Erik ten Hag | 2024/25

[RuudTom83]

Aim for 9, 7 or 6 ok , 5 just about acceptable, 4 disappointing, 3 or under compleatly unacceptable.

Honestly how has the manager and players eroded the standards so far?

Good question, not sure when it happened, but I just don't expect much from the experienced players (Bruno/Casemiro/Rashford) and I know the younger players need time to learn and improve.

So that is reflected in what results I expect before kick-off. I expected 4 points form the opening 3 games.

 

[crossy1686]

So have Liverpool just gone and gotten another one of our managers sacked?

We can only thank them if so.

 

[Shinjch]

But what is there to negotiate? It's just a contract extension with no changes. Ten Hag specifically said negotiations weren't going well and it would be tough to arrive at an agreement, then he gets a +1 with the same deal. That's hardly a tough negotiation.

There was nothing to negotiate. The executive team put themselves in a rubbish position when it became clear they were looking at other managers only to fall back on the guy who was already in post.

 

[Matt851]

Big questions for ineos given our transfer business still seems to have been dictated by ten hag to a significant degree. How many of them will become the new managers dead wood.

 

[saik]

Thought I read somewhere they we trying to re-negotiate his existing contract, to downgrade his title from Manager to Head Coach and remove his veto on transfers etc. EtH wouldn’t agree so they just triggered the extension.

I assumed that was the case at that time but I don't think I've seen anywhere reliable that they offered him a new contract.

If I'm not remembering wrong, the initial news broke out as him signing a new contract but then was quickly corrected to it being just triggering an option.

 

[VP89]

Kamikaze football. Our matches turning into basketball games even against lower level opposition is no coincidence. Newport County scored twice against us. Coventry scored 4 (with one being disallowed). We finished last in a CL group that included Galatasaray and Copenhagen.

Why are our full backs 10-15 yards in front of Liverpool's wingers?? There's no recovery speed that would allow Dalot to prevent Salah's goal with this nonsense set-up. Why is our DM up there? The gaping hole in midfield that Liverpool midfielders can exploit has been there for like 3 years.:

Ten Hag is probably the first manager I've seen trying to use a "glass cannon" RPG build in football. Crazy stuff

I agree this was really stupid - but it was the play after Casemiro was hooked. Ten Hag seemed to gamble with Collyer and put him in a McT role to join the attack more, it left us very exposed and sucker punched us with a 3rd.

I totally agree this was brainless

 

[UnofficialDevil]

Actually it could be this

I wish, but it's just too good to be true.

 

[devilish]

Plenty on here wanted him to stay after the final, not a majority, but a good number.

Pre FA cup final I was sitting at the fence. I understood that there was a big problem with ETH's tactics but I also acknowledged our injury issues and the importance of retaining a manager for once. If INEOS believed that they should sack him then it would be fine for me. If they retained him then I was sure that they'll extract many concessions out of him which would give them a huge say on most things (including tactics).

Post FA cup final I switched to ETH out.

A- I didn't like how ETH reacted to the win. He was so bullish which suggested that he would now double down on his philosophy rather then ask for help.
B- He suddenly got the support of most of the fans. At one point he had near prime SAF's support which is crazy considering that he was nowhere near to the Scot and still had alot to learn about the EPL.

The farce that followed weakened Ineos hand which lead to concessions that I felt that we might regret. United had never been so Eredivisie as now

 

[kouroux]

Lucky to be 3-0 up. No

Lucky not to be 4-3 down...

 

[Yakuza_devils]

I can't take this anymore. I can't see him manage one more Man Utd game. I just can't, sorry.

I will be back supporting the club once ETH is sacked. This boring football and ruining weekends have to stop for my own sanity.

 

[saik]

But what is there to negotiate? It's just a contract extension with no changes. Ten Hag specifically said negotiations weren't going well and it would be tough to arrive at an agreement, then he gets a +1 with the same deal. That's hardly a tough negotiation.

As mentioned earlier, it's possible that ETH requested a new contract, but INEOS may not have been on board with that idea. As a result, all parties might have decided that triggering the existing option was the best temporary solution.

The exact details of these discussions are often unclear, but it's likely they talked extensively about ETH’s vision for the team, how the leadership plans to support him, and what objectives they expect to achieve moving forward.

 

[kouroux]

Maguire has improved

Not for me, Maguire's best form is his first season still. He had way too many tragic games under ETH to brush under the carpet

 

[Garnacho Libre]

Btw, "we beat big opponents" is such a pathetic line. As if we are some relegation fodder. This is worse than when Moyes admitted that we need to "aspire to be like City".

Two mickey mouse cups or not, no one can convince me that he isn't the worst appointment since Sir Alex retired. The worst is that he has filled the squad with expensive mediocre players from Ajax or the Dutch league. It would take a while to clean all the shit that he has dumped on us.

That was Moyes's biggest mistake in my opinion. From what I can remember, the fans that were backing him at the time started to change their tone.

I'm not sure it's quite the same scenario, though. Circumstances are different. I think no matter what he should be given the season (unless by xmas time there's just no hope of anything).

Your second point. I don't think it's good to make an emotional decision on the back of probably making an emotional decision by keeping him. It's time to be calm. Ten Hag has kept calm. He hasn't lost the head. I think his biggest problem is his stubbornness, who knows it might pay off.

The question is, who do you replace him with? RVN? Sure he is there behind the scenes, what improvements has he made? We went through Moyes; a seasoned PL manager. Mourihno; a world class manager. Van Gaal; another world class manager. Ole; it was a gamble, didn't work out. Rangnick came in to asses the squad and said the club needed ''open heart surgery''. I think that is what INEOS has done. We are only 3 weeks into INEOS restructure.

This must be treated in terms of it's INEOS first season with Ten Hag as their manager. You can't blame Ten Hag for signing players for huge transfers or wages, that's down to how business was conducted. What is expected is for Ten Hag to get the most out of the players. Unfortunately against Liverpool, they are just miles above us.

Everyone goes on about Sloth - he inherited a good team and hasn't faced any problems yet. Lets see how he does when his style of play is figured out, how he adapts to it. How he handles big players when contracts are running out, will he convince them to play in his team?

Everyone needs to calm down and stop being so emotional. There are positives over last season but we are miles from being where we should be. For now, I think it's important for the entire club (Players, Manager, Ownership, Fans) to be calm.

 

[morree]

There are some improvements but we aren't playing much different from last season. And Ugarte most likely won't change us as much as people think. We could have 10 loses by Christmas if we don't somehow improve and if he keeps insisting to start players that aren't playing well. Casemiro and Rashford will be his downfall from the looks of it, hopefully he takes both with him to his new job.

 

[KiD MoYeS]

I voted to stick with him after the FA Cup final. Mainly because there was a lack of options to succeed him and a little bit because I felt he deserved a crack of the whip under a proper hierarchy. Three games in and alarm bells are ringing, we have been just as bad as last season and it's genuinely difficult to see him turning it around. I would be in favour of sacking him now but I do think INEOS will give him a couple more months. I would be amazed if he is our manager next season. How INEOS manage this will tell us a lot, I think.

 

[Robbie Boy]

It's not that impressive at all, Liverpool also were not as impressive as people make them seem really.

They're not impressive and Slot doesn't look remotely impressive. They'll be found out.

 

[Ahmer Baig]

Are their people who are still defending him?

 

[VP89]

They're not impressive and Slot doesn't look remotely impressive. They'll be found out.

I hope so!
But I personally think they do look very good. Quite balanced.

 

[VP89]

Are their people who are still defending him?

Yeah I am but I have to say it's getting increasingly difficult

 

[Revan]

Neville - possibly due to PTSD from his managerial stint - is always hustling against United/United’s best interest. In his head sacking a manager is a cardinal offence - to the point he frames is as “stupid”.

Carragher couldn’t believe what he was hearing and even said “why would that (sacking him) be stupid?!”

The funny thing of Neville, is that the one time he actually run a club, he sacked the managers 4 times or so.

 

[GDaly95]

Are their people who are still defending him?

Stretford Paddock are pretty vehemently defending him.

 

[VP89]

The funny thing of Neville, is that the one time he actually run a club, he sacked the managers 4 times or so.

He's a walking hypocrite to be fair.

 

[Raoul]

They're not impressive and Slot doesn't look remotely impressive. They'll be found out.

They've yet to concede a goal this year, and with Bournemouth, Forrest, Wolves, and Palace next, there's a good they could win their first seven games by barely conceding any goals. That's of course not to absolve ETH's tactics yesterday.

 

[JustinC00]

The fact that he hasn't been sacked yet is baffling. There's no way INEOS can watch the first 3 matches with the 3rd match being another +3 goal loss at home to the fecking scousers and think more time should be given. Gotta get him out now before we end up knocked out of Europa and finishing 10th which we still could with someone else but you are virtually guaranteeing it keeping him.

We are a Zirkzee toe tap going wide and a Amad deflected shot going out instead of in from having 0 goals scored thru 3 matches.

 

[Raoul]

Stretford Paddock are pretty vehemently defending him.

Webby and O'Neill are oddly critical of ETH, but also of various players.

 

[RedBanker]

Plenty on here wanted him to stay after the final, not a majority, but a good number.

Even so, it shows the footballing ownership as gutless and juvenile.

 

[fergiewherearethou]

I can't take this anymore. I can't see him manage one more Man Utd game. I just can't, sorry.

I will be back supporting the club once ETH is sacked. This boring football and ruining weekends have to stop for my own sanity.

I feel you, my short term memory always helps in being impatient and barely waiting for our next game to start, only to remember where we are at after the first 10 minutes of every game.

 

[devilish]

Btw, "we beat big opponents" is such a pathetic line. As if we are some relegation fodder. This is worse than when Moyes admitted that we need to "aspire to be like City".

Two mickey mouse cups or not, no one can convince me that he isn't the worst appointment since Sir Alex retired. The worst is that he has filled the squad with expensive mediocre players from Ajax or the Dutch league. It would take a while to clean all the shit that he has dumped on us.

Yoro, De Ligt, Zirkzee, Ugarte, Martinez and Mazraoui are hardly shit players. What we need is a change in tactics. Whenever we attack we go too gung-ho which leads to huge gaps in CM when we get countered. Even prime Roy Keane would struggle with the space left a midfield were the two CM + the two wingers bomb forward

 

[Irwin99]

He's trying to get us to play toe to toe with the big boys rather than the counter attack stuff we usually see.

He's getting it horribly wrong.

Always happens when we do and we only seem to get results when we park the bus and counter (0-0 draw against them at Anfield last season, City cup final). We did beat Liverpool with chaos ball in the FA cup but their poor finishing was a big factor IIRC. The Antony equialiser came out of nowhere really.

I don't want to defend him, but I can see his idea of moving away from what Jose and Ole used to do in the big games but the sad fact is that he can't get the team functioning as an attacking unit. We're just awful unless we counter from a low block and pack the midfield.

The only way i see him keeping his job is if he changes his plan and starts playing more like we did in his first season but he seems too stubborn to do that.

 

[VP89]

Yoro, De Ligt, Zirkzee, Ugarte, Martinez and Mazraoui are hardly shit players. What we need is a change in tactics. Whenever we attack we go too gung-ho which leads to huge gaps in CM when we get countered. Even prime Roy Keane would struggle with the space left a midfield were the two CM + the two wingers bomb forward

Is this what was happening in the first half yesterday?

 

[RedBanker]

Are their people who are still defending him?

162 of em if you go by the poll here and it keeps increasing.

 

[devilish]

Is this what was happening in the first half yesterday?

Its happening on a regular basis. Our CMs and wingers bomb forward, they don't backtrack in time which leave the DM isolated and messing things around. It doesn't help that Casemiro's legs are gone + our wingers are playing in a role which was very similar to what prime Ronaldo used to play for us (ie focus on scoring/creating, don't worry defending) but have like 1/15 his talent. This is a tactical mess. I'd wish that it was more complicated than that as I hate pointing my finger to one person but unfortunately it isn't the case.

 

[saik]

We are a Zirkzee toe tap away going wide and a Amad deflected shot going out instead of in from having 0 goals scored thru 3 matches.

This argument is in bad faith because the same logic can easily be applied in reverse. We’re just a ridiculous offside call against Zirkzee that rarely happens, Zirkzee’s header being placed just a few centimeters away from Alisson, Garnacho missing an open goal against Fulham, or Bruno converting one of his two clear chances against Fulham away from having six goals in three games.

 

[zapp]

Definitely feels like it's a.case of

It really is our luck that we go from vibes fc manager, who pretends that winning cups means nothing in the scheme of things... we follow the right process for recruiting their replacement...

But somehow we end up with anti-vibes fc manager, who pretends that winning a cup excuses them from being a shit coach and terrible communicator, who cant even get the team scoring more than they concede over a season, and averaging 1 point per game since February.

Winning cups is nice but if they dont come alongside progression and improving competitiveness in the comps that matter, they are irrelevant.

Which is exactly the point the vibes fc manager made...

 

[Revan]

Never happening. They aren't fools. If our form doesn't immediately change he'll be gone by October.

They kept him last season though. And decided to reward him by activating the +1 extension, effectively making his sacking cost another 9m pounds.

As much as I would like to believe that they are not fools, I am not sure they aren't when it comes to him.

 

[VP89]

Its happening on a regular basis. Our CMs and wingers bomb forward, they don't backtrack in time which leave the DM isolated and messing things around. It doesn't help that Casemiro's legs are gone + our wingers are playing in a role which was very similar to what prime Ronaldo used to play for us (ie focus on scoring/creating, don't worry defending) but have like 1/15 his talent. This is a tactical mess. I'd wish that it was more complicated than that as I hate pointing my finger to one person but unfortunately it isn't the case.

So this season I don't think I've seen Mainoo run up and leave Casemiro. And our full backs are more inverted but yes, higher up.

 

[devilish]

So this season I don't think I've seen Mainoo run up and leave Casemiro. And our full backs are more inverted but yes, higher up.

Its common for our CM to be overrun especially on counters. Considering how shit Casemiro is, I believe that Mainoo is playing too high up off the pitch + Bruno is becoming a forward in all but name

 

[Blood Mage]

I can't take this anymore. I can't see him manage one more Man Utd game. I just can't, sorry.

I will be back supporting the club once ETH is sacked. This boring football and ruining weekends have to stop for my own sanity.

Calm down, it's torture for me too but I certainly won't stop watching or supporting.

 

[Andycoleno9]

Neville - possibly due to PTSD from his managerial stint - is always hustling against United/United’s best interest. In his head sacking a manager is a cardinal offence - to the point he frames is as “stupid”.

Carragher couldn’t believe what he was hearing and even said “why would that (sacking him) be stupid?!”

Biggest hypocrite among pundits. He was sacking managers left and right in Salford while at United he is promoting 3 years minimum.
Also, for years he is the one who is saying that owners must back manager with every player who managers wants ( remember how Glazers "failed Ole" because they didn't pay 120 mil for Sancho?). Meanwhile in Salford.........he is buying only free players. Because his money is real and Glazers are dealing with monopoly money i guess.

 

[OverratedOpinion]

Since INEOS came in he's had 1 window together with a new coaching+medical staff and that's how they'll look at the situation. They won't rage quit on him unless he fails to take off this season with wins on the board. 3 GWs is too early to call that, but I agree his time to get convincing wins on the board is right now.

You constantly attempt to frame everything in the kindest possible light on Ten Hag in a manner that is so absurd that it becomes annoying to debate. It's of no interest to me.

If you want to stick your fingers in your ears and pretend he's a new manager and should be given as much rope then that's up to you. He's had 2 and a half years.