Utter shite, giant fecking clown
5
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 37
- Clean sheets
- 7
- Goals
- 2
- Assists
- 0
- Yellow cards
- 9
- Red cards
- 1
- Status
I'm not going to blame him for the disallowed goal, it was just absolutely typical of our luck recently.
But his decision-making in defence has been awful this season and the Burnley goal was a prime example. Leaving his position to lunge in on a player already being challenged is literally the stupidest thing he could have done in that situation. Doing so despite being famously slow off the mark even more so. He's good at timing a challenge when players are coming at him but rushing in like that is never going to be his strong suit and he's not quick enough to recover when caught out of position. Brainless all round and showed a inherent lack of self-awareness.
But his decision-making in defence has been awful this season and the Burnley goal was a prime example. Leaving his position to lunge in on a player already being challenged is literally the stupidest thing he could have done in that situation. Doing so despite being famously slow off the mark even more so. He's good at timing a challenge when players are coming at him but rushing in like that is never going to be his strong suit and he's not quick enough to recover when caught out of position. Brainless all round and showed a inherent lack of self-awareness.
I've been a fan but didn't like his post match interview. Breezed over his own problems with an excuse and then blamed the attackers. Even name checked Ronaldo. Not good.
Like Shaw's loss of form I think the most obvious answer is the correct one. They're not fit. Not conditioned enough.
Like Shaw's loss of form I think the most obvious answer is the correct one. They're not fit. Not conditioned enough.
For what it's worth, I think Rangnick does prefer Lindelof and probably would've kept using him had he not got injured when he did. I expect Lindelof will be phased back in as starter ahead of Maguire.
Copyright issues maybe? Like Vom Mistelroum and Farzel Haar if you know what I'm talking about.
Agreed I've never seen a defender that does rash things constantly. If he used his head he would have allowed McTominay to try to win the ball back and wait to either to intercept the ball and or be a body that wont allow them to be in a 1v1 situation with DDG.
People forget this is the same moron that pulled Shaw from getting the ball and conceded against Spurs or the time he put everyone onside against Everton. This is just the tip of the crap he pulls every game.
Maguire is slow and doesn't have the football IQ to position himself to intercept the ball.
I still don't understand why he is the captain when he doesn't even command the defence nor does he motivate the players around him. Every interview it's everyone else fault than him when he is the sole reason we've lost or drawn.
Maguire has been an issue for over 2 years but shitty excuses can be given to him because he is English.
I don't have anything against Maguire, this is just a redundant statement that is meaningless without evidence and shuts down the debate.
there is no reason to step up to make a tackle in that situation, Weghorst had very little space to work with and all the passing lanes were cut-off. He isn't a striker that is going to burst past you with pace, he's a 2m tall lump of a target man, who looks to lay off wide and get in the box.
so Maguire makes the decision to step in when all he has to do is jockey the player, and in your own words once he makes that decision he needs another player, already behind the play, to get back goal-side. By stepping in he exposes himself and the team to what happened, he over-commits, got beat easily and all the play opened up. It was a daft decision, and it cost us a goal.
If you don't think Maguire was right to step up to Weghorst than there's no point in carrying this conversation because you obviously have no idea what you're talking about
As for his "over commitment", this is where McTominay needs to do better. If Maguire is coming in from one area McTominay should cover the other. Not try and also make a tackle. McTominay should be going to Maguire's left and covering. Then he easily intercepts. And Verane should be marking Rodriguez but he doesn't even look at him. And guess who scored the goal? Verane's man...
Let's look at the same incident with Lindelof instead of Maguire.
Lindelof would have faced the attacker head on, but wouldn't jump in. Instead he would have held his line and back off a bit. This would give Mctominay the opportunity to apply pressure. This would also give an extra second to Varane to look around and mark Rodriguez.
Maguire's gung ho tackle nulliefied all of the above and put his team mates in a very difficult position. When he got past Maguire, instead of fouling him and getting a yellow, he just let him enter the box and slot it home.
Goldbridge is leading the brigade and filling your heads with so much garbage it's unbelievable. But muppets can have their strings pulled. I know the game better than most and can think for myself
why do you think he should step up and make a challenge there? There is minimal danger
Does anyone truly believe Ralf has the authority to drop Maguire this weekend IF he so chooses to of course?
I don't for a second. If Maguire is match fit he will play. The board won't allow him to be benched given he's the captain and his price tag.
Would Ralf pick him as captain if he had total control and came in during pre season? I doubt it very much.
I hope Ralf goes rogue and starts going against what I suspect are club orders.
I don't for a second. If Maguire is match fit he will play. The board won't allow him to be benched given he's the captain and his price tag.
Would Ralf pick him as captain if he had total control and came in during pre season? I doubt it very much.
I hope Ralf goes rogue and starts going against what I suspect are club orders.
He benches Ronaldo, he can sure as shit drop Maguire.
Yep exactly, he's never going to get that amount of protection at a top club. He is better suited to mid or lower table teams that sit deep and play on the counter.
He is 29 next month, he is going to lose another yard of pace very soon and he'll be even slower.
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I hope we sell him soon. (This summer.)
Rio has no idea what he’s talking about, some random poster whom can’t spell Varane does though.
Did you find out what he said about that? I just remember Mark losing his shit and clowning Arry to no end. Even called him the most cowardly captain in the history of our club when he retweeted his post match comments. I must say I concur..
@SadlerMUFC
It's like Phil Jones support all over again where you're try to convince people a costly error a game isn't normal for a CB.
It was a joke, I don’t watch him but @SadlerMUFC did say that all who criticize Maguire can’t think for themselves and simply repeat Goldbridge’s arguments.
It’s not even that; it’s interesting that some only focus on the goal-conceding error and not the plethora of daft things he did in a half where a less tolerant referee would have sent him off. In fact, he’s being shielded from wider criticism for his performance by that one incident, ironically enough.
He exudes panic and nervousness, which are not virtues your captain and supposed defensive marshal should be instilling in others. Part of a captain’s job is to lead by example and be a beacon of hope and inspiration for his teammates; Maguire is the opposite, beings as not only is he generally the first to collapse in terms of confidence, but also the most likely to make a poor decision in a one on one.
Due to team deficiencies (big gaps between midfield & defence etc) Maguire (and other defensive partners) are in situations where they have to take quick decisions in exposed defensive positions. Due to the nature of his defensive partners (more passive) this is usually Maguire. His lack of agility and pace leaves him exposed if he doesn't get this right (see Tuesday evening). He's one of the best defenders in the PL at progressing the ball up the pitch and is crucial to our attacking which is very reliant on the left hand side.
It is isn’t to say he hasn’t had his own patches of poor individual form but, if he played in a system that did not hinder him, that could be improved. The more possession United control as a team, the less he’ll have to dive into duels as opposed to guarding space. A better United makes for a better Maguire.
Maguire as an example forces us football fans to ask a broader question about how we evaluate players: how much does the system around a player change what we see on our television screens? Maguire is a good defender — and he’s proved that he is even more than a defender, too.
I looked at the xGA when Lindelof and Varane played together for two games. It was 13% of our xGA in 5% of the games - over 2 xGA per game. It's a small sample but made me wonder if it was an expression of two more passive defenders playing together under the same team deficiencies. They didn't make headline mistakes but the opposition had too many big chances.
Fascinating in-depth analysis that is perfectly summed up by the author
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The issue is that he glances over his mistakes, acknowledging them but not analyzing them (and allowing himself such vague statements like “he’s had his own patches of poor individual form” which is a bit of an understatement). It’s a good article that highlights Maguire’s other contributions, most notably on the ball, but it’s something that I’d imagine to read of a fan forum and not at The Athetic due to how one-sided the argument that he’s making is (regardless of whenever it’s a pro- or anti-Maguire sentiment).
It's amazing how much protection he gets by the press, Rio Ferdinand talking about hangovers from the Euros. Come off it, it's been 6 months, and he's still making awful mistakes. Bonucci and Chiellini are older than Maguire, and for some reason, they don't make the same awful mistakes Maguire does.
Maybe it's because Maguire isn't as good as people like to think he is.
Maybe it's because Maguire isn't as good as people like to think he is.
I think a lot of people decided he was too slow back when we signed him in 2019. And they've been looking for reasons to confirm that bias since day 1.
But if you actually look at his errors, it's not his pace that's the real issue. Stretching back to the beginning of the season, his main problem is actually his front-foot aggressive pressing. He mistimes his tackles in midfield far too often. It was even happening during the Liverpool game when Ole was still in charge.
The narrative around him is focussing on the wrong part of his game, imo. Whether he can fix that or not, is another matter. Assuming Rangnick-ball (or some variation of it) is here to stay, he'll need to.
But if you actually look at his errors, it's not his pace that's the real issue. Stretching back to the beginning of the season, his main problem is actually his front-foot aggressive pressing. He mistimes his tackles in midfield far too often. It was even happening during the Liverpool game when Ole was still in charge.
The narrative around him is focussing on the wrong part of his game, imo. Whether he can fix that or not, is another matter. Assuming Rangnick-ball (or some variation of it) is here to stay, he'll need to.
Surely part of being a good defender is knowing your own skillset? If you lack the agility and pace to come out of the defensive line and lunge into a challenge then, you know, stop doing it?
I don’t think your xGA analysis tells us anything. As you say, it’s pointless trying to do a statistical analysis based on just two games.
I do agree Maguire’s distribution and ability to carry the ball forward is excellent. And massively under-rated on this forum. But I’m starting to think it’s not worth the obvious defensive downsides.
If Maguire's passing is crucial to our attacking then we're never going to score a goal again. Easy pass to the full back? Kick it at the striker's shins.
I mean he's by no means the only United player who is exceptional at kicking the ball at opposition players' shins instead of playing easy passes but it's a bigger failing for a CB given the risk involved if they lose the ball.
I mean he's by no means the only United player who is exceptional at kicking the ball at opposition players' shins instead of playing easy passes but it's a bigger failing for a CB given the risk involved if they lose the ball.
Saw someone with Von Mistleroum on a Dutch jersey once.
Personally, I always preferred his name from the national team.
Yeah howson mentioned yesterday that whilst he’s in top percentile in ball carries, he’s also among the worst in key defensive metrics. I mean his first job here is to defend and seemingly - he’s shit at it.
He does analyse the mistakes, it's the point of the article is it not? They're accentuated because of the poor team structure that forces the defence into drastic actions in exposed positions more often.
It is a part of his skillset, he is front foot and makes a lot of interceptions but if he's forced by the poor team structure in regular desperate actions then mistakes will become more common.
I really don't think he is that bad. Just needs to out of this bad patch of form. He is very slow and has to somehow be coached how to position himself better to not get caught out by fast attackers.
But that’s my point. He’s not forced to do anything. He needs to make split second decisions about when to engage and when to back off. If he’s regularly getting those decisions wrong that’s all on him. Getting those decisions right consistently is literally the art of defending.
Sure but your point is ignoring the point of the article. I suppose we could go round in circles here.
He's got slow acceleration and no agility, but that can be compensated even if you are an aggresive CB. The problem is, he is also a poor tackler. How would Vidic or Terry react in this situation if they decided to step up. Most likely they'd probably make a strong and good tackle that would win the ball, on the off chance they don't get the ball, the tackle would be strong enough to at least foul Weghorst. Probably, yellow but no goal. Even if they'd get beaten like Maguire did, he actually almost catches up to Rodriguez, can you imagine John Terry or Vidic not making a sliding tackle and winning the ball when Rodriguez cuts across him.
So Harry's made a bunch of mistakes in this goal.
1) first he steps down from Weghorst when the pass is initially played. He could have simply stayed with him and immediately applied the pressure. There was no danger behind his back as Varane was covering and Weghorst isn't quick.
2) then as Weghorst dropped, Maguire charges forward, just about when Weghorst will receive the ball. At the moment of a touch, Maguire is something like three yards (??) away from Burnley player. It's only his luck Weghorst had a bad touch.
3) Desipite the bad touch by Weghorst, which allows McTominay and Maguire to challenge him, Harry still makes a bad and weak tackle. Neither winning the ball nor commiting a foul in what is now a dangerous situation. He's completely out of play.
4) He busts his gut to catch up with Rodriguez, but as Rodriguez cuts across him, Maguire doesn't even try to win the ball. Of course, if he'd attempted, he'd probably commit a penalty (because he's a bad tackler). But a truly world class defender would have faith in his ability and made a tackle, probably winning the ball.
So for me that's four instances where Maguire had a chance to prevent goal, but failed. Neither of those has much to do with pace or agility (although having more pace would have helped catching Rodriguez), but rather with poor decision making and tackling ability.
In short you can not be a great defender if you are slow on the turn, with poor acceleration, at best average tackling ability and consistently poor decision making. And honestly, unlike modern fullbacks, centre backs main duty is defending.
Ah but dont forget the poster "knows more than most" presumably including the best CB of his generation so Rio must be wrong.
I agree, we are asking him to be something hes not, a man utd level player.
I think all comes from the attempts to press. Forwards go as individuals, midfield run around like border collies and the defence is exposed and sucked too deep because the keeper won't push them up, so they have to try and rush out and cut out passes or meet players in areas they shouldn't be expected to go.
I don't know how often I've seen 5 or 6 opposition players between the midfield and defense because there's 30 or 40 yards of space for them to play in. Which is a nightmare for defenders as they then have to make a snap decision about whether to hold or try and get out and win the ball.
Maguire is just too slow off the mark to make it out and too slow on the turn to recover and he gets beaten.
I've said it before, you cannot play a highline with someone as slow as him in defence and with a keeper who's glued to his 6 yard box. Either replace DDG with a keeper who can sweep and cover and give the defence the comfort to play a highline knowing they have backup. Or he replaces Maguire with a faster, more aggresive defender who is good at pushing out and winning balls in midfield.
Or preferably just replace both of them.
Not really. He glanced through them, giving a few points on the team’s structure that leads to Maguire trying to do what he can’t do but he doesn’t go into depth & generally dismisses them as a rarely occurrence.
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