Mason Greenwood, Marseille Footballer | Read the thread rules in the OP before posting

Ed9 said:
Why would any national team take him?
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I'm completely lost. If you're making a specific point here can you be clearer? As in, stop asking questions and just say what you want to say?

Are you saying it sends a poor message from Jamaica to take him? If so, I agree.
 
SilentWitness said:
Same reason club teams in other countries would and have.
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Pickle85 said:
I'm completely lost. If you're making a specific point here can you be clearer? As in, stop asking questions and just say what you want to say?

Are you saying it sends a poor message from Jamaica to take him? If so, I agree.
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My point is on club level it makes them money so they put the morals aside.
On national level it's about football and as you say sends a poor message.
 
Gandalf Greyhame said:
"My client allegedly killed some people 2 years ago, and allegedly hasn't since, why is this still so relevant to you?"

Lets do more of these silly ridiculous takes, it's classic caf stuff. You should start a thread.
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The problem is, his partner and her parents have moved on and dropped the charges. She then had his baby after.

Many people are looking at it as, if her and her family can all forgive him/move on. then why should football fans also not move on and forgive him.

I am not justifying what he did as it is disgusting, but that is clearly how many people are now seeing it.
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
The problem is, his partner and her parents have moved on and dropped the charges. She then had his baby after.

Many people are looking at it as if her and her family can all forgive him/move on then why should football fans also not move on and forgive him.

I am not justifying what he did as it is disgusting, but that is clearly how many people are now seeing it.
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Those "many people" should firstly look up how domestic abuse works and how common it is partners will stay with their abusers.
 
Ed9 said:
My point is on club level it makes them money so they put the morals aside.
On national level it's about football and as you say sends a poor message.
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There is a lot of money waged on national level so the all about football angle is not correct. At all.
 
Solius said:
Those "many people" should firstly look up how domestic abuse works and how common it is partners will stay with their abusers.
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Yes but then what about her family, all the fans of Getafe and Marseille, plus every other club that was linked with him, plus many Man United fans wanted him to stay.

Clearly lots of people in football are happy to ignore it as long as he performs well. Unfortunately, football has no morals, look at where the last World Cup was held for example, and also look at how the PL welcomed with open arms the owners of Man City, Newcastle etc.
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
Yes but then what about her family, all the fans of Getafe and Marseille, plus every other club that was linked with him, plus many Man United fans wanted him to stay.

Clearly lots of people in football are happy to ignore it as long as he performs well. Unfortunately, football has no morals, look at where the last World Cup was held for example, and also look at how the PL welcomed with open arms the owners of Man City, Newcastle etc.
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Well I'm glad my club showed some.

We should fight against that shit, not just shrug our shoulders.
 
whitbyviking said:
On performance alone is Greenwood currently the best performing forward eligible for the national team? Wonder if they would ever pick him again.
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Carsley was asked about him last week and said;
'Mason wasn't a player that we can consider to be honest, no. I'm aware of how he's doing but he wasn't under consideration.'
From that it seems as though it's a decision made higher-up in the FA that he's not available.
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
Yes but then what about her family, all the fans of Getafe and Marseille, plus every other club that was linked with him, plus many Man United fans wanted him to stay.

Clearly lots of people in football are happy to ignore it as long as he performs well. Unfortunately, football has no morals, look at where the last World Cup was held for example, and also look at how the PL welcomed with open arms the owners of Man City, Newcastle etc.
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What about her family? Why does my own moral compass have to be shaped by some random woman's family's morals?

As people have said above, many women who are victims of domestic abuse struggle to leave. Some parents will have to go along with it because there's no other option for them. It could be that the partner and/ or her parents are happy for the financial gravy train to continue.

I don't know and frankly don't care, because I don't need Greenwood's father in law to decide how I'm going to maintain my own moral compass.
 
duffer said:
Doing well in a second rate league rarely gets players picked for England.

Carsley picked Gomes though so it would not be totally off the table if it wasn't for the Greenwood's off field actions.
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Personally think it would cause too much strife. I mean the golden boy Bellingham has already called him a rapist to his face in a match.

There’s a lot to unpack. Something like this can’t just be erased
 
africanspur said:
What about her family? Why does my own moral compass have to be shaped by some random woman's family's morals?

As people have said above, many women who are victims of domestic abuse struggle to leave. Some parents will have to go along with it because there's no other option for them. It could be that the partner and/ or her parents are happy for the financial gravy train to continue.

I don't know and frankly don't care, because I don't need Greenwood's father in law to decide how I'm going to maintain my own moral compass.
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I bet you watched the Qatar World Cup...
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
The problem is, his partner and her parents have moved on and dropped the charges. She then had his baby after.

Many people are looking at it as, if her and her family can all forgive him/move on. then why should football fans also not move on and forgive him.

I am not justifying what he did as it is disgusting, but that is clearly how many people are now seeing it.
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Well he’s not our problem anymore. Just wondering what stage it needs to get to for all United fans to forget him. Will it be another beating for his girlfriend? Will it be him being snide against United? Where’s the line?
 
golden_blunder said:
Well he’s not our problem anymore. Just wondering what stage it needs to get to for all United fans to forget him. Will it be another beating for his girlfriend? Will it be him being snide against United? Where’s the line?
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He'll only be forgotten when we have a striker scoring 20+ goals every season
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
I bet you watched the Qatar World Cup...
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I watched some, not all. My general enthusiasm for football is not as high as it was. I've watched 0 Spurs games (or any for that matter) so far this season if you're interested in that.

I also did 80mph in a 70mph zone last week so I suppose I should go out and rape some people now, as they're definitely the same.
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
I bet you watched the Qatar World Cup...
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Wow. So by your logic anyone who has ever done anything that can be questioned by anyone, can never do the right thing ever, because somehow that's hypocrisy?

Is this some stupid version of Jesus' He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her?

Ask yourself, what would stupid Jesus say?
 
Pickle85 said:
Aaaaand we're back to whataboutery. Like clockwork...
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Relevant whataboutery, especially when the poster I said that to was talking about their 'moral compass.

If you have an apparent strong moral compass on ethical situations such as rape and other abhorrent acts, you can't then start being selective and ignorant towards other ethical issues, just because that is something that entertains you (such as the Qatar World Cup). It is hypocritical and takes away your ability to judge other peoples moral views, as it shows you have also ignored ethical issues.
 
africanspur said:
I watched some, not all. My general enthusiasm for football is not as high as it was. I've watched 0 Spurs games (or any for that matter) so far this season if you're interested in that.

I also did 80mph in a 70mph zone last week so I suppose I should go out and rape some people now, as they're definitely the same.
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80 in a 70 is not the same as the human rights issues in Qatar, the same as an 80 in a 70 is not the same as what Greenwood did. How can you preach about Greenwood when you didn't give a hoot about the Qatar World Cup. Selective morals while judging other peoples selective morals is not fair on the people you are judging.
 
moses said:
Wow. So by your logic anyone who has ever done anything that can be questioned by anyone, can never do the right thing ever, because somehow that's hypocrisy?

Is this some stupid version of Jesus' He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her?

Ask yourself, what would stupid Jesus say?
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No. How can a person preach at other people's moral views when their moral views on another topic are just as bad.
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
Relevant whataboutery, especially when the poster I said that to was talking about their 'moral compass.

If you have an apparent strong moral compass on ethical situations such as rape and other abhorrent acts, you can't then start being selective and ignorant towards other ethical issues, just because that is something that entertains you (such as the Qatar World Cup). It is hypocritical and takes away your ability to judge other peoples moral views, as it shows you have also ignored ethical issues.
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Actually it doesn't. I don't actively avoid Marseille or Getafe games, they're just not on my radar to watch. If for whatever reason I'm at an establishment where they're showing one of those games for whatever reason, I'm not going to storm out.

I think Greenwood is a scumbag. I dont need a scared DV victim to tell me that he isn't.
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
80 in a 70 is not the same as the human rights issues in Qatar, the same as an 80 in a 70 is not the same as what Greenwood did. How can you preach about Greenwood when you didn't give a hoot about the Qatar World Cup. Selective morals while judging other peoples selective morals is not fair on the people you are judging.
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Why is it not? Is Qatar the same as what Greenwood did? Am I asking for the Qatari government to pay for my club or represent it in any way?

For you, is there anyone in the world who can judge anything ever?

Yep Greenwood is definitely the victim in all this.

Those damned woke women. Wanting to sing in bands and not get raped, it's a crazy world out there.

Presumably by the way,if I did rape someone....you wouldn't feel able to judge me because you wouldn't want to to judge poor Greenwood? Aka the real victim in all of this.
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
Relevant whataboutery, especially when the poster I said that to was talking about their 'moral compass.

If you have an apparent strong moral compass on ethical situations such as rape and other abhorrent acts, you can't then start being selective and ignorant towards other ethical issues, just because that is something that entertains you (such as the Qatar World Cup). It is hypocritical and takes away your ability to judge other peoples moral views, as it shows you have also ignored ethical issues.
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It's been shown time and time again why the 'if you didn't protest about X, you can't complain against Y' 'logic' is simplistic and ridiculous. I bought an iPhone and have worn Nike in the past, does that mean I don't get to say that genocide is wrong?

There's no point in doing this argument to death again though as you won't listen.
 
africanspur said:
Actually it doesn't. I don't actively avoid Marseille or Getafe games, they're just not on my radar to watch. If for whatever reason I'm at an establishment where they're showing one of those games for whatever reason, I'm not going to storm out.

I think Greenwood is a scumbag. I dont need a scared DV victim to tell me that he isn't.
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By the way, I think Greenwood is scum and I also truthfully hand on heart watched 0 minutes of the Qatar World Cup.

I just have a problem with selective morals and people sat on their high horse, judging other peoples moral views regarding human rights issues in football and footballers, when they themselves gave in over another human rights issue within football to satisfy their need for entertainment.
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
By the way, I think Greenwood is scum and I also truthfully hand on heart watched 0 minutes of the Qatar World Cup.

I just have a problem with selective morals and people sat on their high horse, judging other peoples moral views regarding human rights issues in football and footballers, when they themselves gave in over another human rights issue within football to satisfy their need for entertainment.
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Well that's everyone on earth.

It's impossible for people to be on top of absolutely everything that opposes their morals, but shitting on people for actually taking a stand for anything they feel strongly enough about to voice their feelings is not the way to go.
 
Pickle85 said:
It's been shown time and time again why the 'if you didn't protest about X, you can't complain against Y' 'logic' is simplistic and ridiculous. I bought an iPhone and have worn Nike in the past, does that mean I don't get to say that genocide is wrong?

There's no point in doing this argument to death again though as you won't listen.
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It is not about complaining about one over the other. My point is that you don't have a leg to stand on judging other people on their views of the Greenwood situation when you didn't give a hoot about everything that happens to people in Qatar.

I am not arguing about what Greenwood did, I am arguing about the judgmental hypocrites that are judging football fans for not caring about Greenwood.
 
Solius said:
Well that's everyone on earth.

It's impossible for people to be on top of absolutely everything that opposes their morals, but shitting on people for actually taking a stand for anything they feel strongly enough about to voice their feelings is not the way to go.
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I am judging the people shitting on the people that don't care about what Greenwood did, the same people that act like they care about human rights yet watched the Qatar World Cup.

I support people taking a stand on DV/rape, I am just saying it is harsh to judge people that still want Greenwood to play.
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
By the way, I think Greenwood is scum and I also truthfully hand on heart watched 0 minutes of the Qatar World Cup.

I just have a problem with selective morals and people sat on their high horse, judging other peoples moral views regarding human rights issues in football and footballers, when they themselves gave in over another human rights issue within football to satisfy their need for entertainment.
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Fine let's settle that. I'm a hypocritical scumbag.

Let's turn the questions around then.

1. Is there anyone in your worldview who can ever judge anyone's actions on anything ever? I used to do a lot of work with refugees and I remember one of our events being interrupted by a refugee telling us we were all complicit in genocide by buying smartphones for instance.

2. Is there any act heinous enough that your response wouldn't just be ah well football doesn't have morals, shrug shoulders?
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
I am judging the people shitting on the people that don't care about what Greenwood did, the same people that act like they care about human rights yet watched the Qatar World Cup.

I support people taking a stand on DV/rape, I am just saying it is harsh to judge people that still want Greenwood to play.
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Have I made a comment about Greenwood being stopped from playing?
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
It is not about complaining about one over the other. My point is that you don't have a leg to stand on judging other people on their views of the Greenwood situation when you didn't give a hoot about everything that happens to people in Qatar.

I am not arguing about what Greenwood did, I am arguing about the judgmental hypocrites that are judging football fans for not caring about Greenwood.
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So it's ok in your mind for someone to say that what Greenwood did was awful, but it's not ok for that person to take issue with other people that don't feel that what Greenwood did was awful? All because that person watches the Qatar world cup?
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
I am judging the people shitting on the people that don't care about what Greenwood did, the same people that act like they care about human rights yet watched the Qatar World Cup.

I support people taking a stand on DV/rape, I am just saying it is harsh to judge people that still want Greenwood to play.
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I think you'll probably find this was a lot of people. You are always going to find technical hypocrisies in everything. Some did it whilst also spreading awareness of their terrible human rights record, others felt it was just out of their control and didn't want cnuts like that forcing them to miss a spectacle they've watched every 4 years since they were a kid. Greenwood is much easier to ignore.

Don't think anyone said about him not playing either.
 
Presumably, going by this line of reasoning, I can never comment on any refugee crisis or geopolitical issue ever because:

-while I have gone on marches regarding and done work with refugees from Syria, Palestine, Sudan, Saudi, Tibet, Uganda etc etc among other countries, I have never done so for marches regarding DRC, Haiti, El Salvador or western Sahara.
-I own a smart phone and a laptop, as well as clothes. Many of which seem to have been manufactured in LEDCs.
 
africanspur said:
Presumably, going by this line of reasoning, I can never comment on any refugee crisis or geopolitical issue ever because:

-while I have gone on marches regarding and done work with refugees from Syria, Palestine, Sudan, Saudi, Tibet, Uganda etc etc among other countries, I have never done so for marches regarding DRC, Haiti, El Salvador or western Sahara.
-I own a smart phone and a laptop, as well as clothes. Many of which seem to have been manufactured in LEDCs.
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I think, if I'm reading it right, you're allowed a comment on the crisis itself but you're not allowed to disagree with someone that DOESN'T give a shit about these crises.

I think that's right, though maybe one or both of you also needs to have watched (or not watched, I struggled to follow) the Qatar world cup...
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
The problem is, his partner and her parents have moved on and dropped the charges. She then had his baby after.

Many people are looking at it as, if her and her family can all forgive him/move on. then why should football fans also not move on and forgive him.

I am not justifying what he did as it is disgusting, but that is clearly how many people are now seeing it.
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Its similar to people being released from prison, theyve served their time and have the right to a life afterward rehabilitated or not. The difference being that in the eyes of most he shall forever be guilty as the CPS denied him the ability to serve time and rehabilitation.
 
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