European Super League

Do you want the ESL to happen?

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Manchester Dan said:
Both of those sets of fans already hated their owners. They’re using this to reinforce the message - our owners had a lot of credit in the bank with the fans. It’s very different.

We can’t pretend those protests are because of the Super League alone, that was just the final straw.
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Yeah it was a joke mate we all know the vast majority of City fans don't give a feck about City's owners or where the money comes from and aren't protesting shit now.

Were there even any significant super league protests from man city fans?

All I can remember seeing was a banner at the Etihad.

 
::sonny:: said:
The 3.5 billions from JP was a loan to repay in 23 yrs

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Wasn't it widely reported all this week that the billions to set it up were a loan?

Each club would get 300-40 million Euros i can remember reading.
 
Mickeza said:
So Woodward isn’t the baddy?
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Don't believe that for a second. It's spin from his mates in the media.

This thing has been in creation for 4 years and only now he realised he hates it? How about resigning years ago and announcing it to the world?

Plus, him hating it suggests he has some football knowledge and morals. I think we all know that's the furthest stretch of the imagination in this whole saga.
 
stevoc said:
Wasn't it widely reported all this week that the billions to set it up were a loan?

Each club would get 300-40 million Euros i can remember reading.
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Yes. They were confident they would get it off the ground in terms of TV revenue.

The 3.5bn from JP Morgan would have to be repaid over 23 years to the tune of 6.1 in the end.

The clubs were also planning to stream their own games and make them pay-per-view. We would have ended up paying A LOT MORE because the figure for TV rights talked about is something like 5bn/year which is 5x of what all EPL clubs get now. All this info was in the FT.
 
So apparently JPMorgan was the middleman and the financing was to come from the Saudi's.
 
crossy1686 said:
Tell you what, I disagree with everything you've said here. It's super negative and it ventures into wider areas such as ownership that I just can't be arsed to get into right now. When all the details come out and we all see this is just another European league format (like the CL but different) and everyone stops losing their shit for no valid reason, we'll revisit this thread and look at the grand over reaction for laughs.
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It’s insane that you thought this was even remotely fine and that there was “no valid reason” for people losing their shit. Amazing.
 
Rightnr said:
Don't believe that for a second. It's spin from his mates in the media.

This thing has been in creation for 4 years and only now he realised he hates it? How about resigning years ago and announcing it to the world?

Plus, him hating it suggests he has some football knowledge and morals. I think we all know that's the furthest stretch of the imagination in this whole saga.
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You dont have to agree with something to do your job. Hell City signed up without liking it (apparently)
 
Rightnr said:
The clubs were also planning to stream their own games and make them pay-per-view. We would have ended up paying A LOT MORE because the figure for TV rights talked about is something like 5bn/year which is 5x of what all EPL clubs get now.
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the figure for tv rights income would be much higher than the epl because the superleague was supposed to have the top premier teams, madrid and barcelona, bayern, etc
 
Rightnr said:
Yes. They were confident they would get it off the ground in terms of TV revenue.

The 3.5bn from JP Morgan would have to be repaid over 23 years to the tune of 6.1 in the end.

The clubs were also planning to stream their own games and make them pay-per-view. We would have ended up paying A LOT MORE because the figure for TV rights talked about is something like 5bn/year which is 5x of what all EPL clubs get now. All this info was in the FT.
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The fact they wanted to do this, but still be in the PL as well. The greedy articles. They honestly forget that a lot of their fans are not made of money.
 
The more I think about it the more convinced I become it’s going to happen in some format. This was the opening gambit - a power play they knew could fail. Johnson said “it wouldn’t happen in this format” - which I think was key wording.

Top 4 (maybe 6 from EPL and less from other leagues as they now control if this happens) from domestic leagues in 5 major leagues - 5th gets placed in summer knockout contest along with rest of European champions to get wildcard entry - that contest becomes the richest game in football ala playoffs - rest then go into second league or something - win that competition you gain entry to next years super league.

The results against domestic opponents will be taken from the domestic league games thus avoiding the scenario of United - Liverpool playing each other 6 times - and protecting the domestic leagues.

This format protects the domestic leagues, gives clear entry based on merit into tournament, adds more money for everyone with the solidarity payments, guarantees more big games from big teams for sponsors and TV money and also adds a new hugely lucrative tournament in the summer to gain entry. It’s not even that different from the UEFA one - it’s just less teams. Still screws the smaller European clubs though.
 
Rightnr said:
Yes. They were confident they would get it off the ground in terms of TV revenue.

The 3.5bn from JP Morgan would have to be repaid over 23 years to the tune of 6.1 in the end.

The clubs were also planning to stream their own games and make them pay-per-view. We would have ended up paying A LOT MORE because the figure for TV rights talked about is something like 5bn/year which is 5x of what all EPL clubs get now. All this info was in the FT.
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Oh I had no doubt direct club PPV would have been involved.
 
Mickeza said:
The more I think about it the more convinced I become it’s going to happen in some format. This was the opening gambit - a power play they knew could fail. Johnson said “it wouldn’t happen in this format” - which I think was key wording.

Top 4 (maybe 6 from EPL and less from other leagues as they now control if this happens) from domestic leagues in 5 major leagues - 5th gets placed in summer knockout contest along with rest of European champions to get wildcard entry - that contest becomes the richest game in football ala playoffs - rest then go into second league or something - win that competition you gain entry to next years super league.

The results against domestic opponents will be taken from the domestic league games thus avoiding the scenario of United - Liverpool playing each other 6 times - and protecting the domestic leagues.

This format protects the domestic leagues, gives clear entry based on merit into tournament, adds more money for everyone with the solidarity payments, guarantees more big games from big teams for sponsors and TV money and also adds a new hugely lucrative tournament in the summer to gain entry. It’s not even that different from the UEFA one - it’s just less teams. Still screws the smaller European clubs though.
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Why would most of the english clubs agree to make it merit based. Their big problem is they aren't guaranteed a spot in a merit based competition which CL is, which leads to financial instability for them.

Also if you add a esl europa wouldn't that just be what European comps are currently just without uefa, their whole esl idea is based on small teams of Europe are liabilities to big clubs and they take up money that should go to these big clubs. How would adding small clubs work if they don't get a fair share?
 
SmallCaine said:
Why would most of the english clubs agree to make it merit based. Their big problem is they aren't guaranteed a spot in a merit based competition which CL is, which leads to financial instability for them.

Also if you add a esl europa wouldn't that just be what European comps are currently just without uefa, their whole esl idea is based on small teams of Europe are liabilities to big clubs and they take up money that should go to these big clubs. How would adding small clubs work if they don't get a fair share?
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Because it’ll never pass without the other 14 voting for it. The other 14 aren’t going to allow entry to a tournament that gets huge revenues unless they have a chance of sharing the pie too. For all Sky have been leading the masses into believing greed is unique to the owners of these 6 clubs - maybe people should have a look at the owners of the other PL clubs. They’re interested in increasing revenues too oddly enough.
 
VorZakone said:
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Makes perfect sense. Just look at Perez deal with the Saudis. :lol:

We need to fight this as hard as possible, I'd actually be in favour of FIFA and UEFA punishing Madrid, Barcelona and Juventus with the strongest possible actions for the way they keep pushing this corrupt narrative.
 
Withnail said:
Really poor from Klopp.

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Aye. Comes across as if it’s more important that his club don’t get criticised, rather than fans, players and pundits continue to lobby for the change to ensure this cannot happen again.
 
Mb194dc said:
Meanwhile per other thread quotes from Perez:







Looks to me like a new variant of the super league will be back soon. Probably with Merit based qualification of some kind and potential access to all European leagues one way or another.
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Well, you don't have to be "state owned" to get some help from government or the city. Or did he forgot?

https://www.ft.com/content/750e14a2-3f94-11e6-9f2c-36b487ebd80a

They have lived over they income. Now the reality is catching up with some clubs and they suddenly want change to suit them.
 
Mb194dc said:
Meanwhile per other thread quotes from Perez:







Looks to me like a new variant of the super league will be back soon. Probably with Merit based qualification of some kind and potential access to all European leagues one way or another.
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Why is FFP about about dragging City and PSG's spending down to Reals level. Why not dragging Reals down to Bayer Leverkusens level. I hope he keeps harping on about this and forces more serious people to address the actual problems, rather than Perez's childish little temper tantrum
 
caid said:
Why is FFP about about dragging City and PSG's spending down to Reals level. Why not dragging Reals down to Bayer Leverkusens level. I hope he keeps harping on about this and forces more serious people to address the actual problems, rather than Perez's childish little temper tantrum
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Perez simply can't compute that something hasn't gone his way. Tw@t

Love to see him try to sue United and the other five English clubs. Apart from the fact that collectively, we've got deeper pockets, if he won, Real would be the pariah of European/world football...

.... which sounds ok too.

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...annot-leave-as-manchester-united-fans-protest
 
BeforeKeanetherewasRobson said:
Perez simply can't compute that something hasn't gone his way. Tw@t

Love to see him try to sue United and the other five English clubs. Apart from the fact that collectively, we've got deeper pockets, if he won, Real would be the pariah of European/world football...

.... which sounds ok too.

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...annot-leave-as-manchester-united-fans-protest
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The stupid thing is they can afford the money they're spending, theres minimal danger of them going out of business. Real cant they're the ones who's finances actually need to be regulated.
 
90 + 5min said:
Well, you don't have to be "state owned" to get some help from government or the city. Or did he forgot?

https://www.ft.com/content/750e14a2-3f94-11e6-9f2c-36b487ebd80a

They have lived over they income. Now the reality is catching up with some clubs and they suddenly want change to suit them.
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Real Madrid later went on to win the case against the European Commission in a European court. I know we're pissed at Florentino Pérez but let's try to be right on the facts.
 
I'm not sure if Klopp is being deliberately dense (to support the owners) or just dense..... and ignorant of the issues.

It's nothing to do with the media winding up the fans. Yes, the ESL has died this time but it can come back and that's not the only issue... the fans of most of the club's involved were unhappy to differing extents before. Just because it's failed and the owners have given their pathetic "we're sorry", that doesn't mean we say "oh that's ok then". (1) we still don't trust them and (2) we see this is an opportunity to push for something else, something we wanted pre ESL ..... change of ownership.

I get his point about CV19 (and MUST have been very clear protests should be legal and safe) but for Klopp not to see what the problem is, is amazing. Especially when Liverpool fans (including their official fan groups) have said this isn't over.

 
2cents said:
I guess the thinking is that Asian fans don’t give a shite about sides like Burnley or the prestige associated with certain competitions. They’re only interested in a very limited number of clubs and would like to see them play each other more often.

I don’t know to what degree that is true, but it may have been a factor in this.
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Might be true somewhere else, but all the people I know who watch (and play) football here thought the ESL was shit.
 
Madrid and Barça still in 100%

Juve as well

Florentino will build his league and then will find other clubs in financial trouble to complete the league

The bankruptcy league
 
Klopp makes sense. It’s all so hysterical. Not helped by the media fanning the flames.
 
RoyH1 said:
Real Madrid later went on to win the case against the European Commission in a European court. I know we're pissed at Florentino Pérez but let's try to be right on the facts.
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The point was not about winning in the court. The point was that he can't talk about state owned clubs when he isn't that innocent when it comes to getting a bit help from government or the city.
 
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