Ten Hag sacked | Ruud appointed Interim Manager

Yakuza_devils said:
These 4 men with millions of salary per year cocked up big time on retaining the manager in the summer and throw away another season. Hope they rectify their mistakes soon by appointing a right manager and salvage the season.
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Two of the four weren't even at the club when they retained him.
 
Vidooq said:
One of the things that Ten Hag was missing in order to manage a successful United team was charisma. He might be an honest and good person, but I don't see any of our players in any of their interviews saying that they would run through a brick wall for him. I'm not implying that they downed tools on him, it's just that feeling that he is not a good communicator with the team, and often used the wrong words, like when he said that he substituted Casemiro for footballing reasons, when in fact he wanted to say technical reasons, and this plays into people's motivation. He is too calm, not fiery enough, and just seems too collected. I see Pep, Arteta, and Klopp jumping all over the line, and he simply stands there, like an owl on a rain. It never oozed confidence that. I never liked some of the statements he made during the last 2-3 weeks, like not getting beat by Porto and Fenerbache was some kind of success. Small-minded mentally. Best of luck to him.
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I agree about not being charismatic but I think even more detrimental with Erik was his inability to effectively communicate.

The Phil Jones interview I perceived as an indirect way of saying he couldn't get his ideas across. Phil mentioned the importance of a manager having a good working relationship with the manager but also having the social proponents where the players can resonate with the coach.

Erik's personality seemingly is too reductive, you can grasp from even when new signings were announced he's stand-offish and awkward. It's not a slight against how he is as a person but when it comes to management there is a criteria where it requires the right profile of person especially in a team sport setting.
 
Talk about shutting the gate after the horse has bolted.

If we'd had the brains to do this four months ago maybe our season wouldn't have already been lost after ten matches.

That being said, the F.A. Cup win over City is a great memory so I'm glad he takes that with him.
 
Freak said:
It is extremely strange. It's like they don't support the club's best interests but instead support individuals no matter what.
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I wonder if other big club fanbase are like this?

At times it felt like ETH was more important than the club
 
LordSpud said:
We wait til Summer then Southgate is available. We need to move at Christmas or I fear the worst.
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Good thing is it’s not just Ashworths decision. Wilcox and Berrada and maybe even board members are involved. Can just hope Southgate won’t get a vote of confidence from them.
 
Can't wait to see us start playing football again. What a useless .. this guy was. Fecking Antony!
 
Yakuza_devils said:
These 4 men with millions of salary per year cocked up big time on retaining the manager in the summer and throw away another season. Hope they rectify their mistakes soon by appointing a right manager and salvage the season.
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Don't blame Wilcox. If he had his way, ETH would've been gone in May.
 
Redstain said:
I agree about not being charismatic but I think even more detrimental with Erik was his inability to effectively communicate.

The Phil Jones interview I perceived as an indirect way of saying he couldn't get his ideas across. Phil mentioned the importance of a manager having a good working relationship with the manager but also having the social proponents where the players can resonate with the coach.

Erik's personality seemingly is too reductive, you can grasp from even when new signings were announced he's stand-offish and awkward. It's not a slight against how he is as a person but when it comes to management there is a criteria where it requires the right profile of person especially in a team sport setting.
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The thing is Ten Hag seemed to be very charismatic in Dutch whenever there were videos, everyone was laughing and there seemed a lightness to him that he never had when speaking English. Ten Hag can speak English perfectly fine, but there are different levels of language proficiency where you can make or understand humour/wit vs you're just trying to get the point across accurately, it can make all the difference.
 
Think a lot of managers will be watching how Ruud does and if someone can actually get these players functioning as a serious team.It he can it makes the job easier in a way, that a big overhaul won't be needed. If it doesn't happen it depends then on who wants to take on such a rebuild, if we can sell the necessary players, if there is money available if we struggle to sell players.
 
Big Ben Foster said:
Don't blame Wilcox. If he had his way, ETH would've been gone in May.
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But now when the results don't come it will be the fault of Berrada, Ashworth and Wilcox, not ETH. Now we get to find out how much of the problem was ETH and how much is inherent to a broken club.
 
Yakuza_devils said:
These 4 men with millions of salary per year cocked up big time on retaining the manager in the summer and throw away another season. Hope they rectify their mistakes soon by appointing a right manager and salvage the season.
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In hindsight, letting him go in the summer was the right decision. However, I also see merits in giving ETH the opportunity to work within a new sporting structure and see if he could thrive (he didn’t). So we cut the loss and moved on - I think there’s always a lot of risks and uncertainties around big decision like this.
 
Yakuza_devils said:
These 4 men with millions of salary per year cocked up big time on retaining the manager in the summer and throw away another season. Hope they rectify their mistakes soon by appointing a right manager and salvage the season.
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Chosing the right manager is a lottery. The club and a lot of fans thought ETH would be the right man. Nobody knows if they are right until they are given the job.
 
He should have been gone in the summer but we got there in the end.

I'm not in favour of constantly sacking managers, but I also don’t support blindly backing them when it's clearly not working. It's been clear to everyone that we were not progressing under Ten Hag, in fact we were arguably getting worse. It'll be interesting to see who we go for now.
 
quadrant said:
As opposed to what, something you invented based on literally nothing? Yeah I'll stick with the facts, thanks.
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Do you really believe there is zero contact on these major decisions during the lengthy "gardening leave"? Ok, whatever rocks your boat. Enough said.
 
MadDogg said:
We literally give managers more time than any other big club in the world. That's part of the problem, as rather than replace a manager once he's taken us as far as he can we just let them continue on, tanking our results, destroying the belief and confidence, wasting valuable developmental time (especially for the younger players) and watching other top clubs pick up top managers as they quickly switch and change managers twice as fast as we do.
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Sure, but picking every random manager from the list isn't also exactly a remedy. Now we can't be even sure if we'll reach a cup final. The players looked unprepared for another season and on top of that, they are resigned.

Berrada & board will have to also make the right choice, perhaps that's why they're in charge now. Sacking a manager is relatively easy, appointing someone who won't connect to the club could be another years wasted. Perhaps that's why Ruud looks like logical option, in case he can become full time one with a vision.

Other than that, we can surely switch fast between managers, without no guarantee we will actually make upgrade on Ten Hag. Not a fan of football roulette, as it can lead to random results. Some stage of planning definitely is needed, and so far I don't see it, if Ruud is treated as the interim.

We'll see how he cope in first matches.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Chosing the right manager is a lottery. The club and a lot of fans thought ETH would be the right man. Nobody knows if they are right until they are given the job.
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Hence, we need to build a proper football structure like RM, Barca, BM, City, Liverpool even Brighton, Dortmund and etc. Manager can come and go but the team is still playing the same football and win things.
 
Yakuza_devils said:
These 4 men with millions of salary per year cocked up big time on retaining the manager in the summer and throw away another season. Hope they rectify their mistakes soon by appointing a right manager and salvage the season.
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If they had sacked him after winning the FA Cup, then a large segment of our fanbase would have said "he's just won the cup, was turning the corner, you made a huge mistake, blah blah blah".

This was the right approach as now we have absolutely no doubt that he was not up to it, even if personally I'd have only given him up to the first international break.
 
Thank god for that, shame we can’t get back the hundreds of millions he wasted on dross.
 
Dr. Dwayne said:
If they had sacked him after winning the FA Cup, then a large segment of our fanbase would have said "he's just won the cup, was turning the corner, you made a huge mistake, blah blah blah".

This was the right approach as now we have absolutely no doubt that he was not up to it, even if personally I'd have only given him up to the first international break.
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That section would have moved on quickly like when we did the same to van Gaal.
 
Yakuza_devils said:
Do you really believe there is zero contact on these major decisions during the lengthy "gardening leave"? Ok, whatever rocks your boat. Enough said.
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This isn't being "edgy", its just being un-necessarily cynical. Its very likely he had no input because any sniff of getting caught out and you're sued into oblivian. Indeed, I can be equally cynical and say if he was asked about the appointment he would likely say "I can't be involved in this" not just for legal reasons but also his own personal ability to distance himself from it politically down the line. Never put your name to a decision you don't have to.
 
Dr. Dwayne said:
If they had sacked him after winning the FA Cup, then a large segment of our fanbase would have said "he's just won the cup, was turning the corner, you made a huge mistake, blah blah blah".

This was the right approach as now we have absolutely no doubt that he was not up to it, even if personally I'd have only given him up to the first international break.
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5-7m extra payout to manage fanbase optics. You'd have to hope the people in charge aren't that dumb.
 
Dr. Dwayne said:
If they had sacked him after winning the FA Cup, then a large segment of our fanbase would have said "he's just won the cup, was turning the corner, you made a huge mistake, blah blah blah".

This was the right approach as now we have absolutely no doubt that he was not up to it, even if personally I'd have only given him up to the first international break.
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Majority of fans expected him to be sacked after FA Cup. There were also strong rumors in the medias. Everyone kind of understand if he was sacked.

It was Ineos Team that took 2-3 weeks to make the decision to keep him. Then, the fans think that maybe the best in class football people know what they were doing and the fans followed.
 
Yakuza_devils said:
Do you really believe there is zero contact on these major decisions during the lengthy "gardening leave"? Ok, whatever rocks your boat. Enough said.
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Nice strawman.

Some phone calls and the odd dinner to keep them up to date is one thing. Undertaking the due diligence required to sack the manager, head hunt and then interview a group of potential replacements is something else entirely.
 
quadrant said:
Nice strawman.

Some phone calls and the odd dinner to keep them up to date is one thing. Undertaking the due diligence required to sack the manager, head hunt and then interview a group of potential replacements is something else entirely.
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Okay. Nice. You believe what you believe.
 
There's always a sentiment that failed managers will do well elsewhere now, but there always seems to be when a manager or player departs from United. But rarely it's ever the case.
 
Yagami said:
That section would have moved on quickly like when we did the same to van Gaal.
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Perhaps, but if his replacement faltered at all then the dissent would have grown. I think this approach was right but the plug should have been pulled a few games earlier.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Think a lot of managers will be watching how Ruud does and if someone can actually get these players functioning as a serious team.It he can it makes the job easier in a way, that a big overhaul won't be needed. If it doesn't happen it depends then on who wants to take on such a rebuild, if we can sell the necessary players, if there is money available if we struggle to sell players.
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Thought Ruud was brought in to address our lack of finishing ability. So far results have been abysmal. Worse finishing than ever before.

And now he's getting a promotion kind of. Of course I hope he turns it around being a club legend and all. Just skeptical that he's the man for the job is all.
 
Would have been a justified sacking this time last year, and he's done nothing during his stay of execution that would lead us to believe he's the manager we need.

Long overdue.
 
Dr. Dwayne said:
Perhaps, but if his replacement faltered at all then the dissent would have grown. I think this approach was right but the plug should have been pulled a few games earlier.
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The dissent would have grown, agreed, but that section of the fanbase are the ones who stick with the manager through thick and thin so the next guy would've still had their full support.
 
slyadams said:
This isn't being "edgy", its just being un-necessarily cynical. Its very likely he had no input because any sniff of getting caught out and you're sued into oblivian. Indeed, I can be equally cynical and say if he was asked about the appointment he would likely say "I can't be involved in this" not just for legal reasons but also his own personal ability to distance himself from it politically down the line. Never put your name to a decision you don't have to.
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Of course they can't be the front. But they were of course heavily involved in the back. In front of the media they must state they were not involved at all as was widely reported. Otherwise it will have legal implications as they were officially on gardening leave.
 
JPRouve said:
The players were mostly brought by the manager and the culture is always the manager's responsibility. I still struggle to understand why only football fans pretend that the culture in a club isn't dictated by the person that is supposed to lead and is highly compensated for their supposed leadership qualities. There is no other sport where managers get that much leeway when things go wrong while getting all the flowers if things go well.
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It’s a united fan thing. It’s some weird loyalty to the manager stemming from the unusual success we’ve had with iconic, long term managers.

At most other clubs fans are able to rationalize that managers can get sacked and not throw their own club or players under the bus.

Just last week Flick destroyed Bayern, there were hardly any Bayern fans online berating their club or players for Flick’s dismissal from their club, imagine Flick as a former united manager for a second and our toxic online fanbase would be making memes out of the club they claim to support, targeting our players and generally being negative about the club.

It’s why I don’t take ABU threads seriously. Our fans are probably the biggest ABU agenda peddlers around.
 
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