Manuel Ugarte | Romano - he’s signed | Awaiting Club announcement

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Ekeke said:
I'm sure for the right offer we're happy to let him go but how many clubs are realistically offering somewhere near what we paid for him now?

The club arent going to want to let him go for much less than the £59 million we spent on him. If we let him go for much less than that 2 seasons after signing him then hes viewed as a failure.

Which of the top clubs have a spot for him and want to spend that money?

So I think a much more realistic outlook is hes staying to have a better season, or until he is unhappy because he's not playing if Ugarte comes in and a new CB comes in and both are great so he is never picked. Maybe then he wants games near the end of his career and he himself wants to move. Right now I'm sure he's very happy being paid handsomely and thinks he'll play well when picked next season and will play plenty of games.
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I think the club would take a significant hit on the fee, it's a different ownership and I think they'll look at the chance to be rid of his wages as a big benefit. I also don't think Casemiro will want to stay if he's replaced as a starter with Ugarte coming in, so there's that aspect too.

We'll see who goes for him, if anyone. It'd be a Saudi club if anyone realistically.
 
bosnian_red said:
I think the club would take a significant hit on the fee, it's a different ownership and I think they'll look at the chance to be rid of his wages as a big benefit. I also don't think Casemiro will want to stay if he's replaced as a starter with Ugarte coming in, so there's that aspect too.

We'll see who goes for him, if anyone. It'd be a Saudi club if anyone realistically.
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Why would they want to sell him for lets say £10-12 million less and helping to pay his wages at a new club?

Theres loads of people still at the club that were involved in us signing him and who will want a positive feeling and spin on whats going on at the club. Plenty of super egos who thought the transfer is a good idea and one season with mistakes ruining good performances isnt going to completely change opinions.

Players have a poor season all the time and around those mistakes which were obviously bad - sitting yourself on the floor and not getting the ball or fouling the man is terrible and im sure he realizes that, he was still better than our other midfielders bar Mainoo and Fernandes who is so far forward hes essentially an attacker.

Same thing when he went to CB at the end of the season. He was one of our best CBs this season in the couple of games he had there because he was constantly winning the ball from their attackers, but he did make a couple of mistakes that took away from the performances and he should improve on those. Those mistakes were new and theres plenty of reason to believe he can sort it out going forward whether hes playing DM or CB.

Additionally one of the reasons we signed him was for his experience. Young midfielders and players at the club can learn a huge amount from him as someone who has won a lot of competitions. We've already lost some of that experience with Varane going, making it more valuable for Mainoo and the young midfielders we hope transition from our youth teams to the first team. Ugarte, McTominay and Amrabat dont have that to offer. Few of our players in any position have it to offer. Casemiro does
 
Out of all of our transfer targets this summer, this guy is definitely the one that fills me with the most optimism. Watched the game last night just to see his performance and he done well to make Paqueta and Bruno G look completely average. I know Brazil haven't really been in the best of form recently but he still looks like a beast. Hopefully PSG let him go.
 
Guimeres and Paqueta looked downright intimidated by him last night. That alone would be enough to justify the money for me. He was smarts with the ball as well though. Is he going to spray passes all over the field like a Kroos? No, but so what?. He has good passing range and can progress the ball. And he looked like he had a very good grasp of when he could get away with some dark arts and when to look at the ref as if offended an opposing player would suggest something dodgy.

He looks like great business to me.
 
Bluelion7 said:
Guimeres and Paqueta looked downright intimidated by him last night. That alone would be enough to justify the money for me. He was smarts with the ball as well though. Is he going to spray passes all over the field like a Kroos? No, but so what?. He has good passing range and can progress the ball. And he looked like he had a very good grasp of when he could get away with some dark arts and when to look at the ref as if offended an opposing player would suggest something dodgy.

He looks like great business to me.
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Surprised Boehly isn't all over this. With Gallagher leaving, there could be room as Enzo could be pushed up. Instant Kante replacement.
 
SATA said:
Do we think he can play with Casemiro in midfield, or is that too much of a defensive overkill? I would really love this pair to start together when we go to the Etihad or Emirates
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If cost to value for keeping Casemiro is too high, then maybe there's a chance we keep Amrabat?
 
Ekeke said:
I'm sure for the right offer we're happy to let him go but how many clubs are realistically offering somewhere near what we paid for him now?

The club arent going to want to let him go for much less than the £59 million we spent on him. If we let him go for much less than that 2 seasons after signing him then hes viewed as a failure.

Which of the top clubs have a spot for him and want to spend that money?

So I think a much more realistic outlook is hes staying to have a better season, or until he is unhappy because he's not playing if Ugarte comes in and a new CB comes in and both are great so he is never picked. Maybe then he wants games near the end of his career and he himself wants to move. Right now I'm sure he's very happy being paid handsomely and thinks he'll play well when picked next season and will play plenty of games.
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He has been here for a couple of years, no way we demand anything to what we paid for him and nor is it necessary for PSR reasons cause if he signed on a five year deal his book value has fallen by 24m already. Getting his £18m wages off the books would be more beneficial financially and for PSR reasons.

As for him being happy with his current deal well the Saudis can offer him ten times more given his profile and he'd play in a less demanding league which would be easier on his body and help prolong his career. I'm sure if he told by Ten Hag that he is no longer a starter he is going straight to Saudi Arabia for his big payday. If he doesn't move this season he will move next summer because we are certainly signing a starter in his role this summer.
 
mu4c_20le said:
Surprised Boehly isn't all over this. With Gallagher leaving, there could be room as Enzo could be pushed up. Instant Kante replacement.
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If I understand their “style” correctly (not saying it will work, but what they want to try), they won’t have a Ugarte type. It’s why Uguchukwu could be moving on as well.

Prior to January we were scouting Ugarte heavily. It is around that time I personally believe they decided they wanted Maresca or someone associated with coaching Peps style. That’s when we started inverting our fullbacks and playing a style that deviated in significant areas from Poch ball.

Anyway, one thing Poch and Maresca agree on is that Enzo plays best the deeper he starts and the more of the field is in front of him, but he won’t be a lone 6. He will have either Cucurella next to him or Reece., being the playmaking base of what is essentially a midfield pentagon.

Otherwise I think we would have been all over Ugarte as well. I think he would be fantastic for United.
 
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This is the transfer I'm excited about. Really hope it gets done.
 
What’s his ability like on the ball and in tight spaces? Does he have good technical ability?

We’ve had huge issues in this area for years now with the likes of Fred & Mctominnay and then Amrabat & Casimero all awful in these situations. All slow on the turn & clumsy on the ball, it’s a made building up from the back such an issue.

Mainoo has shown the level of technique needed in these areas and I’m hoping any midfield signings follow suit.
 
Bluelion7 said:
Anyway, one thing Poch and Maresca agree on is that Enzo plays best the deeper he starts and the more of the field is in front of him, but he won’t be a lone 6.
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I thought that much was pretty obvious but from the way you articulate it I gather it took some trial and error to work it out. Weird for a 100M signing.
 
antohan said:
I thought that much was pretty obvious but from the way you articulate it I gather it took some trial and error to work it out. Weird for a 100M signing.
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Enzo is a weird one for me. World class progressive passer, but not really a creator. Not much of a threat around the box, yet he’s also not good enough athletically/defensively to play as a true holding mid either.

It’s a weird player to fit into modern sides because you want him setting tempo and running the show but he’s also not on the level of a Kroos where it’s just a no brainer that you give him a water carrier next to him and the midfield is elite.
 
Raoul said:
Retaining Amrabat and buying Ugarte in exchange for Casemiro moving on would be great business.
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I feel like Amrabat is a bit too heavy footed and laborious in the Premier League though
 
Valencia Shin Crosses said:
Enzo is a weird one for me. World class progressive passer, but not really a creator. Not much of a threat around the box, yet he’s also not good enough athletically/defensively to play as a true holding mid either.

It’s a weird player to fit into modern sides because you want him setting tempo and running the show but he’s also not on the level of a Kroos where it’s just a no brainer that you give him a water carrier next to him and the midfield is elite.
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I think Enzo will be fine he's only 23 he might turn into that in another year or two and he'd still be relatively young. Too many expectations on young guys, it's why I don't want Mainoo starting every game. He needs time to grow mentally and physically. Starting every game he many not have time to assess himself and realize his weaknesses because he's just focused on recovery and getting ready for the next game.

Also I think if we sign Ugarte, getting Amrabat might be fine. I think he'll play better with a guy like Ugarte and he can focus on building up from the back. I'd feel better defensively with Ugarte and Amrabat.
 
Ugarte is not a creative passer, but does well recycling and progressing the ball and is fairly comfortable under pressure.

With Mainoo as a press-resistant passer/dribbler and Bruno as the creative outlet, I think the offensive balance is good.

Defensively, the workrate from Ugarte and Bruno is very high and Mainoo is no slouch either.

If there is an issue with this midfield, it is tactics, not personnel.

Ideally I think, we sell Casemiro, get Ugarte and keep Amrabat as well.
 
I'm not on Twitter or anything, so rely on the Transfer Tweets thread for regular updates from the ITK's. How serious are any tier 1 links confirming our Ugarte interest / how close the transfer is?

I see some strong confirmation for the Zirkzee and De Ligt deals, but Ugarte seems to be more coming from the Uruguayan end as far as I can tell? Have the respected Tier 1 people suggested it's anywhere near as close as the other two deals? As he's the one I'm most eager to see confirmed. The other two I'm hoping to see get over the line as well, but I'd especially love to see a DM like Ugarte signed.
 
I we can move Casemiro on to Saudi Arabia then bring in both Ugarte and Amrabat I think we’ve got a very strong and balanced midfield along with Fernandes, Mainoo, McTominay and Mount plus Eriksen maybe sticking around.
 
Valencia Shin Crosses said:
Enzo is a weird one for me. World class progressive passer, but not really a creator. Not much of a threat around the box, yet he’s also not good enough athletically/defensively to play as a true holding mid either.

It’s a weird player to fit into modern sides because you want him setting tempo and running the show but he’s also not on the level of a Kroos where it’s just a no brainer that you give him a water carrier next to him and the midfield is elite.
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What highlighted him as a special player was the maturity displayed as he got on the pitch in that second half against Mexico. Argentina had lost the opener and they were struggling again with a single shot in the first half. All over the shop.

Kid comes on, sits at the base of the midfield, asks for the ball and the weight of responsibility, and turns absolute disjointed chaos into total control of the game and its tempo.

I know it's just one game and Mexico in a group stage, but it's doing that in that context which makes you sit up and take notice that he already has attributes most players don't have or develop in their entire career.

He scored a goal too, but that was just a nice icing on the cake. Lots of randomers score at World Cups and you never hear from them again.
 
Bertie Wooster said:
I see some strong confirmation for the Zirkzee and De Ligt deals, but Ugarte seems to be more coming from the Uruguayan end as far as I can tell?
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The only semi-serious links I've seen at "the Uruguayan end" all quote Romano as the source. This is no Chilevision scenario.
 
ThinkTank@Cafe said:
Hope Uruguay don’t win the Copa. PSG might demand £80-100M for him.
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Funny, a week ago nobody wanted him because he wasn't Neves or some lab experimental cross of prime Scholes, Keane and Frenkie de Jong.

Now I'm alone in this ABU^2 world.
 
antohan said:
Funny, a week ago nobody wanted him because he wasn't Neves or some lab experimental cross of prime Scholes, Keane and Frenkie de Jong.

Now I'm alone in this ABU^2 world.
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He’s not? :(

I still want him though, those highlight reels of him flying into tackles are like human catnip to me….

…oh and he can break up attacks and make decent passes, yada yada
 
D. Grayson said:
Kobbie is nowhere near as good a passer as Eriksen. His ball-carrying is almost world-class, but his passing has always been just good enough. Players like Hansen-Aarøen, Dan Gore, and Oyedele were all better passers than Kobbie at the youth level. I think we will get the beat out of Kobbie if we play him next to a rangy passer who can sit back and dictate the tempo.
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Except then neither player is sufficiently defensive. There aren't really any available DLPs out there, let alone any who are also defensive units who can shield a back four. That's basically just Rodri.

Mainoo is creative in his running and short passing. Bruno is as creative a passer as they come (with range, too.) Martinez has an excellent range of passing. So does De Ligt, if we do get him to play alongside Martinez. We can afford one player whose brief is just defensive.
 
davidmichael said:
I we can move Casemiro on to Saudi Arabia then bring in both Ugarte and Amrabat I think we’ve got a very strong and balanced midfield along with Fernandes, Mainoo, McTominay and Mount plus Eriksen maybe sticking around.
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Can this Amrabat love in please stop ? He’s not good enough simple as.
 
If we got this over the line and provided we got the other 2 signings sorted it would be a very decent upgrade .

Varane out De Ligt In
Martial out Zirkcee In
Amrabat out Ugarte In
Casemiro Out ???? In
 
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