SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

People are still advocating more lockdowns :lol: complete looney tunes.
It’s been categorically proven you don’t need a lockdown to get over a wave of Covid, yet plenty of you absolutely lap it up. It surely at this stage has to be that many in fact enjoy lockdown?
Would you be alright living in & out of lockdown forever? It’s mindblowing for someone who has never experienced lockdown or mask mandate.
 
What are the chances that a mutated strain could reinfect a recently recovered Covid patient? Is bypassing the vaccine the same as bypassing natural antibodies?
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
People are still advocating more lockdowns :lol: complete looney tunes.
It’s been categorically proven you don’t need a lockdown to get over a wave of Covid, yet plenty of you absolutely lap it up. It surely at this stage has to be that many in fact enjoy lockdown?
Would you be alright living in & out of lockdown forever? It’s mindblowing for someone who has never experienced lockdown or mask mandate.
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Where are you??
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
People are still advocating more lockdowns :lol: complete looney tunes.
It’s been categorically proven you don’t need a lockdown to get over a wave of Covid, yet plenty of you absolutely lap it up. It surely at this stage has to be that many in fact enjoy lockdown?
Would you be alright living in & out of lockdown forever? It’s mindblowing for someone who has never experienced lockdown or mask mandate.
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Not true. Other than in certain very specific circumstances. Unless we’re all imagining hospital systems getting completely overwhelmed in many different countries all over the world (including some European countries right now)
 
groovyalbert said:
What are the chances that a mutated strain could reinfect a recently recovered Covid patient? Is bypassing the vaccine the same as bypassing natural antibodies?
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Probably. That’s the most likely explanation for the current surge in South Africa after the delta wave was ended more by natural immunity than vaccines (only 25% vaccinated)
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Not true. Other than in certain very specific circumstances. Unless we’re all imagining hospital systems getting completely overwhelmed in many different countries all over the world (including some European countries right now)
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Tell you what would have been a novel idea, spend some of those utter insane lockdown costs that have ran into the hundreds of billions and the past two years on actually improving hospitals, building new ones, training new nurses and hugely increasing pay in the health sector.
Instead it’s the same short term attempts at a quick fix.
And yes, it has been proven.
 
groovyalbert said:
Where are you??
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In a place that thankfully doesn’t lose it’s mind when covid cases rise, and understands that the rise simply cannot continue exponentially where 80% of the country all have the same virus at the same time. It works in waves, like all other viruses.

Honestly, looking on here closing in on two years I wanna fecking scream, we’re finally getting back to normal, I took my oldest daughter home for the first time last week which was great. Yet the stupid as feck and economy crippling short term fix of a lockdown is being advocated again by loads. Do people realise this is forever? Surely you’ve all understood the inevitability of it all by now?

People should be screaming from the fecking rooftops at those making decisions telling them to think long term for a change and build a health system with these billions than can actually fecking deal with it, instead of wasting monumental amounts of money on short term thinking.
 
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Pogue Mahone said:
Probably. That’s the most likely explanation for the current surge in South Africa after the delta wave was ended more by natural immunity than vaccines (only 25% vaccinated)
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That could be very dangerous for those getting over a bad bout of Delta/compromised immune system if so.
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
Tell you what would have been a novel idea, spend some of those utter insane lockdown costs that have ran into the hundreds of billions and the past two years on actually improving hospitals, building new ones, training new nurses and hugely increasing pay in the health sector.
Instead it’s the same short term attempts at a quick fix.
And yes, it has been proven.
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No. It hasn’t. At least have the decency to read posts before replying.

You also don’t seem to understand the timeframes involved in building (and, crucially, staffing) a load of new hospitals.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Probably. That’s the most likely explanation for the current surge in South Africa after the delta wave was ended more by natural immunity than vaccines (only 25% vaccinated)
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South Africa also has another massive complication when it comes to looking at their data. About 20% of SA adults are HIV+ and not all of them are in a drug controlled stable condition.

However many people have been previously infected or vaccinated in SA, the number of people who are actually resistant to infection may be relatively low. Relatively in this context meaning that covid rates can run high in a country like the UK where more than 90% of the population have antibodies, so more than 10% susceptible will still allow rapid growth.

Any kind of additional immune evasion from the new variants will be very visible. Plus, I think SA have mostly used J&J which hasn't had the greatest effectiveness numbers against infection. Hopefully the protection against hospitalisations and deaths is better.

Edited to say: apparently about 6m people have had J&J and about 9m have had Pfizer in SA of a population of 68m.
 
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Latest I've heard, obviously changing by the hour:
  • More contagious than Delta
  • More likely to evade immediate immune response i.e. higher risk of infection, and particularly re-infection for those with natural immunity
  • T-cells are key, and likely to protect against severe infection (hospitalisation and death)
Bottom line: we won't know for several weeks, but first signs are vaccination is key.
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
People are still advocating more lockdowns :lol: complete looney tunes.
It’s been categorically proven you don’t need a lockdown to get over a wave of Covid, yet plenty of you absolutely lap it up. It surely at this stage has to be that many in fact enjoy lockdown?
Would you be alright living in & out of lockdown forever? It’s mindblowing for someone who has never experienced lockdown or mask mandate.
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Where’s the proof? Maybe substantiate a claim before making it.
 
711 said:
Sorry to be lazy but are there any stats on whether vaccinated people are easily infected, and the chances of hospitalisation if they are?
edit: should have asked @jojojo of course, the man's an information superstar of galactic proportion.
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:smirk:

Can't even pretend to know the answer, because I don't think anyone has the numbers yet. Now SA and Botswana have identified it and alerted the scientific community to the risks, they'll all be digging deeper.

The fact that it (like Alpha but unlike Delta) has a mutation that certain PCR tests can spot will mean that labs globally will be on alert, looking for any recent rises in the proportion of PCR "dropout" tests. We'll know more, literally within days. Because more people will start the delicate business of linking tests to people's vaccine status and to their previous PCR history.

What we hear next and from who will really depends on how far it has spread, but SA has strong data analysis teams - so I think we'll get updates from them regularly now.
 
jojojo said:
South Africa also has another massive complication when it comes to looking at their data. About 20% of SA adults are HIV+ and not all of them are in a drug controlled stable condition.

However many people have been previously infected or vaccinated in SA, the number of people who are actually resistant to infection may be relatively low. Relatively in this context meaning that covid rates can run high in a country like the UK where more than 90% of the population have antibodies, so more than 10% susceptible will still allow rapid growth.

Any kind of additional immune evasion from the new variants will be very visible. Plus, I think SA have mostly used J&J which hasn't had the greatest effectiveness numbers against infection. Hopefully the protection against hospitalisations and deaths is better.

Edited to say: apparently about 6m people have had J&J and about 9m have had Pfizer in SA of a population of 68m.
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The HIV thing is interesting. After the theory that Alpha developed from a prolonged infection in an immune compromised patient you’d have to wonder if the same is true here.
 
WPMUFC said:
https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-detects-first-case-of-new-highly-mutated-covid-19-strain/

Here we go :( :(
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The amount of travel around the world, day by day, hour by hour, kind of blows your mind. You could go to every major capital city in the world and see at least one, often several, flights from South Africa coming in to land every day. And from almost every other country you can think of. It’s a head melter when it comes to containing this fecking thing.

Makes you wonder if the “delta wave” slamming most of Europe might already be partially “nu wave” (coincidentally, also a genre of not very good music)
 
Do you reckon that governments around the world will start to remove some of the "benefits" of being fully vaccinated? Particularly when it comes to travel and quarantines?

Personally I think this might be a bad decision long-term as it might create a sharp increase in vaccine skepticism, which is the last thing we need now. Plenty of people have only taken the vaccine for the "benefits". Can you imagine their reaction if only a few months after the second doze they lose all/most of these benefits? Then there are those who were scared of the vaccine and needed a lot of convincing.
 
OleBoiii said:
Do you reckon that governments around the world will start to remove some of the "benefits" of being fully vaccinated? Particularly when it comes to travel and quarantines?

Personally I think this might be a bad decision long-term as it might create a sharp increase in vaccine skepticism, which is the last thing we need now. Plenty of people have only taken the vaccine for the "benefits". Can you imagine their reaction if only a few months after the second doze they lose all/most of these benefits? Then there are those who were scared of the vaccine and needed a lot of convincing.
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Can't see that happening too much but certain things like going to football matches might be restricted. I think we'll see more restrictions for those who aren't quarantined like in Austria and Italy.
 
Can we call this one Iota and then people can make jokes about not giving one Iota about this stupid new variant. We'll all love it for the next year in lockdown.
 
Had to call an ambulance for my son on Tuesday night, temperature through the roof, hallucinations, extreme pain, all due to covid. Covid has ripped through our household despite me being double jabbed and my wife being booster jabbed.

The ambulance paramedics (who I must say were amazing) stated categorically that every Covid case that has needed hospitalisation that they have attended have been for unvaccinated people!

Just seems strange why people still won't get vaccinated!
 
OleBoiii said:
Do you reckon that governments around the world will start to remove some of the "benefits" of being fully vaccinated? Particularly when it comes to travel and quarantines?

Personally I think this might be a bad decision long-term as it might create a sharp increase in vaccine skepticism, which is the last thing we need now. Plenty of people have only taken the vaccine for the "benefits". Can you imagine their reaction if only a few months after the second doze they lose all/most of these benefits? Then there are those who were scared of the vaccine and needed a lot of convincing.
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Will happen in Holland within 6 months I think.
 
Champ said:
Had to call an ambulance for my son on Tuesday night, temperature through the roof, hallucinations, extreme pain, all due to covid. Covid has ripped through our household despite me being double jabbed and my wife being booster jabbed.

The ambulance paramedics (who I must say were amazing) stated categorically that every Covid case that has needed hospitalisation that they have attended have been for unvaccinated people!

Just seems strange why people still won't get vaccinated!
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Sorry to hear that mate, hope your son is okay. Must be extra tough when people close to you get that affected by the virus.
 
It’s a matter of time before this new variant gets to the UK and is the dominant strain. Then, if the current vaccines are not effective, we will be back to square one, with a long lockdown whilst a new vaccine is developed and rolled out, starting with the most vulnerable. And, the problem is this time, the Government has already said it can’t afford another round of Furlough / self employment support grants so we'll be on our own.
 
Not gonna lie, this new variant has got me more nervous about covid than any other other news in the last year or so.
 
Champ said:
Had to call an ambulance for my son on Tuesday night, temperature through the roof, hallucinations, extreme pain, all due to covid. Covid has ripped through our household despite me being double jabbed and my wife being booster jabbed.

The ambulance paramedics (who I must say were amazing) stated categorically that every Covid case that has needed hospitalisation that they have attended have been for unvaccinated people!

Just seems strange why people still won't get vaccinated!
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Hope your son gets better soon! What age is he?
 
Let’s hope for the best folks

I agree that we should be proactive though, mask mandates; work from home where possible etc

just had a thought, the Irish rugby team are stuck out on SA at the moment, be interesting to see how that’s dealt with
 
golden_blunder said:
Hope your son gets better soon! What age is he?
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Thanks,

He is 8 years old,

The one thing that has really troubled me about this virus is how quick it went from no symptoms to full on.
 
golden_blunder said:
Let’s hope for the best folks

I agree that we should be proactive though, mask mandates; work from home where possible etc

just had a thought, the Irish rugby team are stuck out on SA at the moment, be interesting to see how that’s dealt with
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Theres loads of Golfers stuck out there too!!
 
Fecks sake this is bad news. So many been killed by Covid and so much financial ruin.
A strain which is vaccine resistant will bring the world to its knees.
 
Every time I have a bit of hope things are about to get better, we get some bad news :(
 
How long do you reckon it takes before we can conclude whether or not the vaccine is effective against the new strain? If it has little to no effect, then wont that put us back to square one?

From a more "selfish" perspective: I have many international friends and acquaintances living in Norway who haven't seen their friends and family for 2-3 years now. They are fully vaccinated and finally ready to go on a prolonged Christmas vacation to see their families again. If they have to cancel their trip or end up trapped in their home countries, then it is going to be devastating for them.

My heart really goes out to them. I feel that this is a group that has been largely forgotten in this mess. People dying prematurely is of course the worst. Financial ruin is a solid second place. But to be cut off from friends and family for years is pretty awful too.
 
OleBoiii said:
How long do you reckon it takes before we can conclude whether or not the vaccine is effective against the new strain? If it has little to no effect, then wont that put us back to square one?

From a more "selfish" perspective: I have many international friends and acquaintances living in Norway who haven't seen their friends and family for 2-3 years now. They are fully vaccinated and finally ready to go on a prolonged Christmas vacation to see their families again. If they have to cancel their trip or end up trapped in their home countries, then it is going to be devastating for them.

My heart really goes out to them. I feel that this is a group that has been largely forgotten in this mess. People dying prematurely is of course the worst. Financial ruin is a solid second place. But to be cut off from friends and family for years is pretty awful too.
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Why haven’t they travelled before now? For what it’s worth, I don’t think this new variant will stop anyone travelling this winter (other than to/from South Africa and Botswana anyway)
 
Champ said:
Thanks,

He is 8 years old,

The one thing that has really troubled me about this virus is how quick it went from no symptoms to full on.
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Sorry to hear about your son. I hope you get better news soon.
 
OleBoiii said:
How long do you reckon it takes before we can conclude whether or not the vaccine is effective against the new strain? If it has little to no effect, then wont that put us back to square one?
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Couple of months I would expect. The vaccines have worked against all variants so far, there's nothing to suggest that it will struggle against this one so I'm quietly confident it'll be fine. It all depends whether you're a glass half full or half empty type of person.
 
Post-covid is beginning to feel like a fantasy and the lifting of measures belies the fact there is a pandemic. Perhaps instead of trying to imagine a world without covid we should be planning for a world where we co-exist with it.

Going back to normal seems increasingly less likely and the world should be looking at a cultural change. Pre-pandemic a lot of the far-east wore facemasks during the flu season and I believe facemask wearing will be standard in winter with summer being naked face season.

Futhermore the need to be at work in person is becoming less necessary inany professions. I think a 50/50 or 60/40 split will be massively beneficial to society although the wealthy nouveau aristocracy will cry that people want to be in the office all the time.

The unvaccinated will further become 2nd class citizens and I could see some countries forcefully inoculating them.

Every 6-12 months a new variant appears which massively puts back all the progress made. Covid 19 won't be defeated.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Why haven’t they travelled before now?
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For most of them their first legitimate chance to go back home was this summer. They all had different(but good) reasons to wait until Christmas. They also expected things to improve with the vaccine, of course.

Pogue Mahone said:
For what it’s worth, I don’t think this new variant will stop anyone travelling this winter (other than to/from South Africa and Botswana anyway)
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Really? Even if it spreads as quickly as Delta did and the vaccines prove ineffective?
 
golden_blunder said:
Let’s hope for the best folks

I agree that we should be proactive though, mask mandates; work from home where possible etc

just had a thought, the Irish rugby team are stuck out on SA at the moment, be interesting to see how that’s dealt with
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i'm more than happy to let them stay there if it means never having to watch a game of rugby again.
 
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