Jeremy Corbyn - Not Not Labour Party(?), not a Communist (BBC)

Ubik said:
I actually find Clive Lewis more annoying than I find Corbyn, but he's at least served in the army so would be less vulnerable on the defence side (although he's also unilateralist, but then maybe that's a good way of that argument being listened to?). Trouble is, there seems to be a large gap even between the soft-left and the Corbyn group. It highlights how annoying FPTP is, because there's clearly two different parties trying to operate under one banner.
Click to expand...

Just his manner? Or has he said or done something particular? Both are gaining front-bench experience, and Long-Bailey was promoted to the NEC. Lewis has media experience and I think comes across quite well,

Those seem to be the only two gaining front-bench experience. As you say the military background is a real political plus.

The gap does seem pretty large at the moment (there would be separate parties under a PR system) but it will be interesting to see how the soft-left attempts to bridge it: they need to appeal to a genuinely left membership if they are to regain control of the party. Maybe Dan Jarvis is intending to attempt that somehow?

[Jarvis is clearly being pushed as a candidate. It's actually quite fascinating seeing the political/media machinery work with a number of puff pieces last week despite his fairly limited political career*. I'd love to know what goes one behind the scenes, although I should probably just rewatch The Thick of It.]

*He's no more qualified than just about any front-bencher, including the two I mentioned. That's not to say he'd be a bad leader, just that it's interesting seeing him being built up.
 
Labour suspends activist Vicki Kirby over antisemitism claims



Be it in regard to the marginalisation of Muslim women or recurring accusations of anti-Semitism, the Labour Party would appear to be struggling with institutional prejudice in various areas. More worryingly, it has to be questioned whether the leadership/party apparatus is committed to its eradication. Not quite the blatant hostility favoured by Trump perhaps, yet a definite undercurrent is present.

We have both past and current party members here on the forum, have any of you come across such views in an official capacity? Or among fellow members at conference?
 
Last edited:
Do people talk about that at all in GB? This rise in membership for an established party is imo unprecedented in Western Europe in the last 40 years. All I hear is, that the party is divided and usually Corbyn gets slandered by most commentators. This development would suggest, that he could be successful.
 
Last edited:
DiseaseOfTheAge said:
Because the stances it takes under Corbyn are much more in touch with the 'grass roots' support of the party.
Click to expand...
Yeah, the problem though, is that it won't be enough for GE. Labour need the Tories to monumentally feck up in order to have a chance of winning with Corbyn as leader.
 
PedroMendez said:
Do people talk about that at all in GB? This hard rise in membership for an established party is imo unprecedented in Western Europe in the last 40 years. All I hear is, that the party is divided and usually Corbyn gets slandered by most commentators. This development would suggest, that he could be successful.
Click to expand...
Divided, meaning most of the MP's dislike Corbyn and McDonell. The members aren't as much. Classic case of politicians being out of touch with the people who vote for them.
 
Mciahel Goodman said:
Yeah, the problem though, is that it won't be enough for GE. Labour need the Tories to monumentally feck up in order to have a chance of winning with Corbyn as leader.
Click to expand...
Looks that way. Boris is capable of a monumental feck up, though, and Osborne could just bore the Tory minded electorate in to a coma, thus they forget to vote.

Anyway, it's our turn. We gave the 'centrist' leadership a fair go and weren't overly happy with the results. Now us 'loony lefties' get our chance to show we're still useless at politics. Has to happen every now and then.
 
Last edited:
DiseaseOfTheAge said:
Because the stances it takes under Corbyn are much more in touch with the 'grass roots' support of the party.
Click to expand...

Including his acceptance of female party members being persecuted in Muslim communities, so it's not all good.


Silva said:
Tbf, their current leader looks like an owl and they still manage to take him seriously.
Click to expand...

Owls are associated with wisdom you know. ;)
 
DiseaseOfTheAge said:
Looks that way. Boris is capable of a monumental feck up, though, and Osborne could just bore the Tory minded electorate in to a coma, thus they forget to vote.

Anyway, it's our turn. We gave the 'centrist' leadership a fair go and weren't overly happy with the results. Now us 'loony lefties' get our chance to show we're still useless at politics. Has to happen every now and then.
Click to expand...

At least we gave the centrists a fair crack at it :/
 
Shamwow said:
At least we gave the centrists a fair crack at it :/
Click to expand...
Yeah, I do wonder if the centrists underestimate how much they're alienating us lefties with the instant public disdain showed. They may get the leadership back before long but they'll need people to knock on doors.
 
DiseaseOfTheAge said:
Think you may have already mentioned that one, Nick.
Click to expand...

Indeed so, although worth repeating. It is a problem that some in Labour circles would rather brush under the carpet, yet such a policy only fosters discrimination within their midst and serve as a slap in the face for victims.
 
Nick 0208 Ldn said:
Indeed so, although worth repeating. It is a problem that some in Labour circles would rather brush under the carpet, yet such a policy only fosters discrimination within their midst and serve as a slap in the face for victims.
Click to expand...
Was it worth repeating in response to my answer to a generic question about new membership though? Cause it's a bit annoying when people randomly push their own cause on to you, when you're trying to discuss something else, because they're annoyed no one's paying attention to their previous posts on it.

EDIT - Budget day makes me grumpy...
 
DiseaseOfTheAge said:
Was it worth repeating in response to my answer to a generic question about new membership though? Cause it's a bit annoying when people randomly push their own cause on to you, when you're trying to discuss something else, because they're annoyed no one's paying attention to their previous posts on it.

EDIT - Budget day makes me grumpy...
Click to expand...

I won't deny that i am pushing the issue, nor that it was arguably a cynical use of your post rather than a truly constructive reply. It wasn't fair to you and i am sorry for that.

Equally, i can't help but find Corbyn to be a damned hypocrite.


DiseaseOfTheAge said:
Because the stances it takes under Corbyn are much more in touch with the 'grass roots' support of the party.
Click to expand...

Whilst that is likely true, particularly for the returnees, you also have to wonder how removed the new intake are from the bulk of the electorate.
 
Nick 0208 Ldn said:
Whilst that is likely true, particularly for the returnees, you also have to wonder how removed the new intake are from the bulk of the electorate.
Click to expand...
Not even the bulk of the electorate, the Labour 2015 vote is quite different to the present membership. Also worth noting that those who cancelled their direct debit in September are still included as members in the figures for another couple of months yet.
 
Fearless said:
Because it's cool to be a self-righteous dickhead and vote for a total underdog who represents your victimhood fetish.
Click to expand...

Or, ya know, people signed up because they liked Corbyn's political views and thought he was worth supporting.
 
Cheesy said:
Or, ya know, people signed up because they liked Corbyn's political views and thought he was worth supporting.
Click to expand...

We also have to consider the impact of the election result: at the very least Labour were expected to be the senior party in a coalition government, not only did this fail to materialise but the Tories were now in overall control. It's a bit like in centuries past when in times of trouble people would turn to more orthodox forms of religion. One could also draw parallels with the anti-establishment sentiment behind the rise of UKIP, as voters had come to distrust the received wisdom of Blairites/Brownites.
 
Last edited:
Nick 0208 Ldn said:
We also have to consider the impact of the election result: at the very least Labour were expected to be the senior party in a coalition government, not only did this fail to materialise but the Tories were now in overall control. It's a bit like the in centuries past when in times of trouble people would turn to more more orthodox forms of religion. One could also draw parallels with the anti-establishment sentiment behind the rise of UKIP, as voters had come to distrust the received wisdom of Blairites/Brownites.
Click to expand...

There was also the quality (or lack of) his competition, and a number of other circumstances that will have pissed off many Labourites like the welfare bill.
 


This actually amounts to a trend now!
 
Ubik said:


This actually amounts to a trend now!
Click to expand...


Polls are meaningless - the last election showed it for the UK, current polls show it in the US. Their only purpose seems to be so the press can write stories about how someone/some party or other 'defied the polls'. Maybe the first couple of times that was a credible and vaguely interesting story, but surely not now. May as well get Paul the Octopus on the case and compare results against his predictions (yeah, I know, Paul died, but no doubt that wouldn't affect his clairvoyant predictive ability if up against any political pollster.
 
skidmark said:
Polls are meaningless - the last election showed it for the UK, current polls show it in the US. Their only purpose seems to be so the press can write stories about how someone/some party or other 'defied the polls'. Maybe the first couple of times that was a credible and vaguely interesting story, but surely not now. May as well get Paul the Octopus on the case and compare results against his predictions (yeah, I know, Paul died, but no doubt that wouldn't affect his clairvoyant predictive ability if up against any political pollster.
Click to expand...
That's more than a little blinkered.

ThierryHenry said:
I miss Paul the Octopus. He would have prepared us for last May.
Click to expand...
We all do, we all do.
 
Shamwow said:
Just realised that Corbyn got a new suit.
Click to expand...

He's conforming to the establishment. Should've strolled into parliament topless, with a new red Labour tattoo across his chest and a can of Tennents in his hand.
 
Flamingo Purple said:
John McDonnell gave a strong interview on Breakfast this morning he gave straight answers to all the questions, which I admire from politicians.
Click to expand...
he gave an interview on five live yesterday where they asked three times
you say you are against all the proposed government cuts... would you make any cuts
on the third time he said he would make no cuts and he would invest more... If we didnt have a big deficit and an even bigger debt that might be an ok answer - but it does not sound like the answer that's going to re-establish economic credibility for Labour
 
So... he has a list of PLP enemies.
 
Ubik said:
So... he has a list of PLP enemies.
Click to expand...

Hardly suprising that such a document exists considering some in the PLP want to stage a leadership bid.

Really hope this "leak" didn't come from within the party. It's very conveniently timed to take away headlines from Osbourne and the budget fall out. I'm sure they'll be getting desperate now YouGov polls have Labour leading.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.