Gary said that whilst sacking managers at Salford on the regular. Which makes you wonder why he's the total opposite when it comes to United.
Ten Hag sacked | Ruud appointed Interim Manager
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Ruud would be moving on once Amorim is appointed? Any news on what his future looks like?
Give it a rest mate, you were VP89 before VP89 ever posted in Caf, just that the manager was called back then David Moyes.
EtH is out, which is the most important thing, no need to remind others how wrong they were, let's move on and hope that the new manager, Amorim or whoever it is, is actually not a total clown, and finally we start improving and become successful again.
Surely he knew when joining that Ten Hag wasn't doing well and could go even earlier than he did. Unless he is genuinely not liked and isn't getting a response out of the forwards then he should be kept on really, otherwise we just made him sign a contract to then pay him out on it after a couple of months of work.
Be interesting to see how Ruud sets up today and if he defers from the 4-2-3-1 formation which just doesn't suit our players at the moment. Love to see him with a 3-4-3 or a high pressing 4-3-3. Be some kick to Ten Hag if he has us flying with a new formation and proper pressing after only a few days!
Unfortunately Ten Hags biggest problem was 600 million spent and we are still no where near a possession team so was time to go. Ten Hag was unable to adapt to our players and was to stubborn to change the system. We were setup the same every single match bar some games the defense was higher.
Unfortunately Ten Hags biggest problem was 600 million spent and we are still no where near a possession team so was time to go. Ten Hag was unable to adapt to our players and was to stubborn to change the system. We were setup the same every single match bar some games the defense was higher.
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Silly that this needs to be highlighted again but any managerial or player threads should be civil and respectful with no personal insults thrown toward the player, manager or other posters. Criticism of their tenure, form, ability or post is fine, but crossing the personal line isn't. That includes snidy comments trying to get people to gang up on posters or tagging them (or not) to try and get reactions. Posts will either be deleted or given warnings. Ta.
Yes but we can ask Amorim to keep him in the coaching staff. At least for this year so that Amorim integration is smooth. Wanted to know if there is any news regarding that?
Letting go of Ruud in just 2-3 months doesn’t feel right at least to me. He seems to have respect of the squad and has track record of being a good coach.
This is the most bizarre of all our managerial sagas (and that's saying something). I'm not one for calling for the managers head, but how this guy survived for so long, considering some of the utter trouncings we've had, is incredible. Must have one hell of an agent.
Can I also add to this that going outside exists.
Its only bizzare if you dont take context into it. I guess things are black and white with you?
Context? First season got 3rd and trophy = good season
2nd season - fails miserably = should be sacked
That's how you probably look at it.
However; in his second season, we had the takeover to deal with, so there was no chance Glazers were making a change whilst INEOS took over in February, the first point of call was to do a complete review of the club and hire the correct structure. Something most fans are calling out for.. some may find us appointing a structure before bizzare.
Then he won a trophy in his 2nd season and had loads of injuries, the board reviewed his position and interviewed candidates, none of them really impressed.
Instead they said, okay lets see what you can do, whilst we appoint a CEO and DoF in July. They then needed to settle in at the club, whilst looking at the football. Once they realised, this man isn't suited for the job, Post Liverpool / Spurs, instead of reacting and sacking without a plan, they made a plan.
The plan was to appoint Amorim and once they found out he will come, they sacked Ten Hag and looking to appoint a manager within 1 week of sacking one.
That is not bizzare, its planning, rather than sacking a manager and playing on interim and loads of questions around the permanent manager.
I mean, throw in 'Was responsible for us signing Antony and Mount' and you could sack him on this list alone, you don't need the results on top of it.
Incredible read. Forget Ten Hag, ithe article is also not a good look for Ineos considering the role they played through their costly indecisiveness. I wonder if Tuchel and De Zerbi developed cold feet during their talks with the club after sensing just how directionless we’ve become as an institution. On the other hand, Berrada seems like a breath of fresh air and I’m not surprised he led the charge to court Amorim going back to summer. We’ll need his forward thinking and expertise
Exactly the opposite actually. INEOS understood that they dont have the expertise to make these calls, thus waited for footballing people to join in Berrada and Ashworth, let them deal with the footballing side.
It the opposite to directionless, its actually having a plan. They back their men, so have given them the responsibility to sack and hire a new manager.
You cant say a club is become directionless after 3 months of taking charge of a football club, that is silly. They reviewed the managerial role, interviewed candidates, weren't impressed and moved on letting the CEO and DoF make these decisions.
Think after a certain amount of time people will look back on his stint more fondly with less recency bias, like Ole.
He won us trophies after years going without. Last season we had a shit ton of injuries and everything that was going on behind the scenes with the club "sale." Not impossible to work through but incredibly difficult.
You just know in the right circumstances, with the right environment (like he had in Ajax) he can succeed. We need someone who can take us as we are now and do something, not wait around for the ideal circumstances to perform.
He won us trophies after years going without. Last season we had a shit ton of injuries and everything that was going on behind the scenes with the club "sale." Not impossible to work through but incredibly difficult.
You just know in the right circumstances, with the right environment (like he had in Ajax) he can succeed. We need someone who can take us as we are now and do something, not wait around for the ideal circumstances to perform.
If he'd gone in the Summer then perhaps but not sure. I will only remember the shitty league performances of the last season and a bit.
I'll give him big credit for sticking up to Ronaldo and Sancho but will primarily remember scratching my head at what was supposed to be going on during matches.
Even now I don't have much of an idea on how we were supposedly set up to play.
If Amorim is confirmed I have a good feeling about this appointment - same young(er) coach, a viewed weaker league but I dunno he looks well worth a go. Will certainly give him a lot of time.
Berrada, Wilcox and Ashworth were in place when it was decided to extend ETH in summer in lieu of giving him the can and appointing another manager. A costly decision it turned out to be, and we all saw this coming
Ultimately club sales, player fueds, banned players and injury crises etc. weren't his undoing. His tactics and own inability to implement something resembling a working plan is what lead to his sacking. This video breaks down his tactical failings.
The context is that we had been poor since the League Cup win.
Ruud comes out to be the biggest loser from this situation
No he doesn't. He has 3/4 games to do additional marketing for his next job.
Not really. Everybody knows new manager bounce exists
Wrong.
Berrada said:
Ashworth said:
Source: MEN
I always thought it curious that they made an effort to distance themselves. Felt that didn't bode well for ETH.
As for Wilcox, as far as I know, he doesn't have the remit to hire and fire managers. He can probably make a recommendation, but that's it.
Werent Ashworth and Berrada exchanging emails when United supposedly tapped Ashworth up while they both were still employed by the barcodes and City? Naughty boys. That’s how it goes in private in business isn’t it? They flouted the rules and their public comments after officially taking their roles are cop outs to cover themselves in my opinion. Ashworth outed himself with his email blunder.They had to have put their direct input into the decision to keep ETH at the helm. I could be wrong
No they weren't. Berrada and Ashworth joined in July, but no point me discussing with you when you will deny the basics.
What basics? You’re going with public statements and official start dates but the evidence shows Berrada (while still a City employee) was representing United when the club tapped up Ashworth at Newcastle long before July. Are you refuting that?
What evidence suggests that they started working before then?
Tapping up and working is 2 different things.
Its like saying, we know Amorin is manager, so the next few results will on him? Win lose or draw?
They might have had informal talks with the club and be part of decisions, but they were not allowed to go into a meeting with say Tuchel whilst not officially starting..
They definitely were not involved with meetings with agents before they joined, what you are trying to prove is all opinion that they were involved.
There is a reason why they paid Newcastle the fees to waive the gardening leave, because if they didn't and carried on working like you think they did, they would be in legal issues.
i’m quite high up the corporate ladder at the multi-billion dollar company i work for, and i can confirm we send emails. all. the. time.
You and us all Erik, Brailsford's indecisiveness turned it into cruel and unusual punishment for him
The press can't let go of the fact that they got it wrong about his sacking in the summer, do they ? Amusing really.
I'm not getting drawn into this debate again, after another ban. But all I'll say is I've learnt my lesson re your first point, I have been the first to point out myself that I was that guy for Moyes and Jose, but how I was wrong. I have said this myself to those defending both Ole and ETH. I'll leave it at that, as I don't want to upset anyone.
I mean he got a much bigger payout - tough punishment. On the other side as a manager who connected with the fans I will always have a fondness for him for that. He was always appreciative of us as club and a fandom.
Were they wrong though?
The club interviewed multiple managers with a view to replacing Ten Hag as they were obviously considering sacking him. It's not like we had a barnstorming season and the press just conjured the story out of thin air, there were obviously briefs/leaks before the Cup final that the club were leaning towards sacking him. Who knows what happened after that that resulted in him staying but he was probably close to getting the boot.
He ended up staying, not just after the FA cup final but well into the new season. So yea, they got it horribly wrong and looks like its hurting them.
That doesn't make any sense though. It's almost certain that United at one point were planning to sack him which the press reported. Things can change at a later date.
So what did they get wrong?
He was sacked 2 months into the season so Ineos obviously didn't have much confidence in him to begin with. Which is why they came close to sacking him in June.
The press reported that regardless of the result of the FA Cup final, he was getting sacked. It was all over the media before the game. They tried to disrupt the preparations as much as they can. They got that wrong. I, for one, am glad that it blew up in their face.
Some of the press reported that and that may well have been the case at the time they reported it. Plans can change, loads of prominent journalists reported the same thing at the same time. They didn't pull that out of their arse, they were obvioulsy briefed or info was leaked.
Honest question, do you think if something that is reported that doesn't end up happening that the journalist made it up?
It didn't though what transpired actually worked in their favour. Because they got to report endless speculation on Ten Hags job for another 6 weeks. They then over the next 4 months got to report and break down in great detail the disasterclass that was the tail end of Ten Hags United career.
I doubt they could have picked a better series of events to report on for clicks.
If they want the reputation of reporting correctly early, they must also bear the accusation of making it up when the report is wrong.
You can add to that the Ronaldo hospital pass, Rashford’s form falling off a cliff, the Greenwood SNAFU and Sancho’s bizarre behaviour. Everything that could go wrong for ETH did go wrong. He’s one of the most unlucky managers I’ve ever seen. In a way it was perfect that the very first match after he left featured a bunch of lucky goals. Jammy deflection, Dalot offside and a mental back pass. Scratch those three off and the result would be classic ETH second season.
Agree with you.
It’s also come out that Amorim was the only candidate they wanted full stop however his release clause was double this summer which also helped the decision to continue with Ten Hag in the interim - it would also help with consistency.
People seem to lose sight this is a project. INEOS came in late December and then it’s taken them until July to assemble the full team they wanted. That’s because they’ve waited for Ashworth and Berrada instead of settling for others who they could bring in quicker. They’ve also waited on Amorim as that’s who they wanted.
We can cry and moan about the start to the season but those fans need to ask themselves the following;
Would you rather they take the time to get the right people or just settle for second or third best for ease? They want ‘best in class’ and a team of elite operators who can work efficiently together for many years.
No one has any patience anymore.
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