Bravo to her. She’s one of the true heroes.
What a shitshow South Carolina is. If only the government had been better...
SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)
- Thread starter Don't Kill Bill
- Start date
What a shitshow South Carolina is. If only the government had been better...
You are just a sane-minded person.
Only ill-intentioned and unhealthy people blessed with hatred can wish the death of these people who just want to live...
But no consequences nor criticisms should befall those who willfully disregard common sense regarding the virus? These people ‘who just want to live’ should be absolved from any responsibility?
What a viewpoint.
Wishing someone's family memher to die isn't a criticism. If you're having a bad day at home then this isn't the topic to vent out your feelings.
Modmin really need to crack down on idiots wishing other people ill health or death just because they don't wear a mask or say something stupid. @Damien are you telling me that on this forum the F word isn't okay to use but people can get away with such comments ? Can we have a warning or something in here because this is a topic getting filled with smart arses who wish other people death.
Of course they're responsible for their actions, but it's nothing new. Some people are always "me first" and others are altruistic.
edit - and @Relevated's right, let's not have anymore of the "I hope she or he dies." No-one here actually wants anyone to die, even though it's so frustrating to see people being ignorant and careless. You can't rely on people doing the right thing of their own free will.
I agree with that, but the woman in question dont ”just want to live”. She is helping increasing the risk of spreading a horrible disease.
So i really get the anger directed at her, and people who act like her. I feel there should be actions against people like that, i just felt that wishing sickness and death upon a her was a bit over the top.
After some thought I am pretty sure that if i myself had a family member or friend who died from this, i would in anger wished for very bad things to happen to people like her.
So i will be cautios in the future ”jugding” others reaction to things like this.
And it’s this crux where we are finding the virus becoming even more horrible.
Great stuff man, your wife and her colleagues around the world are doing invaluable work.
Never wished for her family member’s death, didn’t call for it. Just brought up that something that tragic might have to be what makes that young lady wise up.
Let’s not try to twist it here.
Sure, he wished long life.
He didn't wish her death or any physical harm at all, he said that her carelessness might get her family members sick, and then if it does he hopes she feels awful.
Thinking this was just a PR peice now, fecking pointless building a hospital if you haven't got the staff to run it in the first place.
It's such a terrible waste of money. The staffing issue was always going to be a problem, and even though they invited retired clinicians to come back to work (and many thousands responded), that was stymied by the delays in processing the applications. My friend's husband is a recently-retired senior GP with several specialisms and he volunteered immediately - months later, he was still waiting to actually be called into work.
On top of that, I assume the NHS has lost clinicians because of Brexit uncertainties.
As far as I'm concerned, I just accept the world as it is.
Some follow the guidelines and others are selfish/risk-taker but we are ultimately all victims of the pandemic. I can understand why people argue about mental health, economic survival, individual freedoms etc.
The solution is not to blame each other but to have a strengthened healthcare system with efficient remedies and public policies.
Of course not but governments are there to govern and lead. When they lead with confusing incompetence it is no wonder that a proportion of the population are a confused or stop listening.
Suggesting that are leaders should lead is childish? Really?
If information was all that was required we wouldn't need government at all. We need government most in exceptional circumstances especially when people need to be protected from themselves. This is one such circumstance and where governments have taken strong decisive action and communicated it clearly the outcomes have been far better than in countries like the US and UK where the government responses have been largely incompetent and confusing.
Information doesn't always lead to learning. That is why we can't replace teachers with Wikipedia.
Hard to know what to buy in to where the government is so confused themselves.
Of course people should take individual responsibility but our governments are there is protect us and in the UK and US they have exacerbated the problems whereas they should be helping people to comply.
Say the full thing. He said he hopes they feel awful because of the death.
Appreciate the reply, but not levying rightful blame on those who are actually spreading the virus completely misses the point.
Many governments have shied away from true lockdowns. Looking back, these draconian steps should have been enforced in the vast majority of countries, especially our two. The challenge there is that the populace would blame the governments for such stringent methods & potentially uprise which would have caused its own set of problems.
So, you’re saying that even though 99% of the world’s population who are aware of Covid & its challenges still shouldn’t be held to account for the exponential spread of the virus? That it’s governments that should shoulder the majority of the blame? Even when irrefutable evidence of the damage the virus causes is potentially broadcast to people every minute? If so, that’s where my ‘childish’ statement enters. To believe that fairytale borders on abject delusion.
In my opinion, there’s probably two paths to lessen the chaos of the virus before the vaccines really take positive effect (if they ever fully do) - either the death of people who disregard the mountain of evidence foisted upon them minute but minute & change their behaviors or governments truly lock down societies. Which one would you prefer? Which one would ultimately be easier & less damaging to enact?
You rightly brought up that it’s hard for the populace to know what to do when governments dither. But, shouldn’t those with a modicum of common sense already realize the dangers when the vast majority of them already castigate the government for virtually everything & don’t pay positive attention to their government the vast majority of times? You can’t have it both ways. Government can’t be discounted constantly, then blamed for its populace not listening to it.
Just don't close the gyms again FFS
Yes, and that’s not wishing death on her family. That you then tagged a staff member about it is baffling. I feel sorry for the admin, you probably tag him a dozen times a day
I don’t disagree with what you’ve said here (although earlier you equated not wearing a mask to living your life, which is odd), but taking a flippant and irreverent comment and trying to turn it into something more is stupid.
I'm not saying anyone can avoid personal responsibility just that government should be there to assist them to do so. And the US and UK governments have largely abdicated proper responsibility with deadly and chaotic responses.
Look at where governments have been decisive and the messaging clear? It has worked very well.
And the people who die aren't necessarily those who ignore the rules so the first part of your argument is moot. And I wish the UK government had gone into full lock-down with closed international borders in March. Countries like NZ and Australia who have nearly eradicated are doing ok economically compared to those who didn't lock down because "the economy". Nothing is consequence free but full lockdowns do seem to have been the best tactic. In Australia the suicide rate has improved by 5% and hospitals are still operating as normal with routine tests and procedures. Things are far from normal but still much better than most other places.
Government’s fault, plain as day...
Totally agree here. Eastern countries & AUS / NZ should be held as examples to how to have handled the pandemic.
Yeah, if her family member dies he hopes she feels awful about the death.
That's not him wishing for the death to happen.
Who are you arguing with? Nobody has said people haven’t been selfish twats. What do you think the solution is if we absolve the Government of all responsibility? Who else actually has the power to do anything about these people but isn’t?Government’s fault, plain as day...
Yeah this isn't a one or the other situation. The governments response to the pandemic has been terrible and so has members of the general public.
Not rocket science.
Not rocket science.
People have the power not to act this stupidly.
I’ve never said that government is without blame here. Many on here (& in the world) won’t look to rightfully blame people for the continued spread.
Yeah it's like leaving tax evasion criminals to go Scott free.
Without big consequences for breaking the rules, you can't expect people to comply.
Specially, you can't erxpect people to comply when the same governmet people making the rules, break the rules. My right wing governmet in Chile, is very similar to the UK one. Bunch of millionarioes who break the rules on a daily basis, and expect people to obey the stay at home orders.
Yes they do. And when they don’t exercise it then it’s up to the Government to intervene. It wasn’t people that decided to lock down too late, it wasn’t the people that decided to keep the borders open, it wasn’t the people who sent sick people back to care homes, it wasn’t the people who told everyone it was their duty to go to the pub etc.
The Government can’t just stand by and watch people not follow the rules and then say, oh there’s nothing more we can do, it’s all their fault. They’re elected to Govern. And they’re failing.
One would think that millions of deaths due to the virus would change people’s thinking, but it obviously hasn’t.
Harsh lockdowns & direct punitive punishment might have to be the next possible steps.
Should have been the very first step.
Again, I never said the governments aren’t to blame. But there were feck ton of unknowns at play that governments couldn’t / didn’t handle well, that’s where the altruism of people should have come into play. Ive never called for governments to throw their hands up & give up either.
Governments might have to enact harsher measures in the short term, measures that will negatively affect us wherever we are. This will be a sad point in this saga, but the blame needs to be rightfully apportioned & now acted upon by governments.
Don’t disagree at all.
Governments were undoubtedly anticipating some public buy in to help limit the spread. The public is failing governments worldwide right now. In some countries (like mine), I feel the public shoulders the majority of the blame at the current time. We just had the highest day of airport traffic yesterday since the pandemic happened, higher than Thanksgiving travel.
It’s stupidity like this that will potentially cause true, actual lockdowns to be enacted. Then there will be a cry that personal liberties are being affected.
But public health does not come second to personal liberties.
Hard / close to impossible to enforce when our police force is threadbare from a numbers perspective. We just don’t have the manpower to monitor / enforce anything.
And people did stick by the rules for the most part to begin with. Even now the majority of people are doing it.
Blame does need to be rightfully apportioned, and the majority still lies with a Government who has watched everything unfold and still refused to act.
Due to years of under funding by the Government.
It is all very well us saying what should have happened in March/April but do we think the UK should lock-down properly now including closing international borders?
I'd guess that there is zero chance Boris will do this but interested to see what people think.
I'd guess that there is zero chance Boris will do this but interested to see what people think.
We seem to agree on quite a bit, we just differ on the apportionment or blame, historical or current. I would say that governments shoulder the majority of the historical blame for the pandemic response, people shoulder the majority of the current blame.
Where’s here? UK?
If there’s one thing that my country doesn’t lack is the size of our police ranks. We could loan you thousands.