Its been going on for quite a few decades, no one will notice the difference...
SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)
- Thread starter Don't Kill Bill
- Start date
Its been going on for quite a few decades, no one will notice the difference...
Unless the advice changed, you only have to quarantine if you feel symptoms. Automatic quarantine was only for people returning from China and Italy. This could have changed in the past few days though.
I was keeping an eye on this, as I was supposed to be going to Thailand as part of a trip at the end of April, and wanted to know the situation.
I've not specifically been told that people returning from overseas should enforce 'quarantine' and what that exactly entails. Was certainly not given any instructions at airport or from Government since.
I'm really not sure what the protocol is and for whom. It's the only time I went out as I needed to buy some food essentials. But if you're right, thanks for pointing out, and will strictly enforce from now on.
I think there is a communications issue here in UK. ie: quarantine vs self isolation vs social isolation vs physical distancing; what each actually entails and for whom it's applicable.
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They know this. Hence they've adopted an incremental approach since day one, to minimise resistance and control the situation as calmly as possible.
"Take it on the chin"/herd immunity > some measures > slightly stronger measures > lockdown-ish.
The same will apply for lockdown itself.
"3 weeks and constant reviewing" > 3 more weeks > setting a deadline for lockdown to release which is 2 weeks away.
So basically, an 8week quarantine/lockdown. Same as some other countries. But try telling our population on day 1 they're locked down for 2months. Slow, steady increments while dangling a carrot is the way forward.
Yeah, you're right, but not to this extent (past 5-10 years).
Gun to head?
I think the opposite. One thing world governments do is use a catastrophe to their advantage. If they can slip in a new rule or restriction to favour them, they will.
This is a government that was strongly rumoured to be trying to bring in private healthcare while consistently underfunding the NHS.
What is more likely? Be honest here
A) Boris coming out and essentially saying "We were wrong all along. This crisis has proven how vital our NHS is. We have screwed up, here."
B) Boris coming out and saying "as proud as we are, this has been proof of how inadequate and inefficient a public health service is. Private healthcare and the funding it would bring, would have nailed this virus">
Sorry, but it's B.
It’s just common sense. Travel accounts for a lot of chance for infection. You don’t have to show symptoms to be infected. You will be infecting others unknowingly. If you travel you should self-quarantine - no buts. It’s the right thing to do.
I think that we might avoid that. The measures in place have come late but not too late as to warrant us moving into a full lockdown. It would take something really drastic, like a total moron coming back from someplace like, oh I dunno, let's say Thailand, and just immediately wandering around town instead of self isolating for two weeks. But I don't think anyone is as stupid as to do something as dumb as that.
ffs
Mate, anorexia isn't just "she looks a bit thin, innit?" It's a serious medical diagnosis with a lot of different factors. The idea that fergieisold off the internet can look at her Facebook and conclude "yep, definitely anorexia" is patently absurd. Maybe she did have anorexia. Maybe she had something else. Maybe she had some completely unrelated heart condition. Speculating based on the Facebook profile of a dead girl is more than a bit pointless. We can't know.
Sorry, but 'common sense' wont do here; different people have different standards of 'common sense'.
I'm now very confused and need specific Government guidance, which I'll gladly enforce and follow. Please show me that.
Fair enough on communication. I had an employee who was in Florida and returned to Canada. She and all her family family are in self quarantine now. Their friends buy their essentials for them. I know that might be dififcult for many people. But we all have to do what is needed to get out of this freaking nightmare.
I didn't say he shouldn't do it. I just pointed out that the government advice doesn't say they have to. In fact, it was quite clear on the fact that you didn't need to.
I agree, it makes sense to, but you can't tell someone they're in the wrong for following government advice.
I've no problem enduring difficulty and happy to join the collective nightmare... I've simply not been told by Government to enter strict quarantine.
Yes, we have a quarantine act that's always in effect if you return to Canada and look seriously ill but due to COVID-19 it's been publicly stated that if you return to Canada from abroad you must self-quarantine for 14 days. If you're caught breaking this you face fines and possibly jail time.
My sister was working in the US and came back before the order but her employer instructed her to self quarantine for 14 days.
People need to calm down with the trajectories as if it's a fecking competition. There's very little use in looking at them as the speed in early accelerations will differ so pick you can pick whatever arbitrary point you want to alter the lines.
The only important bit is when each country starts to flatten.
The only important bit is when each country starts to flatten.
Again, please show me instructions from our Government where Im asked to quarantine!
Until we went into lock down the was a government page listing countries into two categories, category one was mainly China and Italy, anyone returning from these counties had to go into self isolation no matter what.
Category 2 countries included most of Asia, including Thailand, for these countries you were advised to keep a close eye on yourself and self isolate at the first signs of any illness. Which was / is basically the advice for everyone anyway.
The site got taken down recently, so I don't know the advice as of today.
Thats also what I was aware of, the day I left Thailand, but according to experts above, I'm not following Government advice.
Yeah we really need a more broader set of communication and protocol across the world. I hear you. But really looking at how infectious this virus is and the tricky nature of it - I hope everyone just does what they can to minimize it’s spread. I have 2 teenagers at home. One gets it. The other thinks it’s ok to go and see his girlfriend the odd day. It is stressing all of us out!
Trump stating that he had a call with Boris Johnson and said the first thing he said before hello was ‘We need ventilators’. Taking it with a pinch of salt. (Source - BBC Live story on Covid19)
I think as long as you're being sensible and following the rules we all have to live by now, then you can't do much more.
Obviously having been abroad, be a bit more aware, even more conscious of whether you could have something, or whether you need anything from the shop etc.
It gives a clear indication on capacity for a incoming peak. Italy has more ICU’s than the UK, and if our peak is bigger then you can almost predict the challenges. Utilising the existing data from other countries is equally important on seeing if their measures are working.
If you only look at the data when the cases start to flatline then you’re already too late.
Pretty much sums it up.
https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...ing-travellers-or-visitors-arriving-in-the-uk
then this
https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...-with-possible-coronavirus-covid-19-infection
According to Government laws and advice, which I take very seriously, I can't see what I've done wrong.
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Officially, nothing. If i had just flown, i would probably acknowledge that the percentage rate of contact with Covid19 is higher than most. No harm in a precautionary measures, if only for those that could come into contact with you.
Extended version for the guys response? You could almost see him disintegrate before your eyes.
Don't disagree with that it's useful for modelling weeks ahead. I'm mainly arguing against comparisons of who has it worse based on arbitrary starting points. At such low numbers there's going to be a great variance in when exponential growth kicks off and the rate, these things can change quickly.
Aaaaand I just found out that my dad's factory has been deemed "essential" as one of the things they make is part of medical protective equipment. Now I've got 2 folks to worry about.
Can you please explain how ?Jeez, for the people wishing death on Boris is one thing
But you guys should be aware that Raab is a far more terrifying prospect as PM
And for the grass is greener brigade, on the flipside, in another universe we could have ended up with Diane Abbott as PM....
(Remember I am not a British).
I just checked WHO's Facebok page and there's been hardly anything special for days there.
Rant ON
Anyone else annoyed that we hardly know anything new on the virus, timeline of the symptoms, some new symptomes maybe, and stuff like that, and it's basically been long period now since the world has been hit? Today I read one doctor saying that the patients admitted all had something different in their eyes, the white colour wasn't white, it was more red with some shades or something like that, he said it was difficult to describe but he says he could pretty much notice which patients were infected with the virus from few samples. But that's one isolated case I read, maybe it's not even correct, but what about other experiences from the doctors, we hardly heard anything from the China or Italy?
There are many people who've had it one months ago, and hardly anyone is sharing situation with their lungs, maybe some short term problems, etc. I mean, people and recovered patients are in their houses, what else are they doing except writing stupid posts on social media? I don't get how we aren't getting more stories and experiences from China or Italy. You would think people in China have internet.
Also, by the looks of it there are many reports from not so loud hospitals that the tests are really tricky and showing lots of false positives. What about test themselves, how much do they cost, how effective and correct they are, and which companies are making them? How much tests they can make tests in next few weeks, next few months? What about companies that make respirators, etc.
What about the virus, aside from non official stories about it's spread on different materials, how easy it is to share it in let's say a supermarket? What else is there to be extra careful except washing your hands? Washing your hands is literally the only guide WHO gave to an average person. How about some interactive videos about using gloves, how do dispose them, how to threat our clothes, our hair, etc? What exactly is killing people, do we have some filter for all those people that have died, I cannot believe that with all modern equipment we still haven't at least found what makes certain people so vulnerable, surely that's minimum what science should know by now?
How many Chinese have been in Europe and in which places? There's that video from USA and Florida(?) and people's locations based on their phones and locations, why aren't we getting that from China? China has the best surveilence of their citizens in the world, and yet we aren't getting any details from them about all this situation?
Sorry for the longer post, I(and probably many people here) am getting seriously annoyed about lack of some crucial information, and by the looks of it lack of preparedness from (at least) modern world about all this. We get Ronaldo's heatmap and number of sprints per game, we have 10 cameras and 1000 paparazzis following him everywhere, but after 3 full months of this shite we have no idea why people die except that it attacks lungs, all while some people have no symptoms at all while some random people just die. The world looks nowhere near ready for this virus even though scientistist expected it to happen, and not just that, but few months into it we absolutely have no new information, we are basically on level of information from mid January, except the pointless statistics that is mostly wrong too, considering the testing varies from country to country.
I have no idea what goverments all around the world expect from lockdowns, but I seriously think lockdowns won't last much for many people, there will be mental cases, there will be hungry people who will want to find food for their family, there will be people who just can't take it anymore, there are many people living alone that will need help, they won't last long alone, etc. People will ask for answers and solution to this, I am pretty sure people will start risking their lives if this continues. I mean, we had 2 patients escaping the hospital today here, we had people fighting for flour yesterday, and we had two guys fighting police tonight, all while our country actually took the lockdown pretty well and calm, but what will happen in more populated countries?
End of the rant
Rant ON
Anyone else annoyed that we hardly know anything new on the virus, timeline of the symptoms, some new symptomes maybe, and stuff like that, and it's basically been long period now since the world has been hit? Today I read one doctor saying that the patients admitted all had something different in their eyes, the white colour wasn't white, it was more red with some shades or something like that, he said it was difficult to describe but he says he could pretty much notice which patients were infected with the virus from few samples. But that's one isolated case I read, maybe it's not even correct, but what about other experiences from the doctors, we hardly heard anything from the China or Italy?
There are many people who've had it one months ago, and hardly anyone is sharing situation with their lungs, maybe some short term problems, etc. I mean, people and recovered patients are in their houses, what else are they doing except writing stupid posts on social media? I don't get how we aren't getting more stories and experiences from China or Italy. You would think people in China have internet.
Also, by the looks of it there are many reports from not so loud hospitals that the tests are really tricky and showing lots of false positives. What about test themselves, how much do they cost, how effective and correct they are, and which companies are making them? How much tests they can make tests in next few weeks, next few months? What about companies that make respirators, etc.
What about the virus, aside from non official stories about it's spread on different materials, how easy it is to share it in let's say a supermarket? What else is there to be extra careful except washing your hands? Washing your hands is literally the only guide WHO gave to an average person. How about some interactive videos about using gloves, how do dispose them, how to threat our clothes, our hair, etc? What exactly is killing people, do we have some filter for all those people that have died, I cannot believe that with all modern equipment we still haven't at least found what makes certain people so vulnerable, surely that's minimum what science should know by now?
How many Chinese have been in Europe and in which places? There's that video from USA and Florida(?) and people's locations based on their phones and locations, why aren't we getting that from China? China has the best surveilence of their citizens in the world, and yet we aren't getting any details from them about all this situation?
Sorry for the longer post, I(and probably many people here) am getting seriously annoyed about lack of some crucial information, and by the looks of it lack of preparedness from (at least) modern world about all this. We get Ronaldo's heatmap and number of sprints per game, we have 10 cameras and 1000 paparazzis following him everywhere, but after 3 full months of this shite we have no idea why people die except that it attacks lungs, all while some people have no symptoms at all while some random people just die. The world looks nowhere near ready for this virus even though scientistist expected it to happen, and not just that, but few months into it we absolutely have no new information, we are basically on level of information from mid January, except the pointless statistics that is mostly wrong too, considering the testing varies from country to country.
I have no idea what goverments all around the world expect from lockdowns, but I seriously think lockdowns won't last much for many people, there will be mental cases, there will be hungry people who will want to find food for their family, there will be people who just can't take it anymore, there are many people living alone that will need help, they won't last long alone, etc. People will ask for answers and solution to this, I am pretty sure people will start risking their lives if this continues. I mean, we had 2 patients escaping the hospital today here, we had people fighting for flour yesterday, and we had two guys fighting police tonight, all while our country actually took the lockdown pretty well and calm, but what will happen in more populated countries?
End of the rant
In case any of ye are wondering exactly what cocooning entails.
Yes a slip of the tongue, I mean Covid19.
Vaccines for SARS were being developed and progressing well, but when it disappeared of it's own accord they all stopped, there was no point carrying on.
MERS has only ever infected a few thousand people and doesnt spread well, so again there is no incentive.
Whoever develops a vaccine for this outbreak will make billions.
Canada is handling this much better than the UK is. Ford has done a decent job in Ontario imo.
How’re you holding up mate?
Excellent, thank you for the explanation. And making it easy enough for me to understand!
Sorry if posted already. This thread is moving way too fast. Small study, somewhat known, but now published.
Objective To determine whether convalescent plasma transfusion may be beneficial in the treatment of critically ill patients with severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) infection.
Results All 5 patients (age range, 36-65 years; 2 women) were receiving mechanical ventilation at the time of treatment and all had received antiviral agents and methylprednisolone. Following plasma transfusion, body temperature normalized within 3 days in 4 of 5 patients, the SOFA score decreased, and Pao2/Fio2 increased within 12 days (range, 172-276 before and 284-366 after). Viral loads also decreased and became negative within 12 days after the transfusion, and SARS-CoV-2–specific ELISA and neutralizing antibody titers increased following the transfusion (range, 40-60 before and 80-320 on day 7). ARDS resolved in 4 patients at 12 days after transfusion, and 3 patients were weaned from mechanical ventilation within 2 weeks of treatment. Of the 5 patients, 3 have been discharged from the hospital (length of stay: 53, 51, and 55 days), and 2 are in stable condition at 37 days after transfusion
Objective To determine whether convalescent plasma transfusion may be beneficial in the treatment of critically ill patients with severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) infection.
Results All 5 patients (age range, 36-65 years; 2 women) were receiving mechanical ventilation at the time of treatment and all had received antiviral agents and methylprednisolone. Following plasma transfusion, body temperature normalized within 3 days in 4 of 5 patients, the SOFA score decreased, and Pao2/Fio2 increased within 12 days (range, 172-276 before and 284-366 after). Viral loads also decreased and became negative within 12 days after the transfusion, and SARS-CoV-2–specific ELISA and neutralizing antibody titers increased following the transfusion (range, 40-60 before and 80-320 on day 7). ARDS resolved in 4 patients at 12 days after transfusion, and 3 patients were weaned from mechanical ventilation within 2 weeks of treatment. Of the 5 patients, 3 have been discharged from the hospital (length of stay: 53, 51, and 55 days), and 2 are in stable condition at 37 days after transfusion
The lockdowns are desperate attempts to stem the tide from the first wave, in order for our governments to buy themselves a bit of time while figuring out how to progress from here. Right now, it's every country for itself, but I hope that the coming months will see a more sophisticated effort to combine the efforts, especially when it comes to production of essential equipment and protective gear for health workers.
As for people not coping with solitude, I'm afraid these things are collateral damage in the war we're battling now. In most of Europe, we just have to accept that this spring and summer won't be anything like what we're used to. As long as there's enough food to go around, we should be okay. I'm quite sure that the toughest measures will be lifted, and people will be able to move around a bit more freely on their own.
In Africa and parts of Asia, on the other hand, I have no idea how they are going to cope.
The main method of spreading is through droplets - coughing and sneezing primarily - so even if asymptomatic people are able to pass the disease on they won't very often especially if we all follow hygiene and social distancing guidelines
The sooner we have ELISA testing the better, preferably in a panel alongside PCR simple positive/negative. Ideally, we need them quickly and en-masse.
Whoever’s behind red issue is a fecking weird bastard
I am sure you have read the Hammer and Dance article. Why do you think there will be a second wave?