Mason Greenwood, Marseille Footballer | Read the thread rules in the OP before posting

Acrobat7 said:
So why do it then? From the OP: "Example of things that are off-topic for this thread: Whataboutisms relating to other club’s players"
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Yeah, but they prefaced it with the fact they didn't want to get into whataboutisms. So it doesn't count, that's how it works.
 
“Don’t want to get into whataboutisms” then does anyway.


What Greenwood did was indefensible. End of story


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UnrelatedPsuedo said:
Both these bolded points are 100% wrong. If you think they are correct, then you have to accept that it’s the clubs fault that Greenwoods character is lacking with regards to how he treats women.

The clubs number one job is to raise, train and educate young boys as they become men. That’s not to say we’re a school. But personal and professional development go hand in hand. The more well rounded an and well cared for a child is, the better they learn. Countless studies support this.

It’s also certainly not the job of parents to educate a child with regards to;

-How it feels to be a millionaire at 16
-How it feels to be surrounded by older men 24/7, with close to no women present, and certainly none your age.
-How having money young will open up doors that should (and will) remain closed for everyone you go to school with.
-How his schoolmates will engage with him in a different way to his peers.
-How the media and ‘fame’ will affect him.
-And, most crucially, how girls and latterly, women, will engage with you.

It’s no criticism of you, but there’s really a lot in this. Kids in football academies now are taught about the perils of social media in a way that school kids are not. Mainly as asset protection, because capitalism, but also base level of care.

Put it this way; If I’d dumped one million pounds into your bank account at 15, and given you a near guarantee that another £10-100m would be following it, with women pursuing you daily, through a device you carried at all times, and that women would want you for no reason other than who you are… how much would you listen to schoolteachers? How much do you listen to a parent telling you to ‘Be careful’?

Without those early adolescent years of self doubt, working your way through a co-ed school, finding your path through puberty, becoming a man… do you honestly think you’d pop out a well rounded man with a respect for women? It’s impossible for these kids. Especially those with almost guaranteed stardom ahead.

Beyond that, it’s 100% a clubs role to provide spaces for these kids to grow together. To have open forums where they learn to report on each others behaviour. To first of all understand what bad behaviour is, and then instill confidence in them to report when they see bad behaviour amongst boys and young men around them.

I’m tempted to just post the Daniel Sloss explainer at this point. Greenwood doesn’t just ‘become’ an abuser. There are hundreds, if not thousands of points of incidence along the way that lead to it. Loads of people would have seen behaviour they’d not have tolerated towards their sister, or friend. That can be as generic as how someone talks about women.

It’s a giant problem in sport. Football has a really dark spot inside it and through agents, clubs, and money, lots of it never becomes public.

So when a case so shocking comes to light, it fcuks me off to see people take a stance that puts money above all else (not saying that’s you).

If we made it a site condition that before anyone posted in this thread they had to listen to the audio and look at the photos, before hitting post?… this thread would be empty.

It’s not really about there being ‘dark forces’ at the heart of the club. We do wonderful things for so many kids. Most kids we never even see play. It’s a wonderful thing and I’m immensely proud of it. But analysing the clubs role in one of its failed men, is normal. It should happen. I suspect that it has/does. But still we seek to profit from it.

Had the club whacked £1 on every ticket and announced ‘This is because we have made a financial decision to not profit from the sale of Mason Greenwood. We will continue to support the player in every way that he needs. We have also reviewed our internal processes and have brought external specialists in to talk to the young men at this football club on an ongoing basis’… who complains?

Yet the way we have handled it, profiting, not commenting, moving on and sweeping it under the rug? Truly awful.
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Sure, I can understand the need for the club to provide support to players and their families around the topics of wealth and fame. But treating women or anyone for that matter with basic respect, not resorting to violence.. these are such basic morals and values that I don't see how teaching these are the responsiblity of the club. I don't think money is the cause of these issues. Perhaps it exacerbates the behaviour but I don't think it's the cause. From what I can tell Greenwood is an outlier. Luckily there are plenty of positive examples that the club has produced. Like you say, the club does wonderful things for so many kids. Which tells me the platform was there for Greenwood to succeed, yet he didn't. For me it's taking it a step too far to blame the club for his actions. I agree the club should look into cases like these to see if lessons can be learned from them and in this case there definitely are. But where I think the club went wrong in this case is in how they handled the matter after the fact. Unfortunately that doesn't prevent it which is what you really want.

Edit: Perhaps we should leave it at this considering it does not quite fall within the scope of a performance thread. Though to be honest, most posts in this thread don't.
 
Devil_forever said:
Can you all stop talking about his personal life now? It's been done to death and I'm sure Niall and the mods are probably sick of having to police these posts by now.
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What you are asking for is a thread where everyone can ignore what’s gone on and fawn over his goals?

That’s not going to happen. Mods POV it’s this thread or none and no mention of him ever again on these boards
 
golden_blunder said:
What you are asking for is a thread where everyone can ignore what’s gone on and fawn over his goals?

That’s not going to happen. Mods POV it’s this thread or none and no mention of him ever again on these boards
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No I'm asking for them to stop bringing up stuff that's going to have you guys spending your time having to hand out infractions. No one is going to fawn over Mason Greenwood.
 
africanspur said:
Maybe I'm being naive but I can't see him coming to a top club in England.

Honestly, some of the posters on here (not meaning you) are so so weird. What is this weird fawning of a player who, as far as I'm aware, was never even a pivotal player for the club over a prolonged period of time?
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Academy players are romanticized at United more than most any other club in the world, even the ones that are disgraced like Greenwood.

But to your earlier point, I think top clubs will just suck it up and buy him if he’s scoring 25+ and just bet on their fans forgetting his past. Grim but it’s what history tells us happens with all of these players.
 
Valencia Shin Crosses said:
Academy players are romanticized at United more than most any other club in the world, even the ones that are disgraced like Greenwood.

But to your earlier point, I think top clubs will just suck it up and buy him if he’s scoring 25+ and just bet on their fans forgetting his past. Grim but it’s what history tells us happens with all of these players.
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Can’t see him playing in England again
 
Devil_forever said:
Can you all stop talking about his personal life now? It's been done to death and I'm sure Niall and the mods are probably sick of having to police these posts by now.
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No. The very real and very major issues of domestic violence and rape should never be brushed under the carpet.

And I'd heavily wager the thing they are sick of most is having to try to not insta-ban some of the absolute cretins in this thread.
 
Redlambs said:
No. The very real and very major issues of domestic violence and rape should never be brushed under the carpet.

And I'd heavily wager the thing they are sick of most is having to try to not insta-ban some of the absolute cretins in this thread.
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You seem obsessed to be honest. The majority of your posts in the last month have been in this thread.
 
mu4c_20le said:
You seem obsessed to be honest. The majority of your posts in the last month have been in this thread.
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Most people want nothing to do with MG, there would be no thread if people didn't have the need to discuss the career of the abuser. A few are quite zealous,so in return on a point of principle some of us feel the enthusiasm for the abuser should be tempered with who and what he is. Most people want nothing to do with the subject so that means the discussion could look disproportionately enthusiastic. And that wouldn't be a good look.
 
moses said:
Most people want nothing to do with MG, there would be no thread if people didn't have the need to discuss the career of the abuser. A few are quite zealous,so in return on a point of principle some of us feel the enthusiasm for the abuser should be tempered with who and what he is. Most people want nothing to do with the subject so that means the discussion could look disproportionately enthusiastic. And that wouldn't be a good look.
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While I am definitely in favour of freedom of speech, I don't think you can have it both ways in this thread. Either don't allow praising of his performances, or don't allow discussion of his private life, because at this point nobody's minds are being changed anymore, it's just sniping from both sides and angry warnings being handed out on an alarmingly more frequent basis than any other thread. (except maybe eth right after the cup win). I pointed out his zealousness because it's not healthy for anyone, i'm sure he doesn't enjoy it either as you said. It's a dumpster fire, that needs to be contained sooner or later.
 
mu4c_20le said:
While I am definitely in favour of freedom of speech, I don't think you can have it both ways in this thread. Either don't allow praising of his performances, or don't allow discussion of his private life, because at this point nobody's minds are being changed anymore, it's just sniping from both sides and angry warnings being handed out on an alarmingly more frequent basis than any other thread. (except maybe eth right after the cup win). I pointed out his zealousness because it's not healthy for anyone, i'm sure he doesn't enjoy it either as you said. It's a dumpster fire, that needs to be contained sooner or later.
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Your concern is appreciated. Your alarm noted. The less people post the quicker the thread will die.
 
Redlambs said:
More ashamed that so many fans of this club don't give a shit about domestic abuse and rape.

Funny you pick on my posts about all this though, eh?
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I am actually concerned for your well being, not because of what side you are on
 
mu4c_20le said:
You seem obsessed to be honest. The majority of your posts in the last month have been in this thread.
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That's not even true. Redlambs has posted approximately 120 times in the past month, and only 20% of those posts were in this thread. 34% were in a thread about Oasis.

The question is, why do you care?
 
Fridge chutney said:
That's not even true. Redlambs has posted approximately 120 times in the past month, and only 20% of those posts were in this thread. 34% were in a thread about Oasis.

The question is, why do you care?
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Perhaps the most disturbing thing posted in this thread.
 
Amar__ said:
It's funny how people like @Redlambs are allowed to continually call people here all kind of names, and yet that same poster praised Ronaldo for years, and never said a bad word about him, not even when the allegations came out, not even when he paid off the victim he probably raped, not even when the evidence of him raping that girl came out. Because that's his hero and after all it's easier to pretend you are Mr. Right guy by calling other people here all kind of names without calling your hero with those same names and admitting you worshipped the wrong guy. Despite that guy being terrible person and an actual rapist unlike many people who are at wrong for following footballers who score goals.

It seems funny that I couldn't find his single bad post about Ronaldo(and many good about him), while he is one of leading posters in this thread making sure the world know how big rapist Greenwood is, and how big twat everyone who posts in this thread is.
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'Hypocrisy, the lowest of criticism.' If that's not a saying, it should be. Also, whataboutism in relation to posters is still whataboutism.

More on point, if @Redlambs was/is wrong about Ronaldo, it doesn't mean they are wrong about Greenwood now. So except if you actually have something to say about their points in relation to Greenwood, please take this to a Ronaldo thread.
 
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Amar__ said:
It's funny how people like @Redlambs are allowed to continually call people here all kind of names, and yet that same poster praised Ronaldo for years, and never said a bad word about him, not even when the allegations came out, not even when he paid off the victim he probably raped, not even when the evidence of him raping that girl came out. Because that's his hero and after all it's easier to pretend you are Mr. Right guy by calling other people here all kind of names without calling your hero with those same names and admitting you worshipped the wrong guy. Despite that guy being terrible person and an actual rapist unlike many people who are at wrong for following footballers who score goals.

It seems funny that I couldn't find his single bad post about Ronaldo(and many good about him), while he is one of leading posters in this thread making sure the world know how big rapist Greenwood is, and how big twat everyone who posts in this thread is.
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So he made a mistake, realised he’s wrong and has taken it onboard with the Greenwood case. If only other people could maturely change their minds
 
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