Spurs XI: name 4 better Prem players in each position?

We'veGotDeleAlli said:
You must rate them incredibly poorly to have them behind some on that list, in their current states. Some of them can barely run anymore.

I need know though, why Gylfi over Alli? As a Spurs fan who saw them both play for Tottenham, Gylfi doesn't have a fraction of Alli's talent, and Alli is miles ahead physically even at the age of 20.

It's not even really a competition, the only area Gylfi wins in is free kick taking.
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Gylfi didn't even get a break in his proper position at Spurs, often shunted out wide. Badly mismanaged there as evident by his performance at any other team in his career.

You're overrating Alli a bit here because he's young. He's not a better player than these guys yet. He blows hot and cold and usually only performs when the players around him do.
 
Snow said:
Gylfi didn't even get a break in his proper position at Spurs, often shunted out wide. Badly mismanaged there as evident by his performance at any other team in his career.

You're overrating Alli a bit here because he's young. He's not a better player than these guys yet. He blows hot and cold and usually only performs when the players around him do.
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He was played centrally a few times and did very little. He just wasn't good enough for us, Swansea is around his level, where he can be the main man, take all the set pieces etc, which is his best attribute in all honesty. No physical presence, slow, couldn't beat his man. Sums him up for us, with the odd nice pass and nice goal thrown in.

As for Alli, despite his age, he's already a lot better than Gylfi. He got 19 goals and assists in the league to Gylfi's 14, despite Gylfi being Swansea's set piece taker and the main man in the side. He's not only more productive going forward, but more of an asset defensively - managing 2.2 tackles and 1.8 interceptions a game last season to Gylfi's 1.2 tackles and 0.8 interceptions.

He does blow hot and cold, but when he blows hot he's a universe away from Gylfi, honestly. Whenever he's on the ball I'm excited something will happen, could never say the same about Gylfi, ever. Unless he was standing over a free kick I never got excited with him.

Alli is just the better player, really. I like Gylfi, he's a solid player who guarantees a good return for any mid table side, but nothing more.
 
Also, Alli got his break because he earned it. On his first sub appearance, he scored. For the first few games he was played in the deeper role, but he kept showing how good he was and Pocchetino knew that he needed to play further forward. Eriksen was shunted to the left for him, because he's that good. Gylfi was played out wide because he is clearly an inferior player to Eriksen and wasn't able to dislodge him from his central position.
 
We'veGotDeleAlli said:
He was played centrally a few times and did very little. He just wasn't good enough for us, Swansea is around his level, where he can be the main man, take all the set pieces etc, which is his best attribute in all honesty. No physical presence, slow, couldn't beat his man. Sums him up for us, with the odd nice pass and nice goal thrown in.

As for Alli, despite his age, he's already a lot better than Gylfi. He got 19 goals and assists in the league to Gylfi's 14, despite Gylfi being Swansea's set piece taker and the main man in the side. He's not only more productive going forward, but more of an asset defensively - managing 2.2 tackles and 1.8 interceptions a game last season to Gylfi's 1.2 tackles and 0.8 interceptions.

He does blow hot and cold, but when he blows hot he's a universe away from Gylfi, honestly. Whenever he's on the ball I'm excited something will happen, could never say the same about Gylfi, ever. Unless he was standing over a free kick I never got excited with him.

Alli is just the better player, really. I like Gylfi, he's a solid player who guarantees a good return for any mid table side, but nothing more.
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He played centrally a few times? Wow, I wonder why he didn't manage to settle with all that time given. There were 3 outfield players that were more often in the squad than him yet 13 played more minutes and 3 players only few minutes less. In the 58 PL games he took part in he played 6 times the whole 90 minutes. He played for 3 different managers in his 2 seasons there. His time there was marred by what makes Tottenham famous, inconsistency.

Gylfi's defensive work overcame Alli's in the Euros despite Gylfi being a part of a two-man midfield to the usual three. You sound like you have no idea what Gylfi does and resort to some stats to help you. They play the same position but have different roles. His role for Iceland is a lot different than in for Swansea and he's been a top 5 performer for two qualifiers straight in a much lesser side. It helps playing with better players if you didn't know that. You think Alli would have rocked that last season playing with Shelvey behind him instead of Dembele? You think Alli would have played well if he was man marked almost every game? He gets lost in games without that help. Excellent potential in him but he's still an immature player in a lot of ways.
 
Snow said:
He played centrally a few times? Wow, I wonder why he didn't manage to settle with all that time given. There were 3 outfield players that were more often in the squad than him yet 13 played more minutes and 3 players only few minutes less. In the 58 PL games he took part in he played 6 times the whole 90 minutes. He played for 3 different managers in his 2 seasons there. His time there was marred by what makes Tottenham famous, inconsistency.

Gylfi's defensive work overcame Alli's in the Euros despite Gylfi being a part of a two-man midfield to the usual three. You sound like you have no idea what Gylfi does and resort to some stats to help you. They play the same position but have different roles. His role for Iceland is a lot different than in for Swansea and he's been a top 5 performer for two qualifiers straight in a much lesser side. It helps playing with better players if you didn't know that. You think Alli would have rocked that last season playing with Shelvey behind him instead of Dembele? You think Alli would have played well if he was man marked almost every game? He gets lost in games without that help. Excellent potential in him but he's still an immature player in a lot of ways.
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I get the feeling arguing about the level of alli with a guy called 'wevegotdelialli' isn't going to be very productive tbh.
 
Snow said:
He played centrally a few times? Wow, I wonder why he didn't manage to settle with all that time given. There were 3 outfield players that were more often in the squad than him yet 13 played more minutes and 3 players only few minutes less. In the 58 PL games he took part in he played 6 times the whole 90 minutes. He played for 3 different managers in his 2 seasons there. His time there was marred by what makes Tottenham famous, inconsistency.

Gylfi's defensive work overcame Alli's in the Euros despite Gylfi being a part of a two-man midfield to the usual three. You sound like you have no idea what Gylfi does and resort to some stats to help you. They play the same position but have different roles. His role for Iceland is a lot different than in for Swansea and he's been a top 5 performer for two qualifiers straight in a much lesser side. It helps playing with better players if you didn't know that. You think Alli would have rocked that last season playing with Shelvey behind him instead of Dembele? You think Alli would have played well if he was man marked almost every game? He gets lost in games without that help. Excellent potential in him but he's still an immature player in a lot of ways.
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Wasn't good enough to make that position his own. Wasn't nearly talented enough to take up the position in attacking midfield. Top players take their chances, Alli is going to be a top player and he took his, a much older Gylfi wasn't able to. He didn't assert himself. He didn't look up to par.

Sure, the inconsistency didn't help, but I never even saw flashes of the level of talent that Alli possesses. Not even an ounce of it, and I think any Spurs fan will tell you the same. Eriksen played during the same period and looked just as good as he does now, class shows through. Gylfi wasn't considered good enough and was sold to a mid table side, where he looks very comfortable. I doubt a top side will take a punt on him.

The Euro's is a completely different kettle of fish, I'm talking about the Premier League, over the course of an entire season. Not a few matches.

Different roles, yes, and Alli's role contributes more defensively yet he still produces more going forward. I agree it helps playing with better players, but Sigurdsson did play with better players and was shown up as not being good enough. He got sold because he didn't look a Spurs level player, and none of our fans were at all upset. Sigurdsson is the kind of player who thrives when he is the main man and is given all the set piece duties, not when he's another good player among many. He's in his element at Swansea and was in it at Reading too.

Alli would have played well in pretty much any side last season. That's how talented he is, as for being man marked there were plenty of occasions last season when a team put a man on Alli, or tried to rile him up. He was pretty much our most crucial player in the second half of the season. I wonder if Sigurdsson could ever take on that role for us? Somehow I doubt it.

Immature, sure he is. I'll take immature over ineffective though, which is what Gylfi was for us for the most part. Lot's of excuses about why he didn't succeed here when the bottom line is he wasn't good enough and dropped down to where he's comfortable. Being the main man for Iceland and being the main man for Swansea.
 
caid said:
I get the feeling arguing about the level of alli with a guy called 'wevegotdelialli' isn't going to be very productive tbh.
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It's just a name, I don't have any more bias towards Alli than any other Tottenham player, it could have been named after any of our players. I just happened to think of the chant when I was entering a username.

He's from Iceland, so there's bias from his side too.
 
We'veGotDeleAlli said:
It's just a name, I don't have any more bias towards Alli than any other Tottenham player, it could have been named after any of our players. I just happened to think of the chant when I was entering a username.

He's from Iceland, so there's bias from his side too.
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Didn't notice that,

you do seem quite fond of alli though tbh
 
caid said:
Didn't notice that,

you do seem quite fond of alli though tbh
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I don't think you'll find many Spurs fans who aren't, to be fair. Had Eriksen been called inferior to Gylfi I'd be arguing his case just as much.
 
Snow said:
I don't rate Walker or Rose very highly.
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Yeah, spurs fans massively overrate those two based on a few months hot streak. By end of the season and at euros they looked mediocre at best.
 
caid said:
I get the feeling arguing about the level of alli with a guy called 'wevegotdelialli' isn't going to be very productive tbh.
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Tbf he massively overrates a lot of spuds players not just allli
 
OK I'll have a go

Lloris (GK): granted he's on par with the best
Walker (RB): Bellerin, Sagna, Clyne, Zabaleta, Coleman, probably Darmian and Trippier
Rose (LB): Monreal, Clichy, Kolarov, Shaw, Azpilicueta, Bertrand, Blind, Baines, Galloway, Fuchs, Schlupp, Cresswell, and Ben Davies (and that's just of the top of my head..)
Alderweireld & Vertonghen (CB partnership): Koscielny & Mertesacker
Dier & Dembele (CM pairing): any combination of Xhaka-Ramsey-Cazorla, Matic-Loftus-Cheek-Fabregas-Kante, Gündogan-Fernandinho, Carrick-Pogba,
Alli (central AM): Özil, Silva, Firmino, Mata
Lamela (right AM): De Bruyne, Mahrez, William, Mkhitaryan, Sané, Mané, Feghouli
Eriksen (left AM): ok ok he's pretty good, but Payet, Alexis better; Hazard and Ayew close
Kane (striker): Sturridge, Ibrahimovic, Aguero, Costa, Lukaku, I'm inclined to say Giroud

:)
 
Cristiano Lell said:
OK I'll have a go

Lloris (GK): granted he's on par with the best
Walker (RB): Bellerin, Sagna, Clyne, Zabaleta, Coleman, probably Darmian AND Trippier
Rose (LB): Monreal, Clichy, Kolarov, Shaw, Azpilicueta, Bertrand, Blind, Baines, Galloway, Fuchs, Schlupp, Cresswell, AND Ben Davies (and that's just of the top of my head..)
Alderweireld & Vertonghen (CB partnership): Koscielny & Mertesacker
Dier & Dembele (CM pairing): any combination of Xhaka-Ramsey-Cazorla, Matic-Loftus-Cheek-Fabregas-Kante, Gündogan-Fernandinho, Carrick-Pogba,
Alli (central AM): Özil, Silva, Firmino, Mata
Lamela (right AM): De Bruyne, Mahrez, William, Mkhitaryan, Sané, Mané, Feghouli
Eriksen (left AM): ok ok he's pretty good, but Payet, Alexis better; Hazard and Ayew close
Kane (striker): Sturridge, Ibrahimovic, Aguero, Costa, Lukaku, I'm inclined to say Giroud

:)
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Obvious troll is obvious.
 
Cristiano Lell said:
Just answering the thread's question in all honesty.
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Oh ok, so you do genuinely believe Giroud is better than Kane, Schlupp, Davies & Galloway are better than Rose, Ayew is 'close' to Eriksen and Trippier and Darmian are better than Walker.

Gotcha. Trippier might just be the best one, he's barely good enough to be our backup right back, let alone better than Walker. Davies isn't a patch on Rose either, slightly better defensively but nothing like as good going forward.
 
oneniltothearsenal said:
Yeah, spurs fans massively overrate those two based on a few months hot streak. By end of the season and at euros they looked mediocre at best.
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Perhaps you can explain then why Rose was voted the season's best LB by his fellow professionals ... are they all closet Spurs fans?
 
oneniltothearsenal said:
Yeah, spurs fans massively overrate those two based on a few months hot streak. By end of the season and at euros they looked mediocre at best.
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Be honest, you didn't actually watch us play last season did you? You're just guessing here.

Neither Walker & Rose had hot streaks. Rose was one of our most consistent threats from beginning to end. I really don't care how they looked for England at the Euro's, considering we're a joke of a National Team who over the years have made some of the league's very best look like donkeys. That's without even going in to the fact that Walker was our best player in the Euro's and Rose did reasonably well, certainly better than most of the side.
 
GlastonSpur said:
Perhaps you can explain then why Rose was voted the season's best LB by his fellow professionals ... are they all closet Spurs fans?
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Haven't you got the memo? Rose is the worst Premier League left-back, and that's including plenty of youth players and our own backup. Who is much better but Pocchetino starts Rose for a laugh.

It's almost like a lot of people in this thread didn't actually watch Rose last season.
 
We'veGotDeleAlli said:
Oh ok, so you do genuinely believe Giroud is better than Kane, Schlupp, Davies & Galloway are better than Rose, Ayew is 'close' to Eriksen and Trippier and Darmian are better than Walker.
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Yes. I particularly dislike both of your starting fullbacks. As you can see, I think even your second fullbacks are better.

I said "I'm inclined to say Giroud" over Kane because frankly I'm not sure what Kane has achieved to consider him better than Giroud, who's not a world beater admittedly but a very consistent player at a relatively high level for many seasons.

Apart from that you might have noticed I put Eriksen even ahead of Hazard, Alli ahead of Sterling or Coutinho, Lloris on the ssame level as Cech, de Gea or Courtois so it's not meant to be anti-Spur trolling at all.

I think you'll need to take differing opinions much better, and maybe consider the possibility you might be rating your own team's players higher than someone looking at it from outside :)
 
Cristiano Lell said:
Yes. I particularly dislike both of your starting fullbacks. As you can see, I think even your second fullbacks are better.

I said "I'm inclined to say Giroud" over Kane because frankly I'm not sure what Kane has achieved to consider him better than Giroud, who's not a world beater admittedly but a very consistent player at a relatively high level for many seasons.

Apart from that you might have noticed I put Eriksen even ahead of Hazard, Alli ahead of Sterling or Coutinho, Lloris on the ssame level as Cech, de Gea or Courtois so it's not meant to be anti-Spur trolling at all.

I think you'll need to take differing opinions much better, and maybe consider the possibility you might be rating your own team's players higher than someone looking at it from outside :)
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There's disliking players and then there's having them below a majority of the league. Rose was in the team of the year last season yet there isn't a player in the league you seemingly think he's better than, it's ridiculous.

What's Kane done? I mean he's scored 16 more goals in the last 2 seasons, but I suppose that's not much. Including being top scorer in the league when Giroud is yet to even enter the top 5 once. Other than that though, they're about on par.

I've got no problems with your opinion, I just genuinely thought you were trolling, I'm afraid that's how ridiculous your opinions seemed. There isn't really another way to put it, you think both our backup fullbacks are superior to those starting and then you've named a bunch of random players like Galloway and Schlupp. Sorry, but it reads as if you've just thrown some names in there, because I don't see how there's any rational reason to think Schlupp is a better left back than Rose.

I really, really don't think rating Kane higher than Giroud, Rose higher than Schlupp and Walker higher than Darmian is me rating my own players higher than 'someone looking in from the outside'. Especially when you've got two of our own players in your lists, which is more than a little bit odd. Maybe you need to consider the possibility that I've seen a lot more of our own players and might know they are better than our backup alternatives?
 
Well I'll admit that I was kind of trolling with some of those numerous Rose superiors, but that was more an exaggeration to prove a point, than trolling. Besides from the fact that Glastonspurs OP is imploringly asking for it.

I really don't think he or Walker are top players, even if they had a good season for a change. I've seen countless games over recent seasons where they were liabilities, sometimes fatal liabilities.

Kane is a very good young striker. But he was, understandably, overhyped last season, while Giroud remains the easiest target for most people because he's not Benzema/Lewandowski/Aguero level. Well I don't think Kane is, either, yet. Let's see how he does in CL, for example.
 
Cristiano Lell said:
Well I'll admit that I was kind of trolling with some of those numerous Rose superiors, but that was more an exaggeration to prove a point, than trolling. Besides from the fact that Glastonspurs OP is imploringly asking for it.

I really don't think he or Walker are top players, even if they had a good season for a change. I've seen countless games over recent seasons where they were liabilities, sometimes fatal liabilities.

Kane is a very good young striker. But he was, understandably, overhyped last season, while Giroud remains the easiest target for most people because he's not Benzema/Lewandowski/Aguero level. Well I don't think Kane is, either, yet. Let's see how he does in CL, for example.
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Glad you admitted it.

Nobody's calling them top players, they obviously aren't up there with the likes of Dani Alves or Alaba. They're both good Premier League fullbacks though, who have their weaknesses but are absolutely vital to the way we play.

Never did I claim Kane was as good as those players. He's not. He's closer to them than Giroud though, who despite being much older, has failed to come close to matching Kane's goal tallies. It's clear to anybody (even most Arsenal fans) who the better striker is, so I don't know why you claimed otherwise. I also don't know why Lukaku is on that list, or Costa. Both have been outscored by Kane in the last 2 seasons. Neither have shown they are better Premier League strikers than him, at any point. Costa scored less goals in a title winning side then only turned up for the second half of last season, and Lukaku has scored 28 league goals in the last 2 seasons compared to Kane's 46.
 
We'veGotDeleAlli said:
Be honest, you didn't actually watch us play last season did you? You're just guessing here.

Neither Walker & Rose had hot streaks. Rose was one of our most consistent threats from beginning to end. I really don't care how they looked for England at the Euro's, considering we're a joke of a National Team who over the years have made some of the league's very best look like donkeys. That's without even going in to the fact that Walker was our best player in the Euro's and Rose did reasonably well, certainly better than most of the side.
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I think the majority on here only watch spurs twice a season.....the two games against Man Utd. Based on that they give their "opinions". Many of which are so far from the truth it's laughable. Like Trippier and Davies are better than Rose and Walker for example. I think I'll frame that one and hang it up, I can laugh at it every time I see it.
 
Vicar of Dibbly said:
I think the majority on here only watch spurs twice a season.....the two games against Man Utd. Based on that they give their "opinions". Many of which are so far from the truth it's laughable. Like Trippier and Davies are better than Rose and Walker for example. I think I'll frame that one and hang it up, I can laugh at it every time I see it.
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Put it up alongside 'Schlupp and Elmohamady are better than Lamela' :lol:
 
We'veGotDeleAlli said:
You must rate them incredibly poorly to have them behind some on that list, in their current states. Some of them can barely run anymore.

I need know though, why Gylfi over Alli? As a Spurs fan who saw them both play for Tottenham, Gylfi doesn't have a fraction of Alli's talent, and Alli is miles ahead physically even at the age of 20.

It's not even really a competition, the only area Gylfi wins in is free kick taking.
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You're seriously underrating Sigurdsson here and/or overrating Alli's current level. There's not much between them right now, and let's not forget Alli had Kane ahead of him, Swansea barely had a proper #9 last season. Sigurdsson did not excel at Spurs but sometimes things just don't work out at a certain club. Bony and Benteke right now are prime examples of good players who've been generally shit for their current teams but are obviously talented players who in the right side can be very effective. Alli has the potential to make any comparison to Sigurdsson out of the question, however at this stage of his career Alli is not better by any substantial amount.
 
We'veGotDeleAlli said:
Wasn't good enough to make that position his own. Wasn't nearly talented enough to take up the position in attacking midfield. Top players take their chances, Alli is going to be a top player and he took his, a much older Gylfi wasn't able to. He didn't assert himself. He didn't look up to par.

Sure, the inconsistency didn't help, but I never even saw flashes of the level of talent that Alli possesses. Not even an ounce of it, and I think any Spurs fan will tell you the same. Eriksen played during the same period and looked just as good as he does now, class shows through. Gylfi wasn't considered good enough and was sold to a mid table side, where he looks very comfortable. I doubt a top side will take a punt on him.

The Euro's is a completely different kettle of fish, I'm talking about the Premier League, over the course of an entire season. Not a few matches.

Different roles, yes, and Alli's role contributes more defensively yet he still produces more going forward. I agree it helps playing with better players, but Sigurdsson did play with better players and was shown up as not being good enough. He got sold because he didn't look a Spurs level player, and none of our fans were at all upset. Sigurdsson is the kind of player who thrives when he is the main man and is given all the set piece duties, not when he's another good player among many. He's in his element at Swansea and was in it at Reading too.

Alli would have played well in pretty much any side last season. That's how talented he is, as for being man marked there were plenty of occasions last season when a team put a man on Alli, or tried to rile him up. He was pretty much our most crucial player in the second half of the season. I wonder if Sigurdsson could ever take on that role for us? Somehow I doubt it.

Immature, sure he is. I'll take immature over ineffective though, which is what Gylfi was for us for the most part. Lot's of excuses about why he didn't succeed here when the bottom line is he wasn't good enough and dropped down to where he's comfortable. Being the main man for Iceland and being the main man for Swansea.
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When he got to play a bit in his last season he was your top scorer for that brief time before he got shunted again. Had nothing to do with not being a top player but everything to do with having 3 different managers coming in and starting things all over again. Remember how rubbish your team was during that time? Mostly the same players though. You rate Lamela now do you? How many chances has he gotten? How much playtime did it take Dembele to settle in. Every single player in Gylfi's time bar Eriksen wasn't doing anything more than him.

Alli is currently in a much better team than Gylfi played for because there's stability in management and tactics. He also has better players around him and doesn't have to play with Adebayor, Soldado, Mason, Paulinho, Sandro etc. Weird how a player that plays week in and week out in his position in an established team can find some form.
 
Snow said:
When he got to play a bit in his last season he was your top scorer for that brief time before he got shunted again. Had nothing to do with not being a top player but everything to do with having 3 different managers coming in and starting things all over again. Remember how rubbish your team was during that time? Mostly the same players though. You rate Lamela now do you? How many chances has he gotten? How much playtime did it take Dembele to settle in. Every single player in Gylfi's time bar Eriksen wasn't doing anything more than him.

Alli is currently in a much better team than Gylfi played for because there's stability in management and tactics. He also has better players around him and doesn't have to play with Adebayor, Soldado, Mason, Paulinho, Sandro etc. Weird how a player that plays week in and week out in his position in an established team can find some form.
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Gylfi didn't get a good run of games in his best position, but anyway he and Alli are very different players, I'm not sure why they are being compared. As for Dembele, what has he got to do with it? But anyway, to answer the question he took zero time to settle in. He was already playing very well for Fulham before joining spurs. Took your midfield apart at Old Trafford while at Fulham, I remember that well.
 
Vicar of Dibbly said:
Gylfi didn't get a good run of games in his best position, but anyway he and Alli are very different players, I'm not sure why they are being compared. As for Dembele, what has he got to do with it? But anyway, to answer the question he took zero time to settle in. He was already playing very well for Fulham before joining spurs. Took your midfield apart at Old Trafford while at Fulham, I remember that well.
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Settle into Tottenham. He wasn't very good for you guys for the first couple of seasons which was my point. They are being compared because I answered OP's question and your Spurs mate took issue with my answer.
 
Okay, I’ll play along and satisfy your need for only talk about Spurs on a United forum.


De Gea, Courtois, Cech, Butland, Schmeichel


Clyne, Sagna, Bellerin, Valencia, Cédric -- Bailly, Koscielny, Kompany, Cahill, van Dijk, Otamendi, Williams, Jagielka -- Shaw, Azpiliqueta, Fuchs, Clichy


Xhaka, Kante, Matic, Fernandinho, Coquelin -- Gündogan, Ramsey, Fabregas, Barkley


Mahrez, Mkhitaryan, Mane, Sané, Musa, Willian -- Pogba, De Bruyne, Silva, Özil, Yaya -- Martial, Payet, Hazard, Sanchez, Coutinho, Tadic


Agüero, Zlatan, Costa, Lukaku​
 
Looking at the players above, the following are positions in which other teams don’t have 4 better players than Spurs’.


Lloris

Walker——CBs——————

————

————————————

Kane

​
 
Lets not kid ourselves just because it's Glaston... Spurs has a good side with pretty good potential. Nowhere near good enough to win the league imo, but still a very solid all around team with no real weakness. Kane is a reliable goalscorer up top though at the same time overrated for me. Eriksen good behind him but not quite good enough that other teams bigger then Spurs would go for him. Basically a lot of their players are in that position. Dele Alli the one with huge potential who the really big teams would try to buy, and Kane of course because of his goal record. The rest, while all good players like Alli, Vertonghen, Alderweireld, Dembele, the wingers, you won't see bigger teams trying to buy them as they have similar to better players.

As for better in each position?
Lloris GK: De Gea, Cech, Courtois.

Walker RB: Bellerin, Valencia (Walker is probably right after this though)
Alderweireld & Vertonghen CB: Koscielny, Smalling (soon to be Bailly :) ). A few others at a similar level
Rose LB: Shaw, Azpilicueta,

Dier & Dembele CM: Pogba, Gundogan, Kante, Matic, Fernandinho, Ramsey, Xhaka, Carrick, Fabregas, Cazorla... Schneiderlin and Herrera I think would also start for them. Pochettino's style makes Dier and Dembele play well together I think. Them 2 are nothing special individually, but work well in a group.

Lamela RW: Mkhitaryan, Mahrez, Willian, De Bruyne (wherever you want him in these 3 positions), probably Sane though no guarantee how he'll fit in
Dele Alli/Eriksen#10: Silva, Firmino, Mane
Eriksen/whoever else LW: Sanchez, Hazard, Martial, Coutinho level probably

Kane ST: Aguero, Ibrahimovic. Equal to Vardy in terms of how each plays for their team.

So there are plenty of better players. Thing is for a lot of them, there isn't much in it or just they suit each other and Pochettino's play style so they have that going for them.
 
We'veGotDeleAlli said:
Haven't you got the memo? Rose is the worst Premier League left-back, and that's including plenty of youth players and our own backup. Who is much better but Pocchetino starts Rose for a laugh.

It's almost like a lot of people in this thread didn't actually watch Rose last season.
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He's not great to be honest. I'd say him and Lamela are the two replaceable players (unless lamela kicks on). It's a good XI elsewhere, though I'm not entirely sure eriksen is best utilised on the left.
 
Snow said:
Settle into Tottenham. He wasn't very good for you guys for the first couple of seasons which was my point. They are being compared because I answered OP's question and your Spurs mate took issue with my answer.
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That is just not true. You are the second poster to say similar without knowing the facts about Dembele. Such comments highlight the fact that non spurs fans don't have knowledge of a particular player/situation and make assumptions to fill in the missing information. Read my post #307 in this thread on Dembele.
 
jungledrums said:
He's not great to be honest. I'd say him and Lamela are the two replaceable players (unless lamela kicks on). It's a good XI elsewhere, though I'm not entirely sure eriksen is best utilised on the left.
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Rose is great though.

Before last season he was very suspect defensively, but brilliant going forward, nobody could have denied that. He's always caused havoc down the left with his pace, agility and stamina. Last season he really sorted out his defensive work (made some crucial, game saving tackles) and positioning. Walker is far more suspect than Rose, I honestly can think of very few mistakes Rose made last season. Walker unfortunately does have lapses in concentration, but he's almost impossible to deal with going forward because of a combination of pace and power. He opens up the pitch brilliantly.

It just feels like people are judging Rose off the past, rather than the present. Pocchetino has made him a much better player. He's now undeniably one of the most underrated players in the entire league I feel, anybody who watches us consistently will see that he is often our most vibrant attacking threat. There isn't a left back in the league I'd take over him except maybe Shaw, but even then Rose is better for our system because he's superior on the overlap.
 
Moussa Dembele whoscored rating last season: 7.69, the 4th highest league. That's ahead of Kante and miles ahead of any other central midfielder in the league.

Again, people are acting as if this is a case of Pocchetino making him look better than he is. The truth is, he's just had Dembele fulfil his potential, nothing more or less. He looked a beast of a player at Fulham but was being played too high up the pitch, then came to us and looked very good in his first season. As has already been noted, he suffered an injury and therefore a couple of inconsistent seasons. When he played a full season for us, he was incredible. Anybody doubting how good he is should watch Tottenham vs Liverpool from last season, he was on another level to anybody else on the pitch.

Martin Jol called him "the best player on the ball I've ever seen" and whilst it's an exaggeration, there's certainly some truth to it. People seem to be under this strange illusion that we could purchase any average player and he could perform Dembele's role in the team, simply because 'our system' makes players look better apparently. This is woefully inaccurate, I'd say Dembele's skillset is one of the major reasons our system can work, and not the other way round.

Watching him play is pretty special. At times he seems to just glide through midfield, making everything look easy. He's a powerhouse with enormous technical quality, meaning trying to get him off the ball is almost an impossibility. He's one of the safest players in possession around. Not as creative as an Eriksen or an Alli, but he opens up the midfield for these players brilliantly. Players are drawn to a magnet like him at times because he just glides his way around them.
 
We'veGotDeleAlli said:
Rose is great though.

Before last season he was very suspect defensively, but brilliant going forward, nobody could have denied that. He's always caused havoc down the left with his pace, agility and stamina. Last season he really sorted out his defensive work (made some crucial, game saving tackles) and positioning. Walker is far more suspect than Rose, I honestly can think of very few mistakes Rose made last season. Walker unfortunately does have lapses in concentration, but he's almost impossible to deal with going forward because of a combination of pace and power. He opens up the pitch brilliantly.

It just feels like people are judging Rose off the past, rather than the present. Pocchetino has made him a much better player. He's now undeniably one of the most underrated players in the entire league I feel, anybody who watches us consistently will see that he is often our most vibrant attacking threat. There isn't a left back in the league I'd take over him except maybe Shaw, but even then Rose is better for our system because he's superior on the overlap.
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Big call about Shaw mate. There's no better left back in the league than Shaw. His work on the overlap is one of his biggest strengths, so I can't agree with you there.
 
jungledrums said:
Big call about Shaw mate. There's no better left back in the league than Shaw. His work on the overlap is one of his biggest strengths, so I can't agree with you there.
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I did say except maybe Shaw. I really rate him, he's better defensively than Rose for sure and of course if I could swap I would, due to age. Rose is a monster on the overlap though, he's genuinely so often our most obvious attacking threat, pulls defenders all over the place.

Very, very underrated player. I can understand people not rating Walker due to his errors, but Rose is much better than Walker IMO and has cut out the mistakes.
 
jungledrums said:
Big call about Shaw mate. There's no better left back in the league than Shaw. His work on the overlap is one of his biggest strengths, so I can't agree with you there.
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The thing with Shaw is that, due to injury, he's so far made just 29 appearances for United ... which is a pretty limited basis on which to proclaim him the best LB in the league. Moreover, as a wingback he's scored 0 goals and made just 2 assists during his professional career so far - 96 appearances. Obviously his primary duty is defence, but even so these stats don't provide much support for claiming he is the best LB in the Prem in terms of his contribution to attack.

Meanwhile, Rose has scored 9 goals and made 10 assists during 182 appearances, which is far higher attacking contribution even taking into account the fact that he's made nearly twice as many appearances than Shaw. And defensively he played a solid part in what was the Prem's joint best defence last season. His being voted the best LB in the Prem last season has solid groundings.

Shaw is a very good LB, but for me he has yet to prove that he's the best LB in the Prem, tho' he has time on his side.
 
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