Michael Oliver

shamans said:
That's BS. An official is the official of the game and is not "equal" of a player to earn respect. Again, Buffon got what he deserved and I hope players think twice before surrounding the referee like that. In almost no sport would that be tolerated.
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Official of the game then what about control the game instead every game with him, there is always debate. Even so called understandable decision where it can go both way, he still can bring in some baggage of the situation.

You are having a laugh if you think surrounding referee is being punished the same, and we're talking about one specific referee. If he is being consistent, then there it is, he earned the respect.

I am not debating because I am supporting Juventus or feel like Real Madrid doesn't deserve to go through. I am debating the way this guy run game. I am sure this thread will be bumped again when he becomes a talking point in PL game. Hope to god it's not one of the game we get involved.

RedDevil@84 said:
Oliver is a crap ref, inconsistent and mostly makes dodgy decisions. But he was absolutely spot on with the penalty and absolutely spot on with the red card. Buffon had no business confronting the ref, leave alone touching him. Juventus are plain lucky that the ref did not send 1 or 2 more for pushing him. Refs can't be expected to take decisions based on whether Buffon is retiring or not.
The idea that Oliver should have taken a decision based on Juventus making a beautiful comeback is ridiculous.
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The point is Oliver could have pull Buffon out and face him one on one as ref and captain often do. He then could warn Buffon. If Buffon still persist, Oliver could then send him off.

In real life, he chickened out (which frustrating the protesters even more) to end up getting surrounded and panicked and sent off Buffon. This is not the first time we see Oliver using this tactic, and cause similar mess. He was not even consistent with the decision regarding players who confronted him either.

Yes he could send off more than Buffon, so why just Buffon? Why being inconsistent? Or he was scared and sent off what biggest mouth in front of him.
 
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We don't know what Buffon said to Oliver, do we? For him to get a straight red I imagine it could have been something pretty inflammatory. Not saying that Oliver is a great ref but there are rules about this and if Buffon went over the line, which it looked like he definitely might have, then a red card may well have been the right decision
 
I hate this logic people have with penalties nowadays of 'not a lot of contact but there was some'. Isn't the point of a foul that there should be enough contact to bring someone down, not just touch them so they go down? The inconsistencies these days are ridiculous from referees, you had the Sterling incident yesterday where he pushed a running Van Dyke in the back with full force but that wasn't given a foul (I'm not sure whether it should have been given as well), and here you have Benatia who only slightly put's his hands on Vasquez's back and he gets a penalty.

Defender's really get too much stick nowadays compared to previous generations, if they are pushed and harried it's not called a foul and people expect them to 'play physical' and when they try to do the same to an attacker the attacker falls down and a foul/penalty is called against them. And then we wonder why we're not having as many 'pure old school' defenders nowadays than previously, older age defenders from the 80's and 90's who we like to remember as being physical (Adams, Stam etc) would be shitting their pants playing in today's matches.
 
RedDevil@84 said:
A foul in box is a penalty. Vasquez was dead on to score. Benatia gave him a push and then tried to get his leg around Vasquez to reach the ball fouling him again.
Penalty all day long.

https://a.pomfe.co/ouxwy.mp4
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A foul shouldn't just be contact, there should be enough contact to bring someone down and that wasn't enough. Vasquez feels Benatia's hand on his back and decides to go down without even trying to be physical and overcome the contact, winning penalties has become an art in finding the right time and way to fall down after you've felt contact; when the contact is not hard enough to bring you down naturally.

A similar example is with the Mane dive against Southampton I think, where he took 1 second to go down eventhough the defender technically did hit his foot when he went in for the tackle, subsequently Mane was given a yellow for diving and everyone agreed it was a dive. Then in another match during the week another player won a penalty, sorry I can't remember the names or matches, where similarly a defender had a slight touch on the player's foot but he feel down in perfect synchronization and won the penalty (without any commentators complaining it was a dive).

These incidents are what's irritating me, fouls in the box aren't about whether there is enough contact to bring a player down, it's become a dark art of being able to act well enough to fall down the moment you get touched and it's become more and more common and accepted within the game.
 
SuzieQ said:
With the exception of almost every match thats ever been played when a dodgy decision has been made. Look no further than the chelsea cry babies that even got their own meme they were so bad at surrounding refs for the purpose of intimidation. A match official, of any sport, gets respect by doing the job well. Oliver is inconsistent, overly reactionary and worst of all incapable of controlling the players in his charge. The fist rule of controlling any situation with high tempers is deescalation. Olivers arrogance and refusal to do anything but walk away is why he pulls cards so often. Refs are regarded by their peers for having the ability to control a game without yellows and reds, and to keep the game flowing. Oliver has proven time and again, this isnt his wheel house. If he had the respect of the players is was in charge of, he wouldnt have problems like that. People would respect his decisions, but they dont, and they wont until he grows a sack and stands up to players without acting like a stuck up prat.
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The rules have changed since that Chelsea era.

http://www.skysports.com/football/n...ges-ahead-of-the-201617-premier-league-season
 
The "if it's a foul in midfield, it's a penalty" argument is terrible. We all know contact in the box is more allowed and specially in late game situations.

I don't think its a travesty to call that penalty, but Michael knew if he didn't call that, the game goes on with no scandal at all.

Now.. I'm not the one who gets hyperventilated over two teams I have nothing to do with, specially because Juve are their federation's little darling like Madrid and also have a cheating past. BUT... it would be nice to see Real get the short end of the stick referee wise just once in a knockout game. I mean, correct or not, it seems like the controversy is always about some decision going against their rival. Come on.. let me just see them get screwed once in my lifetime.
 
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Classical Mechanic said:
Hard to tell from that article, it cites IFAB at the top of the page.
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I tried to follow the link to the FIFA page but "no page found". Watching other league, refs ain't punishing players' protest as what the English football new rule. So here is the confusion on this.
 
ti vu said:
I tried to follow the link to the FIFA page but "no page found". Watching other league, refs ain't punishing players' protest as what the English football new rule. So here the confusion on this.
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I think across all leagues if you touch the ref you should expect to be sent off, if you’re using foul and abusive language then you should expect to be sent off too, especially if you are directly insulting the ref.
 
Classical Mechanic said:
I think across all leagues if you touch the ref you should expect to be sent off, if you’re using foul and abusive language then you should expect to be sent off too, especially if you are directly insulting the ref.
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Sure when players and coaches servely crossing the line, but the official ain't allowed to hide but to take charge of the situation. What was written by the change rule, which I can't find and clues to other league, but PL; basically it allows ref to make the decision then running away. It's not just decision since other leagues also have problem with refs' decision; it's about PL refs are overprotected and can't be held responsible for bad performance thus losing respect from players, coaches and clubs.

I don't speak Italian so I can't say for sure for what Buffon said, but think his comment toward Oliver was like: Oliver officiates a game like spectator. He was not there to control the game. Doesn't have the heart for football game. Just a job to him.
 
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To be fair I think he had a really good game overall, let the game flow. The pen at the end was 50/50 but Benatia gave him a decision to make.

On a side note would Ronaldos ridiculous dive be given as a pen in VAR world? I mean there was the tiniest bit of contact- I’d imagine VAR man would have to give it which means the game will turn into a non contact sport and about 3/4 pens a game.
 
Classical Mechanic said:
I think across all leagues if you touch the ref you should expect to be sent off, if you’re using foul and abusive language then you should expect to be sent off too, especially if you are directly insulting the ref.
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Wait, this is the same Michael Oliver who sent di Maria off for a shirt tug, while allowing Joe Hart to go forehead-wrestling with him while screaming in his face? Oh the consistency!
 
gr3yham3 said:
Wait, this is the same Michael Oliver who sent di Maria off for a shirt tug, while allowing Joe Hart to go forehead-wrestling with him while screaming in his face? Oh the consistency!
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Isn't the point there that he should have sent Hart off, not not sent Buffon off?
 
gr3yham3 said:
Wait, this is the same Michael Oliver who sent di Maria off for a shirt tug, while allowing Joe Hart to go forehead-wrestling with him while screaming in his face? Oh the consistency!
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Yep he definitely got the Hart one wrong but not the first time we see different approaches to refereeing abroad and domestically. I thought Oliver did well last night and the penalty was a 45-55 in favour of not. But tough call and he was going to get battered either way if he called a penalty or not. Buffon was out of order and deserved to be red carded unfortunately.
 
SuzieQ said:
With the exception of almost every match thats ever been played when a dodgy decision has been made. Look no further than the chelsea cry babies that even got their own meme they were so bad at surrounding refs for the purpose of intimidation. A match official, of any sport, gets respect by doing the job well. Oliver is inconsistent, overly reactionary and worst of all incapable of controlling the players in his charge. The fist rule of controlling any situation with high tempers is deescalation. Olivers arrogance and refusal to do anything but walk away is why he pulls cards so often. Refs are regarded by their peers for having the ability to control a game without yellows and reds, and to keep the game flowing. Oliver has proven time and again, this isnt his wheel house. If he had the respect of the players is was in charge of, he wouldnt have problems like that. People would respect his decisions, but they dont, and they wont until he grows a sack and stands up to players without acting like a stuck up prat.
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Just a bunch of noise that.

Football needs the same rules as rugby when it comes to refs, then you wouldn't get shit like this. No teams show refs proper respect. Fair play to him for making the right call in this instance.
 
Ibi Dreams said:
We don't know what Buffon said to Oliver, do we? For him to get a straight red I imagine it could have been something pretty inflammatory. Not saying that Oliver is a great ref but there are rules about this and if Buffon went over the line, which it looked like he definitely might have, then a red card may well have been the right decision
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Considering his post-match comments, which were made after he had time to calm down, I wouldn't be surprised if he used some colourful language in the heat of the moment.
 
gr3yham3 said:
Yeah. Was trying to say what else we can expect from a ref as inconsistent as Oliver. Think others have said the same in the thread.
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Ah right, well at least he's learned from his mistakes, which is all you can ask humans to do i guess.
 
Terrible ref and had a very poor game again last night. However, peno and red card were correct. Benatia should have gone also for stopping Vazquez from scoring and Ronnie should have seen yellow for the t*ts out celebration.
 
westmeath said:
Terrible ref and had a very poor game again last night. However, peno and red card were correct. Benatia should have gone also for stopping Vazquez from scoring and Ronnie should have seen yellow for the t*ts out celebration.
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He did get booked
 
westmeath said:
Terrible ref and had a very poor game again last night. However, peno and red card were correct. Benatia should have gone also for stopping Vazquez from scoring and Ronnie should have seen yellow for the t*ts out celebration.
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I think giving to reds would have been too much, a referee cannot just go by the rules but must also weigh the total impact it has on the team.

Ronaldo got a yellow for the celebration.
 
ti vu said:
I don't speak Italian so I can't say for sure for what Buffon said, but think his comment toward Oliver was like: Oliver officiates a game like spectator. He was not there to control the game. Doesn't have the heart for football game. Just a job to him.
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That was his comments after the game but Buffon and his teammates need to understand that the ref isn't there to have empathy with his team's journey and story. He is there to apply the rules of the game. End of.

Surely they should understand this.

Wumminator said:
I absolutely do not know that.
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I don't think this is true. Seems to be something from American sport I think.
 
A-man said:
I think giving to reds would have been too much, a referee cannot just go by the rules but must also weigh the total impact it has on
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Don’t agree, rules are rules. Ref must apply the rules. Impact on the game is the fault of the player who committed the foul.
 
Stonewall peno and stonewall red card for me. Just because Buffon is a legend of the game doesn't give him special treatment - the way refs and linesmen are treated is bad enough as it is. Players need to know you can't touch, bully, intimidate or push the ref.
 
They were the correct calls. His game management is fecking awful though.
 
::sonny:: said:
How much they pay?

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Well this is ironic.

I detest Real but it was a penalty for me mostly because the defender was on the wrong side of the attacker, it's a schoolboy error there really and Benatia's got only himself to blame. Red card for Buffon? No idea what he said to the cnut but the cnut is as inconsistent as he can be, vide Hart's reaction and di Maria's send off.
 
Zen said:
Definitely agree that we need a bit of intimidation back on the refereeing front....you get none of this shit in Rugby. Just bring them across.
Just get Nigel Owens in there, he'll sort this homophobic sport out.
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The refs are genuinely shit at their job in football though. I'd just pay them more and make abusing the ref part and parcel of the game. If you're thinking your having bad game / losing cause of the ref, slapping the ref around for the rest of the game becomes fair play.
 
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