Erik ten Hag | 2024/25

Erik ten Hag

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People still haven't come to terms with just how spectacularly abysmal 99% of last season was. Talk about injuries as much as you like, the tactical set up and execution produced some of the most inept and amateurish football a major club has produced in my lifetime, it was astonishingly shit.

Frankly since the league cup final there have been very, very few games were Utd have looked a coherent team, we are looking at near 50 league games of very poor levels of performance, with next to nothing on the pitch to point at as a sign of progress. Of course there is little faith in him or his approach.
 
JPRouve said:
No one knows, clubs generally follow a process of elimination. They appoint someone that seemingly has the tools, if it works they keep him and if it doesn't they quickly move to someone else.
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Arteta got time. I don’t think you’d want to be triggerhappy with a manager in general if you find someone who checks the boxes. You’d want a constant over time that develops the team. Not a new manager every year. Then the manager just gets blamed for a poor squad (again).

That’s the only reason I’m not crazy about sacking EtH after 3 games. There’s rarely been a constant team, and a new manager probably wants/needs new players for his specific style too.
 
The Mitcher said:
We lost a league on goal difference, mate...since when was scoring goals meant very little? Crazy post.
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The lowering of standards is never-ending with a certain lot of supporters, they won't be satisfied until we're West Ham level and that we're happy about it too
 
I voted today, the % of not wanting him sacked was below 10%, some how he's gained 5% in the space of 6 hours.

He's woeful, has to go.
 
I only just saw him talking to the press after the match. Infuriating to watch him dismiss the observations that we give away the ball with sloppy passing, get caught on the ball in our own half, and that we are frequently getting countered with the opposition having superior numbers. I feel fecking gaslit by this guy.
 
SungSam7 said:
I voted today, the % of not wanting him sacked was below 10%, some how he's gained 5% in the space of 6 hours.

He's woeful, has to go.
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It will slowly increase in the next couple of days. What usually happens is the people who love Ten Hag more than they want to see United be successful give it 2 to 3 days before they come in here and start making excuses for him. You see it usually takes that amount of time for someone to come up with something extremely creative that can’t be immediately dismissed as bullshit.
 
NK86 said:
Again you are hiding behind “give me a name”.

You tell me why sticking with eth will not make things worse and get us worse than it already is?

You talk about Ragnick but conveniently forget Ole came in as a caretaker and immediately made us look better. Did anyone think at that time his caretaker stint would be that good that he will be given the gig full time?

You won’t know till you try, but sticking with an option which is failing because you are scared is plain silly.
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How can I be "hiding behind" asking you to actually expand on your opinion? That's projection at it's finest.

I'm not against replacing ETH with someone for whom a good argument can be made that they'd do better. I'm just not aware of anyone who's available for whom that's the case. If you can make a case for someone then great, but otherwise your opinion is nothing more than rolling the dice, which could easily make things worse - ETH may be failing to get us playing the type of football we're after, but he still has control of the dressing room. Our last caretaker left us with a huge amount of infighting and egos that we haven't properly cleared out until this transfer window.
 
ROFLUTION said:
Arteta got time. I don’t think you’d want to be triggerhappy with a manager in general if you find someone who checks the boxes. You’d want a constant over time that develops the team. Not a new manager every year. Then the manager just gets blamed for a poor squad (again).

That’s the only reason I’m not crazy about sacking EtH after 3 games. There’s rarely been a constant team, and a new manager probably wants/needs new players for his specific style too.
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The whole point of this restructuring is so we can avoid managers needing a host of players for a "specific" style.

What Ten Hag is trying is generally in the ballpark of what City, Arsenal and Liverpool do, he's just not been very good at implementing it. We'll be looking at something similar with a new manager, and the player's we've signed this summer will all have been signed with that in mind.

The signings from the first two seasons might be largely a write off, but the days of a manager needing their own players are gone.
 
crossy1686 said:
It will slowly increase in the next couple of days. What usually happens is the people who love Ten Hag more than they want to see United be successful give it 2 to 3 days before they come in here and start making excuses for him. You see it usually takes that amount of time for someone to come up with something extremely creative that can’t be immediately dismissed as bullshit.
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Yup, I predicted yesterday that it would settle around 70-30 over the international break as people yet again forget how shit we've been and the excuses start flying in
 
pocco said:
Sorry but that's laughable. Potter posted a variety of different ways and set up differently to de Zerbi. So you believe they just got worse when they forgot Potter's training? They picked up de Zerbis play pretty instantly, but just not the defensive bit?

If you watched Brighton you'd know the defensive injuries they had throughout their team. I think Estupinan still isn't back playing yet, Lamptey was missing most of the season, they had CBs in midfield, CBs out injured, their entire front three missing... you don't even think it's possible that they just struggled without most of their first choice players? They don't have the depth we do, and even our depth was apparently the reason for our poor season
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Of course you slowly lose defensive discipline if you aren't regularly drilling it anymore, these things don't disappear overnight. There are countless examples of new managers benefitting from what their predecessors left behind immediately, with the team slowly losing previous strengths the longer they spent with the new manager. A great example is Roberto Martinez, who was hailed as the guy we should have gotten instead of Moyes or Van Gaal, until Everton lost the defensive solidity that Moyes had built and Martinez couldn't maintain.

Potter consistently had Brighton conceding a relatively few goals. De Zerbi wasn't able to maintain that solidity when implementing his approach, and had them conceding more goals than any team that wasn't relegated. As I said, if relegation form and conceding loads of goals are acceptable qualifications for the United job in your view, then we should just stick with Ten Hag.
 
RDCR07 said:
We were taking about on player in particular - Casemiro. I didn’t say the whole team regressed.
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You asked if players can’t regress, and based on what I’m seeing, almost everyone has regressed. So it’s either there’s something in the water or the managers shit.
 
Let's go easy on EtH guys. We can't be expecting him to be Harry Potter. I guess we'll just have to settle for Neville Longbottom this season instead.
 
ROFLUTION said:
Arteta got time. I don’t think you’d want to be triggerhappy with a manager in general if you find someone who checks the boxes. You’d want a constant over time that develops the team. Not a new manager every year. Then the manager just gets blamed for a poor squad (again).

That’s the only reason I’m not crazy about sacking EtH after 3 games. There’s rarely been a constant team, and a new manager probably wants/needs new players for his specific style too.
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Arteta improved within the first 18 months but the actual point I was making is that Arsenal didn't know whether Arteta was good enough or a good fit when they hired him, they believed in his tools and it's his actual work that saw them keep him. Also Arteta was significantly less proven than Emery at the time, on paper it was easily a downgrade but that paper evaluation is meaningless because in reality Arteta ended up being a better fit than Emery.

All that is meant to answer your question about who is that coach that can be the right fit? If we use Arteta as an example, that coach could be someone that has never been a head coach before, it could be someone that is an upcoming manager or it could be a veteran. But in my opinion it's not ETH based on what ETH has shown with this group of players.
 
My primary concern with ETH is that he’s a poor judge of player ability. We’ve discussed Antony, Onana and Mount long enough, but his continued selection of Rashford is mind-boggling.

But an almost equally concerning aspect of his management is that he can’t seem to get the players in the right frame of mind to handle adversity. He’s just not a good man manager.
 


Gary Neville says we need to give ETH some time. In case he stumbles on something positive.

Carragher, someone I absolutely hate because of the spitting incident, is talking more sense than our Gary.
 
crossy1686 said:
It will slowly increase in the next couple of days. What usually happens is the people who love Ten Hag more than they want to see United be successful give it 2 to 3 days before they come in here and start making excuses for him. You see it usually takes that amount of time for someone to come up with something extremely creative that can’t be immediately dismissed as bullshit.
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Yep was a constant theme last season too.
 
Our play-out from defense against Liverpool was the most amateurish I’ve watched in Premier League last couple of years. ETH was hired to improve our possession play and ability to play out from defense, but we are worse than ever in that regard. Impossible to defend ETH anymore.
 
He has to go soon. We are seeing no progress at all from his methods and, his post match interviews are beginning to embarrass a club of our stature. Keep rattling on about 2 cup wins when our league form is just dire. Already, after 3 games, there are 5 premier league players that have scored more goals individually than we have as a team. Ugarte is not going to fix the midfield on his own. We need a better system and if EtH (and his team) can’t see that then he has to go.
 
Eriku said:
I only just saw him talking to the press after the match. Infuriating to watch him dismiss the observations that we give away the ball with sloppy passing, get caught on the ball in our own half, and that we are frequently getting countered with the opposition having superior numbers. I feel fecking gaslit by this guy.
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Defending himself in an unsubtle and not very appealing manner, coming across as an insecure twat.

Trying to convince journos he's grand by listing his (two) trophies.

Sort of thing you'd expect from someone who's close to getting sacked, really (very similar to his dealings with journos towards the end of last season).
 
I dont get what he can change in all honesty....

Shaw and Ugarte might give us some marginsl gains but they wont improve a system that is ineffective. How long we will have Shaw for is a mystery.

Slot explained how Liverpool comfortably beat our press which seems to be Ten Hag'sgrand plan he's worked on and invested heavily in.

We are relying on individual players and in particular Rashford/Hojlund/Garnacho having transformative seasons which seems unlikely.

I hope it isn't Southgate but another manager with a semi-effective strategy would be an improvement.
 
ROFLUTION said:
Arteta got time. I don’t think you’d want to be triggerhappy with a manager in general if you find someone who checks the boxes. You’d want a constant over time that develops the team.
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But that's the point, there's little evidence the team is being developed.

In fact there's not much evidence the team is being coached, which is the very definition of Ten Hag's job.
 
Laurencio said:
Not only that. Cas has been pretty decent when he is one of the more advanced midfielders playing one-twos
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It's worth remembering that Casemiro and Mainoo were targeted for the press by the dippers yesterday because they were spotted as physically vulnerable. Which of course they are. Mainoo will get stronger. Casemiro won't.
 
buckooo1978 said:
I dont get what he can change in all honesty....

Shaw and Ugarte might give us some marginsl gains but they wont improve a system that is ineffective. How long we will have Shaw for is a mystery.

Slot explained how Liverpool comfortably beat our press which seems to be Ten Hag'sgrand plan he's worked on and invested heavily in.

We are relying on individual players and in particular Rashford/Hojlund/Garnacho having transformative seasons which seems unlikely.

I hope it isn't Southgate but another manager with a semi-effective strategy would be an improvement.
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Very much doubt it will be Southgate, he’s got another job. Best one out there is probably Tuchel but not sure he’d fit in with the Ineos structure. We might need to find a capable interim until someone better comes along. Interim’s can work. Carrick was brilliant in his 3 matches, beating Villarreal to qualify for last 16 of CL, beat Arsenal and drew with Chelsea. Then we brought in Rangnick and the rest is history. Meanwhile this duffer finishes bottom of an easy CL group.
 
stevoc said:
But who identified Dutch/Ex-Ajax DeLigt, Mazrouri and Zirkzee?

McTominay wouldn't have made a difference yesterday, let's be honest here.
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McT would have done better than Casemiro but we still would have lost, it's true. LIverpool are a much better side. Getting Ugarte is the long term smart move so lets judge in the long term.

I don't like Mazrouri at all because of his bigoted stance on LGBT but he seems a decent enough player, as does De Ligt. Zirkzee seems like a clumsy ox but early days let's give him a chance.
 
Its actually stunning to think we have given this joke almost 600 million to spend. And we're actually worse off that we were in 2022. You look at the team he inherited in 2022 and you think they finished 2nd 12 months prior. The difference between us and City was six draws. Surely you cant took at this and think its anything but a fecking calamity.
 
One thing I don’t get is how we’ve managed to take players who are supposedly very good on the ball (half of them came up through the Ajax academy after all) and turn them into quivering wrecks who can’t get rid of it quick enough.

Casemiro has 5 champions leagues. But yesterday he had the composure of a crack addict. This isn’t just to do with his legs going.

Onana was signed solely because of his distribution, yet all he does is hoof it to nobody just as De Gea did. The only difference is Onana can’t save any shots, (3 shots, 3 goals yesterday) and frequently stands in places that make scoring goals easier. At least when Dave dropped his clangers like Onana in the FA cup final, we hadn’t paid £50m to watch him do it.

The midfield is awful. We’ve spent 600m in 2 years, and we still finished the game with a midfield made up of an 18 year old and a 20 year old. Not because of injuries, but because they’re literally better options than some of the players that made up huge chunks of that outlay.

All in all it doesn’t reflect well on the manager. You can tell with multiple players their confidence is on the floor. He keeps picking the same players to do the same jobs, and when it doesn’t work, he does the same thing again the week after.
 
RDCR07 said:
When was the last time our players took some responsibility? If the tactics expose your weakness you don’t have to compound them by playing stupid passes and trying to act like Scholes.
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You kind of do... if that's what's being asked of you. Quite a few players are playing in a way that is uncharacteristic to what we know of them for their nations or at other clubs before getting here. It's not a coincidence.
 
hellhunter said:
Not exactly our most pressing concern at the moment, is it? Rather our expected points having us in 15th
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I wouldn't even except a string of scrappy shite 1-0 wins anymore, we've watched pure crap for far too long. Winning ugly would prove very little at this point. Lowering the standards about goal difference not mattering is bonkers. I want to be entertained.
 
I think its fair to say the support for ETH is waning somewhat.

A lot of us ( including me ) got carried away with the euphoria of the FA Cup win and ignored the complete dross served up over the season.

I am quite happy to give him a couple more months but i think he is incapable of turning things around, I hope I am wrong.

His 2 trophies response to anything remotely resembling criticism is already getting a little old.
 
We’re in a league where Bournemouth are managed by Iraola, who had his number in their first meeting. Another day with him is another step backwards.
 
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