SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

[jymufc20]

Isn't it also including 40 odd thousand tests that were sent out by post yesterday ?

 

[Alabaster Codify7]

While on the one hand that Ireland roap map looks logical, on the other hand, the fact they are hoping to open up work and business fully by October basically means that by next summer Ireland is going to be hitting the third-world-European ranks alongside the likes of Moldova and such.

If this is actually the plans being set out by developed European countries (it isn't, of course - see every other country exiting lockdown as an example) who have an in-context tiny amount of covid-19 deaths, goodbye Europe.

Luckily, this is worst-case-scenario nonsense that will be fast-tracked by a month or two at each stage as it becomes clear that there's no other way but to do so.

 

[Alabaster Codify7]

20 quid a pop for 3 uses ? I'll pull my shirt over my face and take my chances thanks.

Yep, I'm sticking to my bandanas for the foreseeable and washing them each time I come home. 10 for a fiver. Much better option unless you're splashing on proper top-grade stuff.

 

[Withnail]

While on the one hand that Ireland roap map looks logical, on the other hand, the fact they are hoping to open up work and business fully by October basically means that by next summer Ireland is going to be hitting the third-world-European ranks alongside the likes of Moldova and such.

If this is actually the plans being set out by developed European countries (it isn't, of course - see every other country exiting lockdown as an example) who have an in-context tiny amount of covid-19 deaths, goodbye Europe.

Luckily, this is worst-case-scenario nonsense that will be fast-tracked by a month or two at each stage as it becomes clear that there's no other way but to do so.

That's two people now who have referenced Oct in relation to Ireland.

Am I missing something? From what I've seen the date for the final stage is 10th Aug.

They will keep to the plan unless cases spike and if so they'll revert back to the previous stage.

Based on what the government have said there won't be any considerations beyond saving lives and nothing will be fast-tracked.

 

[Based Adnan]

My work came out and said we can work from home if we want until October. Even when/if the government tells us it's ok to go outside again.

 

[Hugh Jass]

Car dealerships for sales looks like phase 2 (depending on size) or Phase 3

Cheers thanks.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

My work came out and said we can work from home if we want until October. Even when/if the government tells us it's ok to go outside again.

That sounds good. They are thinking about their staff.

 

[Withnail]

My work came out and said we can work from home if we want until October. Even when/if the government tells us it's ok to go outside again.

Mine said working from home will just be an option now where practical, regardless of what happens with the restrictions.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

Doesn't matter. Cummings's minions are spamming the Beeb comments so the narrative will be "shut up, they've done it because the numbers say so" now we'll move on and any reference to this failing in the future will be brushed off with some bullshit soundbite. Politicians aren't held to account for feck all nowadays, and they rarely were in the past

 

[RedRover]

I"m not saying i disagree with every word of course lockdown can't go on for years but you've covered all the standard fox news tropes in there and many aren't true or helpful:

1. Loads already have it anyway - Not true
2. Death rate no worse than flu - again not true
3. We don't lockdown for car deaths - i suppose that's true at least
4. Attack on media for project fear
5. Only the elderly- Missing a very big demographic of vulnerable, i have a few friends in this
6. Youngsters have irrational fear they'll die - not true for 99% they just identify a collective good.

To respond:

1. We don't know how many people have it, or have had it, especially in the UK since its only in the last couple of weeks people who aren't admitted to hospital could get a test. Deaths are dropping but infections are increasing and I suspect a lot of that is down to increased testing identifying more people. I know one or two people who believe they have had it but didn't even go to their GP. That will not be uncommon. And I didn't say that "loads had had it", I made the point that testing for antibodies in numerous parts of the world, whilst not foolproof in their methodology, or necessarily 100% accurate point to far more people having had it than those diagnosed. That is true, you can look it up online. Its also the case that scientists consider may people are asymptomatic. They may, ultimately prove to be incorrect but you cannot say that it is objectively "not true".
2. I didn't say that.
3. My point being that we take fairly small risk every day without thinking about it.
4. My opinion. Very little coverage of positive developments and over reporting of negative stories, often without proper context.
5. My wife is diabetic and falls into that category. She has been told that whilst her risk is increased it is not so to any significant extent and we consider ourselves lucky. She cannot afford to shield herself because of her job but we are as careful as we can be. Some will have to unless and until a vaccine is available but that simply isn't realistic for us all. It would help however, if my wife had to shield further, if I could earn a living to support us.
6. You may well be correct but a lot of what i read on social media suggests otherwise to me. Again, a matter of opinion.

This is clearly a very emotive subject. You have your opinions and fair enough. I am simply being pragmatic about what's coming down the line and the simple fact is, without a vaccine or effective treatment, the world has to keep turning for the good of us all and there is only so much social distancing you can do. I also, genuinely believe that however altruistic people feel now, with the (well earned) respect for Captain Tom and clapping the NHS, people will not put their lives on hold for ever and will soon become exhausted with this. People don't exist to work all week and then sit in their homes all weekend and I'd suggest it's the young (without the commitment of kids etc) and the old (retired and with disposable income) are the most likely to be up in arms about long term limitations which impact on quality of life, with no obvious end in sight.

For the record, I'm not advocating lock down being lifted next week, or in its entirety anytime soon. I want to see a plan which gives us a road map back to normality so that the right measures are in place, whilst balancing all the other obvious issues that need to be addressed.

 

[RedRover]

)

Heard some statistician on the radio say that for most people your chance of dying from Covid 19 is about the same as dying full stop in any given year.

Really? That's interesting.

I must say that I've become quite interested in some of the stats, trying to understand what it means. I look at a Reddit sub (r/COVID19) which is for the scientific discussion and I am very, very out of my depth. It is a more positive place to go however as a lot of people on it are very knowledgeable and it's not just media stories. Some really interesting stuff.

 

[RedRover]

For sure that has to play a role, as will the co-morbidities present in local populations and access to healthcare. Eyeballing this I think the median age in New York is pushing 37/38, which would be younger than the UK and about average for the US in general.

Last week Cuomo came out and said that around 14% of the state's population likely have or had the disease by 24th April. At that point I think the death rate was about 0.11% of the whole population. Assuming the test is accurate this would put the current IFR at just under 0.8% with 2/3 of New York's visible caseload still outstanding. I'm not sure how accurate the test is though. For one thing there's some talk about many people, especially the young, beating the disease without requiring a large number of antibodies. If that's true then the number of New Yorkers silently contracting it would be substantially higher.

The numbers, when you look at deaths are staggering.

The antibody stuff is fascinating. As I said in a post above I've tried to understand some of the science but it's not my bag!

 

[cyberman]

)

Really? That's interesting.

I must say that I've become quite interested in some of the stats, trying to understand what it means. I look at a Reddit sub (r/COVID19) which is for the scientific discussion and I am very, very out of my depth. It is a more positive place to go however as a lot of people on it are very knowledgeable and it's not just media stories. Some really interesting stuff.

Isnt that common sense? This wont kill most people, its the vunerable we are protecting.

 

[RedRover]

Isnt that common sense? This wont kill most people, its the vunerable we are protecting.

In general it is. I found it interesting that its the same as dying form anything over the course of a year.

 

[sullydnl]

That's two people now who have referenced Oct in relation to Ireland.

Am I missing something? From what I've seen the date for the final stage is 10th Aug.

They will keep to the plan unless cases spike and if so they'll revert back to the previous stage.

Based on what the government have said there won't be any considerations beyond saving lives and nothing will be fast-tracked.

Schools and colleges won't open until the end of September or early October. Maybe that's what they're on about.

 

[Hugh Jass]

That's two people now who have referenced Oct in relation to Ireland.

Am I missing something? From what I've seen the date for the final stage is 10th Aug.

They will keep to the plan unless cases spike and if so they'll revert back to the previous stage.

Based on what the government have said there won't be any considerations beyond saving lives and nothing will be fast-tracked.

It will be interesting to see what they do with the pubs. The pubs will go broke if they are kept closed too long.

But then on the other hand, if you open them up, they would be a real beehive for infections.

 

[FootballHQ]

They keep saying that there's weak evidence that they help.

Government is slowly changing its tune now, you had Johnson going on about them yesterday so think it will be essential for June when lockdown will likely be lifted.

 

[Hugh Jass]

While on the one hand that Ireland roap map looks logical, on the other hand, the fact they are hoping to open up work and business fully by October basically means that by next summer Ireland is going to be hitting the third-world-European ranks alongside the likes of Moldova and such.

If this is actually the plans being set out by developed European countries (it isn't, of course - see every other country exiting lockdown as an example) who have an in-context tiny amount of covid-19 deaths, goodbye Europe.

Luckily, this is worst-case-scenario nonsense that will be fast-tracked by a month or two at each stage as it becomes clear that there's no other way but to do so.

True. Osterholm said that shutting down the economy would be worse than the actual virus.

His solution was to "thread the rope through the needle." I think what he implied by this is to do what South Korea is doing. Basically you have infections and possibly spikes but you try to control them as best as possible.

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

Government is slowly changing its tune now, you had Johnson going on about them yesterday so think it will be essential for June when lockdown will likely be lifted.

Whitty needs to make his mind up. There's some talk that wearing them might actually be *worse* for the wearer as they harbour germs. Think I'll give them a miss, like Trump Pence

 

[Pogue Mahone]

While on the one hand that Ireland roap map looks logical, on the other hand, the fact they are hoping to open up work and business fully by October basically means that by next summer Ireland is going to be hitting the third-world-European ranks alongside the likes of Moldova and such.
If this is actually the plans being set out by developed European countries (it isn't, of course - see every other country exiting lockdown as an example) who have an in-context tiny amount of covid-19 deaths, goodbye Europe.

Luckily, this is worst-case-scenario nonsense that will be fast-tracked by a month or two at each stage as it becomes clear that there's no other way but to do so.

Complete and utter horse-shit.

EDIT: Probably could have bolded your entire post. It’s drivel. All of it.

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

It will be interesting to see what they do with the pubs. The pubs will go broke if they are kept closed too long.

But then on the other hand, if you open them up, they would be a real beehive for infections.

Open them but make it clear that social distancing still applies. Limit numbers in there, limit number of drinks, no bar - drinks ordered at table, have to book a table and, at the end of the day, personal responsibility

 

[King Eric 7]

Whitty needs to make his mind up. There's some talk that wearing them might actually be *worse* for the wearer as they harbour germs. Think I'll give them a miss, like Trump Pence

I would have imagined that doing the opposite of what those two numpties are doing would be the most sensible way to go.

 

[Hugh Jass]

Open them but make it clear that social distancing still applies. Limit numbers in there, limit number of drinks, no bar - drinks ordered at table, have to book a table and, at the end of the day, personal responsibility

Yea but if this is spreading by aerosols, just by being in the pub is going to be risky.

Maybe use the beer gardens outside.

Personally i dont think this road map will go to plan. We will see another spike and then i am unsure what the government will do because they cannot shut down the economy for too long.

Hopefully that vaccine in Oxford works or some other drug works wonders.

 

[cyberman]

Open them but make it clear that social distancing still applies. Limit numbers in there, limit number of drinks, no bar - drinks ordered at table, have to book a table and, at the end of the day, personal responsibility

These measures kills most pubs anyway. A pub owner was on the radio a few weeks ago saying their pub would be at 1/8 capacity by following social distancing.
Imagine going out for a pint on your own and taking up a table by yourself with everyone 6 feet away. You may as well sit at home. You cant even join up with a mate to sit with you

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

These measures kills most pubs anyway. A pub owner was on the radio a few weeks ago saying their pub would be at 1/8 capacity by following social distancing.
Imagine going out for a pint on your own and taking up a table by yourself with everyone 6 feet away. You may as well sit at home. You cant even join up with a mate to sit with you

I think this sort of thing will be relaxed soon.

 

[FootballHQ]

Open them but make it clear that social distancing still applies. Limit numbers in there, limit number of drinks, no bar - drinks ordered at table, have to book a table and, at the end of the day, personal responsibility

I've been in many city and town centre pubs at 1-2pm on a weekday having a later lunch with 5-6 people sat close by in a seating area of 30-40. In those times of the day most that aren't a Nandos or Wetherspoons could comfortably implement a table service at least imo. The reality is all you do is a beer order at the table when you walk in and sit down.

There is actually a pub in Nottingham city centre called Squares which has been doing table service for years and is reasonably busy whenever I'm visiting there.

The problem would obviously be Friday and Saturday evenings but then that whole culture is going to have to be put on hold for 12 months as impossible to manage in the present climate so I don't know how many pubs could survive with a business model like that, plenty of those tiny street corner boozers don't bother with food.

Also many pubs rely on a football/sports crowd so that likely won't be an option for next few months and will probably be the same discouragement of showing games as was in early March if people can remember the advice that far back.

 

[Port Vale Devil]

These measures kills most pubs anyway. A pub owner was on the radio a few weeks ago saying their pub would be at 1/8 capacity by following social distancing.
Imagine going out for a pint on your own and taking up a table by yourself with everyone 6 feet away. You may as well sit at home. You cant even join up with a mate to sit with you

Yeah I think pubs are fecked to be honest with people being scared and the social distancing aspect that most pubs cannot adhere to apart from the big chains like Wetherspoons.


What do you guys think that will be the other big industries that will be affected most by the Coronavirus?

 

[cyberman]

Yea but if this is spreading by aerosols, just by being in the pub is going to be risky.

Maybe use the beer gardens outside.

Personally i dont think this road map will go to plan. We will see another spike and then i am unsure what the government will do because they cannot shut down the economy for too long.

Hopefully that vaccine in Oxford works or some other drug works wonders.

Its doomed to fail. As soon as the Labour leader asked for Boris to treat the nation as adults and explain the process going forward, I knew FG would wouldnt be slow to jump on the idea.
Its a bluff. We arent that forward thinking and admit we wsit for results of other countries actions before taking our own.

 

[Hugh Jass]

Yeah I think pubs are fecked to be honest with people being scared and the social distancing aspect that most pubs cannot adhere to apart from the big chains like Wetherspoons.


What do you guys think that will be the other big industries that will be affected most by the Coronavirus?

Would not go near a barber shop for two years. Wont be getting on a plane for two years either. Or public transport.

Reading today that the amount of people buying cars has decreased by 90 something percent. In two months time they will be throwing deals at people.

 

[Hugh Jass]

Its doomed to fail. As soon as the Labour leader asked for Boris to treat the nation as adults and explain the process going forward, I knew FG would wouldnt be slow to jump on the idea.
Its a bluff. We arent that forward thinking and admit we wsit for results of other countries actions before taking our own.

The new road map plan?

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

Yeah I think pubs are fecked to be honest with people being scared and the social distancing aspect that most pubs cannot adhere to apart from the big chains like Wetherspoons.


What do you guys think that will be the other big industries that will be affected most by the Coronavirus?

They will have to do something, our whole culture as a country is built around pubs. No Government wants to be the one that let that die.

 

[Sweet Square]

What do you guys think that will be the other big industries that will be affected most by the Coronavirus?

Tattoo shops have to be very worried, right now.

 

[Port Vale Devil]

Would not go near a barber shop for two years. Wont be getting on a plane for two years either. Or public transport.

Reading today that the amount of people buying cars has decreased by 90 something percent. In two months time they will be throwing deals at people.

Good call on barbers. A lot of people have been having their partners cut/shave their nut and with the close contact that comes with it also.

Surely gym memberships will fall with everyone using the same equipment unless you have staff sanitising it after every use.

Cruise ships and Airlines are surely fecked for the foreseeable as hundreds/thousands in a small space for hours/days upon end is surely unacceptable.

Restaurants that do buffets would surely be hit hard but on the other hand there will be more deliveries and table service if they can accommodate social distancing.

 

[Hugh Jass]

Good call on barbers. A lot of people have been having their partners cut/shave their nut and with the close contact that comes with it also.

Surely gym memberships will fall with everyone using the same equipment unless you have staff sanitising it after every use.

Cruise ships and Airlines are surely fecked for the foreseeable as hundreds/thousands in a small space for hours/days upon end is surely unacceptable.

Restaurants that do buffets would surely be hit hard but on the other hand there will be more deliveries and table service if they can accommodate social distancing.

Luckily, i have my own hair clippers and just shave it off once every two months. I was looking for the fun of it on Argos at hair clippers and coincidentally they are all out of stock. That was the Irish Argos so i assume the Uk Argos is the same.

Yea i agree about gyms. With people breathing so heavily, it would be madness to go into one.

Michael O leary was saying he expects flights to resume in June/july. I think the numbers will be down significantly though. I dont think going on a three hour flight to alicante would be wise either. So that and like you say the cruise ships will take a hit.

How long do you think this will last? I think till perhaps Feburary or March next year we are with this. Some experts think it will be longer.

 

[gormless]

Yeah I think pubs are fecked to be honest with people being scared and the social distancing aspect that most pubs cannot adhere to apart from the big chains like Wetherspoons.


What do you guys think that will be the other big industries that will be affected most by the Coronavirus?

I think you’re underestimating the stupidity of a large amount of the British public. Just look at the Friday Boris gave us all advance warning.

There are pubs open now secretly, and as soon as they all open, a lot of people will flock to them.

 

[cyberman]

The new road map plan?

Yep. I believe the phases are in good faith but the timetable hasnt a hope of being kept to.
Its something for the public to aim for, to have a finishing line in sight

 

[Hugh Jass]

Tattoo shops have to be very worried, right now.

I would say the list would be long. Dentists in Ireland have lost 90% of work.

In times of crisis people start hoarding money, like a war for example, so they stop spending. But this is almost worst than war. People are afraid to go into another persons house.

 

[Hugh Jass]

Yep. I believe the phases are in good faith but the timetable hasnt a hope of being kept to.
Its something for the public to aim for, to have a finishing line in sight

I agree totally. For one i cannot see them policing everyone correctly. And two, i expect another spike come late July, early August.

I think as well at that point the government will just say "feck it; what can we do."

I mean what is it, 600,000 people out of work at the moment. The economy cannot sustain that.

 

[Sweet Square]

I would say the list would be long. Dentists in Ireland have lost 90% of work.

In times of crisis people start hoarding money, like a war for example, so they stop spending. But this is almost worst than war. People are afraid to go into another persons house.

Good point. Even if we get very low levels of infections and deaths, people will still be very scared to start behaving as normal.

 

[Withnail]

Its doomed to fail. As soon as the Labour leader asked for Boris to treat the nation as adults and explain the process going forward, I knew FG would wouldnt be slow to jump on the idea.
Its a bluff. We arent that forward thinking and admit we wsit for results of other countries actions before taking our own.

Hang on. We've done very well so far, and I don't see what's so wrong about learning from the experiences of other countries. Best practice is to analyse what has and hasn't worked for others in similar situations and to act accordingly.

We seem to have a logical plan and it's quite likely we'll have to take a backwards step here or there.
However, given each stage is set at three weeks then it's got that margin for error built in so we can gauge how the situation develops.

How you can say we've jumped on Boris's bandwagon when they've clearly been behind us on this thing at every stage is bizarre.