Manuel Ugarte | Romano - he’s signed | Awaiting Club announcement

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Cassidy said:
Only issue I would have here is his wages, got to be on quite a lot at PSG
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daba said:
I believe he is actually only on about £110-120k a week which is not crazy. We could effectively offer him Eriksen’s wages which is about £150k and ship Eriksen off to Turkey for a couple of quid.
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€118k gross, so wages wouldn't be an issue at all
 
Looks like a very tenacious player. PSG is a basket case off a club. So wouldn’t judge him there. Still only 23. I think this would be a good signing. Hope we get him. Middle of the pitch was a huge problem last season
 
Pretty sure PSG would sell if we make the right offer. The question is how much do they want. No doubt they would sell, he is a squad player. He didnt play their most important games this year.
 
jesperjaap said:
Personally neither are good enough.Was abig fanfare about Ugarte last summer and seen nothing in his season At PSG to live up to he hype. As for Onana he is about as progressive as a bollard. I get the physical attributes but he is just so bang average as a player, no Everton fans seem hot on him....really dont get what lots of pundits and fans see in him at all, £50/60m odd people seeing as a good deal yet Rice was a ludicrous fee....in comparison it definately isnt for me.

Good the club dont seem prepared to pay silly fees for players.....as that makes me feel thereis no way we arein for Onana, Ugarte though is no better so who knows
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Onana is absolutely as progressive as a bollard at Everton because their manager doesn't look to progress the ball through midfield. And then I've seen some Everton fans say that Onana doesn't dominate the midfield when in-fact their manager doesn't even attempt to progress through midfield. The difference between how Onana is being utilised with Belgium under Tedesco compared to Dyche at Everton is a big difference.

I've never said that Onana is a playmaker or a high volume passer. But it's clear to see when you watch him play that he's got all the fundamentals to play in a team that wants to sacrifice defensive stability for goals. And even at Everton where there isn't a onus on progression through midfield he's still statistically better than Ugarte who has played in teams who are far more possession dominant and his passing game is still limited. Of course PSG are trying to get rid, because he doesn't fit into the Luis Enrique's positional play requirements.

I covered evertyhing in the post below.
Adnan said:
If the aim is to be a more dominant team in possession, then what is required out of possession is extremely important in the current EPL. I don't believe we can be a dominant team in possession without also having the ability to be dominant out of possession. Both concepts (in & out of possession) are linked and ignoring one or the other will result in our system of play not functioning to a high enough level.

And as far as Onana is concerned, he absolutely isn't bad technically but rather he's very good technically for such a big guy. He's not a playmaker or someone that will play a high volume of passes but within a team dynamic he will provide qualities that are clearly lacking in this Man Utd team. We do not require any one player to shoulder the creative burden in the build up phase and the key to having a strong build up capability in possession is to look at the first phase players as a collective unit and see how they will collectively progress the ball and also repel opposition transitions. So the new CB signing along with Martinez, Shaw and Dalot should also be required to contribute at a good level on the ball as far as exerting control in possession is concerned. Then we have Mainoo and potentially Onana in midfield who both possess ability to receive the pass on the turn with Mainoo having the added freedom and responsibility to be the deep roaming playmaker.

So being a positionally strong team (possession dominant) absolutely requires the team to have a good balance of players with a more expansive passing game and also having the capability to control the large spaces which will open up when applying a high press backed up by a high defensive line. Failing to control or contain that space out of possession will render our possession capabilities ineffective imo.

I want my team to play dominant football but I'm not that naive to believe that all we need is technically secure players on the ball whilst ignoring the out of possession concepts that are a must in a physically and athletically demanding EPL if the aim is to sacrifice defensive stability for goals in a higher defensive line.

And as far as Bruno Fernandes is concerned, he's a player who is best played further up the pitch and his playstyle is one where he does play a high volume of vertical passes with a higher element of risk hence giving the ball away is absolutely a possibility. But if we're keeping him and we want to get the best out of him, then we have to become a team that is good at winning the ball back quickly and pro-actively. Man Utd cannot do this currently and having something like the team below will potentially see us win the ball back quickly and effectively for the likes of Bruno to be more effective in the final third.

I've only added two players to our midfield and first line below. But I think both Kossounou and Onana would raise our technical and athletic level where would become more proactive as a team. I think we would require more players to be brought in but I think that would be a good start to the window imo. Man Utd will always be a attractive proposition for players but we can be even more attractive once we get the ball rolling as far as getting a system of play working for the modern day.

-----------------------Onana------------
Dalot---Kossounou---Martinez---Shaw
-----------Mainoo-------Onana-----
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Sly said:
Correct. Hugo Viana as DoF and our scouting department have been very good. Next in line for big business are Gyokeres (Arsenal rumors), Hjulmand, Inácio, Diomande, even Pote can eventually be a decent deal with the Aston Villa interest. I think Hugo Viana will probably move to a bigger club when Amorim leaves. They are close friends.

Depending on the price tag, Ugarte would be a good player for United. Really liked him when he played for us. Also think he has the right personality for this United phase. He's a no nonsense, no fuss, ultimate professional player. Probably wants out because he's not a starter atm. Doesn't seem like a guy who would be happy to sit on the bench and just pick the checks. Always seemed ambitious and had the objective of solidifying as an Uruguay starter.
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I think Fresneda is one to watch as well. Wouldn't be surprised to see him at a top 10 club in a few years.

However, I don't think Gyökeres is worth big money so I don't expect Arsenal to splash the cash for him, as they have been getting good value on their purchases in the Edu and Arteta era.
 
Rojofiam said:
I think Fresneda is one to watch as well. Wouldn't be surprised to see him at a top 10 club in a few years.

However, I don't think Gyökeres is worth big money so I don't expect Arsenal to splash the cash for him, as they have been getting good value on their purchases in the Edu and Arteta era.
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You got the other way around mate. Fresneda can still turn it around but he looks very raw and I remain unconvinced. He was injured and out for a while but when he played he looked completely out of depth even in the portuguese league. We are open to either loaning him or selling him already. Might be that Amorim doesn't rate him too.

Gyokeres is one of the best strikers I've ever seen in a Sporting shirt. Strong physically, can run for days, good technic and finishing. He can also assist his teammates well. Although he did very well in the portuguese league and Europa League, I think next season in the CL will be the ultimate test. He wants to stay one more season and probably will since we are asking for his 100 million clause. Arsenal or not, I think he will be in the PL next year at least.
 
Sly said:
You got the other way around mate. Fresneda can still turn it around but he looks very raw and I remain unconvinced. He was injured and out for a while but when he played he looked completely out of depth even in the portuguese league. We are open to either loaning him or selling him already. Might be that Amorim doesn't rate him too.

Gyokeres is one of the best strikers I've ever seen in a Sporting shirt. Strong physically, can run for days, good technic and finishing. He can also assist his teammates well. Although he did very well in the portuguese league and Europa League, I think next season in the CL will be the ultimate test. He wants to stay one more season and probably will since we are asking for his 100 million clause. Arsenal or not, I think he will be in the PL next year at least.
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Fresneda: At his age and lack of experience, I think being raw is acceptable. What I've seen from him (pre-Sporting) is admittedly not much, but I really liked him and I think the talent is there.

Gyökeres: If you look at the Primeira Liga, isn't Sporting vastly superior to most of the opponents they face in the league? No offense, but Gyökeres had decent numbers in Coventry as well, and Coventry has more competition in the Championship than Sporting does in Portugal IMO. His improvement at Sporting doesn't make him a 100 million striker for me, not at all.
 
Adnan said:
Onana is absolutely as progressive as a bollard at Everton because their manager doesn't look to progress the ball through midfield. And then I've seen some Everton fans say that Onana doesn't dominate the midfield when in-fact their manager doesn't even attempt to progress through midfield. The difference between how Onana is being utilised with Belgium under Tedesco compared to Dyche at Everton is a big difference.

I've never said that Onana is a playmaker or a high volume passer. But it's clear to see when you watch him play that he's got all the fundamentals to play in a team that wants to sacrifice defensive stability for goals. And even at Everton where there isn't a onus on progression through midfield he's still statistically better than Ugarte who has played in teams who are far more possession dominant and his passing game is still limited. Of course PSG are trying to get rid, because he doesn't fit into the Luis Enrique's positional play requirements.

I covered evertyhing in the post below.
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Whether or not he is being utilised by his teams manager best or not, I disagree on him being he answer.Maybe it ishimlost in a system, but he looks pretty naive and unaware to me as well as sloppy. He is a Mourinho type signing and nota verygood one. Really think it would be money badly spent signing him as personally see little beyigthe physicality which you canbuy for fractions of that price
 
Rojofiam said:
Fresneda: At his age and lack of experience, I think being raw is acceptable. What I've seen from him (pre-Sporting) is admittedly not much, but I really liked him and I think the talent is there.

Gyökeres: If you look at the Primeira Liga, isn't Sporting vastly superior to most of the opponents they face in the league? No offense, but Gyökeres had decent numbers in Coventry as well, and Coventry has more competition in the Championship than Sporting does in Portugal IMO. His improvement at Sporting doesn't make him a 100 million striker for me, not at all.
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I'm not saying he's worth 100 million, Sporting is asking that because he is our most important player and we have a solid financial situation which enables us to drive a hard bargain. I can't argue about the competitive nature of our league. He did score multiple times against Fc Porto and Benfica who are top clubs in Europe and way better than anything the championship can offer though. He did well for us in the Europa League and is solidifying his status in the Swedish national team. I think he can make it in England but that's just an opinion and speculation. We have to wait and see if he eventually gets there.
 
Von Mistelroum said:
Is this actually likely, or are we chasing unrealistic targets again?
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He might be on the market. My guess is that since Enrique likes more cultured midfilders who are good on the ball this guy has become surplus to the requirement.
 
Insanity said:
He might be on the market. My guess is that since Enrique likes more cultured midfilders who are good on the ball this guy has become surplus to the requirement.
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Except hes good on the ball…
 
jesperjaap said:
Whether or not he is being utilised by his teams manager best or not, I disagree on him being he answer.Maybe it ishimlost in a system, but he looks pretty naive and unaware to me as well as sloppy. He is a Mourinho type signing and nota verygood one. Really think it would be money badly spent signing him as personally see little beyigthe physicality which you canbuy for fractions of that price
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No single player is the answer imo, but that one player can be part of the solution towards creating a team in the EPL which can build play from deeper at a good level, squeeze the pitch in a higher line with the aim of pressing the opponent high up the pitch and then having players occupying deeper positions who control or contain transitions in 1v1 situation.

If the aim is to implement a more dominant brand of football then all three of the aforementioned concepts have to come together or else the system will break down and we'll carry on handing the initiative to the likes of Man City and Arsenal who have several players who many would consider not to be of a high technical level but they have the pace and power along with a functional technical game in possession that can be worked around. And these teams don't have world beaters in every position but they create teams with a purpose to dominate all phases of play.

The #6 market looks dead to me right now, and in previous years I've brought up players like Vitinha or even Rodri very early when he moved from Villarreal to Atletico Madrid. I don't see anything close to that level of potential right now but that doesn't mean you can't create a well oiled machine for a proactive attacking game with a different profile of player without sacrificing anything on the ball.
 
I think he is too much of a limited "destroyer" to be the best fit at the base of our midfield with Mainoo. We need someone more like a deep-lying playmaker.
 
SparcMac said:
I think he is too much of a limited "destroyer" to be the best fit at the base of our midfield with Mainoo. We need someone more like a deep-lying playmaker.
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He's a high energy destroyer with a limited passing game. He's good at keeping it simple but isn't someone that should be relied on to break lines. I think signing him puts a lot of emphasis on the likes of Martinez, Shaw and Mainoo to shoulder the creative burden in the build up. Hopefully Ugarte's high energy game where he hussles and harries opponent's will compliment the aforementioned players out of possession.
 
There's a lot of misconception that Ugarte can't pass expansively. He can but he's always played with a player or players in the middle that took on that responsibility. He wins it back and passes it fwd simply. He recycles possession expertly and that is what we need right now. You all complained about how open we were through the middle last year and here is a perfect player to help with that and yet you're all strung up on progressive passing. Mainoo and Fernandes will handle that and Martinez stepping out from the back too. We need steel, agility and power in the middle and Ugarte can provide that and is still young enough to improve too. He's made for the prem.
 
He’s press resistant and robust. A loan with an option to buy would be very smart business as there’s no telling how he’ll take to the league or if himself and Mainoo will complement each other. He’s listed as a world class player in FM for what it’s worth
 
devilsadvoca8 said:
There's a lot of misconception that Ugarte can't pass expansively. He can but he's always played with a player or players in the middle that took on that responsibility. He wins it back and passes it fwd simply. He recycles possession expertly and that is what we need right now. You all complained about how open we were through the middle last year and here is a perfect player to help with that and yet you're all strung up on progressive passing. Mainoo and Fernandes will handle that and Martinez stepping out from the back too. We need steel, agility and power in the middle and Ugarte can provide that and is still young enough to improve too. He's made for the prem.
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This. Our CM is being overrun with casemiro, Eriksen/mount and Bruno. Mainoo improved us but casemiro can't do the running anymore. Hence why we need ugarte. A cm with him, Bruno and mainoo gives us balance
 
devilsadvoca8 said:
There's a lot of misconception that Ugarte can't pass expansively. He can but he's always played with a player or players in the middle that took on that responsibility. He wins it back and passes it fwd simply. He recycles possession expertly and that is what we need right now. You all complained about how open we were through the middle last year and here is a perfect player to help with that and yet you're all strung up on progressive passing. Mainoo and Fernandes will handle that and Martinez stepping out from the back too. We need steel, agility and power in the middle and Ugarte can provide that and is still young enough to improve too. He's made for the prem.
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I mostly agree with your post but Ugarte has always been someone that keeps it simple in possession. It's not his game to be more expansive on the ball and I completely agree that he can potentially add that steel in the midfield that we're obviously missing out of possession.

And our midfield was never open but rather the the CBs didn't close off the space by stepping into the space vacated by the midfield.

If we sign Ugarte then I think it's probably a good idea to sign a very progressive RCB instead of targeting Branthwaite.
 
devilsadvoca8 said:
There's a lot of misconception that Ugarte can't pass expansively. He can but he's always played with a player or players in the middle that took on that responsibility. He wins it back and passes it fwd simply. He recycles possession expertly and that is what we need right now. You all complained about how open we were through the middle last year and here is a perfect player to help with that and yet you're all strung up on progressive passing. Mainoo and Fernandes will handle that and Martinez stepping out from the back too. We need steel, agility and power in the middle and Ugarte can provide that and is still young enough to improve too. He's made for the prem.
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What do you make of his positioning? Can he play the role of the deepest midfielder of a three and just sit and mop up behind? Or will he leave the CBs exposed on transitions because he rushes up high to win the ball but fails?
 
wonder how long it takes for Chelsea to enter their 600th transfer race this summer
 
I made a few posts about him before he moved to Europe. Watched him in some international youth games. I'll have to look them up later. I was a fan but haven't watched him much lately.
 
Adnan said:
He's a high energy destroyer with a limited passing game. He's good at keeping it simple but isn't someone that should be relied on to break lines. I think signing him puts a lot of emphasis on the likes of Martinez, Shaw and Mainoo to shoulder the creative burden in the build up. Hopefully Ugarte's high energy game where he hussles and harries opponent's will compliment the aforementioned players out of possession.
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That is what we need for certain games. If we also get Neves, it means we have different options how we play
 
Escobar said:
That is what we need for certain games. If we also get Neves, it means we have different options how we play
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We've not spending £100m on Neves, not in this transfer window anyway.

I honestly think people are going to have to get used to the idea of Neves pulling on a City shirt in the next year or two.
 
PSG signed Ugarte for €60 million - I think it's safe to say that if they are going to accept a bid - it has to be in that region
 
VP89 said:
Thats not sounding great. Fell significantly below their valuation and other clubs inderested.
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Yeah instead of paying over the odds and get players - we are now trying to pay significantly under and not getting anything
 
Escobar said:
That is what we need for certain games. If we also get Neves, it means we have different options how we play
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I agree we do need some high energy that will result in us playing with a higher intensity. Neves would make sense as a signing if we bought someone like Ugarte but I think if we're realistic, Neves isn't going to sign for us with the fee Benfica will likely want.

I'm hoping we look to sign a cheaper player to go along with Ugarte and for me that player is at Feyenoord (Mats Wieffer) who looks to be showing a good level as far as what he can give us both on the ball and off the ball. I dont think he will cost a lot and he for me is a low risk high reward type of signing who is a strong ball winner both on the ground and aerially and can contribute on the ball at a good level.
 
Loan with option to buy probably the right move. No club is paying €60 million or more this season for a player who is clearly for sale.
 
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