Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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AshRK said:
It's not just the midfield thought. We need another cb, possibly a rb and a lb, some may argue we also need a striker.

Our squad right now is a mess and we are hoping everyone stays fit and chances of that happening is very little.
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We currently have two first team right backs and two first team left backs in the club, with one of our supposed biggest youth talents also being a left back. We have a finite amount of money and resources, we can’t keep spending the whole time swapping those about.

CB is annoying with Yoro getting a freak injury is annoying and probably does require another body in there, which it seems we will get.

I know there’s a lot of doom mongering about injuries but there is a much higher chance that Luke Shaw and Lisandro Martinez play a far greater part in next season. Defence will be acceptable for another season once we sign De Ligt.

We currently have two first choice no.9s in the squad. Again, poor use of our finite resources if we sign a third.

The biggest issue last season was the gaping chasm we called a midfield. Not only did we get out-possessed on average by all of the teams above us in the league, we also got outran and bullied in midfield battles.

The season starts in a week and we’re expecting 19 year old Mainoo to run a midfield on his own for us again, when so far he has shown his biggest strengths are in the middle and final third — ball carrying, press resistance, and short snappy passing.
 
AshRK said:
You cannot work miracles with a defensive pair of lindelof and evans. The fact that again the likes of lindelof awb mctominay eriksen casemiro sancho find a way to be closer to starting line up is a huge worry.

Eth cannot afford to start slow this season. The pressure will be sky high this time around even more.
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He's had another summer window to sort all of this out, and generational talent or not signing an 18 year old CB and expecting him to perform in this league from the off, is incredibly risky. To be honest, I'm so fed up of hearing excuses for this manager. He must start strong or as you say pressure will be monumental.
 
Really hoping we can get a few new faces in soon and get off to a good start. He's under pressure obviously, and a bad start would see that pressure ramp right up.
 
Shark said:
He's had another summer window to sort all of this out, and generational talent or not signing an 18 year old CB and expecting him to perform in this league from the off, is incredibly risky. To be honest, I'm so fed up of hearing excuses for this manager. He must start strong or as you say pressure will be monumental.
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Not making excuses but truth is eth cannot sell them on his own. Not one decent club is coming for lindelof or eriksen or even casemiro. The likes of awb and mctominay are being offered low value money. We somehow always end up with the same deadwoods year in year out.

Again eth has his own issues but not letting them go is not something we can blame him.
 
You can't play a high pressing game without defenders that can stay high and a defensive midfielder that can cover a lot of ground, so hopefully we can some signings over the line .

If we don't I'm guessing we'll just get played through easily like last season.
 
That first half performance vs Liverpool was encouraging. Very intense pressing and it was coordinated too.

Let’s see if we can replicate it in a competitive game. I don’t think we will, ETH isn’t a strong enough coach.
 
AshRK said:
Not making excuses but truth is eth cannot sell them on his own. Not one decent club is coming for lindelof or eriksen or even casemiro. The likes of awb and mctominay are being offered low value money. We somehow always end up with the same deadwoods year in year out.

Again eth has his own issues but not letting them go is not something we can blame him.
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Of course, he can't blamed solely, but I do think that even if Yoro didn't pick up a 3 month injury, he wasn't sorting that defense either way. ETH's judgement so far in this window is as questionable as some of his decisions last summer.
 
Pretty sure we will see a couple new faces once we back from tour. Seen some really good stuff yesterday and with better players will be amazing
 
Cathy Ferguson said:
Are you happy with last year's performance and his transfer dealings? Not least Mount and Antony.

ETH is closer to Moyes than Klopp or Pep in terms of competence. A lucky FA cup victory does not change that. I think top 4 will be very difficult this season.
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No, I’m not happy with last year’s performance or his transfer dealings.

You said he is ‘no better than Ole or Moyes’ which is demonstrably nonsense. Not sure what point you are trying to make here.
 
JB08 said:
No, I’m not happy with last year’s performance or his transfer dealings.

You said he is ‘no better than Ole or Moyes’ which is demonstrably nonsense. Not sure what point you are trying to make here.
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He's certainly not proved that it's 'nonsense' to say that yet.
 
Leftback99 said:
He's certainly not proved that it's 'nonsense' to say that yet.
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Well he inherited a mess, including club for sale , multiple players causing serious drama , won a league cup and top 4 first season. And as bad as second season was, he won an FA cup in a really impressive performance in the final (not just a smash and grab). So yeh, he’s proven to be more successful then Moyes/Ole.

Even if he’s sacked in November , he’s still done more then Moyes and Ole and the squad will be looking in a far healthier place then when either of those two left.
 
BaguetteBoy said:
Pretty sure we will see a couple new faces once we back from tour. Seen some really good stuff yesterday and with better players will be amazing
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Some of the football was fantastic at times. Liverpool looked really dangerous on the counter , but our actual starting back 4 should have better joy, especially shaw on Salah.

Interesting to see what tactics we play in the Charity shield.

Will also be interesting to see how we fair against Fulham as I feel in many ways, breaking down weaker teams has kind of been an Achilles heal of ours and we do better against more open teams.
 
Chumpsbechumps said:
Well he inherited a mess, including club for sale , multiple players causing serious drama , won a league cup and top 4 first season. And as bad as second season was, he won an FA cup in a really impressive performance in the final (not just a smash and grab). So yeh, he’s proven to be more successful then Moyes/Ole.

Even if he’s sacked in November , he’s still done more then Moyes and Ole and the squad will be looking in a far healthier place then when either of those two left.
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I would hope the squad is in a better place after spending £500m+. Everything else, nah much to prove yet.
 
Juice Juiced said:
Arne is football guy, EtH is just rich boy got bored...and he found new hobby.
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Juice Juiced said:
I am not trolling.
I am neurosurgeon, all my professional career I am dealing people like EtH aka nepo babies. He is rich MF who stumbled on disfunctional club.
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These are ridiculous comments. Ten Hag played football professionally, then immediately went into coaching and has been doing that ever since. He's also known to be maniacal in his attention to everything. (For that matter, much like most of his type of coaches from the current generation, including Slot.)

You don't have to agree with anything Ten Hag does, but don't invent nonsense. (Also, what does being a neurosurgeon have to do with anything here.)
 
Chumpsbechumps said:
Some of the football was fantastic at times. Liverpool looked really dangerous on the counter , but our actual starting back 4 should have better joy, especially shaw on Salah.

Interesting to see what tactics we play in the Charity shield.

Will also be interesting to see how we fair against Fulham as I feel in many ways, breaking down weaker teams has kind of been an Achilles heal of ours and we do better against more open teams.
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They will come at us aggressively like Wolves last year did. We're a football equivalent of a wounded animal now.

Anyway, it's funny as I believe we're in very poor shape but at the same time a proper DM away from having a really decent team. So, there's still hope, although I'm not too optimistic about it, because if we're stuck with Casemiro as the only one capable of paying DM, we're in deep shit.
 
Robbie Boy said:
I don't think someone countering a post about him being worse than Ole or Moyes is "proclaiming him the messiah".
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I wasn’t talking about an individual poster. My post was regarding the general consensus on this board that ETH can do no wrong.
 
Borys said:
They will come at us aggressively like Wolves last year did. We're a football equivalent of a wounded animal now.

Anyway, it's funny as I believe we're in very poor shape but at the same time a proper DM away from having a really decent team. So, there's still hope, although I'm not too optimistic about it, because if we're stuck with Casemiro as the only one capable of paying DM, we're in deep shit.
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What do you think is our starting 11? Up to 7 outfield starters not really involved in pre season seems off to me.

I can’t remember thinking back, but have we always not had the majority of our starting 11 available for pre season until 2 weeks before start of season?
 
TsuWave said:
No offence but that’s just such cursory and poor reasoning.

Not that I’m saying RvN would light the world on fire (he did decently as a manager though), I’m just saying that I have a soft spot for him. Your reasoning is still piss-poor
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No offence, but I figured the reasons why would be understood. Very little experience in management, apparently very little will to even be a manager just yet. He absolutely shouldn't be handed the job. We had half of RedCafe turning their noses up at coaches far ahead of him this summer, to give him the job would be absolutely nonsensical.
 
OverratedOpinion said:
That makes no sense.

We have been "there" with nearly every profile of manager since Sir Alex retired. Do we get a consistent Premier League proven manager? An iconic legend of management? A European elite? Former player? Hipsters choice? Modern European coach?

If you discount someone purely because we already had the same profile then no one works. Most of the most successful managers ever have been former players, lots of them at clubs they played for.

Hopefully not necessary anyway.
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See my above post. I thought it wouldn't take much reasoning as to why it would be a bad idea. Being your childhood hero doesn't qualify you for being United manager. Somebody like McKenna even, should be streets ahead of him.
 
Chumpsbechumps said:
Some of the football was fantastic at times. Liverpool looked really dangerous on the counter , but our actual starting back 4 should have better joy, especially shaw on Salah.

Interesting to see what tactics we play in the Charity shield.

Will also be interesting to see how we fair against Fulham as I feel in many ways, breaking down weaker teams has kind of been an Achilles heal of ours and we do better against more open teams.
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True they did target Amass in the first half. But very proud of the youngster in second half stop Salah a few times.

You can see the improvements you can also see Ruud influence. We should have a better back four and midfield when we meet again soon. That will be the benchmark I’m looking forward too. Game 3 few players coming back should be fit enough.
 
Garethw said:
I wasn’t talking about an individual poster. My post was regarding the general consensus on this board that ETH can do no wrong.
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Wait, what? I see relentless negativity about the bloke. Even the more staunch supporters admit that he's done plenty wrong.
 
pocco said:
No offence, but I figured the reasons why would be understood. Very little experience in management, apparently very little will to even be a manager just yet. He absolutely shouldn't be handed the job. We had half of RedCafe turning their noses up at coaches far ahead of him this summer, to give him the job would be absolutely nonsensical.
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I mean, and again, my initial post wasn’t framed as an appeal for him to get the job. Moreover the arguably best manager of all time now had very little experience when he took over his first first-team job. And - if RvN was to get the job - it would be expected as caretaker (as the posts preceding mine spoke of him taking over by December/Jan). Lastly, redcafe isn’t exactly a bottomless well of football knowledge so it being used as a reference point amounts to very little.

But again, you’re seemingly having a non-existent argument. I did not say RvN is the man for the job/that we should etc. I said it would make me happy because he’s a childhood hero of mine. “Been there, done that” remains cursory and poorly applied reasoning.
 
Chumpsbechumps said:
edit: load of bollox

No context to what’s going on at club, where it was when he took over and just a transfer figured.
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It’s borderline comedic isn’t it? It shouldn’t be too complicated to understand how many players left on a free or for very low fees since the summer of 2022. How were they expecting them to be replaced :lol:
 
LawCharltonBest said:
Maybe their contingency plan is Nistelrooy, who’ll have then trained these players but be more willing to follow the “style of play” Ineos want
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They've made their bed now so they'll have to continue with a Dutch coach or someone with Cruyff philosophies. The alternative is ripping up the entire squad again, and that isn't cheap.
 
crossy1686 said:
They've made their bed now so they'll have to continue with a Dutch coach or someone with Cruyff philosophies. The alternative is ripping up the entire squad again, and that isn't cheap.
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They're currently buying technically skillful players that can play a high-energy game. That will suit most modern coaches, it's really not very specific to Dutch football.
 
https://www.espn.com/soccer/story/_/id/40720772/ten-hag-sancho-start-season-striker

Ugh. Over 100m on strikers, and he wants to play Sancho as a false 9 v City. Injuries, sure. He’s worried about Zirkzee’s fitness and acclimating to the Prem. In my mind, the Community Shield is the perfect chance to play this so-called Hag-ball with no repercussions as to the result. Who cares? Let’s see where we are after 2+ years and 500m. Zirkzee isn’t going to learn how to play in the PL by sitting on the bench… I mean, he could always play Rashford as a striker I guess. feck me.
 
DSG said:
https://www.espn.com/soccer/story/_/id/40720772/ten-hag-sancho-start-season-striker

Ugh. Over 100m on strikers, and he wants to play Sancho as a false 9 v City. Injuries, sure. He’s worried about Zirkzee’s fitness and acclimating to the Prem. In my mind, the Community Shield is the perfect chance to play this so-called Hag-ball with no repercussions as to the result. Who cares? Let’s see where we are after 2+ years and 500m. Zirkzee isn’t going to learn how to play in the PL by sitting on the bench… I mean, he could always play Rashford as a striker I guess. feck me.
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Hmm sancho starting yes but I’m sure Zirkzee will get some minutes. 100% sure if we started if Zirkzee and god forbid he gets injured y’all will be crying why rush him. The dude can’t win with anything at all
 
Might be wrong but with the squad he has, already carrying injuries, I see us struggling for the first half of the season. I fear ETH will get sacked by Christmas and replaced with RVN. Once again we've been screwed over by our summer US tour. We need to stop doing it.
 
JB08 said:
No, I’m not happy with last year’s performance or his transfer dealings.

You said he is ‘no better than Ole or Moyes’ which is demonstrably nonsense. Not sure what point you are trying to make here.
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You are right. He is much worse.

Comparatively awful performance in Europe and our lowest ever PL finish, but sure, let some tin cups paper over that.
 
MadDogg said:
De Ligt could easily be a coincidence. We're after a defender but can't spend too much and he's a quality one who is available for a good price. The fact that ETH has managed him before may not have anything to do with it (other than perhaps elevating us to being De Ligt's first choice).

Onana perhaps as well, being one of the two stand-out options at the time we wanted to sign a goalkeeper. In saying that, the rumours were that the club preferred Costa while ETH preferred Onana, but at the same time Costa would have been more expensive and probably seen as being riskier. So I don't think Onana being a target had anything to do with ETH, but ETH perhaps was the difference between him being 1st or 2nd choice (and once again perhaps elevated us in Onana's eyes so he'd leave Inter).

Mazraoui might be a bit of both, in the sense that we're looking for a cheap back-up fullback and he fits that bill (and has the same agent and at the same club as De Ligt so simplifies discussions), but it may be his history with ETH that gives him the edge.

So all three of the above would probably have been high on the clubs list regardless of the manager.

I'd say Antony and Martinez were the two that we definitely signed due to ETH. The amount of time we chased FDJ as well. Timber before he turned us down probably as well.
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They are buying De Ligt for Tuchel.
 
Cheimoon said:
They're currently buying technically skillful players that can play a high-energy game. That will suit most modern coaches, it's really not very specific to Dutch football.
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They’re just buying young players who aren’t the finished product yet and can be moulded, or at least that seems to be the approach this summer. I don’t think they’ve made a definitive decision to sign the players you’re suggesting otherwise it would be a hell of a lot more expensive, plus, those players don’t really work out when you remove them from the system they currently play in.
 
crossy1686 said:
They’re just buying young players who aren’t the finished product yet and can be moulded, or at least that seems to be the approach this summer. I don’t think they’ve made a definitive decision to sign the players you’re suggesting otherwise it would be a hell of a lot more expensive, plus, those players don’t really work out when you remove them from the system they currently play in.
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So those young players aren't a problem, as you say. As for those experienced players, I don't see any that would really only work uniquely with the football Ten Hag is playing. As long as the squad is consistent in terms of player profiles (as it hasn't been in ages, and at this point still isn't), many coaches should be able to replace Ten Hag without requiring another full squad overhaul.
 
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