Sadio Mane | LFC Player

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I'm very wary of us missing out of top 4... If we do that it will be much harder to attract the talent we want. We need to be as ruthless as Madrid or as efficient as bayern as this point. Mane replaces Rooney and Lucas replaces Mata.... Now we got power and speed up top.

And I don't want to see us make the same mistakes over and over. I was against the Mata deal for that reason, Mané isn't a 35m£-40m£ player and we shouldn't entertain the idea of buying him for that kind of prices, even if it means not making top 4. If we want to build a top team we need to do it properly, the winter window is for adjustments not big purchases.
During the winter you take punts at cheap players that can help your roster or you buy expensive players who will cost the same price during the summer and that you will still be after during the summer. Typically players with buying clauses, veteran or young players from financially poor leagues.

For example Laporte, Nolito or Lucas should be our targets.
 
Agreed.

We need players to take us to the next level not just players that are better than our current lot.

I think you're being generous comparing him with the likes of Mhiki and Dybala as they are streets ahead of him but I do get the point you are trying to get across. Ferreira Carrasco, Brahimi, Coman, Deulofeu and so many other players across Europe that would improve us just as much as Mane if not more but for half the price.

To pay Lucas Moura money on Mane would be a joke.
Yep, agree with you mate; what we need right now is a set of difference makers - not just improvements over the current lot - but cornerstone players who we build around over the next half decade. Once you have the nucleus, you can add options to the squad. Mané is a good player in fairness to him, but you have to wonder what his status will be once we reach a level where we're competing in Europe (against the likes of PSG, Bayern Munich, Madrid), and for the Premier League title. If he was in the ~€20 million range, I for one would be all for it - not only would the transfer fee be lower in that case, but we'd be paying him lower wages (this point gets undermined IMO - you look at the quality of our squad relative to our wages, and it's just so underwhelming - and we struggle to move on above average players because we pay them a level of wages that almost no other club will be able to match if we do decide to offload them), and the €15-20 million range is decent value for someone who will eventually become a squad player (again, with the hypothetical understanding that we reach a high level in the near future).

The price Southampton will demand will be disproportionate to the quality of the player, and we must avoid the trap at all costs. Why not sign Sané instead of Mané, since both aren't finished articles? He'll be as good if not better in 1-2 seasons, he will cost maybe €20 million because Bundesliga clubs don't jack up the fee to extreme levels, IMO he has a higher ceiling (insert FIFA/ FM dig), and because he's German - he won't be away for the AFCON. The boner for Mané is bewildering to be honest, though it's kind of understandable since the Premier League is the most viewed league on the Caf.
All those players good as they are changed clubs with us watching and paying millions more for duds. It happened with Vidal to Juventus in similar circumstances ie with us watching. All these examples mean there is something rotten at the core within the club's football side butas things stand our needs are more immediate hence we should take the plunge and bring him in to help us rescue the season whilst the suits take stock and look to restructure the clubby bringing in a DoF and revamping to scouting network and stuff.
Agreed. The point about a proper DoF and a revamp (is that the right word?) of our scouting setup has been brought up time and again, and for all the right reasons. Mané might not be a dud because he is definitely a good player (though playing for United - even in our current diminished state, is worlds apart from playing for Southampton), but when you see superior players (like Dybala or Mkhitaryan) change clubs for a lesser fee, you have to wonder why we weren't in for them. One of my biggest pet peeves to this day was United choosing not to sign the likes of Agüero and Silva when we had the chance. The 'no value in the market' adage rung hollow because we bought the likes of Young for £18 million, while Silva cost only £6 million more. What was that all about? Did Young's Premier League experience serve us well in the long term? Don't think so to be honest, despite his renaissance under Louis.
United shouldn't buy foreign players from English clubs, the inflation in the English market is way too big. And only a handful of premier league players don't have a cheaper equivalent on the continent.
Exactly. The Premier League market is too inflated (and it will only get worse with mid level clubs refusing to let go of their marquee players in the wake of the new broadcast deals unless we pay over the odds), so we really need to identify equivalent players in other leagues. With English players, it's understandable to an extent, because it's always good to have top Englishmen in the squad to maintain the identity of the club, and we won't find them in other leagues. But for non-English players, acquiring them from the Bundesliga, La Liga, or Ligue 1 will be much cheaper - this is something Wenger deserves huge credit for even back in the day. He took a chance on Vieira from Milan, Henry from Juventus, RVP from Feyenoord, Pires from Marseille; or even Cazorla from Villarreal, Giroud from Montpellier, Koscielny from Lorient (who cost about £35 million combined). - and built a squad on the cheap in terms of transfer fee. Even now, there is great value in the market, we just need to look at the right places instead of plonking north of €35-40 million out of desperation.
 
Why can't Mané be someone who takes us to the next level? He has coped with the physical demands of the Premier League very well and his pure acceleration could be very handy for us in attack.

As long as we were able to get him for ~£30m, I think he'd be worth a punt. I certainly don't think he'd be more of a risk than Lucas Moura.

The simple answer is that he does not possess the talent to do that. He would obviously improve us because we lack a player of his skillset but he's not a better player than Memphis or Mata. I'm not the biggest fan of either of those two but playing for Southampton and Man United are two different things. Mane's performances have been fairly average this season, so I fail to see how he will elevate our play so much when he's been unable to do that for Southampton for much of the season.

I'm not usually one for stats but in 18 PL games he has 3 goals and 6 assists. For the type of player he is that's an average return and certainly doesn't scream out a £30m player.
 
The simple answer is that he does not possess the talent to do that. He would obviously improve us because we lack a player of his skillset but he's not a better player than Memphis or Mata. I'm not the biggest fan of either of those two but playing for Southampton and Man United are two different things. Mane's performances have been fairly average this season, so I fail to see how he will elevate our play so much when he's been unable to do that for Southampton for much of the season.

I'm not usually one for stats but in 18 PL games he has 3 goals and 6 assists. For the type of player he is that's an average return and certainly doesn't scream out a £30m player.
I don't think that is true. The next level for us is competing for/winning the Premier League and with him in the side, and I don't think that level is beyond him.

At this point in time, he would offer more to the team than Memphis and Mata, who have both been underwhelming this season - particularly in the past few weeks.

I'm hopeful Memphis will still come good, but it's clear that he needs an adjustment period because he has been largely poor with the exception of a couple of Champions League matches. Mata's lack of pace is alarming and he doesn't possess the level of skill or agility required to make up for that, to put it bluntly.

Mané is rapid, comfortable on the ball and works hard off it too. Even if he doesn't directly contribute in terms of goals and assists, I think he'd make a noticeable difference to how we play. He's streets ahead of Memphis and Mata at the moment, if you ask me.

It doesn't have to be him we move for, but we do need a player with similar traits.
 
Yep, agree with you mate; what we need right now is a set of difference makers - not just improvements over the current lot - but cornerstone players who we build around over the next half decade. Once you have the nucleus, you can add options to the squad. Mané is a good player in fairness to him, but you have to wonder what his status will be once we reach a level where we're competing in Europe (against the likes of PSG, Bayern Munich, Madrid), and for the Premier League title. If he was in the ~€20 million range, I for one would be all for it - not only would the transfer fee be lower in that case, but we'd be paying him lower wages (this point gets undermined IMO - you look at the quality of our squad relative to our wages, and it's just so underwhelming - and we struggle to move on above average players because we pay them a level of wages that almost no other club will be able to match if we do decide to offload them), and the €15-20 million range is decent value for someone who will eventually become a squad player (again, with the hypothetical understanding that we reach a high level in the near future).

The price Southampton will demand will be disproportionate to the quality of the player, and we must avoid the trap at all costs. Why not sign Sané instead of Mané, since both aren't finished articles? He'll be as good if not better in 1-2 seasons, he will cost maybe €20 million because Bundesliga clubs don't jack up the fee to extreme levels, IMO he has a higher ceiling (insert FIFA/ FM dig), and because he's German - he won't be away for the AFCON. The boner for Mané is bewildering to be honest, though it's kind of understandable since the Premier League is the most viewed league on the Caf.

Agreed. The point about a proper DoF and a revamp (is that the right word?) of our scouting setup has been brought up time and again, and for all the right reasons. Mané might not be a dud because he is definitely a good player (though playing for United - even in our current diminished state, is worlds apart from playing for Southampton), but when you see superior players (like Dybala or Mkhitaryan) change clubs for a lesser fee, you have to wonder why we weren't in for them. One of my biggest pet peeves to this day was United choosing not to sign the likes of Agüero and Silva when we had the chance. The 'no value in the market' adage rung hollow because we bought the likes of Young for £18 million, while Silva cost only £6 million more. What was that all about? Did Young's Premier League experience serve us well in the long term? Don't think so to be honest, despite his renaissance under Louis.

Exactly. The Premier League market is too inflated (and it will only get worse with mid level clubs refusing to let go of their marquee players in the wake of the new broadcast deals unless we pay over the odds), so we really need to identify equivalent players in other leagues. With English players, it's understandable to an extent, because it's always good to have top Englishmen in the squad to maintain the identity of the club, and we won't find them in other leagues. But for non-English players, acquiring them from the Bundesliga, La Liga, or Ligue 1 will be much cheaper - this is something Wenger deserves huge credit for even back in the day. He took a chance on Vieira from Milan, Henry from Juventus, RVP from Feyenoord, Pires from Marseille; or even Cazorla from Villarreal, Giroud from Montpellier, Koscielny from Lorient (who cost about £35 million combined). - and built a squad on the cheap in terms of transfer fee. Even now, there is great value in the market, we just need to look at the right places instead of plonking north of €35-40 million out of desperation.
I don't think you will find a proper fan who wouldn't agree with your general arguments but as things stand signing Mane has nothing to do with building a squad for the next five years but as a player who can give us more in attack NOW. Simple accounting will show you that whatever we overspend on Mane will be covered by what we will earn by finishing third instead of tenth given the state of the TV deal.
 
Wanted to get him in the summer.But unless he himself wants to leave .Nothing will happen.
 
I don't even think they will sell even for £35m. Koeman was already getting frustrated in the summer. Selling his best player mid season might be too much for him. They don't even need the money.
It's a similar case with John Stones, I don't think the will sell on principle. Regardless of how much we bid.
 
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I don't even think they will sell even for £35m. Koeman was already getting frustrated in the summer. Selling his best player mid season might be too much for him. They don't even need the money.
It's a similar case with John Stones, I don't think the will sell on principle. Regardless of how much we bid.

Agreed.

Things have changed massively in the last year. PL clubs are going to be beyond difficult to buy from
 
Stones came close to kicking up a fuss last summer, it was just too late in the window. Teams can hold out as they know they can milk money but they risk the players going in a foul mood and kicking a fuss over it.
 
Agreed.

Things have changed massively in the last year. PL clubs are going to be beyond difficult to buy from
The new TV deal has changed the landscape. Small clubs aren't even dancing to the big club tune. West Brom didn't even blink at Spurs £25m bid for Berahino even when he had gone on strike.
 
The new TV deal has changed the landscape. Small clubs aren't even dancing to the big club tune. West Brom didn't even blink at Spurs £25m bid for Berahino even when he had gone on strike.

I think that had more to do with Spurs payment plan regarding the £25M.
 
Mane is very attainable from next summer because his contract is up in July 2018.

Once a player has two years or less left on his contract he has all the power.
 
What's with the snobbery towards him? He's fantastic. We should be all over him. I'll leave the worrying about the money to the club but as a player he's top draw and as good if not better than several others mentioned who don't play in the PL.
 
What's with the snobbery towards him? He's fantastic. We should be all over him. I'll leave the worrying about the money to the club but as a player he's top draw and as good if not better than several others mentioned who don't play in the PL.

I don't think it's snobbery at all, it's more that many are not convinced he's all that great often enough and the fact he'll go missing for ACON.
 
I don't think it's snobbery at all, it's more that many are not convinced he's all that great often enough and the fact he'll go missing for ACON.

I never understood the negative attitude towards ACON - the next cup is in 2017.
Granted its in the middle of the season, but its a month long competition and Mane plays for Senegal, who haven't had a great recent history in the cup and the likelihood is he'll be out for about 3 weeks max.
He's hardly gonna go missing.

He'll still have a full pre-season and longer rest period at the end of the season as he wont be participating in European cup competitions.
 
I never understood the negative attitude towards ACON - the next cup is in 2017.
Granted its in the middle of the season, but its a month long competition and Mane plays for Senegal, who haven't had a great recent history in the cup and the likelihood is he'll be out for about 3 weeks max.
He's hardly gonna go missing.

He'll still have a full pre-season and longer rest period at the end of the season as he wont be participating in European cup competitions.

That competition is slap bang in the middle of the biggest fixture congestion of the season, if he were good enough to become a key player for us you don't want him missing such a vital period.
 
Mane for me is a far superior wide player to Mata and a more consistent player than Memphis with goals and pace to burn. He'd improve us considerably. Plus he has EPL experience. I feel he is almost a must buy. A player who could be as good for us as Valencia when he first arrived with the potential to get even better.

Agree would love him and Moura both here. Think both might be attainable and by paying slightly over the odds in the case of Mane. But both bring to the party qualities we severely lack. Pace, unpredictable with the ability to beat a man one on one as opposed to the drivel we have been served on the wings for sometime now with Young/Valencia and Depay/Mata.
 
That competition is slap bang in the middle of the biggest fixture congestion of the season, if he were good enough to become a key player for us you don't want him missing such a vital period.

Its in the middle of Jan to the end of the first week of feb, how is that the biggest fixture congestion of the season?
If it were happening this season the most amount games he would miss is 5, assuming Senegal were to go all the way to the final and he didn't play the game in the week before he left which is unlikely.
The average amount of games he'd miss is 3.

There's no European football, no FA cup. If we were in the league cup that would be another game missed too, but generally there's a game every 6 days or so.
 
Its in the middle of Jan to the end of the first week of feb, how is that the biggest fixture congestion of the season?
If it were happening this season the most amount games he would miss is 5, assuming Senegal were to go all the way to the final and he didn't play the game in the week before he left which is unlikely.
The average amount of games he'd miss is 3.

There's no European football, no FA cup. If we were in the league cup that would be another game missed too, but generally there's a game every 6 days or so.

Don't the players often leave earlier for a pre-tournemant training camp like clubs do before the World Cup and Euros?
 
Don't the players often leave earlier for a pre-tournemant training camp like clubs do before the World Cup and Euros?

Thats why in the hypothetical situation it were happening this year I included the game before the tournament would have started as a game Mane would miss.
Training camps are usually about 3-5 days long depending on the countries and when their first game is. It's a 3 week competition with games happening every 3 days or so.

And him being from Senegal they usually don't make it past the group stage.
 
Thats why in the hypothetical situation it were happening this year I included the game before the tournament would have started as a game Mane would miss.
Training camps are usually about 3-5 days long depending on the countries and when their first game is. It's a 3 week competition with games happening every 3 days or so.

And him being from Senegal they usually don't make it past the group stage.

Fair enough, he'd miss less time than I thought, but ideally you don't want your main players missing any games because they are playing for someone else, especially given they could get inured while out there.
 
Sadio Mane and Leyroy Sané would be an insane combination. I really am just getting my coat. :cool: So.... Happy New Year to everyone on the Caf...
 
Fair enough, he'd miss less time than I thought, but ideally you don't want your main players missing any games because they are playing for someone else, especially given they could get inured while out there.

He's playing football at a time when he'd otherwise he playing anyway, so its not a fitness issue.
Yes he could get injured but he can get injured in any game of football.

And it's not ideal for this club sure, but international representation is important and to some players more important than club football.
What's the alternative? Him pull out? You could argue that the Euros/Copa America/World Cup take time out of crucial pre-season preparation or Christmas/Boxing day football happens to satisfy the fans even though it could lead to fatigue, injury or lower levels of performances.
There's no ideal time to play international cup competitions, but it's there for the fans and for the players to represent their nations.

I just never understood why particularly English football fans viewed ACON as so negative.
 
That competition is slap bang in the middle of the biggest fixture congestion of the season, if he were good enough to become a key player for us you don't want him missing such a vital period.
City managed without Yaya a few times.
 
I like him. Don't know if Southampton will sell in January, but we should try for him in the summer.
 
He's playing football at a time when he'd otherwise he playing anyway, so its not a fitness issue.
Yes he could get injured but he can get injured in any game of football.

And it's not ideal for this club sure, but international representation is important and to some players more important than club football.
What's the alternative? Him pull out? You could argue that the Euros/Copa America/World Cup take time out of crucial pre-season preparation or Christmas/Boxing day football happens to satisfy the fans even though it could lead to fatigue, injury or lower levels of performances.
There's no ideal time to play international cup competitions, but it's there for the fans and for the players to represent their nations.

I just never understood why particularly English football fans viewed ACON as so negative.

Yes but getting injured while playing for someone else while we are paying him substantial wages would be gratingly annoying. The thing with the summer international competitions is they don't directly interfere with a player playing for their club, how each is affected by missing a week or 2 of pre-season is hard to gauge, but the ACON cuts into actual matches in our season.

City managed without Yaya a few times.

True and with a player of his caliber I guess you take the inconvenience as he is/was that good.
 
Yes but getting injured while playing for someone else while we are paying him substantial wages would be gratingly annoying. The thing with the summer international competitions is they don't directly interfere with a player playing for their club, how each is affected by missing a week or 2 of pre-season is hard to gauge, but the ACON cuts into actual matches in our season.

Annoying sure, but he's getting paid regardless. Thats the point of a contract.
He gets paid his wages even though he doesn't play competitive club football from the end of May - middle of August, thats just under 3 months.

It's hard to gauge sure, but in that scenario you're talking about a 3 week international competition and in the case of the Copa America or a World Cup outside of Europe, massive differences in time zone, then a rest period of say 2/3 weeks to have a holiday before you even begin pre-season. That could potentially be 5/6 weeks without the player. Then it takes them longer to get up to the same fitness as the rest of the squad too. And that doesn't take into consideration injuries either.
 
Annoying sure, but he's getting paid regardless. Thats the point of a contract.
He gets paid his wages even though he doesn't play competitive club football from the end of May - middle of August, thats just under 3 months.

It's hard to gauge sure, but in that scenario you're talking about a 3 week international competition and in the case of the Copa America or a World Cup outside of Europe, massive differences in time zone, then a rest period of say 2/3 weeks to have a holiday before you even begin pre-season. That could potentially be 5/6 weeks without the player. Then it takes them longer to get up to the same fitness as the rest of the squad too. And that doesn't take into consideration injuries either.

I'll conceded that you certainly give an interesting perspective on it, I just think unless that player is so exceptional that you can't miss out on him, then I'd avoid a player that took a month out to play for someone else midway through a season, and if we did take the chance I think Mahrez is the better player.
 
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