way and he'll also expend energy he can't afford to and gas, which is kryptonite to someone who can't move even with a full tank. If he actually can keep Wilder on the end of his jab all night, it's by far the smartest thing for him to do.

Weird post. Joshua is a much better boxer than Wilder. If you accept that (and you should, if you have eyes) it means that Joshua is going to land punches on Wilder. First. Punches that Wilder, chinny and sloppy as he is, isn't going to be able to absorb.

Wilder doesn't have any kind of notable head movement, either. The guy struggled with Molina, FFS.

 

[Raoul]

Weird post. Joshua is a much better boxer than Wilder. If you accept that (and you should, if you have eyes) it means that Joshua is going to land punches on Wilder. First. Punches that Wilder, chinny and sloppy as he is, isn't going to be able to absorb.

Wilder doesn't have any kind of notable head movement, either. The guy struggled with Molina, FFS.

The conventional rules seem to get tossed out the window with Wilder. He on the surface appears to have considerable flaws in his game, but it doesn't seem to faze him in any way. He seems oddly in control of things even when the opponent seems to occasionally have him on the back foot. He sort of defies conventional analysis in this regard and his fights are easily reducible to whether or not you think he will make solid contact on his opponents head. That's far more informative than how well rounded a boxer we think he is.

 

[The Bloody-Nine]

The conventional rules seem to get tossed out the window with Wilder. He on the surface appears to have considerable flaws in his game, but it doesn't seem to faze him in any way. He seems oddly in control of things even when the opponent seems to occasionally have him on the back foot. He sort of defies conventional analysis in this regard and his fights are easily reducible to whether or not you think he will make solid contact on his opponents head. That's far more informative than how well rounded a boxer we think he is.

He has huge flaws in his game. He can punch, though, you can't take that away from him. And he's gotten away with it because of his height and reach. Those advantages vs Joshua aren't there. He's fighting a guy the same height as him, who outweighs him by 30 pounds, who hits as hard as him, who GOT UP after taking a straight right flush from Wlad, and a guy who is going to physically manhandle him and push him around the ring.

Outside of a puncher's chance, I don't see a case for Wilder winning. But hey, it's HW boxing so you never know.

 

[altodevil]

I don't think we will see Joshua reach perhaps his full potential as there just isn't anyone around to push him to another level.

 

[ivaldo]

Yea but you keep talking about technique in a fighter who essentially doesn't need it in such a flawed division as we see with the modern heavyweights; the one element of technique Joshua actually needs in this fight he doesn't have, which is head movement and reflexive motion. It brings the other elements you mentioned down because he can be displaying all of that for nigh on 90%+ of the fight and still get caught because he can't move - the way he leaves his head in place is perfect for a looping shot, which is about the only speciality Wilder has, wingy, off-balance and unorthodox, or not.

If Joshua opens up he's going to get caught, imo, not because Wilder's amazing, rather AJ will not get out of the way and he'll also expend energy he can't afford to and gas, which is kryptonite to someone who can't move even with a full tank. If he actually can keep Wilder on the end of his jab all night, it's by far the smartest thing for him to do.

Doesn't need technique based on what? His 40 fights against bums and journeyman? You so realise Ortiz is the only name of any significance on his record, don't you? And even then he came close to being put on his arse and was 2 rounds away from more than likely losing the fight on points. He hasn't come close to fighting a boxer of Joshua's quality. Joshua isn't going to bumble forward throwing overhand rights against a man a foot taller than he is. He's going to be throwing jabs, controlling the ring and catching Wilder with combinations. When Wilder throws a wild right that misses by a yard and has him hopping on one foot to regain balance, Joshua's going to be all over him.

To say technique doesn't matter is bizarre. And you seem to have forgotten Joshua has bombs for hands too and Wilder a glass chin. Guess what will determine who'll hand first and most frequent? Yup, all those traits you claim don't matter.

 

[Fortitude]

Weird post. Joshua is a much better boxer than Wilder. If you accept that (and you should, if you have eyes) it means that Joshua is going to land punches on Wilder. First. Punches that Wilder, chinny and sloppy as he is, isn't going to be able to absorb.

Wilder doesn't have any kind of notable head movement, either. The guy struggled with Molina, FFS.

OK let me explain my position with Wilder and him fighting conventional boxers as well as the logic that comes with it: common sense tells us that a conventional boxer who has been taught to throw punches along the best lines possible should meet his target first @Andersons Dietician made the point a few posts ago and it's spot on when two conventional boxers have the same aims from the same school of thought: technique is huge then.

When an unconventional boxer comes along with tools that get them to the top, the conventional boxer has to be much better in fundamentals to compensate or to negate whatever the unconventional boxer is getting by on, when it happens, the unconventional boxer's gravy train is pretty much over.

As far as I can see Joshua has an elite uppercut and everything else isn't at a tier where he negates Wilder's tools for people to be calling it a non-competitive bout.

A jab can be rolled with and a bomb fired back - Joshua's jab isn't this amazing weapon he controls fights with and he hasn't the stamina to throw it with conviction for an extended period of time so what I struggle with is the notion Joshua is just going to go in there and make light work of someone who legitimately throws bombs that need to be avoided at all costs whilst having no means of doing so. I think apart from being overly muscular, that lack of movement is the other reason some liken him to Bruno.

It's easy to say he'll stop stuff at source but he's not considerably faster and it's arguable he's faster at all and he doesn't have the juice in the tank to snap shots for extended periods of time.

I'd better understand the elevation of Joshua if he was showing linear progression post Klitschko, but he isn't, is he? The Takam fight wasn't impressive, I'm away so haven't seen the Parker fight, but the impression is it wasn't great either. The biggest issue is he's there to be hit and that, for me, is the equalizer between them and even more so when that vaunted extra weight causes the inevitable slowdown in the middle rounds and with even less intense output, you've got a huge immobile target.

Not going to mention Wilder as @Raoul has outlined nothing changes with him, but him being a joke when his potential opponent doesn't move is quite baffling.

 

[Fortitude]

Doesn't need technique based on what? His 40 fights against bums and journeyman? You so realise Ortiz is the only name of any significance on his record, don't you? And even then he came close to being put on his arse and was 2 rounds away from more than likely losing the fight on points. He hasn't come close to fighting a boxer of Joshua's quality. Joshua isn't going to bumble forward throwing overhand rights against a man a foot taller than he is. He's going to be throwing jabs, controlling the ring and catching Wilder with combinations. When Wilder throws a wild right that misses by a yard and has him hopping on one foot to regain balance, Joshua's going to be all over him.

To say technique doesn't matter is bizarre. And you seem to have forgotten Joshua has bombs for hands too and Wilder a glass chin. Guess what will determine who'll hand first and most frequent? Yup, all those traits you claim don't matter.

Just replied in other as I'd be saying the same thing twice.

Will say my focus is on Joshua' s failings whilst yours focus on Wilder's numerous ones which I'm not disputing.

 

[El General 1994]

@Inter Yer Nan

Views on this weekends action?

DeGale v Truax 2.

HURD V LARA

 

[Andersons Dietician]

@Fortitude he actually in the Parker fight showed quite good moment at getting in and out the way of shots, Parker at times charged at him and AJ just kept moving out the way of the shots. He was getting in putting in shots then stepping back out making Parker’s shots fall short. His jab looked quite good and was a weapon in this fight doing enough to keep Parker at bay or at least make him 2nd guess his approach.

Raul mentioned we need to throw out what we know because Wilder is unconventional. Personally, for me he isn’t unconventional he’s just not a very good boxer. However on the odd occasion I’ve been sparring, people who don’t really know what the hell they are doing are the ones that catch you with stupid shots. Often they aren’t good punches, powerful or even clean hits and watching Wilder that’s what he reminds me of. Like a guy in a Worldstar video.
There is obviously the chance that if AJ isn’t switched on to these leap in looping attacks he could take a shot but I think personally that is also Wilders biggest weakness, because if he does that and AJ sees it which shouldn’t be too hard technique will trump it.

An unconventional boxer for me is Connor, switching stances changing angles picking different types of shots because he is so well balanced which is the big difference. Wilder over reaches, puts himself off balance which puts him in so much danger I’m surprised he’s made it this far with that record.

Edit: thinking about the fight again, Parker did a great job of not giving AJ a target to unleash the right. In a way his tactic is why it kept getting tangled up and broken as he kept his shoulder high then ducked away to the right giving AJ no target. However AJ did notice this, stopped looking for the right and then instead started throwing a left dig like shot akin to looking for a liver but instead he was catching Parker on the bonce as he was coming in. To me that’s good boxing IQ. I think both showed some intelligent boxing and both sort of cancelled out each other making it a bit boring, but that’s what happens when you have to skilled boxers.

 

[ivaldo]

Just replied in other as I'd be saying the same thing twice.

Will say my focus is on Joshua' s failings whilst yours focus on Wilder's numerous ones which I'm not disputing.

He’s not unconventional in the way that Fury is, which makes him hard to hit and gives him the ability to strike from unfamiliar angles. When you say Wilder is ‘unconventional’ you mean he doesn’t have any real boxing ability. He swings for the fences on the premise that he’ll land sooner or later, that’s it. His only weapons are his reach and his knockout power, both of which Joshua has in ample supply. In every other aspect Joshua is superior, and that isn’t because Joshua is some elite level boxer, it’s because Wilder is pretty poor.

No one is saying it’s a non contest, just that it’s highly likely Joshua wins. We’re giving Wilder a punchers chance because of his knockout power.

 

[Inter Yer Nan]

@Inter Yer Nan

Views on this weekends action?

DeGale v Truax 2.

HURD V LARA

Good fights. I think DeGale will be a bit more focused this time and get his title back but it wouldn't surprise me if it's close. DeGale almost always seems to fight to his opponents level and is in closer fights than he should be. I think he has a lot of talent.

Lara-Hurd is an excellent match on paper. Lara is CLEARLY the better boxer, but Hurd is younger, stronger and a giant at the weight. Is that enough to offset the giant gulf in class and skill between the two? My guess is no. I think Lara would dominate the first 7-8 rounds but Hurd will close the distance a little bit but too late. One fight this could potentially look like is Lara-Angulo (remember that one? The only entertaining Lara fight I can remember). Lara is an expert at that straight left hand with timing and distance like most of the best Cuban's.

 

[El General 1994]

Thanks for your thoughts @Inter Yer Nan.

DeGale really ticks me off as he almost always switches off in fights. He had Badou Jack (who is going on to better things) beaten but got knocked down in round 12. So much skill does our James possess...

GGG's people are sounding out to various outlets about not cancelling their hotels during the 5th May. Potential opponents are:

• Spike O'Sullivan
• Andrade
• Lemieux (part 2!)
• Ramirez

 

[simonhch]

I just don't think Wilder struggled at all any more than AJ "struggled" against Klitschko. In both instances, they were up against very good competition and it was a proper fight. Wilder clearly made it his strategy to absorb Ortiz's energy in the earlier rounds and then go to work in the latter ones. AJ and Klitschko each had varying strategies as well, but in both instances each fighter had his ups and downs during the fight because of the level of competition they faced.

Honestly, what did I just read? Comparing Ortiz and Klitschko. Really? Any underlying point you had went out the window right there.

 

[Revan]

Wilder isn't beating Whyte or Povetkin, never mind Joshua.

Wilder knockouts Whyte IMO. He has the reach and the demonic power.

With Povetkin it would be closer, same with Parker. I think that Joshua beats Wilder comfortably.

 

[Raoul]

Wilder knockouts Whyte IMO. He has the reach and the demonic power.

With Povetkin it would be closer, same with Parker. I think that Joshua beats Wilder comfortably.

These are hard to predict imo, as anything can happen if one person happens to land a clean shot.

 

[Inter Yer Nan]

Thanks for your thoughts @Inter Yer Nan.

DeGale really ticks me off as he almost always switches off in fights. He had Badou Jack (who is going on to better things) beaten but got knocked down in round 12. So much skill does our James possess...

GGG's people are sounding out to various outlets about not cancelling their hotels during the 5th May. Potential opponents are:

• Spike O'Sullivan
• Andrade
• Lemieux (part 2!)
• Ramirez

I think it's going to be O'Sullivan. I'd rather GGG just wait a month or two and go straight to Saunders but I guess they think that will be hard to make. Keep him busy and then go for a late summer fight with Saunders I guess.

Yeah, DeGale is like that every fight. No way should he have had competitive fights with the ghost of Bute, Porky Medina and Traux and yes he had Jack and then ended up being lucky to get a draw. Even the Dirrel fight started well and ended up close and competitive after looking likely to dominate. It's definitely something mental with him and part of the reason I'd pick Groves to beat him again.